It makes me sad

[ChadTower]

I just read this fact:

After four seasons, Eli Manning is 36-28 as a starter and has a Super Bowl ring; after four seasons, Peyton Manning was 32-32 as a starter and lacked a playoff victory.

Dammit.

[DeLong20]

Yeah, but who would you want leading your team?  Me, I'd pick Peyton without a second thought.

[ChadTower]

Yeah, but who would you want leading your team?  Me, I'd pick Peyton without a second thought.

It's not a question of who you want now.  It is a question of who you would want at the four year point of their career.  What it is saying is that if Eli's career has as much room for improvement as Peyton's did at that point... Eli could be better.

Based on that, after four years, I'd have to say Eli.

Though I'd still rather have Tom Brady after four years.

[shardian]

Peyton came into a team with ZERO talent around him. The team was built from the ground up. Peyton STILL didn't have a defense until '06.

Eli walked into a Giants team expected to win. That is the difference. Take away that awesome defense Eli was fortunate to have, and the Giants lose a ton of games.

[shardian]

Eli plays "not to screw up, and occasionally make a smart play". Peyton plays to completely control the game and be the main force of his team winning. You gotta remember, Peyton runs that offense the majority of the time in game - not the Coordinator.

Put that responsibility on Eli, and he isn't the same QB.

I'm not trying to take anything away from Eli, but the fact still remains if I had a choice I would without a doubt have Peyton running my offense at the 4 year point.

[ChadTower]

Peyton came into a team with ZERO talent around him.

Marvin Harrison has been there longer than Peyton Manning.  Edgerrin James was drafted the year following Manning.  They had a good to very good OL the whole time.

That is far from zero talent.

EDIT:  forgot to mention... the RB Peyton's rookie year?  Marshall Faulk.  What an untalented zero he was!

EDIT2:  Faulk had 2,227 yards from scrimmage in 1998, Peyton's rookie year.   

[shardian]

Peyton came into a team with ZERO talent around him.

Marvin Harrison has been there longer than Peyton Manning.  Edgerrin James was drafted the year following Manning.  They had a good to very good OL the whole time.

That is far from zero talent.

EDIT:  forgot to mention... the RB Peyton's rookie year?  Marshall Faulk.  What an untalented zero he was!

EDIT2:  Faulk had 2,227 yards from scrimmage in 1998, Peyton's rookie year.   

... they still didn't have a defense.

[ChadTower]

That is true.  They didn't need one, though... they were 13-3 in 1999 and 10-6 in 2000 without a defense.  That is how much talent Peyton had around him.

I do agree that if I had to choose between them I'd rather have Peyton.  Eli played like an elite QB in the postseason, sadly, which is why this is even a debate.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

It makes me sad

I thought you were going to say you were sad about Tommy nuking his account again.

[ChadTower]

Peyton runs that offense the majority of the time in game - not the Coordinator.

I thought about this on the way home - this isn't true either.  Peyton wasn't given nearly the amount of responsibility he has until after 4 years in the league.  His head coach for most of that period was Jim Mora - not exactly a groundbreaking head coach.  Dungy came in in year 4, IIRC, and may have started the shift to Peyton audibles in the first year but I don't think he did.

[Daniel270]

Jim Mora - not exactly a groundbreaking head coach. 

He did do wonders with the Saints for a while... but, never had a Super Bowl -worthy team.