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Author Topic: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine  (Read 8663 times)

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Chris John Hunter

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How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« on: June 22, 2013, 09:55:17 am »



I have been looking for a company where I can buy a upright kit or full machine ready to play Mame.

I spent days talking options to Craig at Turnarcades. I had selected all my options , all ready to go.

Then I read on here about how a customer set up a webpage specifically to ---smurfette--- about his experiences with Craig and his team and how poor the build was.

I gave Craig the benefit of being straight with him.


I said, It had thrown me and could he reassure me that if I had genuine and reasonable issues with my machine he would do his best to sort them? Then he told me how he was the UKs best.


Then I said ok, I will order a full built kit minus the PC and internals - The reason being that when I pay upwards of £1000 I expect to get at least a 30 day warranty . And also, if there were the odd issue with it, because it was at a lower price point and that I had built it, I wouldn't have any issue.


Despite repeatedly telling me of their professional build quality, superb hand made craftmanship and how they are 'Europes no.1' he doesn't seem very confident in the quality of those builds.


But when I put in my order for the kit, he says hes far too busy, my expectations would probably not be met by the quality of the build and finish and fobbed me off with all this , you're expectations are too high/were too busy/etc. I wanted my machine in Dec and was happy to pay by instant transfer in 4 payments. He would have had the total balance by Early August. I didn't expect him to build/deliver/work on the project until after I had paid the full balance. So I am bemused as to why he had a go and did this.

I spend 'literally' all of last night selecting my options and sorting the artwork. I went to bed very tired only to wake up and get a fb message telling me what I have just said. I can't believe people act like this.


Well all I can say is, I am glad I didn't pay the original £1530 ( 2360USD ) now because if that's how he talks to customers I would rather not be his customer.  He may have slagged me off on here already for all I know and I am sure he will now slag me off to all and sundry at retro events. Which is very poor. All I wanted was a decent machine and is it not the customer's right to select his options and to check hes not being ripped off?

What a jerk.

CJ Hunter(Vince W)
« Last Edit: June 22, 2013, 12:17:25 pm by Chris John Hunter »

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2013, 02:41:48 pm »

Ark, if you read what I put. I did try to buy. Just that when I found out he doesn't do any kind of warranty at all not even 30 days or any kind of support I wanted to switch to a full kit (painted, full artwork, buttons, joys) because £1530 / twenty three hundred dollars is a bit much for no support / warranty at all.

His website says all about the handcrafted cutting edge professional service but ironically, there's no aftersales. So that's why I switched. 


He then got a bit shirty and refused my order. Which would still have been around the £850-£900 / 1300+ dollar mark.

I spent the whole of last night working on the Mrs Pac Man Multi Bezel and Marquee. And putting my options of buttons / joys together.


Quite an upsetting experience in reality. I think the guy needs a few books on customer service. :dunno
I might have changing my mind on options, but as he had not had any expenses / started the build there was no need for that.

« Last Edit: June 22, 2013, 02:47:15 pm by Chris John Hunter »

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2013, 02:44:15 pm »
It was a Tron themed cab that convinced me to order because I saw on youtube an awesome finish. But to refuse my order in such a way was incredibly disappointing. More disappointed than angry. I had images of Mrs Pac Man theme and me playing Bubble Bobble.


Have to take my money elsewhere. :angry:

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2013, 02:49:50 pm »
Altered Mrs. Pac

chopperthedog

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2013, 03:20:13 pm »
Sad but true, salespeople will let sales walk if they feel the sale will just end up being a headache in the long run. I've done it myself, but I was in the position to TO (turn over) the sale to a less suspecting salesperson that would end up spending tons of time with the person and doing a bunch of coddling over the phone only to have the idiot return the item anyway. Just sounds like he doesn't have any tact with walking a deal. :p


good day.

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2013, 03:25:33 pm »
That's true Chopper. He can afford to when the going's good. I am not going to go on other than say I hope he has times when the cold is biting and the going isn't so good and he thinks of all the people he has slapped in the face.

Good Day

JDFan

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2013, 04:41:53 pm »
I'm not trying to sound like a dick (others might argue) but Craig is in the business of selling flat pack cabinets. 

