Spray Painters

[Steven633]

Hi guys,

Just wondered what your thoughts are on the various spray paint tools on the market. I am looking to make my first cab soon and want a really nice professional finish to the paintwork.

I have had a quick look on flea-bay, sorry ebay, and there seems to be a really cheap tool going for around 20GBP delivered. It is marketed as being 'Electric Airless Spray Paint Gun' - not really sure what the 'Airless' bit means. Just wondered if anyone has one, and knows if its any good.

There also seems to be a few 'HVLP' or 'High Volume Low Pressure' sprayers going for £50 to £100 delivered. How much better are these?

Any advice appreciated.

(Please note all prices are UK, so would equal $40 for airless, $200 for the HVLP)

[Orclord]

"Airless" means exactly what it says.....These are electric and plug directly into the mains....They have an electric moter that pumps the paint through the nozzle.....Rather than the normal compressed air

When you mention "HVLP" do you means airless as well ?

Because if not you will also need an air compressor.....

Have a look at Machine Mart....

http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/categories/search/airless-sprayers-paint-mixers-2

[surface tension]

Just thought I'd mention that CPC have these electric spray guns for a tenner at the moment. I don't know what postage is as I've always ordered over £40, which is free.

[sstorkel]

If you're planning to make several hundred cabinets, you should look into a spray painting system. HVLP generally results in the most paint on your wood and the least floating around in the air. I have heard that most house painters use air-assisted airless, which does better with thick latex paints. All of these systems are expensive to buy! A good HVLP system starts at US$700.

If you're just planning to paint a few dozen cabinets, I'd suggest investing in good paint, good rollers, and a sanding block. They'll work better than anything that costs less than £250.

[sealslayer]

For my cab I used a 2hp Compressor (£50 from a bootsale) and a clarkes £30 spray gun using cellulose paint.
All the paint, thinners and Primer etc worked out at around £60

[shardian]

"Airless" means exactly what it says.....These are electric and plug directly into the mains....They have an electric moter that pumps the paint through the nozzle.....Rather than the normal compressed air

When you mention "HVLP" do you means airless as well ?

Because if not you will also need an air compressor.....

If you get a chance, tear apart one of those wagoner airless paint guns. They work by alternating a magnetic field rapidly to drive a magnet in a piston motion. That's why you have to clean them thoroughly - if not the magnet gets stuck.

There are HVLP sprayers available that have "carry along" compressors built in. The following is the one I have:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=91772

[2600]

Shardian,
How's that one working out for you?  Painted any cabs with it?

[ChadTower]

I really need to learn to work the compressor I got off Freecycle.

[shardian]

Shardian,
How's that one working out for you?  Painted any cabs with it?

No, not yet. I got it right before the weather changed and only had time to paint a door with it. I like it much better than the airless painter.

I've read forums where people have used that harbor freight HVLP to even paint cars with good results.

[2600]

Any links on that information.  I see some links where people used a different HF HVLP, but not that model.

[shardian]

If I get a chance, I'll dig for it. It was some gearhead forum discussing automotive painting techniques. It was a pretty heated arguement. The old-timers were saying you simply could not paint a car with HVLP. There were several other fellows who said you could and backed it up with photos of the finished work. There was one guy in particular that used the blue all-in-one HVLP and it looked pretty good.

[gatordad]

Make sure you do it outside on the grass, I made a mess of my garage floor even with a huge dropcloth. If you do it inside wear a mask.
My wife asked me when I was painting,(in a closed garage, with no mask) "are you drooling?"
I responded "thats OK I like it"
 

[2600]

Decided to try out the HF, but a slightly different model then shardian
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=44677
I've got some shutters and a door that need paining  and I can practice on.


Rockler sells the same sprayer.  I think I'll pick up one of the extra cannisters from them to help during cleanup
http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=17931&cs=1

[shardian]

Decided to try out the HF, but a slightly different model then shardian
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=44677
I've got some shutters and a door that need paining  and I can practice on.

That one is a little more expensive and a little nicer.

[2600]

Hopefully, it works okay.  I found a few more reviews on this unit then the other so I decided to go with it plus it was on sale. 

I did find one page where someone used the unit you have on a VW Bus.  After finding a few pages of people using the sprayers with water based paints, I think I decided I'm definitely going with the water based paints as I really hate cleaning up after the oil based.

