Dead Or Alive 5 - Requesting Advice on an Issue!

[pj.maybe]

Hello Arcade Controls!

Long time reader, first time poster.   

Setting up a cabinet in my "man cave" (or so my wife calls it) to do a few things, MAME is running well and etc.   One of these things, is play the magnificent fighter, Dead Or Alive 5.   For those unaware, here is the fairer half of the roster:



Primary goal is to use vJoy with my IPAC to create 2 DirectInput controllers, and use these to controll DoA5.   (this works well for Mortal Kombat X).

Now, Dead Or Alive 5 on PC has a particular issue where on opening it only accepts if you press "button A" on controller #1.   Very frustrating!   A few links with some info on the issue are below, if anyone is interested.   This is a problem for me as my IPAC seems to create "controllers" (which aren't really controllers) which come before the vJoy ones.

So EITHER -

a)    I can deactivate the IPAC controllers in Device Manager in which case vJoy doesn't work, and I can only control DoA5 with keystrokes.   

a2)  I know what you're thinking - just use the IPAC keyboard presses to play DoA5.   Would be a great plan, except DoA5 only allows one keyboard player.   

b)    I can leave all the devices active, in which case vJoy emulates joysticks... However DoA5 at the start menu ("press A to start") appearrs to be expecting the button from one of the IPAC devics.   

To see what I mean, check out below.    I even tried a little program called JoyID to move around the joystick numbers with no luck...  (may have been written in the 1980s).



Here is what I see my options are, was hoping to get some thoughts from you guys:

-  Get an arcade controller which emulates a joystick directly, rather than going "Aracade Controls => Keystrokes" (IPAC) and then "Keystrokes=>Windows Joystick" (vJoy)
   (was thinking this - http://kadevice.com/kade-miniarcade/)

-  Hack into DoA5 and try set it up for 2 keyboard players.   (This guy changed the key strokes via a mod - http://www.nexusmods.com/deadoralive5/mods/1 - though I'd have to hope that you could also do a 2nd player this way (seems unlikley))

-  Find a way how to disable those IPAC devices (if that is indeed causing the issue), while still having vJoy work properly.

-  Find a way to re-order things so DoA5 looks at the vJoy devices rather than the IPAC device (if this is indeed causing the issue).

-  Bash my head against a brick wall until the problem sees reason, relents and neatly solves itself.


Please, any advice you can offer is deeply deeply appreciated!

I can program c#.NET pretty comfortably, so am happy screwing around with anything messy.   (Software-wise)


p.s:
Here is some info on the DoA5 bug/controller issue:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/311730/discussions/0/598198356187863309/
http://steamcommunity.com/app/311730/discussions/0/618457398976334213/

[lilshawn]

can you use a keyboard and a joystick?

maybe you can program a microcontroller as an HID keyboard using "Kade" then use that keystroke solely to start the game with a separate switch input while still retaining the joypad for input.

just a thought.

otherwise i'd look into modding, maybe an ini, to look for a different input for starting the game.

[BadMouth]

This one is on my wish list, but the price hasn't gone low enough for me yet.  (and the price of the DLC is just absurd)

Did you try the x360kb files stickied in the software forum?

IMO, the only way to ensure compatibility for new games is to use an encoder that shows up as an xbox360 controller.
I gave up when Injustice came out and switched to hacked fightpads.

If you have a newer version of the Ipac, you could add the paclink adapter:
http://www.ultimarc.com/console.html

Another option:
http://www.focusattack.com/akishop-ps360-multi-console-joystick-pcb/

You could also use the PCBs out of fightsticks if you could find a set cheap enough.

The flipside of that is that you'll have to redo the controls on a bunch of the emulators you've probably already set up.
Some of them will only take input from the xbox d-pad while others will only use the left analog thumbstick.
Most of the interface options allow you to set a switch for one or the other, but not both.
The paclink adapter will let you switch via a combo press, but you'd still need to remember which games need you to do that.
The solution is to use joy2key to have the d-pad post the arrow keys on games that the d-pad doesn't work on.
I still haven't gotten around to doing this yet. 

[pj.maybe]

can you use a keyboard and a joystick?

maybe you can program a microcontroller as an HID keyboard using "Kade" then use that keystroke solely to start the game with a separate switch input while still retaining the joypad for input.

I will try with some generic gamepads tonight for the KB + Joystick option.  The reason it's hard with the IPAC, is the IPAC lists a HID video game controller in the devices which doesn't actually seem to act as one.  I.e:  I need to run vJoy (keypress-to-joystick) to create an actual joystick.   But it seems to be that DoA5 looks for the first joystick, and hence doesn't read from the vJoy.

otherwise i'd look into modding, maybe an ini, to look for a different input for starting the game.

I have the DoA5 ini, but there are no settings for controller.   Seems the game is pretty locked down 

I'll experiment tonight with two generic gamepads I have - just make sure that it all works okay if all other devices (IPAC + vJoy) are disabled.

[pj.maybe]

Did you try the x360kb files stickied in the software forum?

I have been trying x360ce, quite exensivly (maybe based on the same stuff)... but not the above.   I'll give it a go.

