Obligatory New Builder Post

[Brian Lenz]

Hello and good day.

I have been toying with the idea of building a cabinet for a few years now and I'm trying to make the next steps forward. Upon seeing a few posts around here as well as one particular photo on the Redditmachine, I have decided I'm going to forego a real cabinet and take a shot at a single Control Panel.

I would love to do this because generally I don't have many people coming to my place to play, rather I make the trek to others for LANs or just chilling. It would be excellent to lug a somewhat small Panel and partake in some Gauntlet or Mortal Kombat or any of the many games MAME has to offer.

And here's where the questions start.

I don't have a boatload of experience when it comes to the "classics". I played The Simpsons, Gauntlet, and some of the Marvel vs Capcom games (just the machines at my local bowling alley). I've seen many complaints about "Frankenpanels", and I'd be pretty keen to avoid an ugly Panel. I don't really have any drive to play Tron (which seems to be the biggest culprit when it comes to the Frankenpanels), but are there some other games that I should look to include?

I remember seeing somewhere a site that allows me to pick out games and will list all the components required to play, but I can't find it again for the life of me.

And finally, where do I buy? I can't seem to find any sort of resource here on the forums for where it's recommended to be buying parts. Are there good hobby-shop sort of sites I should be looking at? I've spotted a few guide sort of sites/videos recommending certain products, but most links they provide are outdated and don't take me anywhere.


It's incredible seeing all the creations this forum has made (even from only a few days of lurking around here), and I'm very excited to get started on my own project.

[Monkeyvoodoo]

Welcome !

I remember seeing somewhere a site that allows me to pick out games and will list all the components required to play, but I can't find it again for the life of me.

I've never heard of any site like that but from my own experience six buttons and an 8 way joystick per player should be enough for 99% of the available games. Some games require a 4 way joystick but an 8 way can do the job or you can use a switchable joystick that let's you go from 4 to 8 way.

And finally, where do I buy? I can't seem to find any sort of resource here on the forums for where it's recommended to be buying parts. Are there good hobby-shop sort of sites I should be looking at? I've spotted a few guide sort of sites/videos recommending certain products, but most links they provide are outdated and don't take me anywhere.

www.ultimarc.com and www.grooveygamergear.com should be able to supply you with everything you need. Both owners are members here too!


Sent from a pineapple under the sea

[PL1]

Welcome aboard, Brian.

are there some other games that I should look to include?

Here's a good place to start.

I remember seeing somewhere a site that allows me to pick out games and will list all the components required to play, but I can't find it again for the life of me.

Since you're doing a standalone/portable panel instead of a cab, you might consider:

-- A Graphical User Interface (GUI) build of MAME like MAMEUIFX or MAMEUI -- no front end software to mess with 

-- Support and artwork files like History.dat, MAMEinfo.dat, and Progetto snaps (control panels, screenshots, cabs, etc) -- you can find these and other resource links at http://www.mameworld.info/

-- A thumb drive with a backup of your emulator setup including art files, etc.

Another way to see what a game requires is to launch the game and press tab to bring up the menus, the "Input (this game)" menu shows the inputs for that game.   

And finally, where do I buy? I can't seem to find any sort of resource here on the forums for where it's recommended to be buying parts.

The "big four" suppliers are:
Groovy Game Gear (RandyT)
Paradise Arcade (Armi0024)
Ultimarc (Andy Warne)
ArcadeEmulator.net (Divemaster127)

They should carry most of your arcade-related needs, but there are many other reputable vendors to consider as well.

As you plan your build, keep an eye on the various threads and when someone recommends a vendor, bookmark the site in your browser. (I keep several bookmark folders with vendors, specific parts, art sources, etc)

It's incredible seeing all the creations this forum has made (even from only a few days of lurking around here), and I'm very excited to get started on my own project.

Lots of good stuff to read and learn around here.

One thing that will influence your choice of admin buttons is that instead of a cab or bartop you are building a portable/standalone that will connect to your friends' systems as well as your own.

You may want/need more admin buttons than the typical build around here.

For your consideration, this is a diagram of the admin panel on my portable/modular.




Scott

[Brian Lenz]

Since you're doing a standalone/portable panel instead of a cab, you might consider:

-- A Graphical User Interface (GUI) build of MAME like MAMEUIFX or MAMEUI -- no front end software to mess with 

I'm sure that using these GUIs would be much easier, but what is the benefit aside from easier setup of using these? You seem to allude to a portable not being ideal to handle a "standard" sort of Front End software (it seems most every build I've seen on here is probably using some Front End).

I haven't gotten much down on paper yet in terms of design, but in my head, I would be able to finagle some way to have standard peripherals (keyboard/mouse), either plugged in, or included in the Panel somehow (obviously not a visible keyboard, that would be gross). Would that change your opinion on using a GUI based MAME?