Then why is the Who are we section of his website not designed for selling flat packs but instead states :

Quote
Turnarcades are home-based arcade builders based in the West Midlands, England. We custom build video arcade and entertainment machines based around home PC architecture. Our unique machines are designed to replicate authentic arcade machines as closely as possible to bring the ‘old school’ arcade experience home, but also take advantage of the power, capacity, flexibility and customisable properties of modern home PC technology.

Turnarcades can custom build any arcade machine to your specific requirements. With our dedicated on-site workshop we are able to bring the arcade feel you remember right into your home at a cost you can afford.

We can supply anything from kit’s to empty shell’s to full arcade machines with all the same level of quality.

If you have any questions or price enquires the please feel free to contact us craig@turnarcades.co.uk

Seems to me he is trying to promote selling "Full arcade machines" designed to the end users Specs not just DIY flatpacks !  If that is the case then he should expect it to take some time and patience to get it to a point that the buyer and him are on the same page with the design and his pricing seems to reflect that he is including the needed time to make it that way -- If he didn't want to work with customers to get a full build built to their wishes then he shouldn't emphasize the ability to do so in his adverts. 

RandyT

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2013, 08:13:38 pm »
First, let me be clear that I'm not defending or condemning anyone, as I don't know 100% of the situation.  But maybe I can offer my take on what might have happened.

Most sellers, over time, will be able to predict an outcome based on past dealings with the thing that is "human nature".  When an individual approaches a situation, typically it starts out from a "neutral" position colored  by whatever expectations they may have based on the sellers' reputation.  Obviously, if those expectations are very low, an individual would typically decide to go elsewhere unless there were perks involved, such as a lower than market value cost, or similar.

I think what may have thrown up the red flags was the amount of time he had already spent with you prior to purchase and perhaps the feeling conveyed, after the fact, that you were wary about doing business with him, based on the experiences of another individual.  At that point, it's not a stretch to surmise that you might already be expecting to find a problem with his work, before he was given the opportunity to demonstrate what he could do for you.  And, as anyone knows, there is no such thing as "perfect", and when one looks hard enough for faults, however small or insignificant they may be, they will be found. 

No company can continue to exist by deliberately putting themselves into positions which they believe will lead to failure on their part no matter how hard they try.  This is especially so for smaller companies, like the ones who literally devote their every waking hour to servicing a smaller community like this one, and don't have the high volumes or staff to pick up the slack.  So when faced with the prospect of probably spending more resources than whatever profit they might make on a sale, to meet what they feel might end up being unreasonable expectations, the only option they have is to let the sale walk.  It's not an ideal solution, and perhaps it didn't happen in the best way here, but it can help to keep the lights on and the family fed.

Personally, I don't do this, even to my own detriment.  In the extremely rare instance where we have an unhappy customer, it is never one who buys hundreds of dollars worth of components for their "dream" control panels.  These good folks have the money to spend, and are buying the highest quality parts, so expectations are usually exceeded.  The issues always seem to be with customers with little money to spend, and who purchase as few of the least expensive components possible, expecting the results to perform like full-blown panels with parts costing several times more.  As I have personally been in those shoes, I try to be understanding and spend the time to offer guidance, support and ways to maximize what they have, even though the profit from the sale went away after the first of several email exchanges.  But it's something I choose to do, and not all are able whilst continuing to be there for the next person who needs their services.

Again, I have no affiliation with Craig whatsoever and don't know him (even though I believe we share the same last name :) ) but I thought I might be able to offer some insight as to why your experience could have gone the way it did.  My advice is "listen to Ark".  Buy a flat-pack (from wherever you feel comfortable) and outfit it the way you want.  That way, you will have full control over the quality of the end result, and learn many valuable skills along the way.

RandyT
« Last Edit: June 22, 2013, 08:29:21 pm by RandyT »

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2013, 08:48:06 pm »
Lads, ill be clear. I wasn't messing him about. Yes, your right I know what you mean Arc and Randy (Awesome Avatar BTW)
I know what you mean you mean he thought oh here we go...

When it wasn't like that at all from my point of view. I just wanted value for money. Not something extra for my money. JD the website says custom options this / that. Extras this that. So
you know flexibility I expect to be a bit of in that.

It said say, deluxe custom art design and I would have paid for it. But I only wanted my existing art adapted to fit., which considering what it was and its res wouldn't have been too much of a headache.

