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Author Topic: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor  (Read 4196 times)

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rock145

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I have an arcade cabinet that has a neiman displays 27 inch analog trisync monitor. I have it set up with arcadevga3000, however, I got tire of the limited resolution that AVG3000 displays. Most games with mame gives me scramble screens and jumping graphics. If I set it up to display only on 640x480 resolution everything its fine but I really like to have native resolutions. I search online and found out that with groovymame and an ATI card I can have more than 120 modelines of resolution. Can someone Advice me on a good ati card that for groovymame. Please tell me which of the ati family will gives me the most modelines resolutions or are they all the same. I heard about R 9250, R X300, R X600 and 4xxx series of this which one will give me the most resolution alternatives? I saw something about 200 modelines but forgot where.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 03:53:12 pm by rock145 »

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2013, 11:20:52 pm »
There are two versions of CRT_EmuDriver, one based on Catalyst 6.5,
to support older Radeon cards, and one based on Catalyst 9.3, to
support newer cards. Both have their versions for Windows XP-32 and
XP-64. Some cards are supported by both 6.5 and 9.3 versions, so it
is up to the user to choose one or another:

Catalyst 6.5: ATI Radeon 7000, 7200, 7500, 8500, 9000, 9100,
                         9200, 9250, 9500, 9550, 9600, 9700,
                         9800, X300, X550, X600, X700, X800,
                         X850, X1300, X1600, X1800, X1900,
                         X1950, ArcadeVGA 9200/9250, etc.

Catalyst 9.3: ATI Radeon 9500, 9550, 9600, 9700, 9800, X300,
                         X550, X600, X700, X740, X800, X850,
                         X1050, X1200, X1300, X1550, X1600,
                         X1650, X1800, X1900, X1950, HD 2350,
                         HD 2400, HD 2600, HD 2900, HD 3200,
                         HD 3300, HD 3400, HD 3410, HD 3450,
                         HD 3550, HD 3570, HD 3600, HD 3610,
                         HD 3690, HD 3730, HD 3750, HD 3800,
                         HD 3830, HD 3850, HD 3870, HD 4230,
                         HD 4250, HD 4350, HD 4550, HD 4570,
                         HD 4580, HD 4650, HD 4670, HD 4730,
                         HD 4750, HD 4800, HD 4850, HD 4870,
                         HD 4890, etc.

Some cards listed above have known problems with low dot clocks.
For best results, a Radeon 9250 (AGP), Radeon X300-X600 (PCIe),
or Radeon HD 4xxx (PCIe) card is recommended.

More details (in Spanish):
http://postback.geedorah.com/foros/viewtopic.php?id=1424

Translated to English via Google Translate:
http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=es&tl=en&
u=http://postback.geedorah.com/foros/viewtopic.php?id=1424


More info here!

http://mame.3feetunder.com/windows-ati-crt-emudriver/

I have used two cards x550 worked perfectly silent too, 1000000% better then an ArcadeVGA (i own this aswell)

However i wanted to run things other then mame (late model Games)
So i got the best card supported by groovymame HD4890  runs perfectly!

Pros of the HD4890 over the x550
can play late model games and supports
Cons
Loud produces alot of Heat  and requires alot of power!



rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2013, 02:40:09 pm »
Thanks for the reply. I have an inspiron 530 on my cabinet : intel core 2 duo 2.33 with 4 gigs of ram the max watts the power supply has it 350 so I cant get the ati 4850. However, I was thinking of getting this one on ebay http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150396  . I wan to be able to play project 64 and playstion 1 emu .  Can this card play streetfighter 4 on 640x480?

epicfatigue

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2013, 05:37:26 pm »
my x550 did so i am sure that one will no isses!

rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2013, 05:56:25 pm »
Thanks for your help. Once I get the card I'll post again to see if there is an improvement. Hopefully I won't have to deal with scramble graphics with my monitor.

rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2013, 06:22:54 pm »

krick

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2013, 12:19:34 am »

Can a dell x600 card be use with hack drivers for modlines here is the link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/ATI-F9595-DELL-RADEON-X600-256MB-PCI-E-GRAPHICS-CARD-/180983149248?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a236fb2c0


I think that card will probably work, but it has a DMS-59 port...

https://www.google.com/search?q=DMS-59

...so you'll need a DMS-59 to VGA adapter cable.


