The NEW Build Your Own Arcade Controls
Main => Consoles => Topic started by: Howard_Casto on January 09, 2014, 09:46:05 pm
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I'm not trying to start a flame war or anything, it's just that every website and even a lot of people keep posting the "wii u is doomed" articles. Considering I couldn't find one anywhere all winter I was starting to smell the stink of deceit. So I looked up the current sales figures at vg charts:
Worldwide total sales:
Wii U - 5.25 million, over 2.25 million being US sales
Ps4 - 4.13 million, 2.19 million US sales
Xbone - 2.93 million, 2 million US sales
Worldwide Software Sales:
Wii U - 19.93 mill, 9.33 US sales
PS4 - 9.3 mill, 4.86 US sales
Xbone - 6.96 mill, 4.35 US
I know some people are going to chime in and point out that the Wii U has been out a whole year, but I don't see how that's relevant. Last year the Wii U had very strong holiday sales, and then it fell off, because they didn't have any games ready. If you'll look at the two new guys you'll note they are probably going to run into the same problem. But regardless... Where are the "XB One is doomed!" articles? If you look at the numbers it is the one that is struggling as typically holiday launches have strong sales... even the Wii U did better numbers last year.
Of course these figures probably aren't 100% accurate, but vgcharts are at least impartial.
My point is the PS4 and Wii U are doing ok... the Xbone, not so much. Yet the Wii U is getting all the bad press.
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Because people love to hate on the company that brought the industry back from the dead after Atari killed it off.
I've had a Wii U for quite awhile now. How many 3rd party games do I own? Zero.
I bought it to play 1st party titles. That's it. I pre-ordered all the "big ones" the day after I bought the thing. I look at all the titles available, and the only ones I want to play are the 1st party titles, which also happen to be exclusive to Nintendo.
I have a Wii, and I did the same thing there (I bought it a month after it was released). I own a bunch of 1st party titles for that, and maybe one or two 3rd party titles.
I bought a GameCube when I lived in Japan. Why? For the 1st party titles. I ended up buying a couple of 3rd party games, but that's because I was bored. I sold the GameCube when I got back to the states (still kind of regret selling it).
1st party games sell Nintendos. And there is a serious lack of them right now. /cry
I do enjoy other consoles too...
I have a PS2 and a PS3 as well. I bough the PS3 to play God of War games (God of War PS3 bundle actually) - why? Because you can only get God of War on that platform. I also bought the Uncharted series and have enjoyed that. (The PS2 was a gift....)
Every other game I buy that's not exclusive to a console is on Steam or Origin.
Xbox Live and PSN have proven that they have no control over digital sales - and paying customers lose access to the stuff they buy. Steam doesn't have that problem - you may loose the ability to buy, but I can still download and install games I paid for that are no longer available. So... screw PSN and Xbox Line.
The current game line up of Xbox One and PS4 makes me wonder what they're doing. There is nothing I want to play on either console. (well, maybe Resogun on the PS4... hehe). But Nintendo's line up basically sucks too outside of Mario and Zelda games.
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if you look at ALL the numbers it has been in decline and will level off well below the other two. consoles are a money waste now anyway... psone back was greatness... dreamcast was ahead of it's time and best console ever... all downhill after that. PC and emulators are where it's at. new console games are trash compared to PC offerings.
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consoles are a money waste now anyway... psone back was greatness... dreamcast was ahead of it's time and best console ever... all downhill after that. PC and emulators are where it's at. new console games are trash compared to PC offerings.
Such great classics like Swamp Buggy Racing (http://www.ign.com/articles/2000/03/08/swamp-buggy-racing), Extreme Paintbrawl (http://www.ign.com/games/extreme-paintbrawl/pc-10455), Big Rigs (http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/big-rigs-over-the-road-racing). ;D
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I'm a bit puzzled by the hate too. I wonder if it's because of the controller? I don't intend to buy any of the three, but I hope Nintendo do well. Consoles is pretty much all they do, unlike MS and Sony who could I guess ditch their consoles and continue with their other products. Nintendo doesn't have that luxury...
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The current game line up of Xbox One and PS4 makes me wonder what they're doing. There is nothing I want to play on either console. (well, maybe Resogun on the PS4... hehe). But Nintendo's line up basically sucks too outside of Mario and Zelda games.
Well I mentioned this when the Wii U was released, I think it was a case of "me too" syndrome. Nintendo had a solid plan... get the Wii out cheaply but start working on the next console immediately... the instant sales start dropping, announce the release of the next console and get the thing out before the other two. M$ and Sony positioned themselves to make consoles that lasted 10 years or more... they even said so when people asked. That is until the Wii U was announced, then they were all about talking about the upcoming consoles. I think they knew that if the Wii U was the only next gen console for more than a year it would spell their doom so both companies released their units before they were ready. It would explain the lack of games and ridiculously high price tags.
danny.. I dunno, the controller is the best part of the system. If nothing else the fact that I can tap a button on my gamepad and immediately look up info on the game on the net is worth the price of admission alone. I can't tell you how useful that is, especially on games like Assassin's Creed. I mean last go around people complained about the wiimote... now they offer a more traditional gamepad and people still complain? Maybe the younger generations are confused? EVERY Nintendo console gets an over-hauled controller... every single one. It is expected. They aren't Sony.
dcninja: There hasn't been a good pc game released that is exclusive to the pc in over 10 years.
And I don't want people reading this to get confused, I'm not saying that the Wii U is going to win the console war or anything, I'm just saying that their sales are rather healthy... especially in Japan where sales exploded after the release of SM3DW. I mean they did ok with the gamecube and it's sales were terrible.... it's actually the first Nintendo console I skipped out on initially... only buying it a year or two after release.
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I intend on buying a wii u in the very near future, purely for the mario bros/kart titles. Having owned both the 360 and PS3 (PS3 for a month, not my bag) I have no intention of paying silly money for either of the new consoles at this moment in time. The only title that might entice me in the future is Titanfall on the Xbone. The thing with the wii u is its just fun, nothing serious, simple pick up / put down fun. I tried the original wii and though it was absolute rubbish, the motion thing to me was just a gimmick, whereas the Mario titles on the wii u look like they could be a return to the nes/snes days. Only time will tell how many people like me, who had no interest at all in the wii u at launch, will now snap one up due to the amazing 1st party titles.
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I know some people are going to chime in and point out that the Wii U has been out a whole year, but I don't see how that's relevant.
Surely this is absolutely relevant? Your stats their show it - the PS4 has almost matched the wii U's lifetime sales in little over a month. There are industry statistics supporting the poor uptake of the Wii U and many third-party detractors. I regularly read press releases for games on news websites that actually state "Not coming out for Wii U". Nintendo have failed to make it clear to the public exactly what a Wii U is - it's confusing for people who bought a Wii one Christmas to play bowling with their aunt because they're not in the know. Is it just the tablet? Will it work with my old Wii?
But Nintendo can certainly afford a slow uptake because they've made so much money off of the DS and the Wii. I'm sure I read somewhere that they never sell hardware at a loss. But they have to sort out how they work with third-parties and how they approach marketing the device to people. The first few months of a consoles release are so crucial to it being accepted by the public and they appear to have cocked it up.
Also, from a personal stand point, I'm really bored of the major Wii U releases being another new Mario variant.
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All we ever used the Wii for was NetFlix.
The WiiU, in an incredibly dumb move, does not shut off the tablet screen during NetFlix. The only way to watch a movie on that thing is to leave the controller plugged in while it constantly drains and recharges the battery. Defies all reason and the only work around is to start a movie and carry the controller out of the room until it loses range.
I got a Deluxe a year ago when nobody could sell them and the flippers started dumping them at a loss. Recall I paid $100 below retail? Let me know when you see a PS4 deal like that.
The 2D Mario game was fun for a week. ZombiU is one of the worst games I've ever played. Trine 2 and Scribblenauts came out on everything else for $5. Seems like I own a few other games and can't even remember what they are.
:cheers:
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dcninja: There hasn't been a good pc game released that is exclusive to the pc in over 10 years.
You're missing out on some really amazing stuff. I don't know what's out there for people who like nintendo-style games, but there are some incredible games out there that you may never see on a console.
Some of my current favorites:
Mount and Blade: Warband
Kerbal Space Program
Crusader Kings 2
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I think you need to accept that the industry sees Nintendo as an old, out-of-touch relic that is no longer welcome to the party. Some of these perceptions could be attributed to Nintendo's baffling policies of treating all their customers like children that need protection from the real world. But, equally so, their best games are dismissed as not being 'gritty, realistic or mature.'
Truth be told, there are many who would rather Nintendo go the route of Sega - exiting the hardware game and releasing their IPs to smart phones and mainstream consoles.
The sales reports don't matter so much. So long as Nintendo churns out quality stuff, they eventually get my money. And despite that one recent hiccup, they're still quite healthy.
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I think you need to accept that the industry sees Nintendo as an old, out-of-touch relic that is no longer welcome to the party.
I don't knwo that that's necessarily true. Sure, the majority of "hardcore" gamers (for wont of a better word) may have lost touch with the Nintendo that probably fuelled much of their youth, but Nintendo's market isn't that type of person anymore, it's the family audience. It's why you'll rarely see Nintendo pitching its technical specifications in marketing - because they know that their audeicne doesn't know how to interpret these figures nor care. Nintendo's main concern is getting as many boxes into as many houses as possible, which they do by pitching the Wii and the Wii U as essentially fun toys that ANYone can play. And with the Wii they did a damn good job of it.
Truth be told, there are many who would rather Nintendo go the route of Sega - exiting the hardware game and releasing their IPs to smart phones and mainstream consoles.
Well going the route of Sega would mean releasing a console that fails so badly it almost ruins the company, and I don't think people really want THAT to happen; but putting their games out on iOS - while profitable to a certain degree - would dilute the specificity of their brand. Currently you need Nintendo branded hardware to play Nintendo-branded games, and those games sell those consoles almost as much as the consoles sell the games: I can't deny that part of the reason I bought my 3DS was simply to play Ocarina of Time again in 3D.
The sales reports don't matter so much. So long as Nintendo churns out quality stuff, they eventually get my money. And despite that one recent hiccup, they're still quite healthy.
Like I said, for every console they sell they make a profit, so they won't lose money. But now that the novelty of the Wii has worn off with the families who bought them just to play Wii Sports, they'r going to have to win back the core gamers who have defected to Sony or Microsoft with the Wii U to really form a solid fanbase again.
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I don't want 'gritty, realistic, or mature' games. I like to have fun when I play a game. I don't enjoy murdering people or guiding a team of foul mouthed 13 year olds through a simulated battlefield.
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Yeah, but some of us want to steal Barbie's horse and force it to rape her. (don't look at me, that was SavannahLion's fantasy)
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dcninja: There hasn't been a good pc game released that is exclusive to the pc in over 10 years.
You're missing out on some really amazing stuff. I don't know what's out there for people who like nintendo-style games, but there are some incredible games out there that you may never see on a console.
Some of my current favorites:
Mount and Blade: Warband
Kerbal Space Program
Crusader Kings 2
+1
it takes a AAA console title to match the fun of a small indie PC game...
FTL
UnEpic
Starbound
Shadowrun Returns
Wastland 2
...and many more great PC games.
If the consoles are lucky good PC games are ported with sub-par controls...
