Recommendations from the pros

[stigzler]

I come to you kindly gentlemen asking for help.

OK... so done reading here and there, but as ever get lost in the esoteric and details and end up further away from an answer than when I start.

In Short:
I want to buy 2 steering wheels for my cab.
Have usb/12V/5V connectors available in my modular CP.
PC inside cab.
Would like to be able to play: MAME games alongside games on: PCSX2; Dolphin; Dreamcast; N64 etc etc
If possible, most features possible, but force feedback would be most sought.
Not too bothered about fidelity to original games (e.g. 360 vs 270). As long as playable.

Is there one recommended wheel for this? Also - pedals? Would I need analogue? USB?

Either any recs or starting pointers would be gratefully received.

[Generic Eric]

I come to you kindly gentlemen asking for help.

OK... so done reading here and there, but as ever get lost in the esoteric and details and end up further away from an answer than when I start.

In Short:
I want to buy 2 steering wheels for my cab.
Have usb/12V/5V connectors available in my modular CP.
PC inside cab.
Would like to be able to play: MAME games alongside games on: PCSX2; Dolphin; Dreamcast; N64 etc etc
If possible, most features possible, but force feedback would be most sought.
Not too bothered about fidelity to original games (e.g. 360 vs 270). As long as playable.

Is there one recommended wheel for this? Also - pedals? Would I need analogue? USB?

Either any recs or starting pointers would be gratefully received.

That is a tall order.  Look at Badmouths spread sheet.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq37CSO6oe1fdERrVGt0emFCWnh1WDBiaFdoUmcweHc&usp=sharing

 Many games don't work the same way.  The only thing that makes this slightly easier is that interact made a xbox,PS2,gamecube all in one wheel and that the wii didn't use a wheel. 

[stigzler]

Thanks Eric.

That looks like it's for mame - so complicated compatibility with that!

tbh - happy to skip mame for time being and get ps2,gamecube,wii and dreamcast games working.

I'm looking for a PC wheel that will work with these. I saw this sheet here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq37CSO6oe1fdGNQUGN5UU1QeTl0ZFQ3WkFKYTR1aWc#gid=5

added to my confusion - so is this list for wheels that link with the console or ones that you hook up to your pc, but the relevant emulators only accommodate the wheels on this list? (e.g. Logitech driving force for PS2; Logitech speed force for Gamecube; "race controller"(?) for dreamcast)

quick google around your Interact lead, but do you have more specific details?

Thanks for your help.

[Generic Eric]

Thanks Eric.

That looks like it's for mame - so complicated compatibility with that!

tbh - happy to skip mame for time being and get ps2,gamecube,wii and dreamcast games working.

I'm looking for a PC wheel that will work with these. I saw this sheet here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq37CSO6oe1fdGNQUGN5UU1QeTl0ZFQ3WkFKYTR1aWc#gid=5

added to my confusion - so is this list for wheels that link with the console or ones that you hook up to your pc, but the relevant emulators only accommodate the wheels on this list? (e.g. Logitech driving force for PS2; Logitech speed force for Gamecube; "race controller"(?) for dreamcast)

quick google around your Interact lead, but do you have more specific details?

Thanks for your help.

I double check my wheel and make sure its interact.  It was black and blue and that is all I remember now. 

derp
INTEC RACING WHEEL & PEDALS Nintendo Gamecube XBOX Playstation 2

I got it at Salvation Army for $5 without the pedals.  Next time I go back, I'll see if they are there, but I doubt it.

As to the expanse of different options, that is my point.  I don't feel that there is a wheel on the market that connects to the PC that lets you play those faithfully.  *shrug* 

[stigzler]

Thanks again eric - that's one line of inquiry then - I'm supposing you get a converter for each wheel plug - from original system > usb > PC.

The other line I'm wondering about is whether there are any PC wheels that you can use with each emulator (i.e. get the pc wheel and emu talking via the controller plugins)

Forgive me folks if I'm asking the obvious - new line for me.

[Howard_Casto]

I'm still new to this as well, but long story short if you are talking about supporting systems then you are using the wrong unit of measurement. 

On a racing cab you configure one single game at a time.  Your hardware and software has to be tweaked specifically for that single game, it could be a week or more before you get it the way you want.  Then you start adding in the next game. 

Now yes for consoles it's SLIGHTLY simpler, particularly in the Sony camp, but not by much. 

Console emulators are a totally different beast from the actual consoles though.  How well the real controllers are supported has everything to do with the emu dev... some have these oddball wheels and add support and some don't... it's as simple as that unfortunately. 

[Generic Eric]

Thanks again eric - that's one line of inquiry then - I'm supposing you get a converter for each wheel plug - from original system > usb > PC.