This X600 XT might be a better choice for $25 including shipping, though it's not "new"...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/330868389856
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rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2013, 01:03:41 pm »

Can a dell x600 card be use with hack drivers for modlines here is the link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/ATI-F9595-DELL-RADEON-X600-256MB-PCI-E-GRAPHICS-CARD-/180983149248?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a236fb2c0


I think that card will probably work, but it has a DMS-59 port...

https://www.google.com/search?q=DMS-59

...so you'll need a DMS-59 to VGA adapter cable.


This X600 XT might be a better choice for $25 including shipping, though it's not "new"...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/330868389856


thanks for the reply does it has to be x600xt or regular x600 becuase I found this one new . I don't mean to ask a lot but I want to make sure I get the right one.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Dell-JH471-256Mb-ATI-Radeon-X600-PCI-e-Video-Card-/150566788207?pt=PCC_Video_TV_Cards&hash=item230e7adc6f




« Last Edit: February 07, 2013, 01:20:28 pm by rock145 »

Calamity

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2013, 01:11:22 pm »
Hi rock145, the regular X600 will work great.
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

CRT Emudriver, VMMaker & Arcade OSD downloads, documentation and discussion:  Eiusdemmodi

rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2013, 01:28:18 pm »
Hi rock145, the regular X600 will work great.

Thanks Calamity, I know I don't have the card yet but when using groovymame what monitor type will I input. Are there settings for Neiman displays. Here is some info: the tube is a Toshiba M68LMF256X01 and the chasis model is 3m27TC
« Last Edit: February 07, 2013, 01:30:21 pm by rock145 »

rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2013, 01:18:47 pm »
I am probably gonna receive the ati card in the next 2 to three days and I wanted to know which operating system is best with groovymame and calamity crt emudriver 9.3 and 6.5? Windows xp home 32 bit or xp 64 bit? which is more reliable? Gives less problems? . Also I been reading some of the stuff on the forum and found out that there is an issue with hyperspin and 120 modelines and that with magic resolutions you can only get up to 30 to 40 modelines resolutions? Since I don't want to sacrifice 200 modelines of resolutions would groovymame work with GameEX FE or AtomicFE without problems with 200 modelines of resolutions? Can some one tell me their experience with these two front ends.


Thanks.

krick

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2013, 05:16:48 pm »
Windows XP 64-bit edition is definitely the way to go.  MAME performs far better on a 64-bit OS.

You should use the 9.3 version of CRT_EmuDriver.

The issue with Hyperspin is completely solved by using "magic resolutions".  Magic resolutions generates a smaller number of fake "base" resolutions, but then GroovyMAME modifies the base resolutions on the fly to create a nearly unlimited number of actual resolutions.  There is no drawback to using magic resolutions that I am aware of, and no need to use other front ends if you don't want to.
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Calamity

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2013, 06:02:02 pm »
100% with krick.
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

CRT Emudriver, VMMaker & Arcade OSD downloads, documentation and discussion:  Eiusdemmodi

rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #13 on: February 12, 2013, 06:14:33 pm »
Thanks krick and calamity for your replies I really appreciate your guidance on this project. I can't wait to get started once I get the card and play around with the settings. I will install xp 64 bit and keep hyperspin but is it wise to use Nlite to make it smaller or will it create problems. Also I would like to install deepfreeze so windows does not slow down overtime.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 06:31:44 pm by rock145 »

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2013, 06:33:26 pm »
If you use nLite yourself over a legit Windows copy, there shouldn't be any problem. I *believe* most of the problems come with customized nLited warez Windows 'distributions' because they may ship newer versions of the drivers (just my theory).
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

CRT Emudriver, VMMaker & Arcade OSD downloads, documentation and discussion:  Eiusdemmodi

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #15 on: February 12, 2013, 06:44:53 pm »
I have a legit copy of windows xp 64 I bought 2 years ago, probably gonna have to call Microsoft to activate it. I'll start taking things out from xp probably gonna need a tutorial online on what to take out without messing xp 64. I found out this one gonna follow it. http://wiki.eeeuser.com/howto:nlitexp
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 06:55:36 pm by rock145 »

krick

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2013, 08:35:39 pm »
I bought a copy of XP Professional 64-bit edition off of Ebay almost 2 years ago.  It was one of those versions that was sold in college bookstores, but I had no problems activating it.  Unless your copy is one of the corporate volume licensed copies that are blacklisted, you should be ok.

