Pointers for getting started 3D Model to CNC build

[SgtSlaughter]

I'm looking at the potential of designing a cab, going from some sort of 3D CAD software and potentially sending out the drawing to get it cut out from a cnc router service.  If anyone has done this I would love to learn the process.

1) I've heard Google Sketch-up is great, but I also heard that some CNC Routing services are not compatible.  I'd prefer to start with some software that is easy to learn and would have the most compatibility.  I'd prefer to stay away from expensive software.

2) What is the process for taking a 3D model design in the software and creating a cut out template?  Does the software do this automatically or is it a manual process?

3) Has anyone actually built their own CNC router here and had great success? (http://buildyourcnc.com/)?  Not that I'd do this, but maybe one day if I had the room... =)

It'd be cool if a forum was dedicated to CAD software here, seems like it is used quite a bit.

[Rick]

I used Sketchup until my CNC guy said he couldn't properly convert my DXF files, so I moved to Solidworks. ($$$) I'm interested in finding what others are paying for CNC services, as my guy charges $299 for up to 10 sheets and 5 files, but I'm working to find smaller run pricing.

And yes, as soon as I have the space, I'll be ordering the CNC plans and designing and building my own. No question there.

[SgtSlaughter]

Ya you were mentioning Solidworks on your thread...  Your designs are looking great.  I was debating Sketchup since I'm not sure I'll even bother with sending it to CNC machine, but I was just worried if I ever wanted to go that I wouldn't be able to convert... 

I was checking out Solidworks and since they didn't list price on their site I figured I wouldn't even bother getting a quote =).  I just didn't necessarily want to pick another CAD software that might have the same issue that you had with Sketchup.

I'm curious, when you build your 3D model, does it automatically convert it to a cut out template for a 4x8 sheet of material?  (I'm sure there is probably some specific terminology for this).

[selfie]

There are cut list plug ins for sketch up that output to dxf but I have no personal experience with them.

I'm curious, when you build your 3D model, does it automatically convert it to a cut out template for a 4x8 sheet of material?  (I'm sure there is probably some specific terminology for this).

Design software is the wrong place to do this anyway. This sort of this is normally done is the CNC programming software as there are too many variables on the cutting side of things. How much material is required between pieces varies greatly depending on the material, type of cut, tool used etc.

 I'm interested in finding what others are paying for CNC services, as my guy charges $299 for up to 10 sheets and 5 files, but I'm working to find smaller run pricing.

For reference, with my CNC router, I charge material plus $60 setup plus $4 per minute, if you supply your own material I charge $10 per sheet handling fee and I am cheap for all reports. A quick and simple job on a Friday afternoon is likely to be done for beer.   But I am in Australia so it is not really relevant...

[Rick]

my guy charges $299 for up to 10 sheets and 5 files

Also, to clarify, that's 10 sheets cutting only, not including material.

[Unstupid]

Here is what I charge for my services:

Computer time (3d modeling, layout, nesting, toolpathing) - $125/hr
Machine time (5 axis) - $250/hr
Machine time (3 axis) - $150/hr
Difficult material (carbon fiber, fiberglass, aluminimum, non ferrous metals) premium - 25% of machine time charge
Tool wear fee - percentage of tool(s) cost

Also, these prices don't include material costs...

As far as cad software goes, check out rhino3d.  It is pretty easy to use and not that expensive at around $1000.  It doesn't generate files for the CNC machine.  For that I use Mastercam and that software costs upwards of $40,000.  Rhino will be able to generate files that can be imported easily into mastercam or any other cam software.

[stpcore]

This has me wondering a few things.  I have no idea if these hourly charges make financial sense for me since I don't know how fast the CNC can make it's cuts in MDF or 3/4" birch plywood.  What is the average cost/time to cut a full sized arcade cabinet (give or take)? 

I have a pedestal cabinet design I was considering going the CNC route with in order for me to assemble multiple pedestals quickly.  With that being said I would just assume spend the time to cut everything myself if it was not cost effective.  I was going to start searching for someone locally this week (west suburbs of Chicago) but have no idea how to price this out.

[GoYouSalukis]

I design in the free sketchup and then use a DXF plugin to save as a DXF and open in vCarve to create the tool paths. One thing to be wary of though is that sketchup circles start out pretty rough (12 lines -  i think?), so if you cut those circles, they are noticibly comprised of lines. You can make the circles higher resolution in sketchup, but I usually go back in vCarve and replace my circles with the ones built into the program.