The other line I'm wondering about is whether there are any PC wheels that you can use with each emulator (i.e. get the pc wheel and emu talking via the controller plugins)

Forgive me folks if I'm asking the obvious - new line for me.

Its not you, its me.  I haven't been able to communicate well today.  I shared that in an effort to illustrate that the dreamcast was left out of that combo of consoles in the same generation.  Either for technical reasons or licensing agreements to exclude sega from the group. *shrug*

I'm still new to this as well, but long story short if you are talking about supporting systems then you are using the wrong unit of measurement. 

On a racing cab you configure one single game at a time.  Your hardware and software has to be tweaked specifically for that single game, it could be a week or more before you get it the way you want.  Then you start adding in the next game. 

Now yes for consoles it's SLIGHTLY simpler, particularly in the Sony camp, but not by much. 

Console emulators are a totally different beast from the actual consoles though.  How well the real controllers are supported has everything to do with the emu dev... some have these oddball wheels and add support and some don't... it's as simple as that unfortunately. 

+1
This is the most concise way to understand this scenario. 

Another way to understand this is that by way of Badmouths console spreadsheet, you can see that not all PS3 games were programmed for all traits such as FFB, type of shifter, whether a clutch was used or not or if the 900 degree support was used. 

[SegaOutrun]

I use a logitech driving force gt. i got on craigslist for $50, and they are on ebay all day for $80. Its a logitech wheel so not only is built well, pc compatibility is high. You could get G25 OR G27 but, those retain their value and its rare for them to sell under $180. The driving force gt has 900* of rotation and you can create profile with the logitech software to limit it to 270 or 360 or whatever you want.

You will need a mame with dinput turned on. you can either compile your own or just google it and you can find a precompiled one. I dont play the older 360 wheel games so i havent tested how well my wheel works if i switch it to 360*. Newer games play fine like cruisin and ridge racer(needs a good pc)

Dolphin (wii) will see your wheel just fine and i play mario kart and the arcade version all the time just fine. I havent tested gamecube games tho.

Nulldc (Dreamcast) has a plugin called purupuru that will also it to see your wheel. I play hydro thunder all the time.

PCSX2 (PS2) has wheel plugin as well but its new and still being worked on. The issue with pcsx2 is that you will need a strong cpu like and i5 to play racing games as they are demanding. My phenom x6 1100t overclocked can only reach 50fps on some racing games =(. If its emulators you want, single core performance is what you need.

mupen64 (n64) n64 emulator never reached the quality of todays emulator. i found that mupen64 plays racing games the best but i have not tried them with my steering wheel yet. i kinda gave up on n64
 
Arcade games (model2, model 3 and naomi) will all see your wheel and play just fine. Naomi needs a strong DX11 card to play smoothly

added bonus is that it is ps2 and ps3 compatible (PS4? as well) so you could have play on real hardware too. that what i do, i use usb ext cables to plug the wheel into whatever im in the mood for PC, PS2 or PS3.

[Generic Eric]

Sweet.  Looks like I might need some BBQ sauce for my words.

[Howard_Casto]

Well I feel equally dumb now.  I never looked into the driving force because quite frankly, cosmetically speaking it looked like a cheap piece of crap, and as you say, they went so cheaply on ebay I figured it wasn't a quality wheel. 

900 degree rotation eh?  I wonder how that works from a software standpoint. 

Well thanks man, now I've got to totally re-think my plans.  I was going to scrap this gp and use it's innards to make a scratch built wheel, but if the driving force is as good as you say....  And you've already done a shaft extension as well, so I know I can make it look better. 

What about drivers and ff strength and all that business?  I mean is it something I'm going to have to re-do in a couple of years because it doesn't have win 8 drivers?

[SegaOutrun]

i had a logitech momo and that was definably a pos. The gt is not g25 but its great for its price. FFB is stronger than my momo wheel but i have not used g25 to compare. im sure the g25 is better. in the profiler i can set the degrees, for example if i choose 200* it makes a fake stop (i think its using the motors to make a counterforce and i cant rotate it further. i think i have it at 270 as default.  Btw Howard, the logitech website shows a download for win 8 so you should be fine.

Pros
11 inch wheel
has ffb (one motor)
900*
high compatibility

Cons
Paddle shifters are a joke (they make 3rd party paddle shifters)
no clutch
Made of plastic n rubber, no metal
Only a sequential shifter attached to the base

[Howard_Casto]

I'm not hearing a lot of cons really.  I've already researched shifters pretty extensively and if you want a really good one, your options are to build your own or buy a dedicated add-on shifter... the pack in ones aren't all they are cracked up to be.  Like you say, I see the paddle add-ons for the wheel (for multiple wheels actually ) on ebay regularly.  I'd probably roll my own though, that's not too hard to make.  The lack of clutch kind of sucks, but it isn't a deal breaker. 