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by next year ps4 will probably sell more
I dont see xbone winning the "war" tho
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Keep in mind I'm not even referring to the 'hardcore' gamers, but rather the 20/30-somethings who somehow keep buying "Call of Duty"/"Battlefield" games even those they're all ostensibly the same thing over and over. (Okay, that statement was a bit 'generalizing' and 'fanboyish.' Nevertheless that seems to be my perception of the average adult gamer. And I'll admit these gritty shooters can be somewhat fun at times, but not particularly challenging or memorable in the way Nintendo's classics are.) To that particular demographic, having a Nintendo-branded piece of hardware in their house may seem unhip. (The Wii was the exception as it really struck a chord with the non-traditional gamers, except they were happy playing Wii Sports until eternity and practically nothing else. The original NES maybe as well, as it's currently the "old relic" of choice for wannabe hipsters.)
Just theorizing, I don't know.
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xbone
Kind of an aside, but I ALWAYS read this as "ex-bone".
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Ha, I'd assumed that was the joke!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)
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As an aside, we had an WiiU at the Video Game Club meeting today (it's a club I sponsor at the high school I work at), and the kids were hooting and hollering, totally loving it. Contrast that with the serious, sullen looks on the kids playing Halo 4 on the xBox.
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As an aside, we had an WiiU at the Video Game Club meeting today (it's a club I sponsor at the high school I work at), and the kids were hooting and hollering, totally loving it. Contrast that with the serious, sullen looks on the kids playing Halo 4 on the xBox.
Great point. I see that with my own kids. The feel you get is very different from Nintendo games vs PS3.
I was one of those "I'm never going to buy a Wii U" people but we broke down and got one for Christmas. I have to say it has been a huge hit in our house. Super Mario Brothers and Nintendoland in particular. Being able to play with the TV turned off is fantastic as well. Although I have to agree with PBJ that leaving the controller screen on while using Netflix is crazy dumb.
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dcninja: There hasn't been a good pc game released that is exclusive to the pc in over 10 years.
wut?
Amnesia: A Machine for Pigs
Arma III / DayZ
DOTA 2
Prison Architect
Star bound
WasteLand2
TrackMania
Assetto Corsa
iRacing
StarCraft 2
League of Legends
Civ 5
FTL (Faster Than Light)
Metro 2033
Jamestown
Retro City Rampage (though its supposed to be coming out for the 3DS)
HotLine Miama
Mini Motor Racing Evo (despite the ---smurfy--- AI, great game)
Rogue Legacy
Sine Mora
Typing of the Dead : Overkill
Valdis Story:Abyssal City (pretty great Metroidvania style game)
Mark of the Ninja
and thats just combing my installed games in steam for the most part :)
Also, I may eventually get a WiiU but not for a LONG time and a hefty price drop. I still feel burned by the Wii. But its not like I plan to get a PS4 or XB1 for a very long time either.
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Amnesia: A Machine for Pigs
Arma III / DayZ
DOTA 2
Prison Architect
Star bound
WasteLand2
TrackMania
Assetto Corsa
iRacing
StarCraft 2
League of Legends
Civ 5
FTL (Faster Than Light)
Metro 2033
Jamestown
Retro City Rampage (though its supposed to be coming out for the 3DS)
HotLine Miama
Mini Motor Racing Evo (despite the ---smurfy--- AI, great game)
Rogue Legacy
Sine Mora
Typing of the Dead : Overkill
Valdis Story:Abyssal City (pretty great Metroidvania style game)
Mark of the Ninja
I've got half that crap on my Xbox 360.
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That other half is still a lot of good gaming that's not on a console.
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I've got half that crap on my Xbox 360.
Bait taken!
Amnesia: A Machine for Pigs Windows, OSX, and Linux only http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amnesia:_A_Machine_for_Pigs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amnesia:_A_Machine_for_Pigs)
Arma III / DayZ : Windows only http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ArmA_III (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ArmA_III)
DOTA 2 : Windows, OSX, Linux Only http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOTA_2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOTA_2)
Prison Architect : Windows, OSX, Linux Only http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_Architect (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_Architect)
Starbound : Windows, OSX, and Linux only , announced but not released for PS4 and PS Vita http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starbound (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starbound)
Wasteland 2: Windows, OSX, and Linux only http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wasteland_2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wasteland_2)
Trackmania : Windows only. Technically a version was made for Wii and another for DS that arent quite the same game. Not released on 360 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trackmania (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trackmania)
Assetto Corsa: Windows Only. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assetto_Corsa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assetto_Corsa)
iRacing : Windows Only http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iracing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iracing)
Star Craft 2 : Windows and OSX only. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starcraft_2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starcraft_2)
League of Legends : Windows and OSX only. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_of_Legends (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_of_Legends)
Civ 5 : Windows and OSX http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civ_5 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civ_5)
FTL: Windows, OSX, Linux , iOS http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FTL:_Faster_Than_Light (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FTL:_Faster_Than_Light)
Metro 2033 DING DING DING! Available on 360 and Windows. This is the first one you could actually possibly have on your 360. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metro_2033_%28video_game%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metro_2033_%28video_game%29)
Jamestown: Windows, OSX, Linux http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamestown_%28video_game%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jamestown_%28video_game%29)
Retro City Rampage : DING DING DING available on pretty much everything, including 360
Hotline Miami : Windows, OSX, Linux, PS3, and PS Vita. Not on 360 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotline_Miami (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotline_Miami)
Mini Motor Racing Evo : Windows Only (mini motor racing is on iOS and Droid) http://thebinarymill.com/mini_motor_racing_evo.php (http://thebinarymill.com/mini_motor_racing_evo.php)
Rogue Legacy : Windows , OSX, Linux, PS3,PS4, Vita, no 360
Sine Mora: Available on errrrrting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sine_Mora (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sine_Mora)
Typing of the Dead Overkill : Windows only (note: NOT House of the dead, TYPING though house is bundled with typing) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Typing_of_the_Dead:_Overkill#Typing_of_the_Dead:_Overkill (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Typing_of_the_Dead:_Overkill#Typing_of_the_Dead:_Overkill)
Valdis Story: Windows Only http://www.valdisstory.com/ (http://www.valdisstory.com/)
Mark of the Ninja: 360, Windows, OSX, Linux
So thats 3 out of 23 that you could have on 360 gotta say that's little less than half, but I was told there would be no math. 6 out of 23 available on PS3/PS4/360. I say not bad for just spit balling together a list off the top of my head. If you'd like I can edit my first post and just have a list of 17 good exclusives. <3
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Nintendo has been dealing with this nonsense ever since the Gamecube. One of the things to keep in mind in regards to Nintendo is that they own their factories and, as such, directly control their costs. Even if, in the long run, they don't sell quite as many consoles as the other guys they turn a profit on every single piece of hardware they sell. Which is totally the opposite of Microsoft and Sony. Also, Nintendo's market is very different than the other guys. Nintendo has long been going after the casual and family market that MS and Sony, in large part, ignore.
When I was a game store manager we sold 2 wii's for every Xbox or PS that was sold. When Mom came in to buy a console, we sold a Wii. When G-ma came in to get a gift, we sold a Wii. When the herd of 5-12 yr old siblings came in, we sold a Wii. When the 30-something gamer came in foaming about Call of Duty 2012 or Madden: Black Ops, we sold an Xbox or PS.
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Malenko, don't take this the wrong way, but most of the games on that list are crappy independent titles that you can breeze through in an hour or are so underwhelming they could be ported to a cell phone. I meant AAA titles.
I mean when you are listing the typing part of typing of the dead OK, you are grasping at straws.
Like I said, the PC hasn't had a major exclusive title in over 10 years.
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I think you need to accept that the industry sees Nintendo as an old, out-of-touch relic that is no longer welcome to the party. Some of these perceptions could be attributed to Nintendo's baffling policies of treating all their customers like children that need protection from the real world. But, equally so, their best games are dismissed as not being 'gritty, realistic or mature.'
Truth be told, there are many who would rather Nintendo go the route of Sega - exiting the hardware game and releasing their IPs to smart phones and mainstream consoles.
The sales reports don't matter so much. So long as Nintendo churns out quality stuff, they eventually get my money. And despite that one recent hiccup, they're still quite healthy.
But why? Idiot teenage/20 something gamers get a pass, they are too stupid and full of hormones to know any better, but surely "the industry" should know by now that Nintendo always leads the charge in longevity, if not innovation? Nintendo doesn't treat their consumers like children, they put child-safe features into their consoles because many of their consumers ARE children. Microsoft and Sony really need to do some of that stuff if you ask me. I haven't used voice chat in online-multiplayer in years because 8 and 10 year old kids are always cursing like sailors on there. Their parents need to get them off the "adult" consoles.
Nintendo can't go the route of Sega, it's impossible. Sega always copied what Nintendo did... Nintendo, on the other hand, designs their consoles based around games they want to make. You can't make Nintendo games on anything else but Nintendo hardware.
I just don't get FPS... at least not people my age playing them. I played them extensively in high school and college, but I grew out of it. They were actually acceptable in our day though... you were shooting demons from mars/hell or mutant pigs from outer space, not creepily realistic human models on a creepily realistic modern battlefield. I'm not saying that sort of thing is wrong, but I don't know if it's right either. I feel a bit uneasy playing stuff like that.
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Malenko, don't take this the wrong way, but most of the games on that list are crappy independent titles that you can breeze through in an hour or are so underwhelming they could be ported to a cell phone. I meant AAA titles.
I mean when you are listing the typing part of typing of the dead OK, you are grasping at straws.
Like I said, the PC hasn't had a major exclusive title in over 10 years.
Most triple A titles aren't developed for just 1 system, unless its first party like Nintendo. Typing of the dead is great, beyond just good. Not only do I have a fun way to try and improve my typing, I have a "light gun" game to play too (yes, I use a mouse, its still fun) and it cost me $10. I had a blast playing the original typing of the dead on dreamcast. I for one have found a lot more fun per dollar in "crappy independent" games than big budget titles. Example, Assassins Creed III sucked and I dropped $60 on it. Retro City Rampage is an ode to all the games I played growing up as a kid and it cost me like $5. I even made a effort to not list FPS games, you make me sad.
Ok, your turn, name a good WiiU exclusive not made by Nintendo (or any of its studios) that's awesome. Go ahead, I'll wait.
I know youre a nintendo fanboi, and thats cool but....
Nintendo can't go the route of Sega, it's impossible. Sega always copied what Nintendo did... Nintendo, on the other hand, designs their consoles based around games they want to make. You can't make Nintendo games on anything else but Nintendo hardware.
Rly? I had no problem playing any NES game, SNES game and most N64 games on my xbox1.
Wii was waggle shovelware.
And for the record, I'm not a big FPS guy or a repeat sports game buyer. I typically pick up the latest NHL if it adds something new. I didnt pick up NHL 14 because I dont consider "leaky goalies" a feature.
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Like I said, the PC hasn't had a major exclusive title in over 10 years.
*cough*
World of Warcraft. 9 million (monthly) paying customers would agree (used to be 11 million)
(and a good bunch of other MMOs)
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I just don't get FPS... at least not people my age playing them. I played them extensively in high school and college, but I grew out of it. They were actually acceptable in our day though... you were shooting demons from mars/hell or mutant pigs from outer space, not creepily realistic human models on a creepily realistic modern battlefield. I'm not saying that sort of thing is wrong, but I don't know if it's right either. I feel a bit uneasy playing stuff like that.
Sounds like you would Like Borderlands 2...But really. FPS games are just fun...exponentially fun when you play with your friend or other live people...on a team.
Try a game with 64 player maps. Or a night of 4 player coop.
Why would you discount a whole genre as being for teenagers. Yet conveniently not apply this logic for arcade games...Didn't you grow out of it?
Howard, It sounds that since you havn't played any of the awesome games that are only availible on the PC that you discount them for all of us.
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Malenko, don't take this the wrong way, but most of the games on that list are crappy independent titles that you can breeze through in an hour or are so underwhelming they could be ported to a cell phone. I meant AAA titles.
