Should I set the Politics and Religion forum back to open access?

[Malenko]

Oh . . . I don't know.  I don't really think I'm too much of an ---uvula---, though judging by my tactless picture caption I don't discount the possibility that it may be a debatable proposition. 

By the way, did you say that Politics and Religion are not covered by the term Everything Else?  I'm going to have to check out a dictionary when I get a moment.  I could have sworn that I knew the definition of Everything Else off the top of my head, but maybe it means something other than what I thought.   

But in the future I endeavor to comply with your demands.  I will diligently seek to understand how dog fighting, falling through ceilings, cheesecake, the crappy job market and recipes revolving around bacon are appropriate topics for an arcade message board.  And health care, the post office, intelligent design in the public school curriculum, death trains, and government censorship are obviously inappropriate.

Wait . . . I think I'm being backhanded again.  Sorry.

I feel like I'm talking to Genesim.......
Is there an everything else section? Is there a politics and religion section? Then they aren't the same thing. While normally PnR would be covered under the same thing, the fact there is a separate section means they arent. Get it? see how MaLa front end is a section and software is a section, by your skewed logic then MaLa isnt software, and thats not how it works.

perhaps you should go to a forum that deals with reading comprehension?

Also I was just pointing out your caption because it is about religion, or lack there of, and anytime you post in any thread thats not PnR you're making a religious statement outside of where it belongs.

Also, I called myself an ---uvula--- and not you; also stated that when I act like an ---uvula--- I own up to it. I did call your comment cock faced, and I stand by that statement. I am not offended, btw, but I am more convinced the PnR should at the minum stay how it is.

[ark_ader]

The way I see this thread it should be Shmokes Room instead of PnR. 

I conclude the arguments are entertaining, but the comments should be toned down and reflect the rules of the board.  Also (as with shmokes) the ability to understand the comments made from a poster should be backed up with credible references and not wikipedia.

I would like to hear from anyone here who is currently in adult education using wikipedia in their assignments or course work. 

With those rules in place and a daily moderator keeping the order, then I do not see why the PnR forum should be under lock and key.

If the freedom of speech is taken away then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter.
George Washington 1732-1799

[patrickl]

As for daily contributors I'd say you have Mr. C, Dexter, Patrickl, Wunder.  I used to be one, but my posting there has dropped off sharply and I'll frequently go weeks at a time without posting there now, and when I am participating it's usually only half-heartedly in one or two threads.  On top of that you have periodic posts from Dartful, Ed, Frizzle, Saint, pinballjim, polaris.  A few others make occasional appearances ,e.g., Fredster, who used to post multiple times per day, will show up and post something once or twice a year.  

I wouldn't be surprised if 6 is an exaggeration of the average number of people contributing on a given day.  

Recently my "daily contribution" can't have been more than something like 1 post a day. I got too depressed seeing MrC debate with ... wel noone really. Would be nice to get some eloquent Republicans in there.

[shmokes]

PnR should at the minum stay how it is.

At a minimum.  If I had my way we'd take it a step further and have the participants murdered.

[CheffoJeffo]

PnR should at the minum stay how it is.

At a minimum.  If I had my way we'd take it a step further and have the participants murdered.

Beat me to it ... dammit! 

[shmokes]

Melenko, just to help you understand, allow me to show you your argument for why PnR should not exist here.  I have made a few strategic edits to help illustrate how your argument against PnR parallels a similar argument that could be just as legitimately levelled at EE:

I say delete the forum, this is arcade controls not everything else . . . .

yes yes you can retort with "then dont go there" but I can retort to you with "go to a forum that's purpose is to discuss EE"

The secret to understanding what I'm saying is to realize that I don't think the content of PnR is the same as the content of EE.  But the content of both forums are equally unrelated to building arcade controls and, thus,  the argument you made against PnR are equally applicable to EE.  See the difference there?

[shmokes]

Beat me to it ... dammit!  

The sky is the limit.  We could kill their families, burn down their homes, frame them for serious crimes . . .