IMO, the only way to ensure compatibility for new games is to use an encoder that shows up as an xbox360 controller.

Actually DoA5 (I think because it's a pretty crappy port), seems to prefer DirectInput to XInput.
However I know XInput usually works fine with DirectInput... but some people have been having issues as DoA5 is a bit ---fouled up beyond all recognition---.

I gave up when Injustice came out and switched to hacked fightpads.

Thats essentially using a (3rd party, arcade style) native X360 controller and going straight into your PC, right?
I'd be reluctant as this would mean tearing my cabinet apart, throwing out a lot of controls, etc.

If you have a newer version of the Ipac, you could add the paclink adapter:
http://www.ultimarc.com/console.html

This will let my IPAC v2 go into the computer as a X360 controller?    And skip the whole keystrokes thing?   If so - BRILLIANT!

You could also use the PCBs out of fightsticks if you could find a set cheap enough.

So I'd just take out the board, and then wire this up to the wires from my current controls?   
Maybe this could be an option, but would explore other things first.   
Also the keystrokes stuff works so well for plenty of games, MAME, etc, I'm a bit reluctant to get rid of it completly.

The flipside of that is that you'll have to redo the controls on a bunch of the emulators you've probably already set up.
Some of them will only take input from the xbox d-pad while others will only use the left analog thumbstick.
Most of the interface options allow you to set a switch for one or the other, but not both.
The paclink adapter will let you switch via a combo press, but you'd still need to remember which games need you to do that.
The solution is to use joy2key to have the d-pad post the arrow keys on games that the d-pad doesn't work on.
I still haven't gotten around to doing this yet. 

Does sound like a lot of hassle!
But maybe the best solution if all else fails.   

 

[BadMouth]

Did you try the x360kb files stickied in the software forum?

I have been trying x360ce, quite exensivly (maybe based on the same stuff)... but not the above.   I'll give it a go.

It's based on a very old build of x360ce that also supported keyboard input.  It's worked on everything but Injustice and MKX.
I was using it on everything up through MKK when I switched to hacked pads because of Injustice. (which I haven't bothered to play much since)

I gave up when Injustice came out and switched to hacked fightpads.

Thats essentially using a (3rd party, arcade style) native X360 controller and going straight into your PC, right?
I'd be reluctant as this would mean tearing my cabinet apart, throwing out a lot of controls, etc.

Same controls, but now they are wired to PCBs which were removed from official SFIV fightpads (handheld controller) and have had wires soldered to the copper traces where the buttons used to press against.  I added some barrier strips so they could be disconnected or swapped around.  I kept the KeyWiz for the ESC button.

If you have a newer version of the Ipac, you could add the paclink adapter:
http://www.ultimarc.com/console.html

This will let my IPAC v2 go into the computer as a X360 controller?    And skip the whole keystrokes thing?   If so - BRILLIANT!

Yes.

[pj.maybe]

Got an update !

Have been doing more banging   

(Well, sorta, wasn't all bad news)

• Asked the bloke from Ultimarc about the (I thought brilliant) Paclink idea.    He seemed to think the Paclink was for putting arcade controls into an X360 console, and not intended to go into a PC, and I should use an A-PAC in parralel instead.   ()
• Unplugged all the J-PACs (turns out they are J not I-PAC... oops!) and plugged in two normal gamepads.   DoA5 works like a charm.

So,

I am thinking (alas),

Probably the best option is to replace those chitty old J-PAC boards with something a bit.... better.  Which can (via software) either send Keystrokes down the pipe for MAME,  or just represent itself as Joysticks.   

(hopefully controllable via software / API)   

Would slightly prefer this to taking apart a fightstick, as to do keystrokes I'd need to do JoyToKey... and may end up in similar hot soup to which I am in currently with DoA5 and vJoy.   (the reverse).

(if not then I could leave the J-PACs there (for keystrokes) and use an Arduino to switch between using the J-PACs and a fightstick PCB)   

Main options for me now are:

• Hold out vague hope I can somehow get the vJoy joysticks up to joystick ID #1,  so DoA is looking for it.
• Or EVEN better, hide the blasted IPAC controllers somehow
• Then main option is to get rid of the J-PACs and choose a better arade controller.

Ones I am thinking of are:

u-hid,
http://www.u-hid.com/home/overview_board.php

And,

Kade miniArcade,
http://kadevice.com/kade-miniarcade/

Any others that can do joysticks / keys programatically ?

Plan B would be the Arduino switching between J-PACs and a fightstick PCB.   But I hope it doesnt come to that...

[pj.maybe]

Wrote out a whole detailed post but the f ucking timeout screwed me!   



tl;dr
75% problem solved.   Got rid of the 2 virtual joystick devices created by IPAC through a firmware upgrade, (which I don't think is yet published - Andy sent it to me directly).   File is attached.

Now just need application that can create 4 virtual joysticks and have them signalled by keystrokes.  Headsoft vJoy would be perfect but only does two.   Trying with "Sourceforge vJoy" and UCR, but not there yet... quite tricky.