I know everyone bumps into the odd ---Bad words, bad words, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when saint censors you?--- in the retro scene. We all have. But that wasn't the case. Was why I was so naffed off. I've cooled a bit now. But I wasn't happy spending my whole night doing art only to get told to **** off.

Arc. I was trying to do that plus extras that would have been paid for. At the rates quoted.

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2013, 08:54:48 pm »


Randy. I wasn't wanting the earth. I am someone who is easy. I just wanted to order. I had 2300+ dollars on the table then realized there was no warranty. then said ok, what about a kit with custom art. Which is what is one of the options on the website that's all. I was ADDING extras PAYED extras OPTIONS on the site to my order. I didn't ask him to do anything that wasn't part of what he offers.

Although I did ask for some purple buttons. Surely a builder can source a few purple buttons.

Anyway I am going to draw a line under it and get a flatpack and build it myself.  :cheers:  Cheers for your thoughts guys and all of them valid.



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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2013, 09:06:56 pm »
Randy. I wasn't wanting the earth. I am someone who is easy. I just wanted to order. I had 2300+ dollars on the table then realized there was no warranty. then said ok, what about a kit with custom art. Which is what is one of the options on the website that's all. I was ADDING extras PAYED extras OPTIONS on the site to my order. I didn't ask him to do anything that wasn't part of what he offers.

In that case, he missed a good opportunity.  Perceptions can be funny things, and like Ark stated, maybe he was having a bad week, possibly with another customer.

Good luck on your build!  :cheers:

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2013, 09:44:11 pm »
Thanks Randy. is GGG your site? I keep hearing about GGG buttons. Do you deliver to the UK?

RandyT

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2013, 09:49:08 pm »
Thanks Randy. is GGG your site? I keep hearing about GGG buttons. Do you deliver to the UK?

Yes, and about every other day :).

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2013, 10:00:44 pm »
Your buttons have nice colours (colors)  :cheers: I will check them out. In the morning. Its 3am here.  ::)

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2013, 05:00:56 am »
You have many options that are far cheaper than what you were looking at, and your end result will probably be better than you think!

  • Buy an old empty or stripped arcade cabinet from craigslist or similar swap/trader. Outfit it with a pc you build from reading these forums. Don't be shy, ask for advice!
  • Make your own arcade cabinet. Do lots of reading in the wood working section.
  • Ask a local friend or shop to help you build the arcade cabinet. They might be intrigued by the project and help you for fairly cheap. If you know no one, definitely post in craigslist or similar swap/trader.

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2013, 05:25:49 am »
Interesting I had a similar experience when trying to buy a kit from Turnarcades, it was near impossible to get them to reply to any messages, let alone place an order, when Craig did eventually send me a reply it was full of excuses, not any way to run a professional business.

On the upside I have built my cabinet from scratch to my specification and looking at taking Turnarcades on at there own game (no pun intended), my Arcade Flashback business is in the planning stages as we speak.

x-factor

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2013, 10:00:19 am »
I couldn't manage to get kit from Turnarcades either, you had to arrange your own delivery that made it way to expensive.

I ended up getting a bare cabinet from the Retropit, worked out way cheaper and it came with free delivery and was pre built.

http://www.theretropit.com/product_info.php?products_id=32

Allows you to pick and choose your controls/artwork suppliers save some more cash.

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2013, 06:48:48 am »
I ended up getting a bare cabinet from the Retropit, worked out way cheaper and it came with free delivery and was pre built.

http://www.theretropit.com/product_info.php?products_id=32

Sorry to derail, but how is the quality of the cabinet? The Donkey Kong one caught my eye.

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2013, 10:13:03 am »
Sorry to derail, but how is the quality of the cabinet? The Donkey Kong one caught my eye.

I think it's great but then I don't have the skills to make my own. There's a couple of chips in the laminate around the t moulding but you'd probably only notice if your looking for problems. The cabinet is made of chipboard so all the cutouts (speakers and vents) have the chipboard showing if that bothered you it might be a pain trying to paint over it, but for me it's fine and for <£300 I don't think you can complain. The delivery man didn't have much interest in bringing it in the house so you might want a helping hand around during delivery if you need to manhandle it anywhere.

It had a few nice touches like rubber matting, castors/wheels and marquee retainers which I wasn't expecting and saved me coming up with bad DIY solutions.