Following that point, in terms of design, where should I be looking to do that? I don't think I have any version of CAD or something similar available to me. Are those sorts of programs required or superfluous?



And thanks to both of you for the prompt responses =]

[shponglefan]

Welcome aboard Brian!

Your first build sounds pretty similar to my first build: I built a basic two player control panel (2 joysticks, 7 buttons each).

I'd echo what Monkeyvoodoo said: an 8 way joystick and at least 6 buttons will allow you play almost all available arcade games (although some like myself prefer the 7 button Neo-Geo/Capcom hybrid layout).  And if you aren't planning to play much of the classic 4-way joystick games (i.e. Pacman, Donkey Kong, Frogger, etc), then I wouldn't even worry about 4-way joystick options.

Out of curiosity are you planning a single player panel or two player?

One thing you will find is there are a plethora of options when it comes to joysticks and buttons.  I'd try to narrow it down to a couple options for each, then buying both (i.e. couple different types of joysticks, couple different types of buttons) to try out.  I also highly recommend prototyping your joystick/button layout before building the full panel.  One thing I have noticed from some poster's builds is they get everything done and then decide they either don't like the layout or joystick or whatever.  Better to figure all that stuff out beforehand then after you've completed all the work.

[PL1]

I'm sure that using these GUIs would be much easier, but what is the benefit aside from easier setup of using these?

As you indicate, it's easier to setup/configure the GUI vs. command line MAME + a front end.

Most guys that build a cab want the user interface to maintain the illusion by looking and behaving like a real arcade cab which the GUI builds don't do very well since they look and behave like a Windows program.

If there's no cab, there's no illusion to maintain.   

You seem to allude to a portable not being ideal to handle a "standard" sort of Front End software (it seems most every build I've seen on here is probably using some Front End).

A control panel (fixed or portable) is just a fancy keyboard/mouse/gamepad.

The main difference between fixed and portable is in the degree of customization and front end integration you can apply.

With a portable panel you are more likely to use default settings so you can more easily connect to different friends' systems.

With fixed panel setups you can customize them more since you aren't playing mix and match.

I haven't gotten much down on paper yet in terms of design, but in my head, I would be able to finagle some way to have standard peripherals (keyboard/mouse), either plugged in, or included in the Panel somehow (obviously not a visible keyboard, that would be gross). Would that change your opinion on using a GUI based MAME?

Doesn't change my opinion, but my opinion isn't the important one here.

If you don't like the look of any of the GUI builds, you can choose any FE you want.

If you design a panel that includes a trackball, joystick, 6-7 buttons, and the admin panel above, you can do tons of stuff like launching programs, browsing the web, switching windows with P1B2 (Alt) + Menu (Tab), switching browser tabs with P1B1 (Ctrl) + Menu (Tab), etc.

You might want to include an unpowered hub and some Neutrik USB feedthrus -- one to connect the hub to a removable external USB cable (see the link in my sig) and one or two that you can use for gamepads for additional players.

Following that point, in terms of design, where should I be looking to do that? I don't think I have any version of CAD or something similar available to me. Are those sorts of programs required or superfluous?

No need for any fancy CAD software.

Sketchup is available for free if you want to do 3-D design.

Check out Gozer's sketchup cab collection here and there are other people who have models in the warehouse for just about every type of arcade control you might want to add to your panel.

Most of my designs are even simpler than that -- 1:1 PowerPoint like the admin diagram above.   


Scott

[EightBySix]

Are you making a control panel that will connect to a PC running mame, or will this be an all in one with a PC board that you just need to plug into a tv when on your travels?

[Brian Lenz]

Are you making a control panel that will connect to a PC running mame, or will this be an all in one with a PC board that you just need to plug into a tv when on your travels?

I plan on having it an all encompassing Panel. Ideally only having a power cable and HDMI running to a TV.

[drventure]

Are you making a control panel that will connect to a PC running mame, or will this be an all in one with a PC board that you just need to plug into a tv when on your travels?

I plan on having it an all encompassing Panel. Ideally only having a power cable and HDMI running to a TV.

I initially wanted to go in that direction too. I got pretty far into the build and realized that a standalone cabinet works much better, and is just more "attractive" to guests that might be interested in playing. Granted a CP only solution seems like it'd save space and all, but I decided that the hassle of trying to store a big panel was just too much.

That's just my 2c though. A 4 player panel really has ended up being overkill for me too. If I did it over, I'd go with a pretty standard cab design (or refurb an existing cab), and do a simple 2 player panel, with maybe a trackball and spinner.

Regardless, though, welcome aboard! It's certainly a lot of fun putting these cabs together!