I highly recommend using nLite to slipstream SP2 if your version isn't already SP2.  Then I recommend you slipstream the following two updates...

5eraph's Windows XP x64 post-SP2 Update Pack and
5eraph's IE6 Update Addon from here...
http://www.ryanvm.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6400

I wouldn't recommend removing anything with nLite.  You're not really going to make it any faster that way, and you risk breaking stuff that you might not find out until after installing and configuring a bunch of stuff, and your time will be wasted if you have to remake the image and reinstall.  Plus hard drives are huge and cheap so there's no point in making it smaller.  You can always go in after you install it and turn off unwanted services to speed things up.  And if you really want a fast boot, install it on a small-ish SSD and then pair it with a 1TB or larger data drive for ROMs, CHDs, Hyperspin videos, etc...   Just make sure that you align the partitions properly on your SSD and data drive.  On most new-ish large hard drives and all SSD drives, improper partition alignment is a performance killer.  The XP install process doesn't align partitions properly so you need to use another method before (preferably) or after installig XP.

I also recommend NOT installing the IE8 update pack from the above link.  IE8 is not much better than IE7.  Just slipstream the IE6 update pack to patch up IE6 that's in the XP image.  After you install XP and first go into Microsoft Update, you can hide the IE7 and IE8 updates, and tell it to never prompt you to install them again.  Then just install the latest version of Firefox.

The only other thing I would consider slipstreaming into your image with nLite is possibly hardware drivers for on-board devices that aren't recognized.  I slipstream a driver for my on-board Ethernet.

The main problem I have with slipstreaming a bunch of stuff is that if you ever have issues and need to uninstall and reinstall for some reason, you can't if it's slipstreamed.

Sorry to drift off topic.  I should probably put all this stuff in a new thread.
Hantarex Polo 15KHz
Sapphire Radeon HD 7750 2GB (GCN)
GroovyMAME 0.197.017h_d3d9ex
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Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
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rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2013, 08:56:09 pm »
I bought a copy of XP Professional 64-bit edition off of Ebay almost 2 years ago.  It was one of those versions that was sold in college bookstores, but I had no problems activating it.  Unless your copy is one of the corporate volume licensed copies that are blacklisted, you should be ok.

I highly recommend using nLite to slipstream SP2 if your version isn't already SP2.  Then I recommend you slipstream the following two updates...

5eraph's Windows XP x64 post-SP2 Update Pack and
5eraph's IE6 Update Addon from here...
http://www.ryanvm.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6400

I wouldn't recommend removing anything with nLite.  You're not really going to make it any faster that way, and you risk breaking stuff that you might not find out until after installing and configuring a bunch of stuff, and your time will be wasted if you have to remake the image and reinstall.  Plus hard drives are huge and cheap so there's no point in making it smaller.  You can always go in after you install it and turn off unwanted services to speed things up.  And if you really want a fast boot, install it on a small-ish SSD and then pair it with a 1TB or larger data drive for ROMs, CHDs, Hyperspin videos, etc...   Just make sure that you align the partitions properly on your SSD and data drive.  On most new-ish large hard drives and all SSD drives, improper partition alignment is a performance killer.  The XP install process doesn't align partitions properly so you need to use another method before (preferably) or after installig XP.

I also recommend NOT installing the IE8 update pack from the above link.  IE8 is not much better than IE7.  Just slipstream the IE6 update pack to patch up IE6 that's in the XP image.  After you install XP and first go into Microsoft Update, you can hide the IE7 and IE8 updates, and tell it to never prompt you to install them again.  Then just install the latest version of Firefox.

The only other thing I would consider slipstreaming into your image with nLite is possibly hardware drivers for on-board devices that aren't recognized.  I slipstream a driver for my on-board Ethernet.

