Adjusting vertical ?

[Martijn]

I got windows 7 running with crt emu drivers and groovymame. its working and horizontally its all good.

but vertical needs adjusting for many resolutions.

Donkey kong is way stretched out of screen. Street fighter needs a bit more stretching and moving up.

If i adjust something in the tv service menu for a resolution, does this affect all resolutions or just that one?

i have set up the monitor as arcade_15

this is the tv service manual http://manualzz.com/doc/2312752/kv-25fx30k

its a flatscreen 25 inch sony trinitron.

There is some geometric info in the manual. but it doesnt correspond with making your own monitor preset.

any help would be greatly appreciated.

[haynor666]

Usually (at least my Thomson and two Sony Trinitrons) TV holds two predefined set ups, one for 50 Hz range and second for 60 Hz range.
If You change something when You have started 60 Hz game (or close like 59,3 Hz or 61 Hz) for example  Rygar then it affect all games in that range like Bank Panic (61 Hz) or 19xx (59,63 Hz) or even neo-geo games (59,18 Hz). The same goes to 50 Hz. Start Stone Ball, change something in service menu. It will affect also games like Raiden Project (53,98 Hz). Sadly I don't remember in which range TV puts 54,7 Hz (midway games) or Irem games (55 Hz).

I've seen somewhere (Youtube and/or here on BYOAC) user that managed to set groovymame so he have to set one parameter - vertical size. All other parameters were set using custom modelines. But in my opinion that will be very time comsuming. Depending which frequency Your game use will have to shrink or stretch vertical size. From my experience the best way is to use slope option in service menu as it only shrink/stretch picture only only from the bottom. Note that geometry will also change.

Horizontal centering is also needed many times. My TVs does even option for this not also in service menu but also in standard menu. It's needed when I switch from megadrive to amiga (both real hardware).

About that arcade_15 mode. It's ok for typical TV but for trynitrons I have it caused to loose some part of picture on the upper and lower part of screen so I decided to use custom monitor that will shrink picture a bit. Try game Rastan and see if it cut some highscore on upper part of screen.

BTW. Since You asked me about this in personal message I can skip it, right?

[Martijn]

Hey haynor666, yes you can skip it. I wondered if the message was sent. When i use microsoft Edge browser i get all sorts of limits on this forum. Cant press any icons, or imbed stuff. So when i did sent the message to you i didnt see anything in sent items. Thats why i opened a topic.

Did you see the service manual? on page 20 there is geometric info. Can i use that to make custom settings?
And on page 21 there are the options to let me adjust the screen. It can adjust vertical and horizontal size and centre.

ill do some more testing today, Maybe i should pick a PAL tv instead of arcade_15?

[haynor666]

Yes, this is the menu for changing size, position and geometry but before You change anything I suggest to wrote somewhere values that You have right now. Note that You have to do this for 60 signal and 50 signal independent.

arcade_15 is almost fine, pal it's not as it limits frequency to 50 Hz and close to 50 Hz. pal mode was probably designed for TV that accept only PAL signal (old german and polish TVs for example). Every trinitron from silver serie will operate correctly with arcade_15 mode.

BTW. You have really great cabinets

[Recapnation]

~55-Hz games will normally activate a PAL Trinitron's PAL mode. On mine (BE-3B and AE-2 chassis), service menu tweaks affect both, NTSC and PAL modes.

Your questions are pretty much addressed here:

http://geedorah.com/eiusdemmodi/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=987#p987

In general, vertical amplitude is the only setting you'll need to adjust depending on the game, under a super-resolutions configuration, though per-game config. is necessary sometimes (check F.2). One thing to add there is MAME's internal options for picture placement (through <TAB> menu, slider options).

As Haynor says, using your TV for other devices will require further tweaking, so it's better if you accommodate the TV for them first.

[markc74]

Depending on how your TV works, I was able to wire a switch into my SCART cable that sent either 5v or 12v to one of the pins. This could then be used to force it into wither 4:3 or 16:9 mode. My TV (and I'm sure a Sony one I had before could do it) would save the geometry settings for both 4:3 and 16:9 modes independently.

I set up the 4:3 mode to do 224 vertical lines and the 16:9 mode to do 256 lines (widening the sides a bit to keep 4:3 proportions). Then I could flick the switch and it would change the geometry.

Of course, if you have an analog chassis then you can just break out the v-amp pot and that would solve the issue perfectly.

Don't know if this helps your situation?

[haynor666]

~55-Hz games will normally activate a PAL Trinitron's PAL mode. On mine (BE-3B and AE-2 chassis), service menu tweaks affect both, NTSC and PAL modes.

Your questions are pretty much addressed here:

http://geedorah.com/eiusdemmodi/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=987#p987

In general, vertical amplitude is the only setting you'll need to adjust depending on the game, under a super-resolutions configuration, though per-game config. is necessary sometimes (check F.2). One thing to add there is MAME's internal options for picture placement (through <TAB> menu, slider options).

As Haynor says, using your TV for other devices will require further tweaking, so it's better if you accommodate the TV for them first.

By default TV should be ok for all other hardware like consoles and old computers but since TV is in cabinet it will only displaying emulators so that's not a problem.

[Martijn]

It will be mame only. Ill read up on your info and test some things.  vertical amplitude ...

[Martijn]

i have been trying to tweak the geometry. but i cant get it right.

here some pics





Problem 1 : the display is angled a bit, cant seem to find this option to rotate the full display.
Problem 2 : many games like mortal kombat is stretched out of the screen at the bottom
problem 3 : games like donkey kong is stretched out of the screen top and bottom.

any ideas?

[Martijn]

ok scary, i googled that i need to adjust the

PICTURE ROTATION
The rotation of the deflection yoke affects directly the rotation of the picture
X asis

Maybe it rotated a little during building..

[R-Typer]

ok scary, i googled that i need to adjust the

PICTURE ROTATION
The rotation of the deflection yoke affects directly the rotation of the picture
X asis

Maybe it rotated a little during building..

You dont have OSD service menu on that tv? There should be geometry settings.

It can rotate due to geomagnetic field of the earth.

[haynor666]

Option should be straight in user menu rather in service menu.

[Martijn]

tilting is not in the options. so i went ahead and removed the clamp holding the yoke. rotating it did indeed make it level. but other other things are now messed up.
I need to call in a friend to help. looking at the display through a mirror is not easy to adjust this.

[Malenko]

you have to start with purity and adjust the yoke and purity rings for that. Next is convergence, then geometry.

[Martijn]

Thank you malenko. Ill try tomorrow. i asked a fried saying : wanna play with my new arcade 

[Malenko]

[Martijn]

getting beter now, 320 x 244 is great  screenfilled.

mk2 is 400 x 254 pixels and moved out of screen.
 

i read somewhere people edited the monitor ini do adjust this?

[Malenko]

mk2 is 400 x 254 pixels and moved out of screen.

I think the MKs run better at a slightly different resolution, I think its 400x256

[Calamity]

F.2) Tuning up the screen geometry in a per-game basis

http://geedorah.com/eiusdemmodi/forum/viewtopic.php?id=290