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Author Topic: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP Actual Progress!  (Read 18637 times)

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BadMouth

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Re: Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #80 on: February 07, 2012, 08:17:06 pm »
If one of you guys doing this hack want to do an experiment I have an idea that might be worth a shot regarding the rattle.

#### warning just an idea/ experiment/ test ####

1) Hook the logitech pcb to the 100k steering pot and remove the logitech motor outputs from the amc.

2) calibrate the wheel in logitech profiler

3) using a 12v power supply on the logitech pcb measure the voltage at center, full lock left and full lock right.

4) physically move the potentiometer to the point that the calibration will definitely be different.

5) recalibrate the wheel in logitech profiler.

6) remeasure the voltage at center and both sides full lock.

Ideally those voltages should both match. I'm curious though (haven't tested myself just brainstorming) if the ffb voltage isn't changing when we recalibrate our wheels. If that is the case then our pots would have to be installed at exactly center, not slightly off and recalibrated to center in software (which works fine for steering, but maybe not ffb).


I wouldn't imagine this is the case but it would be nice to rule out as a possibility

Sent from my Desire HD

Test 1 (brad808's test)

Definitely odd results.  My wheel has to be slightly right for the voltage to be at 0.0v (centered).
Recalibrating it and picking a center point other than the real center made no difference.
The wheel still had to be in the same place as the first time to register 0.0v
It seems that the ffb center is different than the calibrated center, which doesn't seem to be a good design.

I should also note that setting the center in calibration didn't seem to affect the on-screen wheel once I exited calibration.
Even though I changed to a different center point, the onscreen wheel still had the real one.  I didn't try closing the window and opening it back up.
I did go through the calibration process, center the wheel, then remove the pot, adjust it until it read 0.0v, and reinstall it centered so the ffb center was the same as the calibration center.  It made no difference in the wobble.
  
Also found it odd that I was still getting 18-19v when using the 12v power supply (centering ffb set to 100%), but the big resistor mbasile mentioned stays cooler.

I'd noticed when I hooked up the pot and the driving force ex board that the happ wheel continues turning after the wheel onscreen hits the stops and going through calibration doesn't correct it completely.
The driving force ex must have had less than 270 degrees of travel.  I'm wondering what result using an 80k pot would yield.  I don't think it would do anything for the shaking issue, but it could make the calibration more correct.

I'm going nuts from working long hours, so it would be nice if someone duplicated this test to make sure it really does work that way and I didn't halucinate the whole thing.

Test 2

Removing the steering wheel made no difference.  The momentum of the wheel is not an issue.  (doesn't mean that the momentum of the motor armature still isn't).

Test 3

I turned down the gain on the servo amp until the wobbling stopped.  Then I turned the voltage up to 36v.  When I pulled the wheel to the side and let it go, the wobbling was back.  Then I turned the gain back up high and turned the voltage down until the wobbling stopped (around 14v).  It seems the overall physical force of the ffb is the determining factor.  It doesn't seem to matter whether the force is reduced in windows or on the servo amp.  Once the ffb is strong enough to be fun, the wobbling returns.

That's all I feel like doing tonight.  Going to let that settle into my brain and see if I have an epiphany.  :lol

EDIT: Just had another idea.  Next time I will hook a small ffb motor up to the servo amp to see if it has the wobble.  I'm thinking that if the momentum of the big happ motor is the issue, a small motor wouldn't experience the wobble.  If it doesn't, then we can rule out the servo amp hack as the culprit.

Also might try to think of a way to add constant resistance to the happ setup to see if it stops the wobble without affecting the feel of the wheel too much.  It might not be that noticeable since we always have centering resistance present anyway.