The main problem I have with slipstreaming a bunch of stuff is that if you ever have issues and need to uninstall and reinstall for some reason, you can't if it's slipstreamed.

Sorry to drift off topic.  I should probably put all this stuff in a new thread.



You are right, I had times when I took stuff away from xp installs that gave me problems afterwards. I will hold off on installing xp until I get ssd and 1tb hdd. I will give update once I have it.
Thanks

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2013, 09:49:27 am »
You can always go in after you install it and turn off unwanted services to speed things up.

I agree 100%, I used have a list of unnecessary services for arcade use, I can't find it now, but I swear it made the startup and shut down processes much faster (shut down specially).

Quote
On most new-ish large hard drives and all SSD drives, improper partition alignment is a performance killer.  The XP install process doesn't align partitions properly so you need to use another method before (preferably) or after installig XP.

I didn't know that such a thing as partition alignment existed, I'm going to build a new system for my work and will definitely research about this, thanks.
 
Quote
The main problem I have with slipstreaming a bunch of stuff is that if you ever have issues and need to uninstall and reinstall for some reason, you can't if it's slipstreamed.

This sounds interesting. What's the sort of stuff you can't uninstall later? So do you think that makes sense with my belief that people slipstreaming new ATI device drivers in Windows pirate copies may be a possible cause of the conflicts when trying to install CRT_Emudriver later?
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

CRT Emudriver, VMMaker & Arcade OSD downloads, documentation and discussion:  Eiusdemmodi

krick

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2013, 10:36:00 am »
On most new-ish large hard drives and all SSD drives, improper partition alignment is a performance killer.  The XP install process doesn't align partitions properly so you need to use another method before (preferably) or after installig XP.

I didn't know that such a thing as partition alignment existed, I'm going to build a new system for my work and will definitely research about this, thanks.

Windows Vista and Windows 7 will correctly align partitions that you create during install.  XP will not.  Alignment is only required on SSDs and newer hard drives that use "Advanced Format".  I think that these days, most hard drives use Advanced Format.

There's some info about partition alignment in my post here...   http://krick.livejournal.com/38063.html

As a side note, Windows XP doesn't natively support "trim" functionality for SSD drives, which is sort of a garbage collection routine that frees up erased blocks on the SSD to increase performance.  Intel SSDs have "SSD Toolbox" software that can manually execute "trim" (on intel SSD drives only), and it also has the ability to run the process on a schedule every week or whatever you want.  Some other SSD manufacturers offer their own utilities to perform this trim function on XP, and I think some SSDs even have it built into the drive firmware somehow, however I think the majority of SSD manufacturers have written off windows XP completely and don't offer any way to trim their drives on XP.  So for the foreseeable future, I only buy Intel SSDs for XP systems.


The main problem I have with slipstreaming a bunch of stuff is that if you ever have issues and need to uninstall and reinstall for some reason, you can't if it's slipstreamed.

This sounds interesting. What's the sort of stuff you can't uninstall later? So do you think that makes sense with my belief that people slipstreaming new ATI device drivers in Windows pirate copies may be a possible cause of the conflicts when trying to install CRT_Emudriver later?

In addition to drivers, some people slipstream IE8, .NET runtimes, windows media player, among other things.  If they're truly slipstreamed, then there's no entry in add/remove programs.  This is a problem if you ever need to uninstall and re-install them for some reason.

Slipstreamed ATI drivers could definitely be a source of conflict with CRT_EmuDriver.  I think a lot of the heavily pirated versions of XP have updated ATI and Nvidia drivers slipstreamed as well as .NET runtimes, which are required for the catalyst control center software and whatever Nvidia calls their equivalent software (Nview?).
Hantarex Polo 15KHz
Sapphire Radeon HD 7750 2GB (GCN)
GroovyMAME 0.197.017h_d3d9ex
CRT Emudriver & CRT Tools 2.0 beta 13 (Crimson 16.2.1 for GCN cards)
Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
Intel Core i7-4790K @ 4.8GHz
ASUS Z87M-PLUS Motherboard

Calamity

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2013, 05:17:43 am »
Thanks krick, that's valuable information. I have not used SSD drives yet, I'm looking forward to getting one of those for my next system.
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