[sstorkel]

I did find one page where someone used the unit you have on a VW Bus.  After finding a few pages of people using the sprayers with water based paints, I think I decided I'm definitely going with the water based paints as I really hate cleaning up after the oil based.

One word: Floetrol. You'll probably need it if you attempt to spray a water-based paint using one of these Harbor Freight sprayers. Even a water-based clearcoat might require thinning!

[2600]

I did find one page where someone used the unit you have on a VW Bus.  After finding a few pages of people using the sprayers with water based paints, I think I decided I'm definitely going with the water based paints as I really hate cleaning up after the oil based.

One word: Floetrol. You'll probably need it if you attempt to spray a water-based paint using one of these Harbor Freight sprayers. Even a water-based clearcoat might require thinning!

Yep, already have it marked to use it, but thanks for the verification.  Though from my understanding, Floetrol is a conditioner not a thinner.  I'd use distilled water to thin the paint plus add the Floetrol.

[sstorkel]

Yep, already have it marked to use it, but thanks for the verification.  Though from my understanding, Floetrol is a conditioner not a thinner.  I'd use distilled water to thin the paint plus add the Floetrol.

Have you read the label on your paint? In most of the cases I've encountered, water can't be used to thin water-based paint! Or if it can, you're not supposed to add more than 10% water (which isn't much).

Floetrol, as the name suggests, is designed to thin the paint and make it flow better. In the case of a spray system, it makes it easier for the gun to properly atomize the paint. With out it, you'll get a finish that looks like someone shot millions of very small paint balls at the project!

[2600]

Yep, already have it marked to use it, but thanks for the verification.  Though from my understanding, Floetrol is a conditioner not a thinner.  I'd use distilled water to thin the paint plus add the Floetrol.

Have you read the label on your paint? In most of the cases I've encountered, water can't be used to thin water-based paint! Or if it can, you're not supposed to add more than 10% water (which isn't much).

Floetrol, as the name suggests, is designed to thin the paint and make it flow better. In the case of a spray system, it makes it easier for the gun to properly atomize the paint. With out it, you'll get a finish that looks like someone shot millions of very small paint balls at the project!

I'm not painting this second so I haven't purchased any paint.  From what I recall, most water based paints are thinned with water and oil based paints are thinned with acetone or mineral spirits.

Your definition of Floetrol is a little different then the manufacturer who are quick to point out that it is not a thinner.

In any case, it depends on what paint I do end up getting and the conditions at the time I start paint.

[sstorkel]

I'm not painting this second so I haven't purchased any paint.  From what I recall, most water based paints are thinned with water and oil based paints are thinned with acetone or mineral spirits.

If the can says you can thin with water, then by all means thin with water. I have a friend who is a professional painter and I know several woodworker's that specialize in finishing with water-based products. All of them tell me that thinning water-based finishes with water generally doesn't work well. Especially if you attempt to thin the product by more than 10%.

I think the problem is that the "water" in water-based paint isn't tap water. In most cases, it's a sophisticated suspension of a number of different chemicals: oil-based pigments, mildew inhibitors, crack inhibitors, various organic polymers, etc. You can add water to the mixture, which will make it thinner, but you won't be able to achieve a mixture that's as complete and thorough as the one done at the factory. The result is that the paint may tend to dry unevenly, crack, have compromised mildew resistance, reduced longevity, etc. I hate painting, so I tend to follow their advice because I definitely don't want to have to redo something a few years down the road.

BTW, what finish would you thin with acetone? I've used mineral spirits, turpentine, and lacquer thinner but never acetone...

Your definition of Floetrol is a little different then the manufacturer who are quick to point out that it is not a thinner.

It may not be a thinner, but it does thin the paint!

Think about it this way: start with a gallon of lemonade. Then mix it with a gallon of "beverage conditioner". The conditioner doesn't contain any lemons, just like Floetrol doesn't contain any paint pigment. Do you think the resulting 2-gallon mixture will have the same concentration of lemons? A higher (= thicker) concentration? Or a lower concentration (= thinner)?

The whole point of Floetrol is that it does thin the paint, almost by definition, but it doesn't compromise the quality of the paint while doing so.