JERSEY JACK PINBALL

[amendonz]

its an option.....you can get it with or without the slipper flippers....

[TOK]

It looks like it is too open in the center and too clogged up on the sides.

There is a lot of pressure on the undisclosed FLYING MONKEY feature to be something stupendous if it is to save this game from the looks of things so far.

I agree... the Ruby Slipper flippers gotta go...now!

I think the lack of art and inserts is making it look more open than it is. Lots of games have that much open area in the bottom and center.

[lilshawn]

Oncetheyfillthemiddlewithinsertsitwilllookbetter.Maybetheyhavesomeplansforaflipuptargetareainthearea...

[ChadTower]

Oncetheyfillthemiddlewithinsertsitwilllookbetter.Maybetheyhavesomeplansforaflipuptargetareainthearea...

This post could use some space.

[lilshawn]

for some reason the mobile version of the site message box is only 1 character wide...and apparently does not accept spaces 

[Jeff AMN]

Oncetheyfillthemiddlewithinsertsitwilllookbetter.Maybetheyhavesomeplansforaflipuptargetareainthearea...

This post could use some space.

Like the edges of the machine, amirite?

[lilshawn]

Winkwinknudgenudgestillnospaceswhatthehellissgoingon?!??

[RayB]

So by the looks of that drawing, it's going to be a widebody?

Looks like you were right! I think a message was sent out to buyers today indicating that it is a widebody.

I WIN!!

[lilshawn]

So by the looks of that drawing, it's going to be a widebody?

Looks like you were right! I think a message was sent out to buyers today indicating that it is a widebody.

I WIN!!

  congratulations!!!! here is your prize...

 

[MaineEvent]

Whitewood playing video.
This will be on location in Vancouver, I'm looking forward to trying it.

[smartbomb2084]

Seems like a bit of a snoozer to me so far.

There is EVEN MORE pressure on the FLYING MONKEY feature to save this game. 

I hope there is a software game situation that turns off the MUNCHKINLAND flipper after x amount of revolutions or we are going to be here all day just going around in circles even worse than NO FEAR.

Did they have to use a TWILIGHT ZONE cabinet?  Why not hack up a JUDGE DREDD instead?

[Nephasth]

I like the hand assist into Munchkinland at 1:40.

Did they have to use a TWILIGHT ZONE cabinet?  Why not hack up a JUDGE DREDD instead?

I thought they were trying to be a pinball manufacturer and they haven't even MADE a cabinet for this?

[Xiaou2]

The design seems very flawed.

 The point of a 3rd flipper is usually to be able to send the ball into an exciting, hard to reach area, or a nice flowing loop. In this case, its just sending it to the pop bumpers.  Hitting the witch targets seem easy enough to hit with the standard flippers.

 The left mini field doesnt seem to have the proper angles to hit the targets, which is compounded by the drop hole.

 The right mini field is boring, with its singular use.  Its speed is also a little too quick, esp. after a 2nd hit.. (which might be fixed if the house assembly is somehow powered by the ball... ) 

 In a theoretical layout design, one could for example, use the 3rd flipper to feed into the house-spin loop.

 

[JONTHEBOMB]

Looks like a good first try.  Can't wait to see the finished product.

[smartbomb2084]

The FINISHED PRODUCT is indeed key here. It is all too easy to critically bash the progress but ultimately that is how these things finally get done. Things are tried, accepted, rejected or modified.

That being said I think that the upper right pobumper on the left side will be quickly destroyed from head-on shots without some kind of target in front of it for protection.

[pinballjim]

LMFAO

Proof positive that if someone has been fired four times because he cant sell enough games... He shouldn't get a fifth chance.

[Xiaou2]

In many ways, its not fair to access designers based on past pinball sales.   The reason is because in the past, Operators just bought whatever theme looked like it would be popular.  Most of these arcade Opps never saw or played these games, ordering blindly.

 For example, Batman would be more popular to an op than Theatre of Magic. But no Batman pin has ever came close to trumping TOM.  And on location, TOM will out-earn any batman pin 10 to 1  (or more).

 Also, you have to consider what limitations and forced changes that the company instilled.  A design can go from gold to tinfoil with a single omission or change.

 But, generally speaking, I know that if Ive played 10 games by designer X... and wasnt all that impressed... that I shouldnt expect to be impressed by further works from him.

[amendonz]

soooo...big empty space in the middle = mini playfield underneath?? 

[Pinball Wizard]

Still wondering why it had to be a widebody.

[pinballjim]

In many ways, its not fair to access designers based on past pinball sales. 

When they're advertising the designers, then I think it's quite fair.