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2013, 11:36:55 am »


Agree with all the latest comments. Basically what i've done chaps. Got a bartop plan and got it CNC'd.
I have half built it now. And when I have done I will have one of the flatpack's from either Retropit or ArcadeWorldUK. And get it sorted.

My problem is, I can do all the computery. Software. Own front end etc. But Art, and I brought a load of Vinyl only to find you had to do a whole lot of work just to get a decent finish with it. So I will buy a black flatpack upright. Then I will get my art printed on thick scratch resistent material that I can trim with a precision knife and then trim. Or I might go sod it. Find someone in the uk who can do the vinyl / art application and bung that person a ton to do it for me.



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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2013, 12:00:07 pm »
Or I might go sod it. Find someone in the uk who can do the vinyl / art application and bung that person a ton to do it for me.

Check with a local sign company.  Just about everything in the sign biz nowadays is vinyl, so these guys will probably be the best bet for something like this.

Nephasth

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2013, 12:00:54 pm »
This one time... I built a custom CP for a member here... There won't be a next time...

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2013, 12:09:07 pm »

Oh, the verbs in this thread...

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2013, 07:07:48 pm »
This one time... I built a custom CP for a member here... There won't be a next time...

 :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2013, 08:05:32 pm »
Thanks Randy. The Bartop is coming together now. Doesn't seem to be anyone in the UK that does specifically art for Arcades. Missing a trick mefinks.  :cheers:

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #25 on: June 24, 2013, 08:18:35 pm »
due to boredom i made it yellow... :P


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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #26 on: June 24, 2013, 08:30:44 pm »
This one time... I built a custom CP for a member here... There won't be a next time...



I wonder who?   :o
yeah.... paste bin of pm or email interactions or it didn't happen.



good day.

Nephasth

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #27 on: June 24, 2013, 08:38:44 pm »
This one time... I built a custom CP for a member here... There won't be a next time...



I wonder who?   :o

Just some dude that enjoys urinating on wedding dresses. Oops... I've said too much.

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #28 on: June 24, 2013, 08:56:09 pm »
This one time... I built a custom CP for a member here... There won't be a next time...



I wonder who?   :o
yeah.... paste bin of pm or email interactions or it didn't happen.



good day.

Oh, it happened. Spectacularly, even.
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #29 on: June 25, 2013, 07:11:34 am »
Thanks Randy. is GGG your site? I keep hearing about GGG buttons. Do you deliver to the UK?

Yes, and about every other day :).

hey randy just got my t-mould and slot cutter bit. Excellent quality by the way.
just wondering when you will be getting more electric ice buttons in?  I would like to put happ plungers in them so I just get the (ring) glow effect.
thanks in advance...... your aussie arcade brother stavros 8)
my first build classic style upright cabinet..... MARVELOUS FIGHTER (FINISHED) http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,133066.0.html

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #30 on: June 25, 2013, 02:55:35 pm »
Thanks Randy. The Bartop is coming together now. Doesn't seem to be anyone in the UK that does specifically art for Arcades. Missing a trick mefinks.  :cheers:

Just generate the file, and take it to someone who does vehicle wraps.  They'll have the proper equipment to do it right, and they will probably consider it a "small job" :)


hey randy just got my t-mould and slot cutter bit. Excellent quality by the way.
just wondering when you will be getting more electric ice buttons in?  I would like to put happ plungers in them so I just get the (ring) glow effect.

Yes, the cutters are very high quality.  I just used one again the the other day, after having not done it in a while, and was reminded of how easily they move through the wood, and the quality of the slot.

EI2's should be here in a day or two.  The RGB-Drives are taking longer than I was told it would, so they will be a few more days.  But I'm afraid the HAPP plungers won't fit them, as the CLASSX buttons are a unique design of ours.  You would need to use the plungers from a black CLASSX button to do this.  If you want to buy some without switches, I can apply a bit of a discount.

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #31 on: June 25, 2013, 08:10:04 pm »
This one time... I built a custom CP for a member here... There won't be a next time...



I wonder who?   :o

Just some dude that enjoys urinating on wedding dresses. Oops... I've said too much.

