Need advice: Deck/patio construction

[jcroach]

I need some advice.  My concrete patio is falling apart.  Not good for a 5 year old house. 

My back door is only about 3 inches off of the top of the patio. At first my wife and I were considering ripping out the patio and installing a new brick patio on a sand base.  I've never worked with brick/sand/gravel and it seems daunting to me.

Now we're considering doing a floating low-profile deck.  It'll involve a little more excavation work, but a lot less of the base work.  Has anyone ever built a deck like this? I can't find much info on the web about them.

A few questions:

• Can I support the entire deck on a gravel base? How thick? I was thinking 4-6 inches.
• Or do I need to pour concrete piers?
• Can I support the deck off the ground on some "dek block"? Those pre-cast concrete forms that have the slot for a 2x? in them?
• Anyone ever work with composite materials? What are good brands?
• Do you recommend screws of some sort of hidden anchor for composite decking?
• Any special saw blades needed to cut composite?
• Is decking usually run parallel with the house or perpendicular?

This is kind of what I'm going for: http://www.flickr.com/photos/doorsixteen/3475548003/

[CCM]

I don't know about the floating deck... I dug down 36" to get below the frost line and poured concrete...

Anyway,  I built my deck 6 years ago and used VekaDeck (www.vekadeck.com), I think all of the big name composite deck materials are about the same quality wise.  I couldn't be happier with Veka, the only maintenance I've done is to power wash it every spring.

I used stainless steel screws,  and used the regular blade I had in my miter saw, no issues at all.

The deck boards should run parallel to the house.

Hope this helps a bit...

[JMB]

FWIW doing a brick/paver patio is very simple.  I did one a few years ago and it is holding up well.  Check with area mason supply stores or even Home Depot/Lowes.  They will often offer free instruction classes a couple times a year to help sell product.

[shardian]

The brick on sand patio will be your easiest project. You can make it as simple or complicated as you feel comfortable with. A family friend did a sunburst design patio on their own with no previous experience that looked bad ass.

[ChadTower]

Just don't try to do a Mario.  You will have a ---smurfette--- of a time finding the right color blocks.   

[jcroach]

Thanks for the tips,  everyone.

CCM, It looks like the versa deck is solid. How do people usually hide the cut end of a hollow core composite decking?

I'll look into those classes!

I finally remembered the term for a deck just sitting on the ground. It's called a skid foundation.

http://www.taunton.com/finehomebuilding/how-to/articles/firm-foundation-backyard-shed.aspx

[kingflynn]

Don't use the deck blocks.  They don't prevent frost heave.   Attach the "ledger" board to the house, and pour footings for the far side.   The footings are not as much work as you might think (depending on how many).  You won't need gravel underneath because it won't be seen.  Don't bother with the hidden fastening systems. They are expensive.  Color matched screws look fine.  (It's easiest to pre-drill even though they say you don't have to).  Start installing the decking with a full board at the outside and work toward the house.  

[kingflynn]

To hide the hollow ends you can first "picture frame" around the perimeter of the decking and miter the corners. 

[CCM]

The stuff I used was solid core, so there was no issue.

[jcroach]

Attach the "ledger" board to the house, and pour footings for the far side.  

This is what I'm trying to avoid.  It seems silly to me to attach a ledger board when the joists might end up being partially buried.

[kingflynn]

It's the easiest way to keep the deck from shifting.  You know that once you screw it to the house, it will always remain level.  LedgerLoks only take a few minutes to buzz in.  You'd probably be fine just set it on cinder blocks, but as a professional I need to know that I won't be getting called back in a few years because the thing has shifted due to frost heave.   

[jcroach]

Thanks for the tip Kingflynn.  I guessing I'm going to have the foundation exposed anyway, I might as well attach the deck to it. 

Are these the Ledgerlocks you were referring to? Would I need to use a hammer drill to drive them?

Thanks again.

I might also dig a trench drain at one end of my "hole" to help with drainage from my heavy clay soil.

Do you all recommend any kind of treatment for wood that would have ground contact, other than just buying the right kind of treated lumber? Seal cut ends? Prime/paint/stain surfaces that would have contact?

[kingflynn]

LedgerLocks are actually just for wood, so if you're attaching to concrete you'd need a hammer drill with a 1/2 inch bit to drill some expansion anchors.  Like I said, you might be fine just to set it on the ground or on some cinder blocks.  If it shifted down the road you could take off a couple rows of decking and bolt in on then.  As for the wood, regular pressure treated should be fine.  You'll get higher quality lumber from the local yard rather than the big boxes.  You could seal the ends, but most don't bother.