Need help with my pad

[StealthNinjaScyther]

Yeah, so I got the idea into my head that I wanted to get an arcade pad, so I ended up making one.  So now that all the important stuff is finished I've run into some problems, maybe you guys can help?

My arcade pad is made from a third party Playstation controller.  As far as I can tell, it works perfect on my Playstation.  However, I made it from a Playstation controller with the intent to use converters so I could use it with other systems. I'm using a Cube Joybox converter so that I can use it on my Gamecube.  

The problem is that occaisonally the down button will "press" itself and with all of the other buttons if I hold them down they will randomly come "unpressed" and reactivate themselves immediately after this.  For example I can press and hold the A button to perform an action, but after a few seconds it performs the action again just as if it had been pressed again.  I would just think that it was the converter, but the self pressing down button doesn't seem to be covered by that.  Also, when I was testing the controller on the converter before I ripped out the circuit board I didn't notice any of these problems, but I did only play with it for a fairly short time.

So, any ideas.  Is it just the converter?  Do I need to make my connections stronger?  Yeah, I really need help because I don't really understand any of this electrical stuff.   Thanks in advance.

[grafixmonkey]

I can't tell from your description what it is that you built, or how you built it.  Is this a dance-pad type thing?  or are you saying "pad" and meaning a control panel with joysticks and buttons?  And did you open up a playstation controller and solder to it internally?  or do something else?

Electrically, it sounds like a loose connection inside, maybe a wire came loose and is flopping around, or the button connections are not done properly and the buttons are floating close to the logic-on level without pegging it nicely inside the safety range.  Tell us the above details, as well as:

When you push your down button:
   does it reliably press down when you try to push it?
   does it tend to "press itself" and stick down after you push it, or randomly at any time?
   does it stay pressed down while you're pressing it, or does it also have the random release/repress problem?

Regarding your other buttons:
   do they reliably press down every time?
   do they stick down, even occasionally?  or always release?
   do they have the random release/repress problem when you hold down any other buttons?  or only the down button?  try holding down more than two buttons, without pressing down.


sorry, but until you tell us some details about what it is you did, the only info we have is "My custom electrical hack that none of you have ever seen anything like before isn't working.  What's wrong with it?"

[StealthNinjaScyther]

Okay, I built a simple arcade controller setup:  Joystick and buttons(Happs parts) in a box and wires soldered to a circuit board of a Mad Catz dual shock Playstation controller connected to the microswitches through quick disconnects. I'm thinking that the problem is just that the converter doesn't work well with the controller I used.  I have no problems when I connect my arcade pad directly to my Playstation, it's just when I use my PS>GC adapter that I experience any problems.  My adapter works fine with official pads so it may just be some third party compatability issues.

When you push your down button:  does it reliably press down when you try to push it?  
Yes.

does it tend to "press itself" and stick down after you push it, or randomly at any time?  
It seems that only the  down button presses itself randomly, but it doesn't stay down for more than a single press.  I think that the up button may occaisonally press itself as well, but only after I press down.  For example I can press down on a menu and it responds but then almost immediately the up button presses itself.

does it stay pressed down while you're pressing it, or does it also have the random release/repress problem?  
It has a random release/repress problem for all buttons including directionals.

do they reliably press down every time?  
Yes.

do they stick down, even occasionally?  or always release?  
No sticking down, ever.

do they have the random release/repress problem when you hold down any other buttons?  or only the down button?  try holding down more than two buttons, without pressing down.  
The release/repress problem occurs with all of the buttons.  Holding down multiple buttons presents the same problem.

Sorry for being so vague before.  I'm pretty much new to mods for any type of electronics.  Though I can't really make an informed statement I think that the problem is probably just an issue with the converter.  So fixing the problem will probably just require finding a third party controller that works with my converter.  

Well, thanks for being helpful.

[paigeoliver]

Also be aware that some pads just don't hack very well. They SHOULD work, but then they don't, or they have weird issues.

Gravis Gamepad pros for example do not hack properly. You can do they job perfectly, and they will still exhibit odd ghosting and blocking issues that the original unhacked pads did not have (this only occurs if you hack the D-Pad, if you only use the buttons then it will work prefectly).

The only thing I can guess is that the extra wire involved is dropping the the voltage levels just a tad too much, or something? It is the only thing I can think of.

