Screws into MDF?

[glonq]

If I want to build something like this...

...will MDF hold the screws okay, or do I need plywood?  Forgive a woodworking noob, but I'm visualizing those screws ripping out as soon as any strain is put on them.

[ivwshane]

If you are using mdf your best bet is to actually use glue. With todays wood glues the wood will fail before the glue does.

I've built my cab with nothing but glue.

[glonq]

Just glue?  Wow, I wouldn't have guessed.   Any particular brand?  Gorilla okay?

[ivwshane]

I use titebond (with the blue lettering).

[Kangum]

i used wood screws on my current project. 1/2 inch mdf. as long as they are long enough they hold well.

[Blanka]

Screws are very easy to keep stuff in place as glue dries. But the glue holds the cab together in the end.
So never screw from the outside, it is waste of time to get rid of all the holes from screws with a wood filler, and it never looks as nice as virgin mdf.
Glue is stronger than the material itself, so it will hold!

[Paulson]

 These might help too...
 http://www.screwfix.com/prods/40376/Screws/Interior-Wood-Screws/Screw-Tite/MDF-Tite-Screws/MDF-Tite-Screws-3-9-x-40mm-Pack-of-200

[javeryh]

Just use regular wood glue - no need for gorilla glue - that stuff is VERY messy to work with because it expands when it dries.  The bond you get just from wood glue is unbelievable.  If you put strain on the joint I can almost guarantee the MDF will break before the glue fails.

[DaOld Man]

I agree. Woodglue. I use Elmers carpenter glue (I think thats what it is called)
Also, when I use screws, if I dont intend to remove the screws later, I will coat the threads of the screw with wood glue before fastening them.
BTW, I use screws and glue both, but I think the glue is holding more.

[Chadwick]

Titebond wood glue as others have stated.  If you must screw, use coarse thread screws and drill pilot holes.

[facesmiths]

I personally use ProBond (by Elmer's) interior exterior and I have built a lot of stuff from MDF. (ther eis a place not far from here that has a huge dupster full of all sorts and variaties of the stuff even laminated with wood grain, white and black laminates. If I wanted to I could cover all my stuff with tiles too as they throw that stuff away by the cases. I am still kicking myself cause they threw away a bunch (like probably 2000 to 3000 cases) of marble or some such stone that every single tile had a major artifact in the middle of them (like a 3 to 4 inch snail shell that was petrified and mostly looked like quartz sliced through) and would have lighted quite well considereing it was all light colored. that was the reason I did not even bother to think about taking it as I am more of a black marble and black granite sort of a guy, but now I realize that stuff would have gone great with a steam punk look, and my tastes are changing. If I had to choose between matt black paint or any color of actual stone I go for the stone. Though I prefer stainless that has been naturally blackened

oh and defintly make sure you drill pilot holes. for quick building I find keeping a cordless with a drill bit and one with a drill bit is the best considering quick changes are possible especially when glueing in combination. make sure you use a drill with a countersink too then you dont have to worry about the hole fillingissue as all you have to worry about is the slot in the screws and they will almost fill with paint alone. (and the tiny ring around the screw ofcourse but the same applies to them as well)

[ChadTower]

Hell MDF is so porous I use Elmer's kindergarten white glue and it still makes a bond stronger than the wood itself.

[miles2912]

Titebond and drywall screws.  Pre drll before you glue... and like most people have said the screws are just there to let the glue dry.  Once it dries the bond will be stronger than the wood.

[Jdurg]

Yes.  ALWAYS drill pilot holes.  It makes it easier to put the screw on the wood and have it stabilized while you start to drill and before it grabs.

I was watching Ask This Old House this weekend and saw the coolest thing that I MUST have.  It was an attachment for a drill that went over the end of the drill with the screwdriver bit in there, but it was also a chuck so you could put your drill bit in the attachment, drill the pilot hole, then take it right off and drive the screw in.  Looks like a HUGE time saver.

[Paulson]

 Yep a flip drive...I bought a set off ebay a couple of days ago...here:

 

 It drills, countersinks, then drives the screw

[facesmiths]

ok I must still be getting over being mugged (Or I just suck at typing heh) but I mean one drill witha  drill bit and ther other witha  screwdriver bit in it.