I mean when you are listing the typing part of typing of the dead OK, you are grasping at straws.
Like I said, the PC hasn't had a major exclusive title in over 10 years.
Most triple A titles aren't developed for just 1 system, unless its first party like Nintendo. Typing of the dead is great, beyond just good. Not only do I have a fun way to try and improve my typing, I have a "light gun" game to play too (yes, I use a mouse, its still fun) and it cost me $10. I had a blast playing the original typing of the dead on dreamcast. I for one have found a lot more fun per dollar in "crappy independent" games than big budget titles. Example, Assassins Creed III sucked and I dropped $60 on it. Retro City Rampage is an ode to all the games I played growing up as a kid and it cost me like $5. I even made a effort to not list FPS games, you make me sad.
Ok, your turn, name a good WiiU exclusive not made by Nintendo (or any of its studios) that's awesome. Go ahead, I'll wait.
I know youre a nintendo fanboi, and thats cool but....
Nintendo can't go the route of Sega, it's impossible. Sega always copied what Nintendo did... Nintendo, on the other hand, designs their consoles based around games they want to make. You can't make Nintendo games on anything else but Nintendo hardware.
Rly? I had no problem playing any NES game, SNES game and most N64 games on my xbox1.
Wii was waggle shovelware.
And for the record, I'm not a big FPS guy or a repeat sports game buyer. I typically pick up the latest NHL if it adds something new. I didnt pick up NHL 14 because I dont consider "leaky goalies" a feature.
You are seriously going to compare what are essentially mini games to REAL games? And seriously you are going to count typing of the dead when I played it YEARS ago on the wii, only with a superior gun controller? Hell it was released for the ps3 a couple of years ago as well. I bought typing of the dead... it was a great novelty... for an afternoon. On the other hand I went back to House on the Wii over and over again, because I could play with a gun. TOTDOK disappointingly doesn't even support multiplayer unless you do it online.
I don't know if you are trolling or what... but the system architecture of the NES/SNES ect is what made those games possible and great. Emulation doesn't fall into the equation because that game has already been built. Also if you enjoyed playing those games with an inferior d-pad then more power to you, I'll stick to a real one myself. An inferior d-pad, attached to a controller, I might add, that was a blatent rip-off of the snes controller. Seriously think before you type this stuff man, you aren't making any sense. The xbox, or the gamepad as we know it wouldn't even exist without Nintendo. Prior to the nes all game controllers looked like 2600 joysticks.
I think you guys are confused... I have played nearly every game on that list you gave... all of those games... they just aren't full-sized games. Have I played some of those games and even enjoyed them? Sure! Would I buy a PC just to play those games... hell no! On the other hand there are games on all of the major consoles I could see myself buying a system just to play (except the ps4 and xbone, but they are brand new... give them time). THAT is the difference. I can get a great deal of enjoyment out of throwback and indie games, but they weren't made 30 years ago so their length and lack of content/replay value becomes and issue.
Also to further the point along you can NOT compare a game that costs 5 dollars to one that costs 60. One is a AAA game and one is not. That was kind of my point. If you are going to go that route then we are all borked because the iOS/Android market is the most viable gaming platform... after all they sell millions upon millions of their crappy 1 dollar mini games.
Why would I need to name an exclusive for the Wii/Wii U not made by Nintendo? The whole point of getting a Nintendo console is to play Nintendo games on it and the fact that they ARE exclusive was my entire argument. I think I've hit a nerve here, but I'm not sure why... I'm just speaking the truth, namely the pc master race died around the time the 360 was released. I'm sad to see it go, I LIKED pc gaming... but it just isn't in the shape it used to be. All of these oddball genres that used to be pc only like fps/ rts, ect... they have slowly but surely all migrated to the consoles. Now they are developed for the consoles first and ported to the pc a year or more later.
The Wii was NOT shovelware... I think I've had this conversation with you a million times. Many of the best selling and highest rated games of last gen were on the Wii. You didn't like them, that's fine, but it does NOT invalidate the merits of the Wii. The fact that motion controls are now a standard on all three consoles even a generation later kind of shows that it wasn't a gimmick and it's here to stay.
Some of you obviously don't "get" Nintendo. They try these crazy over-the-top ideas, they always have. Sometimes they stick, sometimes, they flop and sometimes they just need to be brought down to earth a little, but they are pretty much the only company that does that. And they've popularized everything from the d-pad, to putting start/select buttons on the gamepad, hell the gamepad itself, to the standard arrangement of buttons, shoulder buttons, the analog stick, rumble feedback,ect.... Put yourself back in 1985. Arcades have joysticks, the Atari has a joystick, C64, all those guys... joysticks. Nintendo comes out with this flat square brick with a black plastic cross on it? Think of how big of a risk that was! They seem generic now but these were crazy ideas back in the day... time just makes them seem more sensible as they are accepted into the industry.
knave I didn't apply the logic to other genres because they aren't broken. When you are young you like immature stuff, and when you get older you put that aside and keep the good stuff. I didn't discount the whole genre as being for teenagers, you are putting words into my mouth. I discounted all the realistic war fps as being for teenagers, because quite frankly each sequel is exactly the same as the last, and they just weren't very good to begin with. The genre is degraded actually. Back in the Doom/Quake days you actually had more varied environments and weapons... you could carry more stuff at a time ect.... The few fps that are good actually vary from the formula so much I'm not sure if they are even fps. I mean stuff like Portal, and Metroid Prime and although I don't like it, Bioshock.
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One of the things to keep in mind in regards to Nintendo is that they own their factories and, as such, directly control their costs. Even if, in the long run, they don't sell quite as many consoles as the other guys they turn a profit on every single piece of hardware they sell. Which is totally the opposite of Microsoft and Sony.
That hasn't been true since 2011 when Nintendo approved the massive 3DS price drop and they are still losing money on each Wii U they sell.
Nintendo turning a profit on hardware has long been the primary "talking point" of the fanboi when gaming discussion turns to that "hot new game"
not coming to the Nintendo console, Nintendo's derision of third parties, or Nintendo failing to properly support their own console.
Suppose Nintendo were indeed making a profit on each wii U they sell, even the most the most diehard of fanboi's would have trouble trying to
gag out the flacid "at least Nintendo is profitable" argument once games like Fallout 4 release on everything but the Wii U.
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I really think talking about "exclusives" on a PC is a pretty redundant idea. The PC at this stage is such a separate entity from consoles regardless of what Valve are attempting - more than anything, it's also a device that isn't bought solely for games. And I'm lumping Linux, Windows and OSX into this. I mean, who cares? Exclusives divide more of a line between Xbox and Playstation at this point - anyone who uses Steam will barely be complaining when the majority of these AAA titles you harp on about end up being sold for as little a £3 during sale time. Meanwhile, Nintendo games seem to stay at a high price point indefinitely, in the UK at least.
This is sheer Nintendo evangelising that doesn't take in the bigger picture. All of these platforms have their pros and cons - but if you're talking about statistics, you can't show me very similar figures comparing console sales for a Wii U that's a year old with a PS4 that's a month old and then pretend that the Wii U has been a runaway success, because it clearly hasn't. Let's have this discussion in a year's time and see what happens - I'd be very surprised if Nintendo isn't overtaken by Sony and/or Microsoft.
To clarify, I don't WANT Nintendo to fail at all - I'm a big fan of ALL consoles (seriously, why bother taking sides at all??). But at the moment it's flagging.
Also, to tackle another point, the Wii really excelled with family-oriented shovelware. Here's an article about it (bit old, but not much changed):
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2009/09/27/feature-wii-software-problem-shovelware.aspx (http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2009/09/27/feature-wii-software-problem-shovelware.aspx)
And while I don't really like the Call of Duty series myself either, you cannot say that the Dooms/Quakes were better. They were groundbreaking in their day, but the various changes to the FPS formula that have happened since have improved the genre so much - for one, nowadays you get a STORY. Doom and Quake were literally about mindless violence and gore. You can't go from praising Nintendo's risk-taking hardware advances to slating a genre's attempts to do the same with its gameplay.
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But why? Idiot teenage/20 something gamers get a pass, they are too stupid and full of hormones to know any better, but surely "the industry" should know by now that Nintendo always leads the charge in longevity, if not innovation? Nintendo doesn't treat their consumers like children, they put child-safe features into their consoles because many of their consumers ARE children. Microsoft and Sony really need to do some of that stuff if you ask me. I haven't used voice chat in online-multiplayer in years because 8 and 10 year old kids are always cursing like sailors on there. Their parents need to get them off the "adult" consoles.
Nintendo can't go the route of Sega, it's impossible. Sega always copied what Nintendo did... Nintendo, on the other hand, designs their consoles based around games they want to make. You can't make Nintendo games on anything else but Nintendo hardware.
I just don't get FPS... at least not people my age playing them. I played them extensively in high school and college, but I grew out of it. They were actually acceptable in our day though... you were shooting demons from mars/hell or mutant pigs from outer space, not creepily realistic human models on a creepily realistic modern battlefield. I'm not saying that sort of thing is wrong, but I don't know if it's right either. I feel a bit uneasy playing stuff like that.
While it's very unlikely Nintendo will leave the hardware game, it's still not impossible. Anything can and has happened. But I didn't bring that up as an eventuality, just an opinion of certain "gamers" who'd like to play, as an example, Pokemon on their iPhones or Android but are not willing to buy a 3DS.
And the "teenage/20 something gamers" do not get a pass because these are the customers with the MOST disposable income. These are the customers who are dropping money on the CODs and Battlefields (and, in the past: the Guitar Hero/Rock Band entries.)
And the "industry" doesn't care one iota about Nintendo's longevity - they want profit, nothing more - nothing less. Third parties are fair-weathered friends. They have abandoned Nintendo in the mid-90's because of cartridges (pricey, limited space.) And it's still happening now with the likes of EA not even bothering producing any WiiU games (http://gamerant.com/electronic-arts-no-wii-u-games/). (Don't feel too bad for Nintendo, they were kind of ---Deutsche Frankfurters--- to these 3rd parties in the NES days.) So yeah, if you're the type of person who likes Battlefield or EA Sports games, Nintendo is never going to be your first choice of console.
Now, as for Nintendo treating its customers like children: They just recently maimed Swapnote (http://www.destructoid.com/nintendo-can-i-have-swapnote-back--264977.phtml) because some lowlife was using it for nefarious purposes. Heinous yes, but Nintendo is more interested in putting up walls than reminding parents to set the parental controls and tell their kids not share information (including friendcodes) with strangers online. And yeah, swapnote is just a silly little app on the 3DS but there were users who liked it and weren't too pleased over the change.
Of course, you did say "many of [Nintendo's] customers are children" as a response for the above but then that just proves what the industry has against Nintendo. The average gamer is in his/her 30's and they're the ones with the money to spend on new software and gadgets. So the "adult" consoles get more press while they dismiss Nintendo as "yeah, you're kids will like it." Remember, these are not game journalists I'm referring to but mainstream news and information sources.
Lest you think otherwise, I am huge Nintendo supporter. I just got a 3DS (loving it) and I plan on getting a WiiU this year. But I know it's an uphill battle for them. You just kind of have to accept that people are going to be talking about the other consoles more. All you can really do is not worry about it and enjoy your Nintendo.
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I know a lot of gamers and not one owns a Wii-U!
I have never even seen one in person!
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I had a lengthy reply (yeah, even longer than below), but I decided to cut it down, so you'll actually read it.
Me: "Ok, your turn, name a good WiiU exclusive not made by Nintendo (or any of its studios) that's awesome. Go ahead, I'll wait."