[CheffoJeffo]

OK ... it's been a while since I posted from my collection of tommyisms, but this made me laugh out loud at the parallel.

if you dont like what you see or read DONT LOOK OR READ IT that should be the end of the story, why does everyone on the forum or whatever the case may be have to pay for it.

tommy and shmokes on the same side ... who'd a thunk it ?

[Ginsu Victim]

tommy and shmokes on the same side ... who'd a thunk it ?

Oh no....you may have just opened a whole new can o' worms....

[CheffoJeffo]

Actually, after further reflection, I think that there is a very simple way to decide on the best course of action.

"What would Stingray do?"

 

spoiler space for those who may not know

I've really lost all interest in splitting EE, I'm just jumping on the "get shmokes' knickers in a twist" bandwagon.

 

[Ginsu Victim]

Actually, after further reflection, I think that there is a very simple way to decide on the best course of action.

"What would Stingray do?"

 

Since you just printed it out, I've been looking through this...
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=35408.0;all

[Malenko]

Melenko, just to help you understand, allow me to show you your argument for why PnR should not exist here.  I have made a few strategic edits to help illustrate how your argument against PnR parallels a similar argument that could be just as legitimately levelled at EE:

I say delete the forum, this is arcade controls not everything else . . . .

yes yes you can retort with "then dont go there" but I can retort to you with "go to a forum that's purpose is to discuss EE"

The secret to understanding what I'm saying is to realize that I don't think the content of PnR is the same as the content of EE.  But the content of both forums are equally unrelated to building arcade controls and, thus,  the argument you made against PnR are equally applicable to EE.  See the difference there?

The secret to understanding what you are saying is easy, pay no attention to what is said and just bend everything to fit your needs. Let me use your logic here. Saint is wrong for not allowing discussion of ROMs , Warez,and pr0n in everything else because its "everything else" . Its "Everything Else" not "Anything goes"

I showed you the obvious flaw in your "logic" when discussing how MaLa must not be software because its not in the software forum. See the difference there?

Lastly, I dont understand what you hope to achieve with this "debate" ? I mean are you trying to show people how crappy it is in PnR using this thread as an an example? Are you trying to show people that its impossible to have a discussion with you because context and logic mean nothing to you?  Proving you still have no tact by having a religious statement in your caption?

Also feel free to not edit my quotes for examples. Oh yeah,  I misspelled minimum because I was in a rush to leave work.

[Ginsu Victim]

Let me use your logic here. Saint is wrong for not allowing discussion of ROMs , Warez,and pr0n in everything else because its "everything else" . Its "Everything Else" not "Anything goes"

[shmokes]

I showed you the obvious flaw in your "logic" when discussing how MaLa must not be software because its not in the software forum. See the difference there?

Malenko, I don't understand the relevance of your example to anything I have said.  In fact, as far as I can tell it only exposes the obvious flaw in your logic.  You specifically said if two things have separate forums they cannot be talking about the same thing.  Your exact words were:

Also, lumping "Everything Else" in with "Politics and Religion" is a fallacy, they obviously cover different things since they have their own independant sections. . . . Again, its not under the "Everything Else" umbrella so please refrain from lumping them together in any future posts on the topic.

It is by your logic that MaLa must not be software because MaLa has its own forum distinct from the Software forum.  I am quite sure that you will not find any similar quote from me.

But I seriously don't get where you're going with it.  The only comparison that I ever made between the two was to point out that if PnR is inappropriate by virtue of it being unrelated to arcade controls, EE is inappropriate too.

Now, PnR may still be inappropriate for other reasons, just as ROMS and pornography are inappropriate.  We can have that discussion if you like.  But you suggested that PnR had no place here because it had nothing to do with arcade controls, and that is what I was responding to with my comparison to EE.

Oh yeah,  I misspelled minimum because I was in a rush to leave work.

I hadn't noticed, nor would I have pointed it out if I had. 

[AtomSmasher]

I think it's time to move this thread into PnR.

[Dartful Dodger]

P&R started because of all the Bush bashing.

People who are bashing the current government have actual polital complaints.

It might work now, but if you open up P&R you'll just have to lock it again in 3 years.