« Last Edit: February 07, 2012, 08:57:49 pm by BadMouth »

brad808

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #81 on: February 08, 2012, 06:25:09 pm »
@ gbeef - My dips are 1,3,5 to the left all others to the right (voltage mode)

@badmouth - Thanks for testing that out for me, it's good to know at least. With that being said the more I think about it the more it doesn't really matter. As far as I can tell the "offset" pot on the amc is basically to compensate for that exact thing. The manual says "Offset / Test. Used to adjust any imbalance in the input signal or in the amplifier." So even though the ffb doesn't correct itself which I would think that it should? I think we can manually do it without too much trouble


This is my note taking for the night basically in this order, I don't want to muck around too much with adjusting the potentiometers and stuff just yet because believe it or not my wheel works really good  :D


0.86v measured from current monitor output (pin 8 on amc where 3.8 amps = 1V) at highest... Max explosion
0.86 x 3.8 = 3.268 amps
Think I did this right

***** Although it looks a little confusing/boring there is some potentially very useful info here just read to the bottom*******
If your super lazy just read the bottom part

Logitech motor outputs with centering feedback at 12%
Full left - minus1.31v
Full right - 1.80 v
Center - 0.20v
Explosion 9.5v Max approx

Logitech motor outputs at 100%
Full left - minus 11.14v
Full right - 11.15v
Center - 0.20v
Explosion 9.5v max approx

Both these move smoothly from 0v center to the Max v at either side full lock

Happ motor center 0.01v has been corrected for using offset
Centering at 12%
Full left - minus 16.48v
Full right - 16.47v
Explosion - 23.6 v Max approx

Move to 100% centering
Rattle obviously
Can't test most because wheel is barely responsive

*** These seemed a little different (lower then what I remembered) to me for some reason possibly related to below... I acidentally unplugged my wheel from the computer and replugged it in. When I re-checked the voltages to make sure they were correct I noticed they were different.. After checking them all more then once the first time. Which leads me to more exploration.

#Take 2
unplug and plug in without opening main calibration type page in windows game controllers. The one where you can see the wheel move back and forth

Logitech motor outputs at 12%
Full left - minus 7.55v
Full right - 8.05 v
Center - 0.24v
Explosion - can't test without window open

Opening calibration window
Logitech motor outputs at 12%
Full left - minus1.31v
Full right - 1.80 v
Center - 0.20v
Explosion 9.5v Max approx

Close widow without unplugging
Logitech motor outputs at 12%
Full left - minus1.65v
Full right - 1.80 v
Center - 0.20v
Explosion 9.5v Max approx
Same as above

Unplugging and only opening Logitech profiler

Logitech motor outputs at 12%
Full left - minus 7.55v
Full right - 8.05 v
Center - 0.24v
Explosion - can't test without window open

Happ motor outputs      Logitech centeringat 12%
Full left - minus 23.7v
Full right - 23.6 v
Center - 0.00v
Explosion - can't test without window open

Happ motor outputs      Logitech centering at 100%
Full left - minus 23.7v
Full right - 23.6 v
Center - 0.00v
Explosion - can't test without window open
No rattle wtf?

With centering at 100% still
Open up windows game controllers screen
Rattle

Close windows controllers screen
Still rattle


So in clonclusion I don't really know what the hell is going on but I think it's safe to say that windows game controller screen where you see the wheel move will without a doubt change how your wheel reacts. Obviously when I tested mine I used the windows screen to calibrate the wheel and test explosions and stuff.... but I must have either restarted the computer or unplugged my wheel before I went through and used my voltmeter to calibrate the amc.

People with problems try either unplugging or restarting and NOT opening up windows game controller screen, set up your amc with a voltmeter to adjust input gain etc and see how your wheel reacts. This may very well have been what I did (cant confirm) but at the time not thought anything of it and assumed they were both working equally. This may also explain why I "setup" the amc probably 20 or so different times  :banghead: :banghead:. It basically got to a point once that it worked perfectly so I left it and have tried to muck around with it as little as possible so as to not screw anything up.

This would explain why my wheel works in windows game controller screen (which I now know is probably at a much lower voltage) and why my wheel still feels great during games. If other people are setting their wheels in windows game controller screen (like I've been telling people to do [I was only trying to help :'(]) Then when they load a game it'll be WAY to high.

Hopefully it can help, at the very least add to the research that there definitely are some strange things going on here
« Last Edit: February 08, 2012, 06:41:18 pm by brad808 »

brad808

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Re: Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #82 on: February 08, 2012, 06:39:32 pm »
 
Also found it odd that I was still getting 18-19v when using the 12v power supply (centering ffb set to 100%), but the big resistor mbasile mentioned stays cooler.