CRT Emudriver, VMMaker & Arcade OSD downloads, documentation and discussion:  Eiusdemmodi

rock145

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2013, 12:20:31 pm »
Sorry for the delay, but I got everything ready now. I install xp 64 bit on an ssd and transfer all my games to a 1 TB Hdd. I have also downloaded :crt_emudriver_9.3_1.2a_x64_multisync, vmmaker_1.3c_arcade_osd_1.3b. I install the 4650 because I wanted to play Street fighter x Tekken instead of the x600. Before I begin installing calimity drivers: Does it matter what version of mame I used: Mame 64, Mame plus xt 64, MameUi 64? I thinking of downloading one of these and replacing the .exe with groovymame or groovyume and keeping all the files that come with it. Then run create the the ini mame64.exe -createconfig or mame64 -cc then create the groovymame -cc ini. After that run the driver in the crt_emudriver_9.3_1.2a_x64_multisync folder. Do I have to install direct x or will this driver include it?. Is it wise to do this with the arcade monitor connected to the card or do I do install all this first on pc monitor than when finished with everything connect to the arcade monitor to test it?

Thanks.

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2013, 02:02:56 pm »
You can use standard MAME64 to get the folder structure if you want.  That's what I normally do.

The driver does not include DirectX.  If you're not sure if you have the latest, you can always use the Microsoft web installer first...
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=35

You should install CRT_EmuDriver while connected to a PC monitor.  You should set your desktop resolution to 640x480 before installing the driver.

Before you do that make sure that you've grabbed the latest VMMaker from here and unzip it into the CRT_EmuDriver folder...
http://mame.3feetunder.com/windows-ati-crt-emudriver/

I ran into an issue where the install didn't complete properly or something and I had to run VMMaker after the driver install.
I think that is why some people are installing Soft15KHz, even though they don't need to.
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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2013, 02:03:41 pm »
Ok. So I fallowed the instruction on the readme text of the calamity drivers.

1. install crt_emudriver_9.3_1.2a_x64_multisync
2.downloaded mame64 1.47 and groovyume 1.47, replaced mame64.exe with groovyume and renamed groovyume to mame64.exe
3. Created a mame.ini from mame64 1.47 mame.ini , then generated new ini from groovyume 1.47 Ume.ini and name it mame64.ini I have two inis mame.ini one from mame64 1.47 and from groovyume 1.47.
3.Opened vmmaker.ini and told it the location of mame64.exe ( groovyume) and the mame.ini (Was not sure if it was mame.ini in mame64 1.47  or the one created with groovyume name mame64) but chose the one from the regular mame64.
4. I ran VMMaker, on the crt_emudriver_9.3_1.2a_x64_multisynci folder by mistake generated the new modelines and then I restarted.
5.then I ran vmmaker_1.3c_arcade_osd_1.3b the correct one and it found 844 diff modes and generated 120 modelines then I restarted.

After restart I noticed the picture on the arcade monitor flickering and shaking in screen. Don't know if I mess up? I tried launching

Hyperspin but it did not let me. Don't now if this is the bug known off or if I did something wrong. Can someone help me figure out how to fix this? ???

On the groovyume.ini I change the monitor type from generic_15 to Arcade 15_25_31 and did not help?
« Last Edit: February 15, 2013, 02:31:11 pm by rock145 »

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2013, 02:20:49 pm »
Ok. So I fallowed the instruction on the readme text of the calamity drivers.

1. install crt_emudriver_9.3_1.2a_x64_multisync
2.downloaded mame64 1.47 and groovyume 1.47, replaced mame64.exe with groovyume and renamed groovyume to mame64.exe
3. Created a mame.ini from mame64 mame.ini , then generated new ini from groovyume Ume.ini and name it mame64.ini I have two inis
mame.ini and mame64 from ume.

I'm not experienced with GroovyUME so I can't help there.

I would just start with standard GroovyMAME.  Create a mame.ini file, and go from there.  Once you get it all working, then experiment with GroovyUME.