You " Why would I need to name an exclusive for the Wii/Wii U not made by Nintendo? The whole point of getting a Nintendo console is to play Nintendo games on it and the fact that they ARE exclusive was my entire argument. "
So, what you're saying is, other than Nintendo made WiiU, nothing is worth playing on a WiiU? FINALLY we agree on something. I don't know if maybe you missed the part where I said I'm not buying a WiiU, XBOX-One, or Playstation 4 ; so I don't have a dog in your troll fight. Did I mention I own a 3DS too? Your "Nintendo games need Nintendo hardware" became invalid after the SNES, pretty much any game that's come out on any system since then could be done on any available hardware (Except Jaguar, man what a turd) at the time.
Howard talking about Nintendo with you is difficult if not impossible. You basically say every genre of game you don't like doesn't count towards a great game (apparently everything that isn't a 3D platformer me thinks) , any game that doesn't have millions of dollars dumped into development sucks (MineCraft, Fez, Path of Exile, Wasteland2, etc) , and by that same token the most expensive game ever to make (GTA V) isnt a good game either. Or we're wrong cause we don't get Nintendo. I accept some people like you like the WiiU, you need to accept that some people like me, don't like the WiiU (and didnt like the Wii either).
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Madden: Black Ops
:duckhunt
That WOULD be intriguing...
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Wii and Wii U appeal to parents due to the content. So many kids get violent games for birthdays and Christmas on the Xbox and PSX, which leads them to behaviour problems down the road. That is why I am against kids playing call of duty. The age rating on the box should be respected. We all know what happens if you sell an adult game or video to a child. ::)
The Wii and Wii U's catalogue is more cartoon and kid friendly, to share games with grampa. My friend's kids get one hour of Wii game time before bed, and most of the time it is competitive play with wii sports. His kids are 10 and 13.
I think the tide will turn when the only games available for the PSX and Xbox are the shooters, so the Wii sales will take up the slack. remember the aged play games too, and the wii is more conservative and easier to use than the modern consoles.
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I really think talking about "exclusives" on a PC is a pretty redundant idea. The PC at this stage is such a separate entity from consoles regardless of what Valve are attempting - more than anything, it's also a device that isn't bought solely for games. And I'm lumping Linux, Windows and OSX into this. I mean, who cares? Exclusives divide more of a line between Xbox and Playstation at this point - anyone who uses Steam will barely be complaining when the majority of these AAA titles you harp on about end up being sold for as little a £3 during sale time. Meanwhile, Nintendo games seem to stay at a high price point indefinitely, in the UK at least.
PC gaming is irrelevant because it's the most affordable?
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...which leads them to behaviour problems down the road. That is why I am against kids playing call of duty. The age rating on the box should be respected. We all know what happens if you sell an adult game or video to a child. ::)
I'll debate a lot of this to the ends of the Earth. Behavior problems are NOT caused by violent games. What little evidence that HAS been connected to this concept is anecdotal at best and contrived at worst. I know this is completely tangential to the thread, but it's an exposed nerve to me. Don't get me wrong, I agree that not enough parenting occurs in relation to the games played, but I also think that a lot of the parenting that DOES occur is horribly misguided. The best example of this... I was once selling a batch of games to a mom for her kids B-Day and she had a bunch of 'M' games in her hand. Grand Theft, CoD, Manhunt (fer cryin' out loud... Manhunt???). I tried to explain to her that maybe the violent content was not appropriate for her 10 year old. Her response? "Oh, I don't mind the violence. As long as there's no nudity!" Seriously????? You have no problems with Little Johnny choking someone to death with a plastic bag or sticking a grenade to someone's head - but a boob is gonna be a show stopper?
WTF?
We all know what happens if you sell an adult game or video to a child
Yeah - $5000 fine per incident that is reported to the ESRB with any documentation and the cashier's job if it's at a Gamestop. I've had to fire cashiers for that before.
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No that's not what I meant. I was trying to point out that so many of the games from both the xbox and Playstation camps that "matter" end up on steam at some point, if not at first, and eventually for so little outlay compared to their console counterparts that, really, who cares that I had to wait a couple of years?
The PC excels at providing an open arena for indies to get the wackiest of ideas up there as soon as possible if they want, unhindered by corporate red tape and bureaucracy, and then worry about proper distribution if they see the demand. Could anyone really argue that a game like Papers Please would ever have come out in a console first (if at all)? Triple A titles rarely stretch far outside of the box because they propose too great a risk for the people holding the purse strings.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)
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Sorry, accidentally posted twice (silly iPhone)
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Just to clarify, I think PC gaming is massively relevant, but Steam is the closest thing it has to a marketing department in gaming, so I really think it's quite a different beast.
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...which leads them to behaviour problems down the road. That is why I am against kids playing call of duty. The age rating on the box should be respected. We all know what happens if you sell an adult game or video to a child. ::)
I'll debate a lot of this to the ends of the Earth. Behavior problems are NOT caused by violent games. What little evidence that HAS been connected to this concept is anecdotal at best and contrived at worst. I know this is completely tangential to the thread, but it's an exposed nerve to me. Don't get me wrong, I agree that not enough parenting occurs in relation to the games played, but I also think that a lot of the parenting that DOES occur is horribly misguided. The best example of this... I was once selling a batch of games to a mom for her kids B-Day and she had a bunch of 'M' games in her hand. Grand Theft, CoD, Manhunt (fer cryin' out loud... Manhunt???). I tried to explain to her that maybe the violent content was not appropriate for her 10 year old. Her response? "Oh, I don't mind the violence. As long as there's no nudity!" Seriously????? You have no problems with Little Johnny choking someone to death with a plastic bag or sticking a grenade to someone's head - but a boob is gonna be a show stopper?
WTF?
Like many studies, they'll probably NEVER be able to determine causation. However, there is no denying there is often a correlation between violent games and kids' behaviors.
And you say that games don't cause behavioral problems, yet in the very same post you express disgust and disbelief at the mother who buys a violent game for her 10 year old child. I know your argument will be that an inattentive mother /= causation. And I agree. However, with all these messed up kids, and all these messed up games, it seems mathematically impossible that one of these games has never caused any behavioral problems. Though I will concede it's far more likely that games have exacerbated many issues such as racism and sexism among others, and in some instances may have catalyzed some into action to do things they otherwise would not.
I'll end this by agreeing. It's all about the parenting. Parents of at-risk kids and teens should not be encouraging this kind of behavior. If their kid is being relentlessly tormented, and he has a new profound fascination with guns and death and such, perhaps a war simulator isn't the best thing to be getting him.
Found a blog or something by some guy who let his 7 year old (or around that age) play GTA (maybe V?). However, his son didn't do any bad things. Instead, he went around helping and doing nice things (I didn't know such things were even in GTA.) It was an interesting read.
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Hi,I'm new to the forum.I don't intend to argue with anyone just add my two cents.Having three kids 18,14,and 6 years old has had me buying consoles since the mid 90's.I all i can say from experience is that my kid always have more fun with nintendo products.My 18 year old that's a female had me buy her wwe 2k14 for ps3.Played for an afternoon and got tired of it.Waist of money on my part.But yet she still takes time out of her busy texting schedule (lol) to sit down with us to play mario party on the Wii U.Its been about a month and she still hasn't picked up the ps3.But at least twice a week on the Wii U.The Lego games are easier for my 6 year old to play and he has the batman lego for ps3,3ds,and Wii u.Guess which console he preferes.Kids may not have money but Parents like me do.I mean who in there right mind would want there child learning fowl language online.No call of duty and the likes as I try to raise my kids without any additional bad influences.FPS for me is just that.With out them ps and ms would be dead.At least sega had sonic. :)
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To add I had my 13 year old nephew stay with us over the summer who never played Wii or Wii u.Came with his own ps3 and games packed in suitcase.He then found out that he actually liked the Wii U contrary to what his friends have said.When he gets back home a month later my sister calls me up and said "thank you".I said "for what".He no longer wanted fps games or the ps3 for that matter.He wanted the Wii U.So I got him one.Guees what he wanted for christmas?Not ps4 or xb1,but super mario 3d over everything else.I figure those who prefer the Wii are more family oriented as anyone from a 6 year old to my dad at 65 years old can play and have hours of fun.To me that is PRICELESS.Simplicity in its best form.I personally like ps3,but thats only because of the driving games nothing more.Injustice plays just as well on the Wii u.I have fun with my son on it.
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I really think talking about "exclusives" on a PC is a pretty redundant idea. The PC at this stage is such a separate entity from consoles regardless of what Valve are attempting - more than anything, it's also a device that isn't bought solely for games. And I'm lumping Linux, Windows and OSX into this. I mean, who cares? Exclusives divide more of a line between Xbox and Playstation at this point - anyone who uses Steam will barely be complaining when the majority of these AAA titles you harp on about end up being sold for as little a £3 during sale time. Meanwhile, Nintendo games seem to stay at a high price point indefinitely, in the UK at least.
PC gaming is irrelevant because it's the most affordable?
No PC games in the UK is used by the elite hardcore gamer. Having managed several game servers in the UK, I would say the majority of gamers are console restricted. The cost of hardware, infrastructure and knowledge is more expensive in the UK. One of the reasons why I got a Xbox 360. My upgrade process was non-ending, where the console allowed gaming without the expense. Coupled with the high cost of living in the UK, creates a separate demographic, which is not as comparable to console users. You can pick up a used 360 for £50 and you are all set. Try picking up a used PC for £50 and see where that takes you.
The Wii, for its size, usability and content, cannot be compared to the PC no matter how you try.
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And you say that games don't cause behavioral problems, yet in the very same post you express disgust and disbelief at the mother who buys a violent game for her 10 year old child. I know your argument will be that an inattentive mother /= causation. And I agree. However, with all these messed up kids, and all these messed up games, it seems mathematically impossible that one of these games has never caused any behavioral problems. Though I will concede it's far more likely that games have exacerbated many issues such as racism and sexism among others, and in some instances may have catalyzed some into action to do things they otherwise would not.
You are drawing an in correct connection in my comment. That part was directed at ---smurfy--- parents being the problem. The example was pointing out that this mother was offended by something that is natural and expected, sexuality, and not phased at all with graphic violence. THAT is where the problem exists, not with the games.
You further go on to point out that there MIGHT be SOME connections. And that in CERTAIN folks with a PREDISPOSITION, the situation MIGHT be EXACERBATED. Seems like an awful lot of outlying possibilities, not enough to make any kind of blanket statements on. Basing any kind of law on something like that would be like saying that since some 32 year old males that work in food service that happen to have fathers that were members of a masonic temple might, if the phase of the moon is correct, beat there girlfriends to death with a hammer (FOX would call this a new "Trend sweeping the nation"...), that we must pass a law limiting access to hammers without a doctor's note.
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dcninja: There hasn't been a good pc game released that is exclusive to the pc in over 10 years.
This is the comment I was responding to. My point is that their are several "good" PC games that are not on any of the consoles..
knave I didn't apply the logic to other genres because they aren't broken. When you are young you like immature stuff, and when you get older you put that aside and keep the good stuff. I didn't discount the whole genre as being for teenagers, you are putting words into my mouth. I discounted all the realistic war fps as being for teenagers, because quite frankly each sequel is exactly the same as the last, and they just weren't very good to begin with. The genre is degraded actually. Back in the Doom/Quake days you actually had more varied environments and weapons... you could carry more stuff at a time ect.... The few fps that are good actually vary from the formula so much I'm not sure if they are even fps. I mean stuff like Portal, and Metroid Prime and although I don't like it, Bioshock.
Howard. I ma not a teenager and I like FPS games. I buy and play the ones that give me the experience I want. Doom was ok, Unreal was better, Half-Life was where they became amazing. then counterstrike, Halflife 2 etc...
Team fortress-original and Half-life deathmatch were lan party favorites whin I was in college. It is alot of fun to frag your friends and talk smack.
