Are These The Same Button?

[LiquidFlame]

Was wonder if these are the same button, as in made by the same manufacture, I know the microswitches aren't the same. The Groovy Gamer says "Authentic HAPP / SUZO" so are these the ones made in China?

1: http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=73&products_id=181
2: http://www.paradisearcadeshop.com/il-psl-l/263-red-il-concave-pushbutton.html

[lilshawn]

I happen to have one of each right here...

happ actually makes their own (stamp moulding as such). they are almost identical to IL but not quite. I'm not sure where happ has them made but it could be china.

there are some slight differences to some of the structural reinforcing where the button clips in (IL being slightly thicker in some spots) that could make the IL button slightly stronger in a commercial application.

the spring in the IL is a slightly longer length spring having about 1/2 a turn extra compared to happ (this could just be a variation in manufacturing.) both seem to have a similar (if not same) force

the IL spring appears to be zinc plated (dull silver in coloring) while the happ is uncoated and appears to be raw steel. (dark almost black color)

the nuts appear to be interchangable so the threading is the same.

the IL appears to have slightly less flashing along the edges of the parts indicating tighter tolerances in the mould.

The IL appears to have any nubs where the plastic was injected cut or removed (or moulded in such a way as to eliminate it) the happ has some "tits" left from the moulding process (albeit in areas where it doesn't show or affect use)...but shows a more lax QC process.

I would say from the outside they are identical quality wise.

but behind the panel the IL shows a bit of a higher quality product.

so the choice is yours.

[jeremymtc]

They are of different manufacture, but the same basic design. Happ used to sell IL buttons, but now has them outsourced elsewhere.

The plungers on the current Happ buttons seem to have a bit more lateral play [read: slop], and for that reason I prefer original IL or any of GGG's branded buttons over the current Happ units.

edit - what lilshawn says

[lilshawn]

The plungers on the current Happ buttons seem to have a bit more lateral play

I should note that the 2 buttons I have compared are new old stock we have at the warehouse of unknown manufacture date... current standards may not apply.

[LiquidFlame]

Thanks for the info.

[RandyT]

I should note that the 2 buttons I have compared are new old stock we have at the warehouse of unknown manufacture date... current standards may not apply.

If your HAPP button doesn't have "SUZO/HAPP" on one of the switch retainer legs, then it is not current stock.  HAPP has used a few different manufacturers over the years, one even here in the US.  They now have financial interest in a factory in China, which is where many of their parts are made under their guidance.  The parts from this factory have improved greatly from the early days of this arrangement.  Like anything newly produced in China, it takes some time for the factories to get things figured out.  But the current buttons don't seem to be any worse with regard to fit and finish, than those from other factories.

Honestly though, if you are paying more for something you can't see or feel from above the panel, then you are just paying more for something which provides no tangible benefit.  But design differences can be important, and that is what is best focused upon, based on individual preference and/or build requirements.

[lilshawn]

Honestly though, if you are paying more for something you can't see or feel from above the panel, then you are just paying more for something which provides no tangible benefit.

this +1

really from the outside they are identical. they actuate the same distance. the springs feel the same. for all intents and purposes they are the same. if you can get one cheaper with shipping...get that one. 

but if you have SOME and need MORE...buy from the same manufacturer...sometimes the blue of one isn't the same blue of another manufacturer.

[RandyT]

but if you have SOME and need MORE...buy from the same manufacturer...sometimes the blue of one isn't the same blue of another manufacturer.

Good advice, but I'd even go a bit further.  One should always try to get as many as you think you will need in one order.  Good vendors will try to make sure that all of the buttons of a specific color on that order will be without an "oddball" from a different run.

Colors can vary a bit from each manufacturing run, even from the same supplier.  They all try to do the best they can in this regard, but perfect color control isn't really possible.  It makes sense when you do the research on how plastic injection molding works.  Basically, a smaller percentage of pigment pellets are mixed with raw (uncolored) plastic pellets, and the ratio determines the color / intensity.  It's virtually impossible to mix pellets to perfect ratios, so what comes out of the molds at any given injection, tends to be an average of what actually enters the injector, and if that can vary a bit, even in the same run.

It's also important to note that home builders tend to be more sensitive to this than the industries for which these parts are designed.  For them, if it's close, it's good.  Color control and the challenges it poses, especially between items of different materials, is probably one of the least understood aspects of panel building.