I think we're going to see a final product with deep roots in redemption games.  This is reminding me of Stern's Simpsons redemption game with the addition of flippers.

[Jeff AMN]

For example, Batman would be more popular to an op than Theatre of Magic. But no Batman pin has ever came close to trumping TOM.  And on location, TOM will out-earn any batman pin 10 to 1  (or more).

How much do you want to bet? I personally know an operator that has The Dark Knight and Theatre of Magic in the same location and I know what they take in.

Spoiler alert!

Batman crushes ToM. Your casual passerby would rather drop a few quarters into a Batman machine than a generic magic theme. It doesn't mean that they're playing the better game, but in their minds they're playing the better theme.

[MaineEvent]

In many ways, its not fair to access designers based on past pinball sales.   But, generally speaking, I know that if Ive played 10 games by designer X... and wasnt all that impressed... that I shouldnt expect to be impressed by further works from him.

[Jeff AMN]

Oh, and I know another operator that is trying to get me to fix up a guy's Lord of the Rings so that he can trade his Tales of the Arabian Nights for the Lord of the Rings because TOTAN no longer earns any and the one LOTR he has is doing really well. I have a LOTR and he wants it too, but I won't part with mine. Basically it's what we've all come to find lately: location machines rely heavily popular themes well before actual gameplay, art, or designer street cred.

[smartbomb2084]

That's because there are alot of clueless people in the world. 

They are spending their money on what they know--- mainstream movies and media. Any obscure theme is automatically garbage because they didn't make a $100 million dollar movie about it.

They know zilch about pinball and are likely only playing it for the 'wrapper' not the 'candy' inside.

[Jeff AMN]

Well, licensed themes are cheap to go for and you basically get some free marketing by attaching yourself to a license. I don't always agree with the theme selections, but I understand why they do it. Heck, going back to the early '90s it's always been the licensed games that have sold well and it's a huge gap between the best selling licensed games and the best selling original themes.

Transformers seems like a case of way too late though. I know that's Stern's next game, but Michael Bay has done plenty of damage to that license already.

[Xiaou2]

Sorry, but I had a perfectly working Batman in the mall arcade.  It made NOTHING.
The No Fear was trouncing it in earnings.  Twilight Zone and Whirlwind even did better than the batman pin.

 Its one thing to walk up to a game and play it once as a test.  Its quite another to actually get hooked and play it several times a month.

 And its quite another, to invest in a very expensive machine for the home... on a game merely based on generic theme.

 The days of highly successful generica are over.   Internet word of mouth can kill a lame game in mere minutes.

 Edit:

 And BTW - check up on the Opps machines.  I pretty much guarantee that the TOM has some sort of issue.  Unlike with my games, I knew that both worked 100% perfectly, because I cared enough to keep them in excellent shape.   Not just in mechanical functionality, but weekly cleaning, proper 'hearable' volume, non-glare lighting, and proper leveling.  Being at a mall location, on-premises over 45 hrs a week enabled me the ability that no typical Opp had.  

 It also proved itself on replay value.. because a mall has repeat regulars, who return often... rather than trying to gauge a game by mere passerby traffic in some airport niche.  Theres a HUGE difference.


 Anyways, go look over the games. Photograph them.  Play them.
Stern games are newer, so theres less chance of damage and malfunctions on them.  They also might look nicer merely out of a shine and 'clean' that will soon fade due to lack of time and effort.  If the TOM was brand new, and the Batman looked and played like a +20yr beat to hell pin, you can bet the stats would be opposite.

 A license never did anything for me when I was growing up playing machines.  I saw one look at Johnny Numonic, Judge Dredd, Dracula, and countless others, and walked right past them.  Starwars PB2K?  Once for a test, and never again.

 I remember playing Funhouse, cause I liked the idea of a Ferris Wheel ball lifter.  Pinbot, cause it seemed interesting. Jokers for the cool card theme and ramps, BK2K for the Awesome knight theme and kick butt soundtrack, Haunted House... cause of the great music, theme, and 3 levels.

 Remember, Batman or Harry Potter were not known in mass when they first came out.  It was the desire and interest in people that lead to their popularity.  And samely, someday, there might actually be some more excellent Original material produced that people will fall in love with.  Till then, we have to suffer thru craptastic remakes of previously Original material.

 The Irony of Circular Logic... Ugg.       

[pinballjim]

When exactly were you working/managing/owning a mall arcade?  I ask because Theater of Magic came out in 1995 and that date doesn't match your other timelines.

BTW, Cyclone and Hurricane have the ferris wheels, not Funhouse.  Black Knight 2000 is an awful game, too.