Have you actually checked your power supply with a voltmeter? I have a strong feeling that your power supply isn't putting out a proper 12V like it should. As far as I know it's the only reason you would be able to achieve any voltage over 12.

The first "12v" power supply that I had on my logitech wheel was actually reading closer to 16V or 17V which isn't good for the amc which is setup to accept 10-15V max at the reference input.

BadMouth

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Re: Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #83 on: February 09, 2012, 08:21:17 am »
 
Also found it odd that I was still getting 18-19v when using the 12v power supply (centering ffb set to 100%), but the big resistor mbasile mentioned stays cooler.


Have you actually checked your power supply with a voltmeter? I have a strong feeling that your power supply isn't putting out a proper 12V like it should. As far as I know it's the only reason you would be able to achieve any voltage over 12.

The first "12v" power supply that I had on my logitech wheel was actually reading closer to 16V or 17V which isn't good for the amc which is setup to accept 10-15V max at the reference input.

No, I'll check it when I do another round of testing.  I decided for my next test to reassemble the driving force ex wheel, but run the force feedback through the AMC (to the original little ffb motor).  If I get a wobble then, we know it's the AMC causing the issue.  I don't think it is.  These logitech wheels have a fair amount of resistance when not hooked up to anything.  I think between that, and the smaller motor, it prevents the centering feedback from slingshotting the wheel past center, then needing feedback in the other direction to correct (wobbling). 

Definitely weird about the feedback being a different strength in the windows calibration screen.

brad808

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #84 on: February 09, 2012, 01:08:56 pm »
 
Also found it odd that I was still getting 18-19v when using the 12v power supply (centering ffb set to 100%), but the big resistor mbasile mentioned stays cooler.


Have you actually checked your power supply with a voltmeter? I have a strong feeling that your power supply isn't putting out a proper 12V like it should. As far as I know it's the only reason you would be able to achieve any voltage over 12.

The first "12v" power supply that I had on my logitech wheel was actually reading closer to 16V or 17V which isn't good for the amc which is setup to accept 10-15V max at the reference input.

No, I'll check it when I do another round of testing.  I decided for my next test to reassemble the driving force ex wheel, but run the force feedback through the AMC (to the original little ffb motor).  If I get a wobble then, we know it's the AMC causing the issue.  I don't think it is.  These logitech wheels have a fair amount of resistance when not hooked up to anything.  I think between that, and the smaller motor, it prevents the centering feedback from slingshotting the wheel past center, then needing feedback in the other direction to correct

That'll be a good test and will probably tell us a lot. I've been suspicious about the resistance in our hacks causing problems myself because the logitech wheel clearly had a lot more.

I still can't wrap my head around why the motor outputs on the amc will react so differently when the voltage coming in is so low. although the tests would have been done using the windows game controllers screen, which may cause problems. The voltage moved smoothly at the logitech motor outputs at 100% centering from 0v to 12v yet on the amc they jumped from 0 to 24v in about 1/10th of the travel distance. That is with me holding the wheel and slowly moving it, no "overshooting" or wheel inertia could have come into play.

This makes me suspicious about some specification that we are ignoring on the amc that might be having problems. Maybe the centering feedback is a long duration signal vs quick duration for effects?

Maybe windows game controller screen drops the voltage down and ups the current or something like that? Potentially causing the amc to overload. Just a thought.

I'll also add that when i loaded up gt4 on my ps2 with a completely stock driving force, load a straight test track with hands off wheel it would eventually rattle (less violently then what we see on the hacks while driving, and stop when i stopped the car.

I'll add that i was at an arcade about a month ago and 1 game there was a nascar i think it was '09 had an unpayable amount of rattle. So much so that i got up and went to a new game. I have no idea what type of system nascar uses but the rattle looked very similar to what we can create. May be irrelevant.