I don't buy them all. but do try out diferent sub-genres. Doom 3 for example was fun but it turns hout I'm not really into being scared that often while I play a game. The multiplayer was simplified but entertaining.
Counterstrike source was very fun but you could find servers with asshat players that killed the fun...solution. Don't play on those servers.
Battlefield 2 introduced to me the joy of 64 player multiplayer matches and unlockable weapons. I loved every minute of it. Of any game I've ever played I have more hours in this game. I still boot it up every now and again and it is still fun.
(There's something wrong with your theory, I'm not in High School/Collage any more but a thirty-something family man.)
Since then my game time has dwindled, Kids, work, social obligations take hold and I don't have hours and hours to play. But I do check out and buy
Battlefield 2:Bad company which I liked even though they tweaked some things and reduced the multiplayer to 32 players.
Far Cry 2...was entertaining as an example of open world gameplay
Crisis...Really I picked this up really cheap on sale and enjoyed it.
Then their was the awesome Borderlands 2 which added humor, a fun single player story and awesome 4 player co-op.
I am now even further from being in high school or college just like my friends whom I play with...Whats not to like about these games?
I bought a bundle with Battlefield three in it for pennies so I will check that out someday and no doubt will like it too...
Bottom line. The fun of FPS games is the experience...the action, and shooting...
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And you say that games don't cause behavioral problems, yet in the very same post you express disgust and disbelief at the mother who buys a violent game for her 10 year old child. I know your argument will be that an inattentive mother /= causation. And I agree. However, with all these messed up kids, and all these messed up games, it seems mathematically impossible that one of these games has never caused any behavioral problems. Though I will concede it's far more likely that games have exacerbated many issues such as racism and sexism among others, and in some instances may have catalyzed some into action to do things they otherwise would not.
You are drawing an in correct connection in my comment. That part was directed at ---smurfy--- parents being the problem. The example was pointing out that this mother was offended by something that is natural and expected, sexuality, and not phased at all with graphic violence. THAT is where the problem exists, not with the games.
You further go on to point out that there MIGHT be SOME connections. And that in CERTAIN folks with a PREDISPOSITION, the situation MIGHT be EXACERBATED. Seems like an awful lot of outlying possibilities, not enough to make any kind of blanket statements on. Basing any kind of law on something like that would be like saying that since some 32 year old males that work in food service that happen to have fathers that were members of a masonic temple might, if the phase of the moon is correct, beat there girlfriends to death with a hammer (FOX would call this a new "Trend sweeping the nation"...), that we must pass a law limiting access to hammers without a doctor's note.
Yes, but at some point, you have to start giving credence to a mountain of circumstantial evidence. If games didn't have a potential effect on the younger generation, we wouldn't put ratings on them. I'll post an additional bit later...gotta go!
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Yes, but at some point, you have to start giving credence to a mountain of circumstantial evidence. If games didn't have a potential effect on the younger generation, we wouldn't put ratings on them. I'll post an additional bit later...gotta go!
Nonsense. We put ratings on things because it is human nature to do so. Video games are nothing more than this generation's bogey man. In the past it's been comic books, rock music, movies... You name it, at some point it's been blamed as the "source of corruption of today's youth". Hell, even Plato says that Socrates complained about the decline of modern youth.
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Ahhhh.... the age-old debate of the effects of video game violence. No one in this world could possibly just have a screw loose, it's always cause-and-effect.
Anyway, here's an episode of P&T's BS dealing with the topic (NSFW language but no nudity in the episode.)
Penn and Teller: ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow---! - Season 7 Episode 3 - Video Games (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tS1Ys7lNXYY#ws)
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When we turn a blind eye at an issue like this, I'm reminded of the gun industry and their absolutism regarding their beliefs. Heck, any dissension is met with swift action. Just ask Dick Metcalf. (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/05/business/media/banished-for-questioning-the-gospel-of-guns.html?_r=0)
If I were to contemplate a situation where everything else was equal, and a young person was allowed to frequently play games such as Mario and Zelda for 10 years, then compared that to a young person that was allowed to frequently play games such as GTA and Hitman, I believe you'd have two very different people at the end of that time.
I harbor no deluded belief that I'm going to convince anyone otherwise. Even I'm not convinced one way or the other. But some things are worth a deeper look. The conflicting studies that are available certainly suggest that. Just because we can't see something doesn't mean it isn't there.
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Just because we can't see something doesn't mean it isn't there.
And the corollary to that; just because we think something is there doesn't mean there is. Which is why I believe in evidence and proof over anecdotes.
If we poll a prison we will find that every person there has eaten food. Some would draw the connection that eating food leads to criminal behavior. Obviously this is a flawed hypothesis. I realize that this is an absurd example, but in this day and age when nearly every kid in the country has been exposed to violent games and movies we are faced with an interesting trend. According to FBI violent crime stats, crime rates have been going DOWN for almost two decades. How can this be the case when penetration of violent games is becoming the norm rather than the exception?
I'd be more inclined to accept that access to violent games actually have an opposite effect. As an anecdote, I know that me and many of my friends go and play games when we get pissed as a release. We take out our aggressions on the game rather than, for example, getting into a bar-fight. Once again, no proof, something that maybe warrants more study.
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Just because we can't see something doesn't mean it isn't there.
And the corollary to that; just because we think something is there doesn't mean there is. Which is why I believe in evidence and proof over anecdotes.
If we poll a prison we will find that every person there has eaten food. Some would draw the connection that eating food leads to criminal behavior. Obviously this is a flawed hypothesis. I realize that this is an absurd example, but in this day and age when nearly every kid in the country has been exposed to violent games and movies we are faced with an interesting trend. According to FBI violent crime stats, crime rates have been going DOWN for almost two decades. How can this be the case when penetration of violent games is becoming the norm rather than the exception?
I'd be more inclined to accept that access to violent games actually have an opposite effect. As an anecdote, I know that me and many of my friends go and play games when we get pissed as a release. We take out our aggressions on the game rather than, for example, getting into a bar-fight. Once again, no proof, something that maybe warrants more study.
I would be more inclined to say that prison food leads to bad behaviour.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2006/oct/17/prisonsandprobation.ukcrime (http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2006/oct/17/prisonsandprobation.ukcrime)
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolutionary-psychiatry/201105/diet-and-violence (http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolutionary-psychiatry/201105/diet-and-violence)
http://www.westonaprice.org/environmental-toxins/violent-behavior-a-solution-in-plain-sight (http://www.westonaprice.org/environmental-toxins/violent-behavior-a-solution-in-plain-sight)
Oh crap! there I go again, referencing my opinions. :lol
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Just because we can't see something doesn't mean it isn't there.
And the corollary to that; just because we think something is there doesn't mean there is. Which is why I believe in evidence and proof over anecdotes.
If we poll a prison we will find that every person there has eaten food. Some would draw the connection that eating food leads to criminal behavior. Obviously this is a flawed hypothesis. I realize that this is an absurd example, but in this day and age when nearly every kid in the country has been exposed to violent games and movies we are faced with an interesting trend. According to FBI violent crime stats, crime rates have been going DOWN for almost two decades. How can this be the case when penetration of violent games is becoming the norm rather than the exception?
I'd be more inclined to accept that access to violent games actually have an opposite effect. As an anecdote, I know that me and many of my friends go and play games when we get pissed as a release. We take out our aggressions on the game rather than, for example, getting into a bar-fight. Once again, no proof, something that maybe warrants more study.
I have heard of a study that shows that this is possible. Like you, if I'm feeling angry, there's nothing better than blowing away strangers online. Beats doing something regrettable in the real world ;D
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I did a study on this while I was in the Child development field.
While the violent TV and video games can influence attitude to a degree, the study could not provide any statistically significant data that they increased the probability of violent actions.
So, my bottom line...I don't let my kids watch/plat anything that I deem isn't age appropriate.
I used my own internal ratio of what kind of violence is age appropriate for my kids. I mean...cartoons and Mario games have violence...so I drew my own line...?
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good or bad nintendo is not going anywhere anytime soon period.
many console's and company's follwed and failed and there the original next to atari and still around today and survived through all competition since.
sony is sony and xbox is xbox but either has nothing on nintendo when it comes to gaming and console/handheld history.
me personally there all worth only the same $150.00 at most that I wlll pay for any of them when the time comes, good or bad I got my money's worth when that time comes too lol.
I compare them to what the playstation 1 and xbox cost when they came out and what there worth now wich is about a tenth of the launch price.
same wil go for these console's too and when that time comes I still dont care who was best on the games or sale becuase I was not the dummy that paid 500+ for any console in the first place.
I am not saying it is wrong if your the desprite for one but me there just a game console and I already have a ton that need attention with huge back logs so am in no hurry to go out burn weeks pay on any of them when I can grab them all down the road for a single weeks pay for al of them.
but as far as the wii-U and the next gen console's as long as link and mario live on so will nintendo it been a proven formula over and over for over 25 years now and something xbox and sony will never toach plain and simple.
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I did a study on this while I was in the Child development field.
While the violent TV and video games can influence attitude to a degree, the study could not provide any statistically significant data that they increased the probability of violent actions.
So, my bottom line...I don't let my kids watch/plat anything that I deem isn't age appropriate.
I used my own internal ratio of what kind of violence is age appropriate for my kids. I mean...cartoons and Mario games have violence...so I drew my own line...?
Due diligence? Paying attention to your kids? Taking responsibility for your own judgement calls?
That's downright un-American!
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Video games lead to violent behavior just like listening to Led Zeppelin made me worship the devil due to backward masking. Oh wait, it didn't.
And since it came up....blaming guns for (insert topic here) is like blaming cars for DWI's...maybe we should ban cars.
Ratings on games is a product of the gaming industry trying to avoid govt. intervention in the gaming industry...period.
All of the surrounding issues amount to poor parenting and/or lack of personal accountability.
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Video games lead to violent behavior just like listening to Led Zeppelin made me worship the devil due to backward masking. Oh wait, it didn't.
And since it came up....blaming guns for (insert topic here) is like blaming cars for DWI's...maybe we should ban cars.
Ratings on games is a product of the gaming industry trying to avoid govt. intervention in the gaming industry...period.
All of the surrounding issues amount to poor parenting and/or lack of personal accountability.
I agree.
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:cheers:
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Video games lead to violent behavior just like listening to Led Zeppelin made me worship the devil due to backward masking. Oh wait, it didn't.
And since it came up....blaming guns for (insert topic here) is like blaming cars for DWI's...maybe we should ban cars.
Ratings on games is a product of the gaming industry trying to avoid govt. intervention in the gaming industry...period.
All of the surrounding issues amount to poor parenting and/or lack of personal accountability.
^ This
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Video games lead to violent behavior just like listening to Led Zeppelin made me worship the devil due to backward masking. Oh wait, it didn't.
And since it came up....blaming guns for (insert topic here) is like blaming cars for DWI's...maybe we should ban cars.
Ratings on games is a product of the gaming industry trying to avoid govt. intervention in the gaming industry...period.
All of the surrounding issues amount to poor parenting and/or lack of personal accountability.
You forgot the books. ;)
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To bring this back to the OPs point...
A friend of mine happened to send this link to me today (apropos of nothing) which provides an unnamed developer's insight into developing for the Wii U.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-secret-developers-wii-u-the-inside-story (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-secret-developers-wii-u-the-inside-story)
If you're not interested in the trials and tribulations of developing for the platform, you can skip to just after the Assassins Creed video and see his more general conclusion.
In short, he explains the pitfalls in the hardware, the lack of support, the bad timing of its release and the withdrawal of support from third-party developers.
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Interesting read s_bubsy. That does explain a lot of the reasons why the industry turns it back on Nintendo hardware.