3.Opened vmmaker.ini and told it the location of mame64.exe ( groovyume) and the mame.ini (Was not sure if it was mame.ini in regular mame64 or the one created with groovyume name mame64) but chose the one from the regular mame64.
4. I ran VMMaker, on the crt_emudriver_9.3_1.2a_x64_multisynci folder by mistake generated the new modelines and then I restarted.
5.then I ran vmmaker_1.3c_arcade_osd_1.3b the correct one and it found 844 diff modes and generated 120 modelines then I restarted.

After restart I noticed the picture on the arcade monitor flickering and shaking in screen. Don't know if I mess up? I tried launching Hyperspin but it did not let me. Don't now if this is the bug known off or if I did something wrong. Can someone help me figure out how to fix this? ???

Can you see the picture on the arcade monitor?  If the drivers didn't install correctly, you wouldn't be able to see anything.

If the resolution is 640x480 interlaced, you will notice a faint flickering, especially on thin horizontal lines and/or small text.  This is how interlaced looks.  If what you're seeing is something other than interlaced flickering, then you may be able to adjust your monitor settings to get a better picture.

There's a known issue with Hyperspin where it will not launch if you have over a certain number of resolutions.  There's a workaround called "magic resolutions".  Here's a thread where I tried them out for the first time, and then worked through some issues.  Make sure you read the second post too, as Calamity corrected my first post...
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,121216.0.html
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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2013, 02:51:27 pm »
thanks krick, I am gonna do the process again with groovymame. I do have picture on the arcade monitor I don't know if it is interlace. Before I install the calamity drivers I install the ultimarc quicres utilty because my pc monitor minimum res was 800x600 so it allowed me to go down to 600x480. Should I install the ultimarc trisync utilty will this help? I will check the thread you suggested also.

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #26 on: February 15, 2013, 03:21:59 pm »
If you're using an ATI Radeon HD 4650, then you don't need the Ultimarc Tri-Sync utility, and I don't think you should use the quick-res utility either, both are really only meant for the ArcadeVGA.

Note: To test your setup without Hyperspin, you can open a command window in your MAME folder and run games from the command line.

To get the most out of your tri-sync monitor, you'll eventually need to figure out custom range settings to tell GroovyMAME what your monitor is capable of.  I don't think anyone has figured out a set of monitor presets for your monitor yet.  Hopefully, Calamity or someone who understands this better will jump in and help.

In the meantime, you can try the "arcade_15_25_31" preset in GroovyMAME by changing...

monitor generic_15

...to...

monitor arcade_15_25_31

...in your mame.ini
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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #27 on: February 15, 2013, 05:12:00 pm »
If you're using an ATI Radeon HD 4650, then you don't need the Ultimarc Tri-Sync utility, and I don't think you should use the quick-res utility either, both are really only meant for the ArcadeVGA.

Note: To test your setup without Hyperspin, you can open a command window in your MAME folder and run games from the command line.

To get the most out of your tri-sync monitor, you'll eventually need to figure out custom range settings to tell GroovyMAME what your monitor is capable of.  I don't think anyone has figured out a set of monitor presets for your monitor yet.  Hopefully, Calamity or someone who understands this better will jump in and help.

In the meantime, you can try the "arcade_15_25_31" preset in GroovyMAME by changing...

monitor generic_15

...to...

monitor arcade_15_25_31

...in your mame.ini

Thanks now I am able to start hyperspin. I don't know what happened but I did what you suggested and tried it with groovymame instead of groovume.Vmaker found 476 res and generated 109 modelines.
I also changed the monitor type to arcade_15_25_31. Looking at some of the games I think the card booted into cga mode not 25 or 31 because now it shows thick scanlines on the games and desktop. I read the thread that you suggested what I get is that I have to make these changes right? so if I make these changes I'll enable magic resolutions and have more than the currently 109?

MonitorType="?"
ModeTableMethod_Custom = 2
ListFromXML = 1
GereateXML = 1

ModeTableMethod_Custom = 1
ModeTableMethod_XML = 2

ListFromXML = 0
GenerateXML = 0
MonitorType

I still get flickery image and shaking.Do you thing is because of quickres?