The g25's aren't metal either btw.. it's just the wheel and while that makes them look really cool I doubt it makes them any sturdier.  I saw a couple of mods to your wheel since you posted this where people had mounted a car wheel to it fairly easily.  They are even selling pre-made quick release hubs for the thing  (a bit out of my price range, but I could probably replicate it). 

So yeah don't listen to us apparently.   

[stigzler]

@ SegaOutrun - Spot on! Thanks chap - precisely what I was looking for. Thanks as well for the comprehensive answer - looked into it all today - went for the straight GT option in the end rather than 25 or 27. Compromised on the gear shift, but the 25 + 27 had a lot less buttons on the wheel, and wanted plenty of options regarding buttons. Also, the paddle problems look like they have some easy work-arounds - so plumped for this in the end.

Looks great for multi-purpose/platform use. Ordered one - £30 off ebay - so cheap because peddle potentiometers need some tlc, but this also looks easy. Yer a star, Sega - thanks for the advice.

Only one issue. Will be panel mounting on my modular CP system. Have 24" across, giving 12" each for two of them. Sadly, width with gearstick = 14". But there'll be a way, right!?

@ Howard and Eric - thanks for your contributions - helped chase down all the issues regarding this. Think one of you did a thread on working dials on racing cabs - sooo sewed the germ of an idea for my next cab! Dammit add racing cab to the Quiz machine; Pincab; Rotating monitor cab. My next 5 years are booked

 

[Brian74]

I have both logitech driving force gt and G25. I have to say, the logitech driving force gt has very close ffb as the G25 does. I finally got my hands on another G25 for my second cab. I would have used the GT, but I want my cabs to match.

[Boomslang]

I would only really go with 2 wheels right now, either Logitech G25/27 or Fanatec GT2/Clubsport.

Logitech G25 works great with almost all PC games, Emulators, PS2 and PS3 Consoles (Apparently PS4 too)
Fanatec GT2 works great with almost all PC games, Emulators, PS3 and Xbox 360 Consoles (Apparently PS4 too). Fanatec has a mode to actually show itself as a Logitech g25 too in windows!

I myself would not go past the Fanatec wheel, it's awesome. Ive even got it working with Xbox One too (Without FFB though sadly)

[BadMouth]

I come to you kindly gentlemen asking for help.

OK... so done reading here and there, but as ever get lost in the esoteric and details and end up further away from an answer than when I start.

In Short:
I want to buy 2 steering wheels for my cab.
Have usb/12V/5V connectors available in my modular CP.
PC inside cab.
Would like to be able to play: MAME games alongside games on: PCSX2; Dolphin; Dreamcast; N64 etc etc
If possible, most features possible, but force feedback would be most sought.
Not too bothered about fidelity to original games (e.g. 360 vs 270). As long as playable.

Is there one recommended wheel for this? Also - pedals? Would I need analogue? USB?

Either any recs or starting pointers would be gratefully received.

Bit late, but a few points:

As stated in the driving cab info thread, 360 degree wheel games that spin endlessly like pole position don't work well with analog wheels which have limited rotation (no matter how far they rotate).
I can't think of any arcade games that allow 2 players on one screen and uses an analog (270 degree) wheel.
Having 2 analog wheels could be of some use on console games, but personally I wouldn't bother with more than one.
If you want the most flexibility, get a Logitech.  The profiler software makes it possible to automatically adjust sensitivity, rotation, mappings, etc based on which emulator is running.  The power supply is 24v though, so you'd need to add another connector to your modular setup.

There were some really good multiplayer 360 degree wheel games though (Ivan Stewarts Offroad, Sprint, Badlands).
Both groovygamegear and ultimarc offer steering wheels in various sizes for their spinners.
You could have another panel with 2 360 degree wheels, undersized wheels if necessary.

Analog pedals are absolutely necessary for some games.  You can get by with digital if you're only going to play casually for the sake of nostalgia and don't really care how well you do.  Really need analog ones if you take the game seriously and want to improve your times.

You mentioned ffb being extremely important to you.  At this point in time, I don't think any console emulators actually have wheel force feedback fully supported except for maybe PCSX2 (my pc isn't fast enough to run it).
The spreadsheet you linked to lists if a wheel was supported on the original console.  I'm hoping it comes in handy at some point in the future when the console emulator devs progress to that point.  With a Logitech, you can enable centering feedback for emulators that have no feedback.  It helps on the console emulators and MAME.

For N64 emulation, I use Project 64.

[stigzler]

Fantastically helpful post. Thanks badmouth