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What I took from that article was not development communication from Nintendoh, but management and developer greed. Sometimes you have to sacrifice time and money to get to grips with a new platform. Wanting to see a COD level product on the third tit platform from the get go is just fantasy.
Just let the Japanese develop for the platform and leave the foreign 3rd parties to their own devices. Now with two consoles on a X86 platform, having to reinvent the wheel will not be an issue.
IMHO if it was my company doing the work, I would only want the best, and it was the second best explaining in that article. I would say management was responsible for the 3rd parties pulling from the Wii U, not Nintendoh.
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A real gamer plays a bit of everything and being a loyalist to one company is honestly ridiculous unless you are a major shareholder.
Limiting yourself to the big N leaves a ton of amazing content on the table, period!
I own most consoles, from the 2600 up to the PS4/Xone (own both), a stout gaming pc, arcade cabinets, handhelds, tablets and I find the WiiU to be severely lacking considering it has been around for about 14 months, they have under delivered thus far when it comes to first party content (which is the only reason I own a Wii... 1st party).
These loyalist driven debates are always so entertaining. ::)
:cheers:
Jason
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So you're going to willingly ignore all the bits where he talks about poor developer tools, unfinished features, overly slow feedback time, last generation tech... It's clear the console was rushed out the door.
Your solution to just let the Japanese develop for the platform is mind bogglingly narrow minded and it would be suicide for Nintendo to do that. You mention the x86 architecture of the ps4 and xbox1 - clearly these are machines that have been carefully designed to make it as easy as possible for developers to make games for them without having to waste valuable time working out the platform, which was always one of the issues raised at the PS3.
The best thing that can happen out of this is for Nintendo to learn from its arrogance in time for it's next console - but unless they get a boost from China since it's laws on consoles were loosened, it's going to find this generation a real struggle.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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These loyalist driven debates are always so entertaining. ::)
I'm honestly trying to be as objective as I can here! This has nothing to do with hating Nintendo for my part - I love their games! I even own a Wii (even if I've not used it in over a year). But I've been following console news for the last couple of years via various RSS feeds and news sources, and the signs are not great for Nintendo. But I will be the first to applaud if they turn things around!
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These loyalist driven debates are always so entertaining. ::)
I'm honestly trying to be as objective as I can here! This has nothing to do with hating Nintendo for my part - I love their games! I even own a Wii (even if I've not used it in over a year). But I've been following console news for the last couple of years via various RSS feeds and news sources, and the signs are not great for Nintendo. But I will be the first to applaud if they turn things around!
Absolutely has nothing to do with hating Nintendo, they have made some of the best games of all time and I think most everyone would agree.
However they have made some serious mistakes with the WiiU and it's feeling more and more like a sinking ship for all but the loyal fan base.
Heck self admitted loyal N fans have been calling them out for months asking where the games are, sadly Nintendo's arrogance has lost them most third party support and they admit their own AAA titles take a long time to develop.
It's ironic how big N fans like to rip on games like COD yet seem to be thrilled with a New 'Mario Kart' title every year (meaning same core gameplay but with new content) :dizzy:. Which is not meant to imply that COD is better than Mario Kart, it's just an observation.
:cheers:
Jason
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I'm not sure I agree with the headline but this brings everything into stark relief:
http://techcrunch.com/2014/01/17/wii-u-not-selling/?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000591 (http://techcrunch.com/2014/01/17/wii-u-not-selling/?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000591)
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Oh god, I can't wait to hear how this is a good thing.
::)
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Just adding more fuel to this fire:
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/01/wii-u-sees-rare-negative-sales-trend-in-second-holiday-season/ (http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/01/wii-u-sees-rare-negative-sales-trend-in-second-holiday-season/)
...'cos everyone loves a good graph.
Edit: Interesting little article here too:
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/10/the-wii-u-death-spiral-and-how-nintendo-can-reverse-it/ (http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/10/the-wii-u-death-spiral-and-how-nintendo-can-reverse-it/)
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If I was Nintendoh I would allow hacking of the console for home brew applications. If the device is as dead as a dodo, why not make it more appealing to the hacker community, and spin it.
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If I was Nintendoh I would allow hacking of the console for home brew applications. If the device is as dead as a dodo, why not make it more appealing to the hacker community, and spin it.
Because the hacker community is not nearly big enough to save the console. Nor would they want to actually promote hacking.
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Hackers have been unable to do anything on WiiU.
That conference where they announced, "we've figured it all out but don't want to release it" was pure comedy.
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I am sure there attention is all on the ps4 and xbox one before the wii-u get's any of their attention there's just not enough interest to have the wii-u hacked over the other console's at ths point in time is all.
if the xbox one and ps4 was not luanched the console would be hacked already but the xbox and sony disracted them from the wii-u is all lol.
once there both cracked I am sure the wii-u will be on the menu afterwards but for now there is no point other then to say yup it's hacked and all that work for this small handfull of titles :dizzy:
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I am sure there attention is all on the ps4 and xbox one before the wii-u get's any of their attention there's just not enough interest to have the wii-u hacked over the other console's at ths point in time is all.
if the xbox one and ps4 was not luanched the console would be hacked already but the xbox and sony disracted them from the wii-u is all lol.
once there both cracked I am sure the wii-u will be on the menu afterwards but for now there is no point other then to say yup it's hacked and all that work for this small handfull of titles :dizzy:
I don't follow this logic. WiiU was out first. Has been out for a while, shouldn't it be the first to be hacked if all things are equal? It really does seem the reason is that it is harder to hack, in which case it has little to do with the other two major consoles...
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The whole WiiU debacle is so reminiscent of my experience with the Sega Saturn that it's spooky. Comes out first, major company that made a fortune on the previous generation, some excellent games, and then left in the dust. I don't see them putting Mario on Android anytime soon, though... making too much money off the 3DS.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/445870/nintendo-thinking-about-a-new-business-structure/ (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/445870/nintendo-thinking-about-a-new-business-structure/)
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The whole WiiU debacle is so reminiscent of my experience with the Sega Saturn that it's spooky. Comes out first, major company that made a fortune on the previous generation, some excellent games, and then left in the dust. I don't see them putting Mario on Android anytime soon, though... making too much money off the 3DS.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/445870/nintendo-thinking-about-a-new-business-structure/ (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/445870/nintendo-thinking-about-a-new-business-structure/)
Its pretty reminiscent of the Dreamcast failure too.
The 3DS may keep them afloat but it's not doing as well as the DS did, and that's arguably a lot to do with the recent surge in tablet/phone devices making portable gaming incredibly cheap and more convenient (if, in my opinion a hell of a lot less enjoyable - touchpad joypad controls are dreadful).
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I don't follow this logic. WiiU was out first. Has been out for a while, shouldn't it be the first to be hacked if all things are equal? It really does seem the reason is that it is harder to hack, in which case it has little to do with the other two major consoles...
It is probably a mixture of that coupled with the lower capabilities of the system and adoption rate of the Wii U in the hacker community.
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Its pretty reminiscent of the Dreamcast failure too.
Dreamcast sold better than WiiU, but Saturn was a flop out the gate that they kept around longer.
Oh well, it'll be the typical "ten good games" system like all other Nintendo consoles.
:cheers:
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Had they just made their stupid controller a 3ds (or at least 2d version of), I think they would have been fine. A lot of people would have jumped on the wii if it doubled as a full fledged handheld gaming system.
Getting 2 systems in one would be amazing if you thought about it.
You could buy wiiware and old Nintendo games, and they could be played both handheld and on a tv, and save files could be shared seamlessly. I would take Tecmo bowl with me everywhere. You could have a a lot of wii games that you could take on the road, where you could play at least minigames or a lower resolution version of the game. You could pop in 3ds games, and telecast one of the screens up on to the big screen. You could also do cool things with linking up other 3ds handhelds, like play against each other on 3ds games and have split screen pop up on the TV.
That, and make a series of toddler to Kindergarten games for the thing, with a big rubber case to go around the controller. A lot of parents will shovel out $150 for those LeapPads, plus $20 a pop for games. Nintendo is already catering to 8-year-olds, might as well go all the way down that path and get them from the beginning.
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I think the time it takes to hack a console is fairly dependent upon how easy it appears to be. The fact that the new gens are x86 based probably is putting them on the forefront concerning the hacking community, as I assume they'd think those two would probably be easier to do.
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Yeah, but they had the softmods running on Wii mode on the WiiU instantly, so you'd figure....
:dunno
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Hacking on the WiiU is fairly moot with regards to their sales. The general console-buyer is not looking for something he or she can "hack" in-between their gaming-fix. (Nor do many of them have the inclination or skill to do-so.) The OUYA, which allows users to do most anything with their hardware, isn't exactly flying off shelves. Likewise, the PSP - a relatively easy-to-root handheld - never came close to sales of the Nintendo DS.
Not to mention that if Nintendo adopted a lax-attitude towards hacking of their hardware, this can be seen by many as a lax-attitude towards piracy-prevention, scaring away publishers even more.
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Well, (apparently being the only person around here that's slightly informed on the WiiU "scene") the problem is that a lot of well known groups have announced they've gotten it hacked. None of them have released a damn thing. About 3 weeks ago, one of those groups got on stage on a conference and basically said, "yeah, we've got it but we can't be assed to put it out there."
So people doing it for the challenge/glory/money aren't touching it because why bother? As soon as you release something, these better connected groups are going to one up you.
In my (sigh) years of experience with this stuff. Nobody has ever, EVER held back an exploit or a hack. Anyone claiming such should be instantly dismissed. People still buy it, though.
But, hey, maybe we'll see a WiiU Key... some day....
:laugh2:
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I'm not that up on the hacking scene - what's the ultimate goal of "hacking" a Wii U? Is it basically to be able to play pirated media, to run homebrew or is the whole thing just about kudos?
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I'm not that up on the hacking scene - what's the ultimate goal of "hacking" a Wii U? Is it basically to be able to play pirated media, to run homebrew or is the whole thing just about kudos?
Starts as the third thing, advertised as being for the second thing but ultimately for the first thing. ;)
(EDIT: I'm grossly generalizing, of course. I do understand there are legit goals for "hacking" a console.)
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No there aren't.
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No there aren't.
There are. It is about being able to do it (and being first to do it) but ultimately its just for piracy. Home brew is neat, and I played some neat home brew games on my PSP but I used it more for emulators and games I didnt own than anything else. Actually still use it for the CPS1&2 emus and as a portable SNES
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If it's just about being able to hack the thing then groups would develop their hacks and then not distribute them. That way other people wouldn't be able to exploit their work for piracy.
Oh wait, I think pbj said that is what is going on right now...
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No there aren't.
There are. It is about being able to do it (and being first to do it) but ultimately its just for piracy. Home brew is neat, and I played some neat home brew games on my PSP but I used it more for emulators and games I didnt own than anything else. Actually still use it for the CPS1&2 emus and as a portable SNES
This and the 60 odd games I never got around to play on yet.
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Even more fuel:
Nintendo pretty much admitted themselves that things are not so rosy in their camp.
http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/175052-the-wii-u-is-dead-in-its-current-form-admits-nintendo-but-what-now (http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/175052-the-wii-u-is-dead-in-its-current-form-admits-nintendo-but-what-now)
As such, rumors have been swirling about them getting started on a new console already...
http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/175135-as-the-wii-u-struggles-reports-and-specs-of-nintendos-next-gen-consoles-spread (http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/175135-as-the-wii-u-struggles-reports-and-specs-of-nintendos-next-gen-consoles-spread)
Now that last link should be taken with a grain of salt - not only because it is just that, "rumors", but also because I always thought these companies were always putting their next design on the table the day after a launch.