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #28 on: February 15, 2013, 06:56:47 pm »
I also changed the monitor type to arcade_15_25_31. Looking at some of the games I think the card booted into cga mode not 25 or 31 because now it shows thick scanlines on the games and desktop.

That's normal.   I think to get a desktop at a higher resolution, I think you need to modify ReslList.txt before running VMMaker.  Right at the top of the file is...

## Desktop ##

 640 x 480 @ 30.000000 desktop

...I think you need to modify it to something like...

 800 x 600 @ 60.000000 desktop

...or whatever your monitor supports.


I read the thread that you suggested what I get is that I have to make these changes right? so if I make these changes I'll enable magic resolutions and have more than the currently 109?

You should only have to change...

ModeTableMethod_XML = 2

You'll actually get less resolutions.  I think I only have 42.  However they're "dummy" base resolutions that GroovyMAME will modify on the fly as needed, so the actual number of possible resolutions are much higher.

Leave the monitor type as "CUSTOM".  Eventually, you'll need to change the monitor specs section to include several lines for the various ranges supported by your monitor.  Calamity will probably have to help you work that out.



I still get flickery image and shaking.Do you thing is because of quickres?


The flickery image is what interlaced resolutions look like.  When it's interlaced, it draws the odd lines on one pass, then the even lines on the next pass.  This causes it to flicker when displaying high-contrast images with sharp horizontal edges.  It doesn't have anything to do with quickres.
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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2013, 07:15:48 pm »
Thanks, Krick I am so glad I found someone that can help me like you. I did what you suggested and make the change to ModeTableMethod_XML = 2 and it gave me 42 modlines. I also change the resolution to the monitor to 720x480. The destop looks much better no scanlines howerver, when I run hyperspin and pick a game the monitor makes a sound on the back like a click then monitor turn black? when I exit it clicks again and I can choose other games but have the same problem. The monitor says max res 640x480 but when I was using arcadevga300 I allow me to play at 31khz. I tried again with  640x480 and I still get the same problem but now some games are all the way to the left not like before the it took the whole screen. The only way to fix it is to leave ModeTableMethod_XML=1 but desktop flickers and heavy scanlines and no magic res
« Last Edit: February 15, 2013, 08:14:00 pm by rock145 »

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #30 on: February 18, 2013, 12:40:31 pm »
I'm not really sure what you should do here.  I *think* that the right course of action is to set up proper monitor specs in VMMaker for your monitor's capabilities, but I'm not really sure what they would be.  Hopefully someone else can help with this.
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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #31 on: February 18, 2013, 01:59:59 pm »
I also order the x600 when I get it I am gonna try it maybe it will make a difference. I read one of your post before that said that with x550 your desktop at 15kzh look much better than the 4650. Hopefully no heavy scanlines and constant flicker.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2013, 02:02:43 pm by rock145 »

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #32 on: February 18, 2013, 03:05:04 pm »
Hi rock145,

Make sure you have 'video d3d' enabled in mame.ini. Consider posting a log here (groovymame romname -v >romname.txt)
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #33 on: February 18, 2013, 05:14:19 pm »
Hi, calimity I would really appreciate your help. I was able to get magic res enable I think. I did sytem restore before installing the VMMaker, on the crt_emudriver_9.3_1.2a_x64_multisync and then Install it again but this time made the change ModeTableMethod_XML = 2 and it work don't know why it did not before. then I use the arcade osd and pick the resolution 640x480P set as desktop res. I booted to 640x480p not interlace no flickering and heavy scanlines. However the screen its not full it's has black bars on bottom and top. I would have to use v size to make it bigger. I then tried hyperspin with groovymame and pick some games and all of them show the heavy scanlines as before. Now the monitor makes a click sound everytime I pick a game I think its changing from 31 to 15khz in everygame. I did the command you suggested but don't know where the file when? Here are some of the txt from vmmaker.

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #34 on: February 20, 2013, 02:55:27 pm »
I finally got some game logs. The reason I was not getting it before it was because I was doing the command on start run. I did it in command prompt and it worked. I did two types of logs one with arcade_15_25_31 and one with monitor type vga and set desktop res to 640x480P@60.
I like the vga res becuase it does not show heavy scanlines it shows zero scanlines but I don't think it's natives res. I don't mind scanlines but not like this thick heavy ones I am getting on 15khz and 25khz on 31khz progressive vga scanlines are not present.