[PL1]

Are you making a control panel that will connect to a PC running mame, or will this be an all in one with a PC board that you just need to plug into a tv when on your travels?

I plan on having it an all encompassing Panel. Ideally only having a power cable and HDMI running to a TV.

Disregard my earlier comments.

I thought you were just planning a USB controller instead of a self-contained portable system minus the monitor.


Scott

[Brian Lenz]

I initially wanted to go in that direction too. I got pretty far into the build and realized that a standalone cabinet works much better, and is just more "attractive" to guests that might be interested in playing. Granted a CP only solution seems like it'd save space and all, but I decided that the hassle of trying to store a big panel was just too much.

The main reason I'm looking to do a portable Control Panel, is purely because I won't be playing games solo, and usually not at my own home. Frequently, I go to LANs or just to hang out with other people, and lugging a decent sized Panel isn't too big of a hassle for me (plenty of trunk space, and plenty of helping hands). It will be a 4 player Panel because the big draw for me has always been the 4 player games: Gauntlet, Simpsons, TMNT.  I probably wouldn't even have the Panel "displayed" when it's at my house, and probably just tossed in a back room or closet space. If and when I actually have guests, pull 'er out for the night, and toss it back when we're done.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a standalone Cabinet, but I'm not really looking for an "authentic" experience necessarily just yet. Perhaps down the road if this build goes well, I'd look into a full cabinet that looks truly gorgeous.

For now, it's all about functionality.

[drventure]

The main reason I'm looking to do a portable Control Panel, is purely because I won't be playing games solo, and usually not at my own home.

Ahhh.. Well, that makes sense. Not sure how big you plan your panel to be but mine is a fairly normal 4p panel, and it's just at 4' wide. You might get away with a bit smaller dropping the trackball, but not a whole lot.

And mine is freakin' +heavy+. If you use 3/4 MDF, you might have a similar issue.

Looking forward to what you come up with, in any case!

[nick3092]

If you want the flexibility of a 4 player panel, but you may not use all 4 players every time, you could consider building separate "parent"/"child" panels.  The "parent" panel would have controls for 2 players and house all your electrical components.  Then wire up your interface for P3 and 4 to some form of a jack (or jacks as needed) and then build a smaller panel for both P3 and 4 that just has sicks/buttons and a cable to connect to the parent.  Or even separate smaller panels for 3 and 4 (2 child panels).  Separating them out gives you the flexibility of letting people spread out a bit, instead of trying to all cram in on a couch or something.

Sort of like a modular panel, but portable.  You could also do things like put the trackball on it's own child panel with a couple buttons to help keep the size down of the parent panel you would primarily be transporting.  Especially if you don't play that many trackball games, but still want to be able to from time to time.

[Brian Lenz]

If you want the flexibility of a 4 player panel, but you may not use all 4 players every time, you could consider building separate "parent"/"child" panels.  The "parent" panel would have controls for 2 players and house all your electrical components.  Then wire up your interface for P3 and 4 to some form of a jack (or jacks as needed) and then build a smaller panel for both P3 and 4 that just has sicks/buttons and a cable to connect to the parent.  Or even separate smaller panels for 3 and 4 (2 child panels).  Separating them out gives you the flexibility of letting people spread out a bit, instead of trying to all cram in on a couch or something.

Sort of like a modular panel, but portable.  You could also do things like put the trackball on it's own child panel with a couple buttons to help keep the size down of the parent panel you would primarily be transporting.  Especially if you don't play that many trackball games, but still want to be able to from time to time.

This all seems like a wonderful idea, but seems like it may be adding a bit too much complexity I'd be willing to handle for my first build. I have a fairly strong understanding of electronics and wiring (especially with the amount of excellent tutorials 'round this site in particular), but adding in additional ports and plugs for a more modular design seems a bit out of my skill range as it stands. It would be an excellent second or third build for sure.

[shponglefan]

^ Actually, building two (or more) control panels shouldn't be any more difficult than building only one.  If you put a seperate controller/encoder in the "child" panel, you could connect it to the main panel with just a USB cable.

[paigeoliver]

4 player usually isn't worth the trouble. I have owned multiple 4 player games and watched as people played them 2 at a time rather than squeezing in for 4 player action. I am finally biting the bullet and building a 4 player Mame cabinet but that is ONLY because a converted gauntlet fell into my lap as part of a truckload buy and because my daughter and her cousins will be game playing age in a few years.

My suggested first build is a simple Streetfighter layout with a trackball in the middle. I would suggest Happ supers if you want to go cheap and perfect 360s if you want to spend big. Both have very balanced areas of movement that translate well to a large variety of games.

You will probably want to follow this up with a vertical mounted cabinet with a 4-way joystick so you can play Ms. Pac and Dig Dug and the like.