That being said, it would make perfect sense for Nintendo to just dust themselves off and release a new console that will compete with the current generation but do so earlier rather than later to avoid suffering the fate of the Dreamcast (a system made obsolete within the space of a year.) It's not unheard of: the North American Sega Genesis was released in 89, giving them a nice two-year head-start over the SNES that provided the momentum to remain a viable threat throughout the 16-bit wars. And hopefully they can bridge that gap between their handheld and home console in a smart way (not like the GBA cable for the GC that went underused.)
Anyway, just wildly speculating - interested to see how this all plays out.
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Yeah, it'll be interesting. I think they could modernize the menu interface and try to stop making the online component so kid friendly. I'm kinda peeved I'm finally legit for the first time in forever and there's nothing I want to play online on the damned thing.
And fix the NetFlix app.
:soapbox:
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That being said, it would make perfect sense for Nintendo to just dust themselves off and release a new console that will compete with the current generation but do so earlier rather than later to avoid suffering the fate of the Dreamcast.
Nintendo missed this generation...they are going to have to wait at the very minimum 3 years and probably more like 5 to garner any enthusiastic responses for a new release. Otherwise, people will still be enjoying their XB1 and PS4, and will be rather unwilling to spend money on a console company that has recently been catering to children. And they are going to have to make the two new consoles look like a Macintosh computer.
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That being said, it would make perfect sense for Nintendo to just dust themselves off and release a new console that will compete with the current generation but do so earlier rather than later to avoid suffering the fate of the Dreamcast.
Nintendo missed this generation...they are going to have to wait at the very minimum 3 years and probably more like 5 to garner any enthusiastic responses for a new release. Otherwise, people will still be enjoying their XB1 and PS4, and will be rather unwilling to spend money on a console company that has recently been catering to children. And they are going to have to make the two new consoles look like a Macintosh computer.
Well yeah, it would be a waste to release it as soon as next year. I would say three years would be a safe bet if this generation goes back to the five-year cycle between generations. Long enough that a new console would get gamers excited but not so late that Sony/MS would have their next consoles ready in time to counter.
That being said, it's still an uphill battle. The "console for kids" stigma they have is a big issue as you said. But what's really killing them is the lack of third-party support. They haven't had the best history with these companies so maybe if they could sweeten the incentives for the likes of Activision, EA, et. al. to make games on their console (and make it developer friendly) it would turn things around.
But of course, I'm fairly certain that it's all easier said than done.
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Guess howards too busy having fun with his Wii U pedometer to come back to his thread.
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You can't really argue with sales numbers and public statements from company leaders.
This thread has actually prompted me to dust the thing off and play with it lately. I'm sorry, but it's just so damned boring.
But, beyond that - the eShop is a complete disaster to navigate. The NetFlix app is terrible and it runs better on my $50 BluRay player. ZombiU is flat out one of the worst games I've ever played. Wonderful 101 is terrible. Super Mario 3D World is okay but plays exactly like the 3DS game that came out 2 years ago (luckily I borrowed this one first). Everyone hates Wii Party U and wanted to quit 3 turns into it. The floating thing in Nintendoland won't shut the ---fudgesicle--- up and actually let you play anything, and when you play something you've navigated through 10 screens to get to a 30 second game that isn't fun. I like the 2D Mario game okay but it's not anything new either (and some of the levels are really, really whacked). Balloon Fight was a good purchase at 30 cents. If all their old games like that were cheap (say, $1 each) I'd probably have 50 of them.
So it keeps telling me "Data Downloaded" or some crap every single time I use it. Looks like I downloaded Wii Sports and forgot about it. Hey, I remember that golf game being a hell of a lot of fun and I was always disappointed they didn't release a proper game.
The WiiU golf game is so ridiculously complicated. Put your irreplaceable touchscreen controller on the floor and waggle your remote over it. The ---fudgesicle---? Nobody wants to stand up to play video games. Everybody plays Wii golf by dangling your arm off the side of the couch.
I won't buy a Nintendo console again until I play it first. I felt the same way after Gamecube but 10 seconds of Wii Sports convinced me I had to have a Wii.
:cheers:
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Everybody plays Wii golf by dangling your arm off the side of the couch.
I've don't see one person do that in my house. We like standing up and acting as though we're actually doing something. Of course games are boring when you decide to cut the activity in half out of laziness. A large part of the fun is acting like you're playing for real. Punchout is 100x more fun when you're standing up then sitting.
Granted, that only applies to the games that are actually fun.
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Same here. We always stood up when doing the Wii Golf and other sports. Although, admittedly on the short <2 ft putts, we half-assed it.
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Wonderful 101 is terrible. Super Mario 3D World is okay but plays exactly like the 3DS game that came out 2 years ago (luckily I borrowed this one first).
Wonderful 101 for me would be The reason to get a WiiU. But then I am a big fan of Platinum Games. Bayonetta and Vanquish being two of my favorite games from last generation.
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More people signed into steam yesterday at the same time than there are WiiU units sold, yet PC gaming is dead.
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Wonderful 101 is terrible. Super Mario 3D World is okay but plays exactly like the 3DS game that came out 2 years ago (luckily I borrowed this one first).
Wonderful 101 for me would be The reason to get a WiiU. But then I am a big fan of Platinum Games. Bayonetta and Vanquish being two of my favorite games from last generation.
Likewise - that was one of the only exclusives I felt I was missing out on by not getting a Wii U. And Zombi U, for that matter - I know some people hate it, but I thought the permadeath mechanic was really interesting.
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More people signed into steam yesterday at the same time than there are WiiU units sold, yet PC gaming is dead.
Steam is trying to push themselves as a viable platform, so take any numbers with a grain of salt.
Also, don't you sign in just by turning on your computer if you've bought into their DRM sandbox?
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More people signed into steam yesterday at the same time than there are WiiU units sold, yet PC gaming is dead.
Steam is trying to push themselves as a viable platform, so take any numbers with a grain of salt.
Also, don't you sign in just by turning on your computer if you've bought into their DRM sandbox?
Don't you more or less sign into any console by switching it on these days? Not sure I see your point.
Also DRM is not an issue if it's handled correctly - that's why you don't see anyone complaining about Steam's DRM, because the service is so well run that it's never an issue. For starters, you can play the games offline so it's barely an issue. And signing into Steam is nearly always an advantage for numerous reasons, least of all streamlined updates and multiplayer matchmaking. Just because your console game doesn't necessarily phone home every time you play it doesn't mean you're any less at the behest of piracy measures that that company has put in place. It's all a means to stop you pirating the software, so unless you're running a modded console then you're as much in their pocket as anyone else.
As games move more and more towards digital distribution this sort of thing is going to become more widespread, not less. The question is, not that it's being done, it's how it's being done.
Really the only downside to the Steam system is not being able to sell your games on - though you can sell on games you've not played yet. But then on the plus side, you will soon be able to share your entire games library with up to 10 friends/family members.
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Steam is trying to push themselves as a viable platform, so take any numbers with a grain of salt.
Also, don't you sign in just by turning on your computer if you've bought into their DRM sandbox?
You can disable that. Steam runs just fine on my Cab in offline mode. No network connection required, besides to install new games, or update existing ones. So its pretty much the same as any console.
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Yeah, but they had the softmods running on Wii mode on the WiiU instantly, so you'd figure....
:dunno
As well, hackers hack. Because they can. It doesn't even matter if they are interested in the system or not. A friend of mine bought the original xbox when it first came out, just to hack. He doesn't even play console games. He then ran Linux on it, turned it into a server and ran a MS hate sight from it ;D
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Steam is trying to push themselves as a viable platform, so take any numbers with a grain of salt.
Also, don't you sign in just by turning on your computer if you've bought into their DRM sandbox?
You can disable that. Steam runs just fine on my Cab in offline mode. No network connection required, besides to install new games, or update existing ones. So its pretty much the same as any console.
Yeah, that being said, I'd be willing to bet that most people just let it log in at start up. You definitely can not use people logged in as a an example of people playing on steam. I haven't played a game on steam in a couple months, but I have been logged into it literally every day.
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RE: Howard
Epic thread title, considering the timing. Charlie Sheen would be proud.
The Wii and the WiiU should be a lesson to any current or future console makers out there. The gaming community at large is not interested in gimmicks, all-in-one set-top boxes, or really anything which detracts fundamentally from the core gaming purposes of the machine. These peripheral devices are fine when properly supported and actually bring new and interesting facets to the gaming experience, but they cannot be forced into the situation, solely due to the parent company's desire to "differentiate" itself from other players in the market. It also cannot take the place of powerful gaming hardware functioning in the background of those differentiators.
I have stated in the past that sales of the Wii was a "quirk", and the attempt to recapture that anomaly would likely cost Nintendo it's place in the market. One really has to question the savvy of Nintendo's guidance team, and what they really care about. They should have learned from the experience of so many consumers who bought the Wii, and shortly thereafter left it languishing in a closet, while those same purchasers were continuing to play, and more importantly purchase, games on the 360 (and still are today.) This really makes it appear that with the WiiU, Nintendo was interested primarily in the same "short term" success, without much regard to the longevity of the system and it's consumers' longer term experience. A more unkind speculation is that Nintendo doesn't understand the market at all. Nintendo has made some great titles and will always have it's ardent fan base who will support anything with an "N" on it. But we are seeing how small that base is now, and how little draw those franchises have retained. They aren't system sellers they once were.
Microsoft is treading similarly in their footsteps, but at least had the sense to build upon a solid, forward looking gaming hardware foundation. They are extolling the differentiators, but have a solid gaming foundation to fall back on. The problem MS will have, at least initially, is that the differentiators which are it's primary focus now, make the system more costly. Not so different from the Blu-Ray player of the PS3, which added cost and hobbled adoption rates. MS's pre-launch PR debacle has also done it damage, from which it may not fully recover.
The PS4 is going the be the next leader in the console marketplace. Sony could still screw it up, and give MS a chance to go head-to-head, but I'm thinking Sony have learned their lessons from history. Nintendo, unfortunately, appears to have not. I'm looking forward to seeing Nintendo titles on other systems. It's what they do best, and it's long overdue.
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Steam is trying to push themselves as a viable platform, so take any numbers with a grain of salt.
Also, don't you sign in just by turning on your computer if you've bought into their DRM sandbox?
You can disable that. Steam runs just fine on my Cab in offline mode. No network connection required, besides to install new games, or update existing ones. So its pretty much the same as any console.
Yeah, that being said, I'd be willing to bet that most people just let it log in at start up. You definitely can not use people logged in as a an example of people playing on steam. I haven't played a game on steam in a couple months, but I have been logged into it literally every day.
I had to let steam eat all my data bandwidth on my laptop so I could load up Steam the day after I went into offline mode. Note to myself: don't go on holiday with a laptop with steam games on. :hissy:
Steam is being a real pain of slowing down my PC just to check if there is any updates. Try changing the server location in settings, as it sometimes speeds up the process.
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The PS4 is going the be the next leader in the console marketplace. Sony could still screw it up, and give MS a chance to go head-to-head, but I'm thinking Sony have learned their lessons from history. Nintendo, unfortunately, appears to have not. I'm looking forward to seeing Nintendo titles on other systems. It's what they do best, and it's long overdue.
I don't know if Sony learned anything per se. It's just that as you said, Nintendo did NOT learn anything, and MS decided to see how much it could get away with, and it ended up hurting them as well. For once, Sony is looking to be the company that is actually trying to be the only one to avoid alienating their customers, so I suppose you could say they learned that.