Sent from my Desire HD

BadMouth

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #85 on: February 10, 2012, 09:30:11 am »
retrorepair sent me this link to a thread on arcade otaku about setting up this hack: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:tQSFsgzc1lwJ:forum.arcadeotaku.com/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D6%26t%3D13444%26start%3D90+site:forum.arcadeotaku.com+arcade+otaku+thesharkfactor&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=firefox-a

You need to have an account and sign in to see the whole thread.  I haven't had time read the whole thread yet, but the page I can see looks promissing.
Looks like they have a setup process that ends up making it useable for both PS3 and PC.

brad808

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Re: Re: Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #86 on: February 10, 2012, 10:54:01 am »
retrorepair sent me this link to a thread on arcade otaku about setting up this hack: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:tQSFsgzc1lwJ:forum.arcadeotaku.com/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D6%26t%3D13444%26start%3D90+site:forum.arcadeotaku.com+arcade+otaku+thesharkfactor&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=firefox-a

You need to have an account and sign in to see the whole thread.  I haven't had time read the whole thread yet, but the page I can see looks promissing.
Looks like they have a setup process that ends up making it useable for both PS3 and PC.

That's the thread i got most of my information to stay my hack from. There is a lot if good stuff for sure, unforunately none of the problems were really solved tough. Just to clarrify my wheel (and any one else that has a similar hack) does work with a ps2/ ps3. The problem is it isn't exactly what i would call an ideal hack. It's very limiting on what you can control as far as ffb is concerned. It definitely does work though. I pulled my ps2 for the time being so i could concentrate on one thing at a time.

.... My front end still isn't setup haha but i do have about 5 games in it so far.

Sent from my Desire HD

BadMouth

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #87 on: February 13, 2012, 11:20:43 am »
Haven't had time to do any more testing, but had another idea:

I wonder if the gearing between the motor and the wheel affect centering.
I don't think it would be this complicated, but what if the logitech pcb sends a signal expecting to turn the wheel X amount, but the wheel turns farther because our motor & wheel aren't geared the same as the original. 
It would need a smaller gear on the motor or larger gear on the wheel to slow it down, but there isn't room for a huge change on either one.

ScottoKong

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #88 on: February 15, 2012, 04:49:16 pm »
Hi Guys

Is there anything I can be checking/measuring on my cab to try and help you guys?

Thankfully I never experienced the wobbles you guys are talking about.

Scott

brad808

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #89 on: February 16, 2012, 07:05:10 am »
Haven't had time to do any more testing, but had another idea:

I wonder if the gearing between the motor and the wheel affect centering.
I don't think it would be this complicated, but what if the logitech pcb sends a signal expecting to turn the wheel X amount, but the wheel turns farther because our motor & wheel aren't geared the same as the original.  
It would need a smaller gear on the motor or larger gear on the wheel to slow it down, but there isn't room for a huge change on either one.

Just to build on that thought, if that is the case and the logitech does read how far the wheel travels vs how much signal is sent then an issue could lie with the little "self test" thing the wheel does when it first boots up. The stock wheel will turn all the way to the right and left where the hacked wheel will simply jolt to the right/left, almost like a twitch. I'm not sure if it's simply and "output" type test just to show you it's working or if it is in fact setting some sort of boundary. My guess is it's just an output test, but who knows it could be something as simple as that throwing it off. Might be able to test it by holding the wheel at different positions during it's boot up phase and see if it has an affect on the force feedback.



Hi Guys

Is there anything I can be checking/measuring on my cab to try and help you guys?

Thankfully I never experienced the wobbles you guys are talking about.

Scott

What sort of settings are you using as far as dip switches on the amc, logitech profiler settings etc on your wheel? Have you done any voltage measurements?
« Last Edit: February 16, 2012, 07:07:32 am by brad808 »

BadMouth

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #90 on: February 16, 2012, 11:28:38 am »
Hi Guys

Is there anything I can be checking/measuring on my cab to try and help you guys?

Thankfully I never experienced the wobbles you guys are talking about.

Scott

You had a higher voltage motor (90v).  Not sure if that means it would turn slightly slower with 24v.
The specs are clearly visible on a pic in your thread.  Might be interesting to compare the specs.

You also had those big ceramic resistors that were wired inline with the motor that nobody had seen on a machine before!
Can you make out out any markings or a value stamped onto them?
« Last Edit: February 16, 2012, 12:32:56 pm by BadMouth »

ScottoKong

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #91 on: February 17, 2012, 02:47:41 am »
Howdy

I hope to get some time this weekend to help with the trouble shooting.

I hacked a Logitech Driving Force - the same wheel at Marks Basement  http://home.comcast.net/~mshaker/marks_arcade_006.htm
You guys use a different wheel?