[Jeff AMN]

BK2000 is indeed a terrible game. It's a one-sided game with so few shots that it's kinda fun until you master those 2-3 shots and the it's a snoozer. Sure, good music and art, but the gameplay is atrocious.

[Xiaou2]

I worked for a Namco Owned Mall Location Arcade, from around 1996 to 1999.

 I never said we had a TOM.  We had a Batman, TZ, No Fear, Bram/Dracula, Judge Dredd, ...and various others on rotation from other locations.  Usually only 2 or 3 pins at one time. NF & TZ stayed around the longest.

 3yrs working in the arcade, felt like 20yrs.  Always something breaking down, some jammed coin mechs, customer arguments over drinks, little kids taking 20 min to pick out a toy, entire assemblies being ripped off games, employees that would play games on shift after I left, District MGRs that were total Tools, Stupid Namco rules... such as putting new games at the front entrance - which made them impossible to play due to reflection-glare, waking up once a week at 5am to collect & count tokens from 42 games + write down hard to find & read Coin Meters.. all before store opening.  Staying an extra hrs to assemble a new game kit & get it operational. Getting called back after-shift frequently due to a problematic bill changers going down. Driving an extra hour to clean and collect money from kiddie rides in distant off-site locations. Getting yelled at for beat up game that keeps breaking down (given to you from a busy location that trashed it, hacked wired it as barely operational, fudged collection numbers, never really could or would fix it properly... but now its Your problem).  Getting a call from an employee that stated a customer had kicked in the glass prize case due to a heated argument... I could go on and on about the nightmare.

 The best was when Namco tried to blame all the Mgrs of somehow embezzling money, because they couldnt accept the fact that sales were sliding down the tubes.  Soon after, stores started closing in rapid succession.

[Jeff AMN]

We had a pretty nice Namco arcade near me. Well, it was nice for a few years and from one day to the next it seemed to go right down the crapper. I remember feeling completely deflated after going out to the place one time and all of a sudden there were multiple broken games, dirty machines, and they had rotated out some of the bigger machines to fit in more generic smaller cabinets. It didn't take long to die off after that.

[Vigo]

3yrs working in the arcade, felt like 20yrs.  Always something breaking down, some jammed coin mechs, customer arguments over drinks, little kids taking 20 min to pick out a toy, entire assemblies being ripped off games, employees that would play games on shift after I left, District MGRs that were total Tools, Stupid Namco rules... such as putting new games at the front entrance - which made them impossible to play due to reflection-glare, waking up once a week at 5am to collect & count tokens from 42 games + write down hard to find & read Coin Meters.. all before store opening.  Staying an extra hrs to assemble a new game kit & get it operational. Getting called back after-shift frequently due to a problematic bill changers going down. Driving an extra hour to clean and collect money from kiddie rides in distant off-site locations. Getting yelled at for beat up game that keeps breaking down (given to you from a busy location that trashed it, hacked wired it as barely operational, fudged collection numbers, never really could or would fix it properly... but now its Your problem).  Getting a call from an employee that stated a customer had kicked in the glass prize case due to a heated argument... I could go on and on about the nightmare.

So that's where you get that easygoing demeanor from.   

Even though your description of an mall arcade in the late 90's sounds a tad more eventful than the cobweb-caked funeral parlors I have personally seen back then in the malls around me, I don't doubt that Namco would have been a ---smurfette--- to work for.

My short stint working at a theme park on the arcades was a cakewalk. We contracted AAA, which was perfect, because I didn't work for AAA. If something broke, I would take a golf cart over to the machine, see if I could easily fix it on the spot, and if not I would put it on the list for the next time the AAA guy came. Morning golf cart trip to fill the change machines, evening golf cart trip to empty the arcade machines and other coin-ops around the park. Spot check between on busy days. Everything went into commercial automatic coin and bill counters. We had amazing security, so if there was any problem, they were a radio call away. We had a cleaning dept that would take care of the routine cleaning, AAA would take care of the rest.

Damn, I miss that job.  

[pinballjim]

I always thought the Namco arcades were kinda strange... they always had all of their games for sale but it was amazing how much runaround they'd give you.  Oh, it's gotta be serviced first.  Oh, it doesn't work so you can't have it.  Oh, the guy that signs the paperwork is out today.  We don't have the form, blah blah blah.  Then you'd come back a month later and they had sold it all in bulk to someone else.

Prices were all over the map, too.  I seem to recall the Pin2ks were $1,500, some piece of junk like Power Stone would be $450 and then a Soul Calibur would be $75.

Anyway, it did have the ripple effect of flat out killing prices in Texas for a lot of stuff. 