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I am sure there attention is all on the ps4 and xbox one before the wii-u get's any of their attention there's just not enough interest to have the wii-u hacked over the other console's at ths point in time is all.
if the xbox one and ps4 was not luanched the console would be hacked already but the xbox and sony disracted them from the wii-u is all.
once there both cracked I am sure the wii-u will be on the menu afterwards but for now there is no point other then to say yup it's hacked and all that work for this small handfull of titles :dizzy:
I don't follow this logic. WiiU was out first. Has been out for a while, shouldn't it be the first to be hacked if all things are equal? It really does seem the reason is that it is harder to hack, in which case it has little to do with the other two major consoles...
it's very simple there is many more games people want to play and actally put an effort in to do so over the wii-u so it is more important to them to get to the huge library of games there dying to play over a handfull of children based games that most could care less to even hack their conosle over lol.
or in other word's if you had a choice of all 3 hacked and set n your lap free you would take the wii-u and it's library over the other 2?....not!!
and even if you did your the 1 in 1000 that would type of thing it's like making it a priority to hack a handheld leapfrog over a psp or 3ds there is just no incentive to do it.
has nothing to do with when they were released either it's the overall big picture in the long run and the incentive to put the effort in to make it happen where the wii-u is on the back burner over the other 2.
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Not that Howard will come back to this thread now that the facts are against him, but here is the latest info:
http://www.engadget.com/2014/01/29/nintendo-wii-u-sales-figure-2013/ (http://www.engadget.com/2014/01/29/nintendo-wii-u-sales-figure-2013/)
For the TL:DR crowd: Nintendo sold fewer Wii Us in a year than Xbox Ones or PS4s sold in two months
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I think you need to accept that the industry sees Nintendo as an old, out-of-touch relic that is no longer welcome to the party. Some of these perceptions could be attributed to Nintendo's baffling policies of treating all their customers like children that need protection from the real world. But, equally so, their best games are dismissed as not being 'gritty, realistic or mature.'
Truth be told, there are many who would rather Nintendo go the route of Sega - exiting the hardware game and releasing their IPs to smart phones and mainstream consoles.
The sales reports don't matter so much. So long as Nintendo churns out quality stuff, they eventually get my money. And despite that one recent hiccup, they're still quite healthy.
But why? Idiot teenage/20 something gamers get a pass, they are too stupid and full of hormones to know any better, but surely "the industry" should know by now that Nintendo always leads the charge in longevity, if not innovation? Nintendo doesn't treat their consumers like children, they put child-safe features into their consoles because many of their consumers ARE children. Microsoft and Sony really need to do some of that stuff if you ask me. I haven't used voice chat in online-multiplayer in years because 8 and 10 year old kids are always cursing like sailors on there. Their parents need to get them off the "adult" consoles.
Nintendo can't go the route of Sega, it's impossible. Sega always copied what Nintendo did... Nintendo, on the other hand, designs their consoles based around games they want to make. You can't make Nintendo games on anything else but Nintendo hardware.
I just don't get FPS... at least not people my age playing them. I played them extensively in high school and college, but I grew out of it. They were actually acceptable in our day though... you were shooting demons from mars/hell or mutant pigs from outer space, not creepily realistic human models on a creepily realistic modern battlefield. I'm not saying that sort of thing is wrong, but I don't know if it's right either. I feel a bit uneasy playing stuff like that.
Well, if profiles are accurate, I'm several years older than you and I still very much enjoy a frantic FPS match at times... I don't see why we need to limit ourselves to any particular genre or console or game manufacturer... We play what we enjoy regardless of what it may be. If you don't enjoy FPS and have a particular type of game you like then obviously that's fine, but I'm not sure why we need to pigeonhole games to certain age groups. Just depends on my mood, sometimes FPS sounds like fun, next day maybe racing, etc... Right now I'm working on setting up ScummVM and some old LucasArts point-and-clicks. At the end of the day, isn't it really just about our having fun regardless of the type of game or who made it?
Also, I'm not sure why it matters if the PC exclusives need to be "AAA" or not... Again, if you enjoy them, why does it matter if it's an indie title by 2 guys in a garage or a blockbuster by Activision?
Lastly, the 20-something "idiot hormone filled gamers"... My kids are early 20's gamers... :P And they enjoy everything from classic arcade games on my cabinet (seen them playing things like Ms. Pac-Man and Donkey Kong and a variety of newer ROMs) to current PC games, emulators for various consoles, plus their NDS's, N64, SNES, Wii, GC, Dreamcast, etc... :)
P.S. I also see nothing wrong with the Wii U, but wasn't really compelled to grab one either... As far as that goes I'm still a little annoyed at our Wii that doesn't seem to like the DLP TV in the living room at all... :/
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Our kids are not good examples. They have been exposed, with care, to the stuff before their time. And they often appreciate it.
Their freinds are good examples. I see it in my kids' friends all the time. Walking into a gameroom with several pins and nice Atari vectors they play 3 games and then go right back upstairs to a modern console. They just don't know what to do with the older games and don't seem all that interested in learning.
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Old games have their charms, but new ones are far superior.
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Old games have their charms, but new ones are far superior.
Based on?
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Old games have their charms, but new ones are far superior.
Based on?
His desire to troll you.
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Old games have their charms, but new ones are far superior.
This is a pointless argument - a) you can't argue with nostalgia and b) one man's trash is another man's treasure.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Based on having played/owned damn near everything made in the last 30+ years?
I probably put a good 15-20 hours into Far Cry 3. I like River Raid but I'd be hard pressed to play it 15 minutes. I'm working on Assassin's Creed 4 right now and don't even want to contemplate how much time I've wasted on that game in 1 hour increments.
:cheers:
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I certainly couldn't spend 180+ hours like I did on Xenoblade on something like Frogger or Centipede, or even River Raid (which I do love). It's funny, arcade games of old almost seem like the newer mobile platform games. Meant for quick games and fun diversions. Fortunately there's hundreds of good ones you're bound to enjoy, so it can add up.
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I'm working on Assassin's Creed 4 right now and don't even want to contemplate how much time I've wasted on that game in 1 hour increments.
Ugh. I'm with ya there. Working on collecting the chests/fragments on all the tiny islands scattered around. Enjoying the game a lot so far. Then again, I've been a fan of the series from the beginning.
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Old games have their charms, but new ones are far superior.
Based on?
Cars? :dunno
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Based on having played/owned damn near everything made in the last 30+ years?
I probably put a good 15-20 hours into Far Cry 3. I like River Raid but I'd be hard pressed to play it 15 minutes. I'm working on Assassin's Creed 4 right now and don't even want to contemplate how much time I've wasted on that game in 1 hour increments.
:cheers:
So basically for the reason that ChatTower stated... To troll...
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Meh, newer games are trying way too hard to be "movies" than actual games (me to screen: "That's interesting, but can I play now?") and are too preoccupied with making a game X amount of hours leading to unnecessary, not particularly fun padding.
I'm generalizing and I already know of plenty of exceptions but I turn to the older games since I can fit more playing in smaller time allotments.
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I have better things to do than blow 15 hours collecting widgets in random corners of a game just so my gamer tag can have a little icon next to it.
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I don't think it's fair to equate hours played in a session with quality. Neither is it fair to compare pac-man with flappy bird.
The classics were designed to make you want to feed it quarters. Play time was really short if you messed up or just sucked. But could last longer as you gained in skill. Hopefully you wanted, just-one-more-go.
I don't knock the new AAA titles that suck in hours upon hours, they are fun or folks wouldn't loose 8 hours to them. Online games too... just look at WOW or any MMO.
But there are intros to some RPG's that are longer than a quick play at a arcade game. Quality is irrelevant. Play what you want.
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The cut scenes are great, and relevant in some games. They really make it, even if they are long. I did a rough add-up of the cut scenes in The Last of Us and it came to about 90 minutes! Longer than some movies. Each scene adds something to the game though, it never feels like a waste of time.
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When all you have is 45 mins to get some gaming in a 15 minute cut scene is a complete waste of time.
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When all you have is 45 mins to get some gaming in a 15 minute cut scene is a complete waste of time.
This is why I have a 3DS. Closest thing to playing modern games without endless cut scenes or even having to watch 3 minutes of pre-menu credits before being able to pick up a game. I just leave the 3DS on all the time, but close the lid.
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You know, the 3DS and moreso the DS have been excellent consoles. Can't say I've encountered many games with what I felt were excessive cinematic sequences. Newer games will let you save at just about any time, so even the story-heavy ones work for short play sessions.
I couldn't take The Last of Us for more than 20 minutes. Bored with the zombie thing and that game was just fake hard. Those guys peaked with Uncharted 2.
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This is why I have a 3DS. Closest thing to playing modern games without endless cut scenes or even having to watch 3 minutes of pre-menu credits before being able to pick up a game. I just leave the 3DS on all the time, but close the lid.
You know, the 3DS and moreso the DS have been excellent consoles. Can't say I've encountered many games with what I felt were excessive cinematic sequences. Newer games will let you save at just about any time, so even the story-heavy ones work for short play sessions.
Yup. Totally agreed. The latest Zelda (Link Between Worlds) was probably the first one in a while in which I legitimately enjoyed every minute of it. I realized it was because I wasn't spending hours of playtime traversing a large landscape (or ocean) with little to do, wondering if I'm going the right way or all that travelling if for naught.
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I have to admit over the last three years I have been more concerned with what else a console can do than I have been with the games. Just don't have time, I guess, and I'm not interested in spending 15 hours learning to play a game that may take me a year to finish.
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When all you have is 45 mins to get some gaming in a 15 minute cut scene is a complete waste of time.
Horses for courses. I am a bachelor, and a slacker. For a good game, I'll MAKE time ;D
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There's always time for gaming in my household. Then again, the kids are all out of the house so there may be some advantage there.
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Yup. Totally agreed. The latest Zelda (Link Between Worlds) was probably the first one in a while in which I legitimately enjoyed every minute of it. I realized it was because I wasn't spending hours of playtime traversing a large landscape (or ocean) with little to do, wondering if I'm going the right way or all that travelling if for naught.
I'll have to check that one out, then. Best advert for a Zelda game to me these days is not having to spend hours traveling. Wind Waker ruined a lot of the love I had for the series simply because of the travel.
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Yup. Totally agreed. The latest Zelda (Link Between Worlds) was probably the first one in a while in which I legitimately enjoyed every minute of it. I realized it was because I wasn't spending hours of playtime traversing a large landscape (or ocean) with little to do, wondering if I'm going the right way or all that travelling if for naught.
I'll have to check that one out, then. Best advert for a Zelda game to me these days is not having to spend hours traveling. Wind Waker ruined a lot of the love I had for the series simply because of the travel.
Yeah, fairly early on you are able to warp to any save point (also, most weapons are available all at once - you only 'rent' what you need for the dungeon you're tackling.) There's very little "waste" in the worlds as almost every screen seems to serve a purpose (whether it's just basic battle, Shadow Link appearances, 'links between worlds', one of the 100 collectible macguffins, etc.)
Everyone seems to love OOT and WW - but this one is my favorite for those reasons.
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You can actually buy the items, too. Rupees serve virtually no purpose in this game and it hands them out like candy, so I've actually purchased everything.
:dunno
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You can actually buy the items, too. Rupees serve virtually no purpose in this game and it hands them out like candy, so I've actually purchased everything.
:dunno
yeah it didnt take much farming to buy everything without ever renting.
(http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=137060.0;attach=304909;image)
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You can actually buy the items, too. Rupees serve virtually no purpose in this game and it hands them out like candy, so I've actually purchased everything.
:dunno
That's my one complaint about the game - after you've purchased all the items (which, you'll do fairly quickly since, as you said, rupees are plentiful) there's practically no need to even bother with anymore money. It makes finding the optional dungeon chests rather anti-climactic. I've "maxed out" my wallet numerous times.