As for the 90v motor - I asked about it when I first got my cabinet.
I was led to believe that all the happ ones were 90v???  Just not run that high??

I've got the 10 dip servo (30A something from memory)
1 3 and 5 dips on, on the servo.

I cant make out the markings on the ceramic resistors - they werent listed in the schematics that came with the Cruisin USA cab either.
I'll try yo test with them out of the loop over the weekend - at least I'll measure either side.

Keep it real  :afro:


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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #92 on: May 22, 2012, 07:55:55 pm »
Hey everyone!

Seems like its been ages since I've made any progress on my cab. since my last update, I've messed around with the wheel hack a little more, with no luck. Everytime I'm unsuccessful, I stop trying and that's the biggest thing keeping me from moving forward on this build. That being said, I'm ready to tackle the hack so i can move along..so, have any of you guys got any more knowledge about the settings of the servo amps? That's one huge gray area that could be a cause of my issue. Another thing i think could be my problem is the wiring to the pot. If you remember, a while back i messed up one of the pads on the PCB where the header that connected to the wheel pot was soldered in. I then had to repair the board by soldering into a via that was connected to the same trace as the ruined pad. Ever  since then, the wheel pot intput always "flickered" on screen, like in the diagnostics screen that shows all of the digital and pot inputs, the wheel value was never steady. I think this could be causing the constant rumble of my motor. The video i posted a few posts back still shows the current state of everything. Any ideas??

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #93 on: May 22, 2012, 11:01:28 pm »
Ever  since then, the wheel pot intput always "flickered" on screen, like in the diagnostics screen that shows all of the digital and pot inputs, the wheel value was never steady. I think this could be causing the constant rumble of my motor.

That would definitely be a problem, as the wheel would think it was off center and try to correct it every time it "flickered".
It probably needs to be fixed before moving on.

There is still the issue everyone else has had of some wobble that can be eliminated by turning centering feedback way down, but I still don't like that solution.  I have 2 ideas to test when I get back into working with my new dash (I'm busy building a joystick cab at the moment).

The first theory is that the wobble is caused by a lack of friction in the Happ wheel.  The plastic logitech wheel turns kinda hard when unplugged.
The Happ wheel has bearings and moves freely.  I'd test this by hooking the servo amp up to the feedback motor in an original logitech wheel to see if it wobbles.  Then I'd try to introduce some kind of friction to the happ wheel.  The only thing I've come up with so far is to install nylon washers between the pulley on the steering shaft and the main bracket, or between the steering wheel and the main bracket.  Then tighten the steering shaft until is has some resistance when you turn it.  I'm not sure how long the nylon washers would last.

The other theory is that the gearing in the happ feedback system makes the wheel move farther than expected (past center).
Not sure how I'd go about finding different gears.  

You might want to see if any more progress has made on the interface mentioned in this post:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=119633.msg1268910#msg1268910
The guy sounded like he was going to sell them eventually.
It still uses the servo amp you already have.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2012, 11:26:28 pm by BadMouth »

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Re: Re: Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #94 on: May 23, 2012, 09:33:26 am »
Ever  since then, the wheel pot intput always "flickered" on screen, like in the diagnostics screen that shows all of the digital and pot inputs, the wheel value was never steady. I think this could be causing the constant rumble of my motor.

That would definitely be a problem, as the wheel would think it was off center and try to correct it every time it "flickered".
It probably needs to be fixed before moving on.

There is still the issue everyone else has had of some wobble that can be eliminated by turning centering feedback way down, but I still don't like that solution.  I have 2 ideas to test when I get back into working with my new dash (I'm busy building a joystick cab at the moment).

The first theory is that the wobble is caused by a lack of friction in the Happ wheel.  The plastic logitech wheel turns kinda hard when unplugged.
The Happ wheel has bearings and moves freely.  I'd test this by hooking the servo amp up to the feedback motor in an original logitech wheel to see if it wobbles.  Then I'd try to introduce some kind of friction to the happ wheel.  The only thing I've come up with so far is to install nylon washers between the pulley on the steering shaft and the main bracket, or between the steering wheel and the main bracket.  Then tighten the steering shaft until is has some resistance when you turn it.  I'm not sure how long the nylon washers would last.