[michelevit]

is this your first cabinet?
CNC builds are great for complex cuts like decreasing radius curves and pocket holes. What are you looking to achieve that cant be done with a hand-held router and cutting guides/templates? Most arcade cabs are just simple boxes with nothing but straight cuts.

If your just looking to design it in cad and send it off to a fab shop, you might save time and money by just sending your generated plans to a hobbysist woodworker who will cut it out for you. This will be for a fraction of what a cnc shop will cost.

If you have crazy complex curves, then go ahead and go the CNC route.
The operator will need to generate some code before making the cuts (nesting parts, feed rates, cut out tabs) which takes time ($)

[stpcore]

I've built a bunch of pedestal and counter tops over the past year.  I'm thinking it may save some time to have 5 or 10 cut at a time versus me doing it one by one.

[michelevit]

Definitely. If your looking to build more than one identical cabinet the CNC way will save time. If your looking to build just one, it might be cheaper and quicker to just cut it out with a hand held router.

[stpcore]

I'm really wondering what kind of time it takes per cabinet as I would be supplying the materials.  If someone is charging me $4 per minute or $240 per hour (not to mention set up and handling fees) and it takes an 2 hours to cut a cabinet it's not in my best interest to pay $480 per cabinet (no room for profit).  Does anyone know on average what to expect for CNC cutting times?  I know it's a vague question but I'm looking for a little direction.

[Unstupid]

I can cut out a pretty complex sheet of plywood (4'x8') in about 5 minutes.  That's just single pass, full depth 3/4" plywood at around 400 inches per minute.  Now if you start adding tool changes, drilling holes,etc..etc.. it will add more time.  each tool change takes about 2 minutes on my machine... others may take a lot longer.   You also have to account for setup time, fixturing the wood down to the table.  easy if you have a vaccuum table, harder if not.

[stpcore]

Got it.  When you say a "single pass" do you have to make multiple passes to cut 3/4" plywood or is it fully cut in a single pass? 

Thanks for the info on this.

[Unstupid]

That depends a lot on the machine.  My machine uses a 12HP 24,000 RPM spindle which allows me to cut thicker stock rather than someone using say a 2.5hp router.  For example, I can cut 3/4" plywood in a single pass at around 800 Inches per minute with a 3/8" compression bit, I more often than not would slow it down though to get cleaner cuts. 

[Rick]

That depends a lot on the machine.  My machine uses a 12HP 24,000 RPM spindle which allows me to cut thicker stock rather than someone using say a 2.5hp router.

Would I be amiss in guessing your machine is not home built? If not, can we see pics / specs?

[Unstupid]

yea.. not home built...  Thermwood Model 90... got some videos on my youtube channel "Unstupidtube".  Machine looks a lot like this:

[SgtSlaughter]

Thanks for the info, great to hear about the different setup & costs.

For me, its not really about only sending 1 cab to CNC shop, its more I want to design it with the right application so I have the option to do something like that in the future. 

You guys are seriously making me envious having a CNC machine though, I know I don't have the need for one, nor the space at this time, but I still want one! 

I'm curious how often do you go through blades (estimated per number of sheets of 3/4" mdf)?  I know that probably depends a lot on the quality of blade and RPMs of router, but just curious.

Anyone else have any other software picks? 

[macattack]

Mdf chews up bits.  I tend to replace my up it spiral every 10 sheets. melamine is great, cuts like butter with a compression bit. mdo is my main choice of material. i Mainly change bits  to help with the damn noise . Granted some of that may be the lack of a large spindle as I only run a 2.5hp motor, but it gets the job done. I built the cnc about a year ago. Lost count how many pinball cabinets and other arcades have come off it. Most of my design work is done in the vectric line of programs both 2d and 3d.

My usual cost is $50 per hour of machine time, plus material. 

[stpcore]

My usual cost is $50 per hour of machine time, plus material.

You aren't located in the Chicagoland area by any chance are you?  I would have a bunch of work for you at $50 per hour plus materials!

[macattack]

My usual cost is $50 per hour of machine time, plus material.

You aren't located in the Chicagoland area by any chance are you?  I would have a bunch of work for you at $50 per hour plus materials!

Just outside Detroit.

Www.xtremepinball.com

[Unstupid]

Isn't Detroit and Chicago the same thing?