[Malenko]

I never stated we cant discuss anything not arcade related here, you made that assumption. I say we shouldn't discuss PnR here because when we could, it sucked and brought down the other forums. It was moved away from the general chat for a reason, and you want it back because you are bored that no one goes in there. instead of campaigning for open PnR chat why dont you recruit via PM other members to join it? Its not difficult to get into PnR so I dont see what the big deal is.

I compare it to a diseased hooker on the corner, you think its fine for her to be there that if I ignore her that's the same as her not being there. I say I don't want a hooker on my street corner.

Also, I still find your avatar caption offense and I'm not the only one who feels that way and I dont understand how you get away with having it there, to me it seems to break the rule about respecting the other members.

[shmokes]

Malenko, I really think this argument has run its course.  Let's just both agree that PnR is like a diseased hooker on a street corner and we can leave it at that.

 I dont understand how you get away with having it there.

Someone upstairs looking out for me, I suppose. 

[CheffoJeffo]

I compare it to a diseased hooker on the corner, you think its fine for her to be there that if I ignore her that's the same as her not being there. I say I don't want a hooker on my street corner.

What would Stingray do ?

 

[mr.Curmudgeon]

Pn'R is like the Costco of discussion forums. You need special permission to get in because it provides "the stupid", in bulk form.

[protokatie]

I think it's time to move this thread into PnR.

Damn you beat me to it!

Anyways, I think it is fine the way it is personally. Forums can be like families, and conversations often stray from why this forum exists, and most of that can fit in EE. Basically, if someone can't be arsed to send a PM to saint to get into PnR, they must not really care about the content all that much. I only got access to it because so many forums in EE got the "moved to PnR" rubber stamp a few years ago, and I was curious to see what they were about.

[shmokes]

Katie, that is exactly the point, and exactly why PnR used to be great and now is only frequented by a handful of fanatics (the people who care about the content enough to be arsed to send a PM to saint).  If people had to send Saint an PM asking for special permission to access the Everything Else forum it would have exactly the same effect.  Traffic to EE would drop off sharply.  Only a fraction of people would continue visiting the forum which would not only deprive those people of EE, but it would deprive people in EE from those people's contributions.  It's easy to say, "Well . . . those people must not care about the content of EE enough to send saint a PM."  To which the only logical response is, "Well . . . yeah, obviously.  So?"

[Gorotsuki]

There was this one time
that I offended myself,
but then I got over it.

[DillonFoulds]

One time, I bought a coke, but then I accidentally the whole bottle. Is this dangerous?

[shmokes]

Verb trouble.

[AtomSmasher]

Katie, that is exactly the point, and exactly why PnR used to be great and now is only frequented by a handful of fanatics (the people who care about the content enough to be arsed to send a PM to saint).  If people had to send Saint an PM asking for special permission to access the Everything Else forum it would have exactly the same effect.  Traffic to EE would drop off sharply.  Only a fraction of people would continue visiting the forum which would not only deprive those people of EE, but it would deprive people in EE from those people's contributions.  It's easy to say, "Well . . . those people must not care about the content of EE enough to send saint a PM."  To which the only logical response is, "Well . . . yeah, obviously.  So?"

I used to post somewhat often in PnR, but it was the fanatics that got me to stop.  It got to the point that where anything you said required a bibliography with at least 3 sources sited, and each source needed to be from sites with differing political leanings then the rest.  I decided it wasn't worth the effort and decided to leave it to the fanatics, so I rarely post anything anymore.

[WunderCade]

Bring. It. On.

Sincerely,
Member of the G6.

[Vanguard]

Katie, that is exactly the point, and exactly why PnR used to be great and now is only frequented by a handful of fanatics (the people who care about the content enough to be arsed to send a PM to saint).  If people had to send Saint an PM asking for special permission to access the Everything Else forum it would have exactly the same effect.  Traffic to EE would drop off sharply.  Only a fraction of people would continue visiting the forum which would not only deprive those people of EE, but it would deprive people in EE from those people's contributions.  It's easy to say, "Well . . . those people must not care about the content of EE enough to send saint a PM."  To which the only logical response is, "Well . . . yeah, obviously.  So?"

