Thoughts on this button layout for my first small 4-player cocktail?

[JeebsFat]

This is my first attempt on a Mame Machine, so go easy on me. Hopefully, I'm in the right sub forum, too! 

So, what do you guys think?

Yellow is the coin button, whites are 1 and 2 player buttons, and blue is shift. This thing will be on the smaller side with only a 15in monitor. (This is a super cheap, use want I have around kind of build) This button layout fully fills an i-pac 2 (32 slots).

For the controls, I quickly realized that the more I thought about it, the more I wanted. It is a slippery slope, indeed! I wanted 2 player across each other for vertical cocktail flipping and also wanted two player side by side for horizontal beat-em-up's. I should be able to do some twin stick shooters with this too. Maybe some two player twin stick shooters, but it might be a bit awkward. I went with 3 buttons per joystick as per metal slug and asteroids and keeping it simple.

I am considering putting the screen on a hinge for playing horizontal games more comfortably. This would give easy access to the guts too.

Anyway!

Just wanted to see what you guys thought before it's too late!

[Dekieon]

You don't need a shift button. the shift function on the Ipac works by detecting two button presses to give you a new option.

An example whould be to holder Player 1's button 7 and press the pause to open the volume control. Or pressing botth P1 and P2 to exit, that sort of thing, you don't actually have a button that is just a SHIFT.

So for your layout you could make yellow the coin button, white p1 and p2 buttons, and blue the pause, and then have P1&P2 together to be exit.

You don't need a pause, but I highly recommend it.

[DaveMMR]

Yes ditch the shift button and maybe put a coin on the sides (like where a coin door will go - GroovyGameGear sells coin reject shaped lighted buttons.) You may consider arching the buttons slightly but that's all preference really.

Otherwise looks good.

[CpCaveman]

I agree, dont need the shift button unless you want a hidden one for changing settings/emulators , but use it for exiting a game back to the menu (only button you dont have, and WILL need unless its a one game machine) and if it is going to be a two player cab vertical and horizontal only, you could run them in parallel and free up half your inputs, answered a similar one a while ago on how to do it (see diagram, just wire both player 1 vertical and horizontal buttons to the same inputs then the same with player 2 vert and horiz, loop the ground wires at each station then a dpdt switch would make only one set of controls active) , the switch makes only one set work at a time or if you leave it out both active at the same time, and the spare inputs could be used for other things (volume etc) hope it helps

[PL1]

Welcome aboard, JeebsFat.

Another thing to consider is that for some games, which "coin slot" you use decides which player position gets the credits.

If you want to play Gauntlet and you only have P1 Coin (5) wired up, you will be the Warrior, and can't have a second player join you as Valkyrie (P2), Wizard (P3), or Elf (P4).

Also keep in mind that you can take the games that have cocktail video mode and map the side (P3 + P4) controls to that game so you can play facing eatch other

If you only want 2 players at a time, you can wire the P1 side and P1 front controls in parallel with each other and do the same for the P2 side and front controls.

If you want to be able to have up to 4 people playing at once, step up to the IPac4 so you'll have enough inputs for everyone's controls, coin buttons, and start buttons.

If you choose to use shifted functions, use them sparingly and plan them carefully.


Scott

[JeebsFat]

Wow, thanks for all the help so far here!

I certainly do want 4 player capabilities for gauntlet and such and I initially thought that I could avoid having a player button and a coin button for each player. Maybe that's not the case. I also wanted to keep this thing as small, as cheap, and as minimal as possible, but I just don't want to be stuck with something that is borderline broken by design.

Here were my shift button plans:
shift + coin = exit
shift + 1p = 3p
shift + 2p = 4p
shift + any joystick up or down = volume
shift + any joystick left or right = rotate (I think I want this for non-cocktail-supporting games)
I thought that would be all I need, but I guess I need the 1, 2, 3 and 4 player coinslots... I guess I could set it up like this:
1p + coin = 1p coin
2p + coin = 2p coin
shift + 1p + coin = 3p coin
shift + 2p + coin = 4p coin
But, yeah. This get complicated quick. Is there a way to setup Mame to give a coin to each player on a single coin button push for these particular games? That is, one coin button push gives 4 credits, one for each of the four players. Then it's just up to the player buttons. This might simplify things.

I will want to arch the buttons a bit. Just didn't draw it for some reason.

If I have two buttons mapped to a different command when pressed simultaneously, won't Mame run the command that is triggered by the first of the two buttons that I push, even if just a split second. Maybe this would cause problems? Maybe not?

About putting the coin button on the side. I probably will unless it ends up being used in conjunction with those aforementioned and widely disdained shift commands.

I don't think I plan on implementing a pause button. Those are for my console and pc games! 

Anyway, Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!

[CpCaveman]

Is there a way to setup Mame to give a coin to each player on a single coin button push for these particular games? That is, one coin button push gives 4 credits, one for each of the four players. Then it's just up to the player buttons. This might simplify things.

press the tab key and select the "Input (this game)" and you can set the coin input for each player the same, which will do that

was just asking about how you`re setting up the players, as a 4 player game of gauntlet or ones like it will take some getting used to for the people not facing the right way, make a mock up of your setup with the controls 90 degrees to how the screen is facing and see how it feels, you can work around it with changing joystick setup inputs for those specific games (so the character moves the direction the joystick is pushed as opposed to UP being LEFT (from player 1 vertical positions point of view)

also not sure if mame has an easy way of having two separate control schemes for vertical and horizontal games or whether you`d have to set say for example the 2 horizontal players as the default, then reconfigure the 2 vertical players for all the vertical games, most of the two player games just look at player one and player two inputs so your player 3 and player 4 inputs would have to be configured manually into each game, .....I think that makes sense

[Xiaou2]

Had a unique Tabletop idea the other day based on this post.

 If the table was Round  (or at least half a circle),  you could make it so that the control panels could slide on a track,  then lock in place
depending on where you wanted to play.

 That would eliminate need for 4 control panels,and thus extra controllers , buttons, lighting, artwork, etc.

 I suppose you could keep the table Rectangle, if the track itself had enough of a curve on the corners.

 Another option would be pull-out panels, with a snapping spring lock + a cabled disengage button / lever.

[paigeoliver]

If that is a 15" monitor in the diagram then the cocktail is way too small to comfortable support two sitting players side by side.

[JeebsFat]

Thought I would post a final update. Thanks for your help. Here's the ultimate product:

http://imgur.com/a/o3TnD

[liveplaylearn]

Nice job, JeebsFat!