I also slide the 1kohm3v to 75ohm1v I think the screens look brighter and more vivid on 75ohm1v so I left it like that. Can someone tell me if there is risk of damaging the monitor by changing 1kohm3v to 75ohm1v? I would really appreciated calamity looking at the logs and telling me what its wrong.

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #35 on: February 20, 2013, 03:48:50 pm »

I like the vga res becuase it does not show heavy scanlines it shows zero scanlines but I don't think it's natives res. I don't mind scanlines but not like this thick heavy ones I am getting on 15khz and 25khz on 31khz progressive vga scanlines are not present.


If you see square pixels on the screen, you're not seeing the way the game originally looked.  Check out this page...

http://mirrors.arcadecontrols.com/OscarControls/monitors.shtml

The one closest to the way it should really look is #7.  You can see faint scanlines.

Look at the bushes in #1 and #5.  You shouldn't see white pixels.   They're supposed to blur into the green like #7.
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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #36 on: February 20, 2013, 04:53:12 pm »

I like the vga res becuase it does not show heavy scanlines it shows zero scanlines but I don't think it's natives res. I don't mind scanlines but not like this thick heavy ones I am getting on 15khz and 25khz on 31khz progressive vga scanlines are not present.


If you see square pixels on the screen, you're not seeing the way the game originally looked.  Check out this page...

http://mirrors.arcadecontrols.com/OscarControls/monitors.shtml

The one closest to the way it should really look is #7.  You can see faint scanlines.

Look at the bushes in #1 and #5.  You shouldn't see white pixels.   They're supposed to blur into the green like #7.

Here are some pics I took of the same game that's on the link you suggested of spyhunter in vga 640x480P and some other picture of streetfighter and Mortal Kombat showing the heavy scanlines issue I am having with all the games in hyperspin in native res. I never noticed scanlines until I used groovymame and calimity drivers becuase with arcadevga 3000 everytime I used natived res the picture would come out scramble and scrolling.Please take a look. I dont know if this is normal for native res? If you look at the picture in vga spyhunter pics where would it fall?
« Last Edit: February 20, 2013, 06:29:51 pm by rock145 »

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #37 on: February 20, 2013, 06:58:17 pm »
Hi rock145,

Your 15 kHz pics look fantastic, that's how it's intended to be. Your 15 kHz logs are fine too.

Scanlines can be more defined on multisync monitors because the beam is sharper in order to allow higher vertical resolutions.

Forcing 31 kHz defeats the purpose of the whole thing.

The vertical size must be adjusted manually for each resolution, unless your monitor can memorize different settings.

So as far as I can see your system is perfectly fine, no issues.
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #38 on: February 20, 2013, 07:17:24 pm »
Thank You, calimity and krick for your help.I'll guess I am gonna have to get used to the scanlines. But is there anything I can do to make it less noticeable. Are there settings I can try on groovymame ini or is there a button or something I have to push on the monitor chasis? what about effects? I read somewhere that I can adjust the focus botton to less and it make the image fuzzier and less noticeable but don't know where is located.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2013, 07:32:23 pm by rock145 »

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Re: scramble, scrolling, jumping picture with Neiman Displays trisync monitor
« Reply #39 on: February 25, 2013, 02:36:31 pm »
Over, the weekend I finished testing all the games with groovymame and I gotta say that they look amazing. I never thought native resolution would make a difference specially games in ega mode they looked gorgeous. There are some games that I don't like how they look with the scanlines but only a few overall all other games look fantastic. I wanna to know if it's possible in groovymame to change the resolution of a cga game to ega resolution? like mortal kombat 399 x 253 to 320x240 24khz

I am really happy I found this forum and about groovymame and calamity drivers. Imagine what it would be like if the guy from arcadevga and calamity work together. I would say that it has made my gaming experience much better and now I feel like I am using a real arcade. I wanna thank all of the people that has work on creating this software and keep the good work. I just wished that there was a way that I can maximize my monitor specs but it seem its not possible because nobody has my monitor type.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2013, 10:51:58 pm by rock145 »