I used to post somewhat often in PnR, but it was the fanatics that got me to stop.  It got to the point that where anything you said required a bibliography with at least 3 sources sited, and each source needed to be from sites with differing political leanings then the rest.  I decided it wasn't worth the effort and decided to leave it to the fanatics, so I rarely post anything anymore.

That's not true.   You kept submitting your bibliographies in MLA style when we told you it had to be in Turabian style, so we kicked you out.

[shmokes]

Since you just printed it out, I've been looking through this...
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=35408.0;all

Oh . . . man.  What a trip down memory lane.  Good times.   It's criminal that Chris went through and edited the content out of all of his posts. 

[Dexter]

I say delete the forum, this is arcade controls not politics and religion.

@Malenko

Its the very fact that the main forum is not political or religious in nature that gives the politics and religion section such a wide range of opinions. You don't just get a bunch of republicans moaning about liberals, or a bunch of christians moaning about muslims.

A politics or religion based forum would not have the range of views necessary for the type of debate you see in P+R on various issues.

My 2 cents: Open up access to P+R to any forum members with a certain post count, but without first having to send a PM to saint. Less hassle from him and more likely to add some fresh viewpoints to P+R.

[Ed_McCarron]

Vote yes.
The arguments are fun to read.

Your avatar is fun to look at (",)

Misty?

Let 'em all in.  Misery loves company.

[Ed_McCarron]

I compare it to a diseased hooker on the corner, you think its fine for her to be there that if I ignore her that's the same as her not being there. I say I don't want a hooker on my street corner.

What would Stingray do ?

 

Help dispose of the hooker once she succumbed to her various diseases?

[missioncontrol]

if your complaining about the lack of people in PnR you could always post a reminder in your signature that there is a PnR board visible upon request.

Kind of like a member drive.

[Malenko]

I say delete the forum, this is arcade controls not politics and religion.

@Malenko

Its the very fact that the main forum is not political or religious in nature that gives the politics and religion section such a wide range of opinions. You don't just get a bunch of republicans moaning about liberals, or a bunch of christians moaning about muslims.

A politics or religion based forum would not have the range of views necessary for the type of debate you see in P+R on various issues.

My 2 cents: Open up access to P+R to any forum members with a certain post count, but without first having to send a PM to saint. Less hassle from him and more likely to add some fresh viewpoints to P+R.

your 2 cents is about how it is now, which is the way I'd like it to stay, the deletetion was me being the aformentioned ---uvula--- =)

I voted, thats the extent of my power. I digress and withdraw, enjoy the "discussion"!

[saint]

Going to leave this up for one more day...

[mr.Curmudgeon]

The point of a minimum prerequisite is to protect the people in PnR from trolls.

That never stopped Dartful.   

[WunderCade]

Made a decision yet?  Also, since we seem to be heading toward a more adult attitude on discourse, is the IGNORE feature going to be rearing it's head again, or are we resilient enough to handle contrary viewpoints?  Let's not become like the Canadians at U of Ottowa.

[CheffoJeffo]

Let's not become like the Canadians at U of Ottowa.

 

For the record, most of the "2000" protesters were actually people trying to get in to see Ms. Coulter and it was the organizers, not the university nor anybody in government, who canceled. I absolutely think it was regrettable that the event was canceled, but the spin that is being put on it is just silly.

CAVEAT: My brother works at U of O

[patrickl]

Made a decision yet?  Also, since we seem to be heading toward a more adult attitude on discourse, is the IGNORE feature going to be rearing it's head again, or are we resilient enough to handle contrary viewpoints?  Let's not become like the Canadians at U of Ottowa.

The ignore feature is not to block out contrary viewpoints, but to block out people who write mostly useless replies.

[saint]

Hey guys - I've had two things that are distracting me so I'm putting this to the side right now.

1. I've been threatened with a lawyer.
2. My father's had a heart attack.

Things are a bit muddled right now so thank you everyone for the feedback, I'll come back around to this when everything's sorted out.

--- John