[ChadTower]

Of course, you don't have to use screws... you guys are describing exactly what a brad nailer is for.

[Chadwick]

Brads + Titebond are my preferred method as well.

[DaOld Man]

Do the brads split the mdf? Or do you drill pilot holes for them also?
I just got an electric stapler/brader for my BD. Never thought of using brads instead of screws, might make the job a lot faster.

[ChadTower]

Brads are so thin they usually won't split anything unless you poke it though the back edge.  If you do that even a drill bit will split MDF if you're not careful.

[Chadwick]

On 3/4" MDF I use 1-1/4" brads (18 gauge).  Never had any problems with splitting.  You might have problems if you try to use 15 or 16 gauge finish nails though.

The brads just hold the work together while the glue sets, that is really their only purpose.  I use the lightweight vinyl "spackle" to fill the tiny holes where the brads penetrated the wood.   It's cheap, paintable, sands reasonably well, dries reasonably fast, and doesn't shrink when it dries.

[miles2912]

Everyone does realize that do do brads you need a compressor and brad nailer.  If you have them great if not then screws and drill bits are your friend.

[Jdurg]

Yes, but you can find a small air compressor and nail-gun/staple-gun combos for about $100 if you look around Home Depot/Lowes and it is WELL worth the investment.  I am so incredibly happy that I picked mine up.  Makes installing molding or trimwork so much easier.  In fact, it makes it possible.  My poker table would not be built without my air compressor and nail-gun.

[Chadwick]

I agree.  If you are remotely into woodworking, a compressor and brad nailer are must-haves.

[ChadTower]

You can't overtighten a brad and rip material out of a hole and brads never strip.

[DaOld Man]

As I said earlier, I just got an electric stapler/brader.
Im sure its a lot cheaper than air compressor setup, but I havent tried it yet, so it may not work with MDF.
I have a project coming up, I will let you know how it works..

[georgemcfly]

DANG IT I GOTTA READ MORE.... good info.

[ratzz]

I've got to admit, I can't get my head round the 'just glue' technique...

I'm at the point of installing my small batons (like the top image), and I don't feel confident in the just glue procedure.

I guess I'll give it a go and see how it goes.

Does this technique also work for assembly with the sides, top and bottom etc?

No screws at all???

[ivwshane]

If you look at my cab, I can tell you that it is very solid (I've whipped that thing around and stood inside of it) and all I used was glue. The monitor supports on my cab (the ones on the side of the cab) are simply glued in place and hold that heavy monitor just fine!

[ChadTower]

I've got to admit, I can't get my head round the 'just glue' technique...

I'm at the point of installing my small batons (like the top image), and I don't feel confident in the just glue procedure.

I guess I'll give it a go and see how it goes.

Does this technique also work for assembly with the sides, top and bottom etc?

No screws at all???

Glue is stronger than screws - it joins the entire glued surfaces rather than just holding by the threads of a screw at a single point.  If you aren't confident in the glue use better joinery with more surface area. 

[ratzz]

I've got to admit, I can't get my head round the 'just glue' technique...

I'm at the point of installing my small batons (like the top image), and I don't feel confident in the just glue procedure.

I guess I'll give it a go and see how it goes.

Does this technique also work for assembly with the sides, top and bottom etc?

No screws at all???

Glue is stronger than screws - it joins the entire glued surfaces rather than just holding by the threads of a screw at a single point.  If you aren't confident in the glue use better joinery with more surface area. 

Hi Chad,

I'm more than happy to go with the glue only technique, as I really don't fancy screwing into MDF.

So, once you have applied glue to the baton, and placed it in the correct location on the MDF, do you then clamp it in place, or will it dry pretty solid without clamping?

Ratzz

[ChadTower]

Clamp it at a medium pressure.  Enough to keep the joint tight but not enough to squeeze all of the glue out of the edge.

[nickynooch]

I've got to admit, I can't get my head round the 'just glue' technique...

I'm at the point of installing my small batons (like the top image), and I don't feel confident in the just glue procedure.

I guess I'll give it a go and see how it goes.

Does this technique also work for assembly with the sides, top and bottom etc?

No screws at all???

Yeah, me too! I feel like I am being punk'd as I was just about to start screwing boards into my mdf.  Seriously?  Glue only? wow.  I hope you guys are right!