[grafixmonkey]

does it tend to "press itself" and stick down after you push it, or randomly at any time?  
It seems that only the  down button presses itself randomly, but it doesn't stay down for more than a single press.  I think that the up button may occaisonally press itself as well, but only after I press down.  For example I can press down on a menu and it responds but then almost immediately the up button presses itself.

My Happ Super joysticks tend to bounce back and press the opposite direction if I push them one direction and release.  It's probably just that.

does it stay pressed down while you're pressing it, or does it also have the random release/repress problem?  
It has a random release/repress problem for all buttons including directionals.

A random release/repress problem on all buttons is consistent with a ground loop having a shaky connection...  but since you say it works fine connected to the playstation itself, I'm not sure if that's the case.  If you know anybody else with the MadCatz controller you have, maybe you could borrow it and see if the button problem happens without the parts you hacked onto it.

It's also possible the controller might draw more power than the converter can provide.  If you have a voltmeter, one way to test this would be to check the voltage on a few of the pins of the plug.  If you hold the controller's plug horizontally in front of you, with the rounded part facing down and the pins of the plug facing you, then call the leftmost pin number 1 and the rightmost pin number 9.  If you can find a way, measure voltage between pins 4 and 5, and pins 4 and 3, with the gamepad plugged into your playstation, and with it plugged into your converter.  The voltage between 4 and 3 should be 7.6v, and the voltage between 4 and 5 should be 3.5v.  They might be off by 0.1v or 0.2v and that's normal.  If the voltages are significantly lower when plugged into your converter than when plugged into your playstation, that means the converter can't supply enough power.  If power is the problem, you might be able to build something to boost the supply and make it work.

do they have the random release/repress problem when you hold down any other buttons?  or only the down button?  try holding down more than two buttons, without pressing down.  
The release/repress problem occurs with all of the buttons.  Holding down multiple buttons presents the same problem.

I'm thinking that since holding multiple buttons down probably draws more power than holding a single one down, it probably points to power supply.  But, it might still be an incompatibility too.  From what I've read of the playstation controller communication protocol, it just seems the kind of thing it would be hard to be incompatible with and still function with any playstation system.

Good luck with the voltage testing, if you're going to bother.  I suggest using the beeping continuity tester on a voltmeter, sticking one contact in a controller pin, and touching the insides of the controller where the wires connect to the board.  The one that beeps will be the wire that connects to the plug pin you have the other lead stuck into.  Or you can measure resistance and look for zero ohms.  Once you've figured out which is which, it'll be easy to test the voltage with it plugged in.  Just be careful not to accidentally short anything while you're testing.  

Here's a web page I found about the pins on a playstation controller:
http://www.geocities.com/deonvdw/Docs/Diagrams/Playstation/PSXLinux.htm

[StealthNinjaScyther]

Thanks for the responses, I appreciate it greatly, especially seeing how I don't really know what I'm doing.

Okay, I got the voltmeter out in a poor attempt to find the problem.  The first problem I ran into was that I wasn't getting the right reading between pins 4 and 5, it was measuring below a volt.  The voltage between 3 and 4 read about right at 7.8 volts.  Onto the Gamecube I measured 3.4 volts between 4 and 5.  And between 3 and 4 I read 5 volts.  I then went to recheck the voltage between 4 and 5 on my Playstation, but the controller stopped responding.  I'm pretty sure that I fried my controller ports.  So, well....
 

[StealthNinjaScyther]

I'm pretty sure that I'll be able to replace the fuse I blew without too much trouble.

Anyway, I'm not exactly clear on how to provide the extra power to the controller.  I'm about 2.6v short between pins 3 and 4 so I just need to use something like some batteries that provide about that much voltage, right?  Then I'll just have to get a compartment or something to put them in and solder some wires to connect that to those 2 points right?  Or should I just quit before I blow something that I can't replace as easily?

[grafixmonkey]

Your best bet might be to just hack a different controller...   sorry about your playstation ports, I guess your test points were close together.  Should have emphasized the need for really careful measurement a little more.

You could build something to amplify the power available to the controller...  it would basically provide power to those three pins instead of your converter device.  But, I don't think you want to take that project on...   it's possible, but difficult, and far more work than just hacking a different pad.

[StealthNinjaScyther]

So now you tell me that I might as well hack a new controller.

Don't worry about the ports, all I need is to get a new fuse, and that shouldn't cost more than a few dollars. Thanks for  all the help, I actually learned a few things and didn't screw up too bad.  It's nice to know that there are still helpful and friendly people on the net.