The other theory is that the gearing in the happ feedback system makes the wheel move farther than expected (past center).
Not sure how I'd go about finding different gears.  

You might want to see if any more progress has made on the interface mentioned in this post:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=119633.msg1268910#msg1268910
The guy sounded like he was going to sell them eventually.
It still uses the servo amp you already have.

Just thinking about your two ideas. I'm not using the original happ gears on my wheel, I'm using the sega gears with the happ motor. I'm not sure how to properly compare gears (just count the teeth on big gear and small gear?) But if someone wants to do the happ gears I can do the sega gears and we can compare.

As for the first theory wouldn't adding more resistance just so you could add more force be counterintuitive? Wouldn't all the new force just be nulled by the added resistance? It's very possible that the resistance is the problem which is why it works when the centering feedback force is turned down. I'm not sure how yours felt when you did that but mine still feels very strong to the point that i turned it down further in most games.


Edit: on second thought if resistance is the final culprit adding resistance may not be such a bad thing. Not so much for PC but for ps2/3 where you have very limited control over force feedback. Getting the wheel back closer to the stock resistance could make a lot of sense then. As of right now i have to kill the power to the logitech board to play ps2 games which means no ffb :-[.
Sent from my Desire HD

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Re: Re: Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #95 on: May 23, 2012, 09:55:06 am »
Just thinking about your two ideas. I'm not using the original happ gears on my wheel, I'm using the sega gears with the happ motor. I'm not sure how to properly compare gears (just count the teeth on big gear and small gear?) But if someone wants to do the happ gears I can do the sega gears and we can compare.

As for the first theory wouldn't adding more resistance just so you could add more force be counterintuitive? Wouldn't all the new force just be nulled by the added resistance? It's very possible that the resistance is the problem which is why it works when the centering feedback force is turned down. I'm not sure how yours felt when you did that but mine still feels very strong to the point that i turned it down further in most games.

I don't think my wobble was any worse than yours when I was using the MOMO optical hack.  It was able to be tamed fairly easily.
In that setup, the Happ wheel was restricted to the same amount of travel as the original MOMO so the onscreen stops matched up perfectly with the real life ones.

It's a little worse with the driving force ex hack, but can still be tweaked away.  One thing with the driving force EX is that it's limited to a little less than 270 degrees.
I'm wondering if the happ wheel were limited to the same amount if it would behave better.    I remember skimming over some threads about using a different pot to make up for it, but didn't dig too deep into it at the time.

On the resistance thing, I'm not sure.  It's more about stopping the momentum after the motor is off.  I'm not sure that I have my head wrapped around it, but wanted to to go ahead and test it to see what happens.  I probably won't get to this anytime soon unless I take a half day off work to do it.

mbasile35

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #96 on: August 03, 2012, 06:58:35 pm »
Hey again everyone


Cruising around the internet got my excited to do more work on my cab some more. I saw that  the next release of supermodel 3 is going to support widescreen which is awesome, I saw that there is some preliminary work being done on Hikaru emulation which is exciting because I love Sega's NASCAR and can't wait to play that, and finally I've seen video of people who got Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 running full speed in (i think a modified version of) Dolphin. These were three big things i was hoping for, and to find them all at once was pretty cool. Needless to say, I got the itch to get some work done.

I mentioned before that i wanted to do something for the dashboard because it's just kinda boring looking. Originally i was going to use bondo and try to sculpt some lines into it to resemble a car hood or something like that. I tried that and it's going to take way too muhch bondo to get it right. So what i'm going to do instead is build a fiberglass "cover" (i guess) for the dash.  Similiar to the picture below but way less intricate. I've done a little repair with fiberglass sheets and resin, but not building something new so it should be interesting. My plan is to build the cover around the dash in foam and then use that to make the fiberglass cover



As far as the FFB issues i was having...I'm scrapping the whole thing. Too much of a hassle i think with  the lifted pad so I'm just going to hook the controls up to an opti-pac for now, and wait on the interface that badmouth mentioned above (that is if i finish this thing before the guy finishes his interface lol) that being said, I have everything except the plastic housing for the sterring wheel. It was a driving force EX, if any of you need the boards, cables or whatever i'd be happy to send them your way. The main pcb just has a lifted pad on the head where the wheel pot pluggged onto.