At the same time, I would pass on doing a project for the seller as well. Way too high maintenance and far too "I've proven this" and "I'll remind you" while at the same time not knowing even the basics. Too much potential for buyer dissatisfaction to be worth the effort.  :-\

Well you don't know that. And you're making that prediction out of nothingness.

No, I make that prediction based on years of experience and pretty much everything that you posted in this thread.

I hope that the panel turns out brilliantly for you and have complete faith in Neph -- for me, it just wouldn't be worth the potential hassle (and I'm the guy who is putting together a cab for somebody for free!)

 ;)
Working: Not Enough
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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #32 on: June 25, 2013, 08:18:49 pm »
Ahh yes, the guy that thought it would be a good idea to store his "things that go bang" in his arcade cabs.

moron.

Also his videos were weird. I was more focused in on the background and how he lived like a slob.


good day.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 08:22:41 pm by chopperthedog »

Nephasth

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #33 on: June 25, 2013, 09:16:01 pm »
At the same time, I would pass on doing a project for the seller as well. Way too high maintenance and far too "I've proven this" and "I'll remind you" while at the same time not knowing even the basics. Too much potential for buyer dissatisfaction to be worth the effort.  :-\

Well you don't know that. And you're making that prediction out of nothingness.

No, I make that prediction based on years of experience and pretty much everything that you posted in this thread.

I hope that the panel turns out brilliantly for you and have complete faith in Neph -- for me, it just wouldn't be worth the potential hassle (and I'm the guy who is putting together a cab for somebody for free!)

 ;)

I hope that the panel turns out brilliantly for you and have complete faith in Neph --

Ouch...

...again.

TopJimmyCooks

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #34 on: June 25, 2013, 10:58:50 pm »
After years of working with potential customers for my gc business, I can tell when a client will be super abrasive and arbitrary from the get go.  They have to be willing to learn a little about what they're buying to get best value and the most satisfaction.  Sometimes I hold my nose (and their hand) because times are lean.  Sometimes I'm busy and I gently pass on their work by giving them a price I'd be happy to work for them for.  Even with my best filtration efforts, about one out of 5 jobs is a major pain in the rear.   This is fairly constant throughout the commercial construction world.  We also have repeat business to factor in, while in the arcade game a first sale is rare enough - repeats are unlikely.  Some contractors have a full on reputation for being dirty and nasty to people and they still get work for some reason. 

When I do a pinball game or arcade or whatever and decide to sell it, I do it my way, then post it for sale as-is, take it or leave it.  Doing a full custom job on a $2000 item is a loser's game.  Neither the buyer or seller will end up happy. 

Chris John Hunter

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #35 on: June 25, 2013, 11:13:22 pm »
On this. I would like to say, anything I was asking for custom, was an Option On A Drop Down List nothing but that, and every option selected adjusted the price accordingly. The only thing I actually wanted custom was the art and I was delivering those files myself so all they had to do was print them. It was the NO WARRANTY WHATSOEVER that made me balk. Thank you.

Also, I seem to have missed a whole chunk of history here.  :dizzy:

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #36 on: June 25, 2013, 11:14:26 pm »
Jim, I would appreciate you reading my original post.  :cheers:

mgb

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How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #37 on: June 26, 2013, 12:12:49 am »
I don't know, to me it sounds like turnarcades was at fault here, at least judging by your side of the story.
A lot of times when someone complains about a vendor, there are little hints in their own story that kinda show they are jerks and I don't see that here.
Turnarcades site shows full custom cabinets. The customer here went through and selected options, where's the pain in the ass customer component here?
If the cabinets are so great ( and truthfully I'm not impressed with what I see on their site) why no warranty?

I guess the real test will be if your next thread starts with a story of how randy backs out of selling you buttons :)
« Last Edit: June 26, 2013, 12:14:39 am by mgb »

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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #38 on: June 26, 2013, 01:02:16 am »
It's been a while since Turnarcades has posted here. I'd like to hear his side (not that I don't believe you, CJ, you've been a solid member so far, but I always like to hear both sides in cases like this).
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Re: How Not To Order an Arcade Machine
« Reply #39 on: June 26, 2013, 02:26:37 am »
I'm sure an arcade cabinet ordered over the internet would be covered by the Distance Selling Regulations here in the UK, so you would have at least 7 days to claim your money back should there be problems. Here's a link to the official guide http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/general/oft913.pdf