Identical Controllers in Windows, how to set One as P1 and one as P2?

[Sosetsuken]

Hey guys,

Just a bit of trouble with my cab atm, which I thought I'd solved.

I've got 2 360 hacked pads which in windows are identical.  So its basically luck when the PC boots as to which one is set up as Controller #1 / #2,  I thought I'd gotten around this old chestnut by plugging in the P1 controls directly and plugging the P2 controls into a USB hub.  But this morning I fired up the cab and they're back to front :/

Anyone know a fix?  (Running XP SP3 x86).

Cheers.

[headkaze]

If you leave them plugged in I don't see how they could change their id. Anyway there is a program called JoyIds that should be able to help.

[Sosetsuken]

Thanks for that Headkaze, i'll give it a shot tonight

[Cananas]

Anyway there is a program called JoyIds that should be able to help.

I think this very old utility ony works for Windows 95/98. Never worked for me in WinXP.

[Sosetsuken]

Anyway there is a program called JoyIds that should be able to help.

I think this very old utility ony works for Windows 95/98. Never worked for me in WinXP.

Working fine XP SP3!

[Gatsu]

ah cool. I'll have to give this a try. This was one of my concerns for using 360 pads on a PC.

[Bender]

I have a U360 and Logitech wingman gamepad I've instaled JoyId's software and the U360 is set as Id 1 but Mame still sees it as the second controller any Ideas?

[u_rebelscum]

I have a U360 and Logitech wingman gamepad I've instaled JoyId's software and the U360 is set as Id 1 but Mame still sees it as the second controller any Ideas?

Mame asks directInput ("enums") for all connected joysticks, and numbers them in the order directInput gives them to mame.  The ID is not checked.

The order windows throws them at mame isn't constant across all computers.  Tthe manufacture's identification numbers, the numbers the manufactures give the devices (DirectInput's guidProduct), and the order they were installed (directInput's guidInstance, which is the guidProduct plus some more numbers) all seem to effect the order enummed.  This is why GGG and Ultimarc let you change the ID of their devices (guidProduct) and it effects how they show on mame: the device are given a higher device number (the last of the three I listed above) for players 2-4) than "player 1".

The app doesn't change the device ID (neither guidProduct), but windows "game controller ID", which mame doesn't use.  Now, I think this game controller ID can change the numbers added to the guidProduct to make the guidInstance, but since this is after the guidProduct, it only helps if the devices have the same guidProduct (IOW are the same device).


FWIW, you can see some of the IDs mame sees if you look at device manager, and the properties of the devices, details, hardware Ids.  For example, my three mice at work show:
HID\Vid_045e&Pid_00e1&Rev_0007&Col02
HID\Vid_045e&Pid_0095&Rev_0424&Col01
HID\Vid_046d&Pid_c517&Rev_3810&MI_01&Col01

The first two are MS mice (vender ID: Vid_045e), the last logitech (Vid_046d).  The product ID comes next (Pid_###).  These are fixed.  JoyID cannot change them.  I'm not sure about the rest of the info after that, but they come after the Vid & Pid, and thus can only effect the sort order if the Vid & Pid are the same.

[Bender]

thanks so much for the explination U_reblescum

I'm still not clear though, is there a way to change those #'s so mame sees the U360 first?
Sorry I'm so slow 

maybe I could get Andy @ Ultimarc to change the vid and Pid #'s or is it something that is registered with MS

[u_rebelscum]

I'm still not clear though, is there a way to change those #'s so mame sees the U360 first?

Sorry, I went too techy again, and wasn't totally clear in my answer:
AFAIK, if the JoyIDs app doesn't work, I doubt it's doable besides what you've tried already.    

Vender IDs are fixed, and the vanders pick their own product IDs.  Both are set in the joysticks' (and all USB devices) firmware, and the joystick sends this info to windows when it's plugged in (& at boot up).  With two devices with the same IDs, boot up is a time race, whichever one registers first gets player 1.  The ultimarc and GGG products change the product ID in the firmware when you change their "player #".  Unless you can reprogram one of the joysticks to tell windows it's a different vender or product (that it still works with of course), it's hit and miss on which joystick reports to windows first on each boot up.

The quick & dirty fix is unplug both, plug in player1 (assuming it was installed first), wait until it's registed in windows, plug in player2.  Besides the delay behind a hub trick you tried, not much more you can do for boot up but hope.

[drventure]

I'm not sure if it'd be more appropriate to necro this thread or start a new one, but I had a question along these same lines

I'm seeing this same behavior in WinXP. I was just wondering if anyone knew whether this "arbitrary USB ordering" issue is something that's been altered in any way (fixed or whatever) in Vista or in Win7?

In my case, I've got a cab that has a number of devices that may get unplugged or reconnected. When I do that, Mame tends to completely loose all the stick config I've set up in it (because suddenly, what was Joy1, is now Joy5).

I haven't noticed similar behavior on my Win7 box, but then, i don't have all the same equipment connected to it, and installing Win7 on my cab just to test would be, well, I'm hoping someone else might have had some experience with this before I head down that path!

[loadman]

[NotHelping]

Just buy one of everything and never unplug anything

[/NotHelping]

 

...hmmm I don't know a better way than using such a utility

http://www.wingmanteam.com/latest_software/gadgets.htm#JoyIDs_Utility:

[drventure]

Hey Loadman, yeah thanks for that 

I did happen to stumble on JoyIDs, haven't tried it yet, but when I get back in town, I intend to.

My cab's running XP, and I'm kind of wondering whether Win7 has improved on the whole "Handling multiple USB game controllers" issue that has been a long running problem with XP (not sure about Vista).

I seem to recall that reading that there had been some improvements in that area (mostly done for XBox and then those changed migrated into either Vista or Win7). I just can't find anything about it now.

I'd hate to go through installing Win7 on the cab just to find out nothing's improved...

From URebelScum's post, it sounds like JoyID's wouldn't help with Mame, but then maybe he was discussing a much older version.

Worth a try anyway!