Anyways thats about it. For now I'm going to start the fiberglass piece and try to get a few more games working


Mike


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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #97 on: August 03, 2012, 10:17:08 pm »
Sometimes I wish I'd just made my own dash instead of trying to squeeze what I want into a model 2 dash.

look up some fiberglass speaker enclosure building videos on youtube.
Stretching fleece over a framework is probably going to be the quickest method to get the shape you want.

For the recessed parts of the dash, cut a plate with the shape you want to recess out of some 1/4" material.
Put it on the front side of the fleece, push it inward, and screw it to some kind of bracket behind the fleece.
The more of these tricks you use, the less bondo you'll need.

mbasile35

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #98 on: August 04, 2012, 12:03:37 pm »
Sometimes I wish I'd just made my own dash instead of trying to squeeze what I want into a model 2 dash.

look up some fiberglass speaker enclosure building videos on youtube.
Stretching fleece over a framework is probably going to be the quickest method to get the shape you want.

For the recessed parts of the dash, cut a plate with the shape you want to recess out of some 1/4" material.
Put it on the front side of the fleece, push it inward, and screw it to some kind of bracket behind the fleece.
The more of these tricks you use, the less bondo you'll need.

Thanks for the tips bad mouth. I've got a pretty busy weekend ahead of me but I'm hoping to pick up some foam this week to start making some progress. It's been too long lol


Mike

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #99 on: August 06, 2012, 12:42:07 am »
A fibreglass, CP sounds awesome you should start a WIP thread. Im with BM, i wish i did a custom sometimes. In the end i just used a G27 wheel also. I didn have the patients to get a real wheel working if you need Parts fire me a PM i be parting out my servo and motors and wheel.


My cabs
4 Player Arcade
X-men Arcade Remixed
My Pin Cab Attack of the PINZ cab
My Racing Cabinet Cab [URL=http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=

mbasile35

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #100 on: September 08, 2012, 04:42:25 pm »
I'm having some issues getting this started as it occured to me that i can't just switch up my control layout if i don't like what i come up with in fiberglass as easy as a simple wood panel. So I'm looking for some feed back on what you guys think about my layout and if i'm missing anything.



The buttons are all happ low profile illuminated pushbuttons. On the left theres 4 view buttons, and a start and exit. The left side is where i want to put a a "weapon button" for the mario kart games to shoot your item. My problem is with a control you can pull the analog stick back and fire the weapon to shoot it backwards (most go forward by default) So my first thought was the put a button in the sterring wheel. The mario Kart arcade games have this. There's also some games with a 2 button steering wheel which would work, but i can't seem to find a used one. And on top of both of these i was hoping to use the newr  style happ wheel with the rubber coating. Do you guys think modding the wheel to put a button in there is possible? Anyways if i don't do a button in the wheel, then i want to put two buttons on the dash. The triangle button shown would be forward weapon and then another one would be backwards weapon.

So what do you guys think?

EDIT

I think the right side is really boring, even with 2 buttons on it. Is there anythign else i should add? My shifter is gonna be on the seat base
« Last Edit: September 08, 2012, 04:47:42 pm by mbasile35 »

mbasile35

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #101 on: September 17, 2012, 06:47:54 pm »
I've got a tiny little update and I've made minuscule progress, but that's okay because its more than i've done in quite some time.


I'm still trying to finalize a design for my fiberglass dash...not so much the dash itself but the button layout. I was almost there, I ordered push buttons and everything, then i got an email last night saying that they don't make the small round low profile IPB's anymore...should have know something was fishy when the online store said they had them in white and the Happ website doesn't have white. So now I'm waiting for a reply and hopefully i can swap out small square low profile IPB's for the round ones.



This is a rough idea of what the dash is going to look like. There's no buttons on the left and the right side raised section is not going to be rounded like that, but the top is what iwas really trying to show. I'm still a little bit lost on what to do for the sides but i figure i'll start building up the front and top and then take it from there.



This one is model of the "plug" which is the form that the fiber glass is built around, with the esception that i put in the buttons because i was doing this when i got the email i mentioned and i wanted to see how the square ones looked on there.