It was always kinda fun to go into those arcades with a pocket full of tokens from other places.  Their mechs were so poorly adjusted you could have probably shoved washers down a lot of them.

[ChadTower]

Dunno about Texas but up here the tax laws are different for a "retail store" than a "coin op establishment".  I don't think Namco ever really intended to sell many games.

[pinballjim]

http://www.namcoarcade.com/Game-Sales.asp?search=All


 

[ChadTower]

There is a very large local arcade here that does the same thing.  "Every game is for sale".  Few games ever actually get sold, none are marked with a price, and the fact that they are for sale is barely advertised.  It's a tax and zoning issue.

Didn't you just say yourself that "it was amazing how much runaround they'd give you"?  Why do you think that was?

[studmuff]

I worked for a Namco Owned Mall Location Arcade, from around 1996 to 1999.

 I never said we had a TOM.  We had a Batman, TZ, No Fear, Bram/Dracula, Judge Dredd, ...and various others on rotation from other locations.  Usually only 2 or 3 pins at one time. NF & TZ stayed around the longest.

 3yrs working in the arcade, felt like 20yrs.  Always something breaking down, some jammed coin mechs, customer arguments over drinks, little kids taking 20 min to pick out a toy, entire assemblies being ripped off games, employees that would play games on shift after I left, District MGRs that were total Tools, Stupid Namco rules... such as putting new games at the front entrance - which made them impossible to play due to reflection-glare, waking up once a week at 5am to collect & count tokens from 42 games + write down hard to find & read Coin Meters.. all before store opening.  Staying an extra hrs to assemble a new game kit & get it operational. Getting called back after-shift frequently due to a problematic bill changers going down. Driving an extra hour to clean and collect money from kiddie rides in distant off-site locations. Getting yelled at for beat up game that keeps breaking down (given to you from a busy location that trashed it, hacked wired it as barely operational, fudged collection numbers, never really could or would fix it properly... but now its Your problem).  Getting a call from an employee that stated a customer had kicked in the glass prize case due to a heated argument... I could go on and on about the nightmare.

 The best was when Namco tried to blame all the Mgrs of somehow embezzling money, because they couldnt accept the fact that sales were sliding down the tubes.  Soon after, stores started closing in rapid succession.

Which Batman game?  DE Batman or Sega Batman Forever?  Just Curious.

[Donkbaca]

Taxes an zoning?

[Xiaou2]

Namco's Base-Office, told the managers that certain games were for sale.  However, then the district Mgr. would tell you not to sell certain games without his permission.  I sold like 4 games to a vendor one day, and I got reamed because there was nothing immediately available to replace them with.  Also, if a game did well in your location, you were told not to sell it.

 If you sold a game, you got a small commission.  Which still was better than nothing, considering the crappy pay I was getting.

 We had a multi-cart Neo-Geo for sale one day.. and I really wanted it for myself.  $300 was pretty cheap, but my finances were too restricted due to a brand new car, and super high insurance because I was a new driver.  I decided to set a price on the game to $400... and when the game was sold, Id write it up in my name, pocket the extra 100, and get the commission.  I didnt figure it would be all that big of a deal, because I could have just bought and sold the thing off anyways - off location.

 But the buyer was a game-store owner, who found out the prices from other locations... and threatened to turn me in unless I gave him the extra money back.  I got nervous, and folded.  I wish I would have just bought the thing and got someone to get it home for me.  It had an excellent monitor.

Which Batman game?

 Sega Batman Forever

[Vigo]

The best was when Namco tried to blame all the Mgrs of somehow embezzling money, because they couldnt accept the fact that sales were sliding down the tubes.  Soon after, stores started closing in rapid succession.

We had a multi-cart Neo-Geo for sale one day.. and I really wanted it for myself.  $300 was pretty cheap, but my finances were too restricted due to a brand new car, and super high insurance because I was a new driver.  I decided to set a price on the game to $400... and when the game was sold, Id write it up in my name, pocket the extra 100, and get the commission.  I didnt figure it would be all that big of a deal, because I could have just bought and sold the thing off anyways - off location.

 But the buyer was a game-store owner, who found out the prices from other locations... and threatened to turn me in unless I gave him the extra money back.  I got nervous, and folded.  I wish I would have just bought the thing and got someone to get it home for me.  It had an excellent monitor.

Heh, you ever think there may be real reasoning that Namco suspected their managers of embezzling money? 

[pinballjim]

It never ceases to amaze me how penny ante employee fraud tends to be.  Yeah, we could all use a raise, but was it really worth losing your job over 3 days of pay?