Anyways what's holding me up now is access to a able saw. To make the plug for the top fiberglass section i need to make long straght cuts on an angle which is something i don't think i can do without a table saw. I thought about using a 45 degree chamfer bit to make the angles, and that's looking more and more like the route i'm going to go.  The other hurdle is time. I just picked up a  :censored: ton of OT at work and have been going to school 3 nights a week for the past few weeks . This weekend i hope to start the front panel plug because i can do most of that without a table saw.

mbasile35

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP
« Reply #102 on: September 22, 2012, 04:26:33 pm »
 Made some actual progress today. Its now been about a year since i started this thing..i wish i had more time.


Anyways, I ended up buying a table saw so i could just do the cuts myself. I figured it'll help out with this and any other future cabs i build, plus who doesn't like buying a new power tool? I table saw i bought is the cheapest one at home depot, the Ryobi RTS10. It got really good review for the most part and the price was attractive so i figured i'd go for it. After about 2 hours of use, i can say i don't have any complaints yet...and i still have all 10 fingers.



So what i cut today was the pieces of wood that are going to be used for the top of the dash board. I'm really happy with the way it came out considering this was my first time operating a table saw. I when i bought the saw i also picked up a 6" x 1" x 6' board and to my surprise i was able to cut everything i needed for the beveled cuts.






As far as the rest of the CP goes, I'm still trying to work out the buttons with the vendor i mentioned above. I also got a template laser cut to make the button panels. I figured i could trace them with 3/4 mdf and stack them up till i get the desired height. The laser cut part shipped friday so hopefully by next weekend i have something to show for that. I'm also thinking of using the laser cutter again to get the raised sections that the buttons actually sit on made (around the button, not the whole left/ right pieces) so i can get more intricate than i'd be able to by hand. I still have to wait to see if i get my buttons then i can figure that out.


Mike
« Last Edit: September 22, 2012, 04:50:24 pm by mbasile35 »

mbasile35

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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP Actual Progress!
« Reply #103 on: September 24, 2012, 08:02:58 pm »
Got the template in today, cut a piece from mdf with the jig saw really quick, clamped down the piece, clamped down the template, aaaaaaaaand......


I broke the acrylic template within a minute of routing.  I lifted up the router carelessly and ended up hitting the template with the bit, shattering a sqaure corner..not so bad, i still had had the intricate parts in tact and i could use something else to trace the missing corner. So i went along and routed the three straight edges (minus the one corner) and then when i got to the detailed part i did the same stupid thing. Now the template was a goner. Then i unclampled the template and threw it at my garage floor and now its really a goner. Oh well, but now i'm stuck with either buying a new template, or making my own. I'm going to look at the laser cutter's site and see if they can cut wood.

So no progress as far as the front of the dash goes, but i did start mounting the pieces i cut this weekend to 1/4 inch mdf. I just need to take some measurements and make some mounting holes and then i'll be ready to fiberglass the top at least. I also think I've got the buttons figured out. Apparently happ doesn't sell many of the low profile buttons so they're discontinued and i can't get either the small round or small sqaure  ones in white. So i settled for rectangles that i'll mount vertically.

That's about it for now.


Mike


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Re: Custom Driving Cabinet - WIP Actual Progress!
« Reply #104 on: September 27, 2012, 10:23:56 pm »
Been busy with school and work to do much of anything to the cab, but i'm gearing up to make some good progress this weekend. I didn't have luck trying to map two separate buttons in dolphin to fire weapons forward and back, so i'm probably going to dump that idea and use a single item button on the right side of the panel. This is going to leave a bunch of panel space open.  What i'm wondering is what do you guys suggest i should do with that space? I've got 4 view buttons, start and exit on the left side and that's full. The right side is the single item button. Am i missing any necessary buttons? All i can think of is coin but i'm planning on setting everything up for free play and probably putting a button on the coin return.

My other idea is just mounting the shifter there. I can probably think of way more games that mount the shifter on the dash than on the seat base so i'm not entirely sure why  wanted to do it this way to begin with. What do you guys who play games with the manual trans prefer?  Do you guys have any other ideas on what to use the left side panel for? Maybe simple speedometer decals?

Mike