Mame32 and lightgun / dual Lightgun Support or lackoff

[epraiser123]

Hi, I have 2 of the latest Act-Lab usb type lightguns with 2 of the vga boxes, the new ones are all nice with either a choice of red or blue like the happ light guns (only the triggers feel very cheap).

I have Windows XP Pro with SP1 and I am running Mame32 / UI  latest version .121u3

Does the latest version of Mame32/UI support Lightgun(s)?

if not, what was the last version that did?

if the latest version does support lightguns why does the "Controllers" tab for game properties always have the "Enable Lightgun Input" greyed out along with the Dual lightgun option greyed out.  Strangely enough the Offscreen shots reload will become enabled if you check off that you enable mouse input but it feels like something is not right.

Did the programmers just take the stance that the light gun is just a mouse really so they disabled all the lightgun options ?

this is where I am confused and did not find any other forums with definitive answers.  If found many old posts with like mame32 0.62 or around there with people saying they got light guns working and they've checked to enable lights guns.

Thanks so much guys
Dave

[Cananas]

I have Windows XP Pro with SP1 and I am running Mame32 / UI  latest version .121u3

Does the latest version of Mame32/UI support Lightgun(s)?

Well, Mame supports lightguns, but since 0.120u4, there is a bug that makes impossible to move the cursor with the gun (not tracking axis).

if the latest version does support lightguns why does the "Controllers" tab for game properties always have the "Enable Lightgun Input" greyed out along with the Dual lightgun option greyed out.  Strangely enough the Offscreen shots reload will become enabled if you check off that you enable mouse input but it feels like something is not right.

I really don't know why mame32/UI has always greyed "Enable Lightgun Input". Don't worry about that. Take a look to the mame.ini and verify that lightgun, dual_lightgun and Offscreen_shot_reload is enabled.

If you wish, you can set lightgun device to lightgun. With this, it doesn't matter if lightgun is enabled or not, because Mame enables it automatically in the games that uses the lightgun device.

One more thing. Since the last change of the input controls, the Offscreen_shot_reload  options only works for lightguns and not with mice.

[Cananas]

Did the programmers just take the stance that the light gun is just a mouse really so they disabled all the lightgun options ?

If I'm not wrong (if yes, please, someone correct me) Mame tries to know if a device could be a lightgun vs a mouse checking if the device can work with absolute coordinates regarding to the screen and not with relative position with regard to the previous one.

If it can manage absolute coordinates, Mame considers the device could be a lightgun. If only support relative coordinates, for sure is a mouse.

[u_rebelscum]

Did the programmers just take the stance that the light gun is just a mouse really so they disabled all the lightgun options ?

If I'm not wrong (if yes, please, someone correct me) Mame tries to know if a device could be a lightgun vs a mouse checking if the device can work with absolute coordinates regarding to the screen and not with relative position with regard to the previous one.

If it can manage absolute coordinates, Mame considers the device could be a lightgun. If only support relative coordinates, for sure is a mouse.

I think the idea was for mame to check for relative vs absolute mouse data and allocate a normal mouse or a lightgun, respectively, and has the variables (structures) to hold the info. 
However, due to whatever reason, mame currently sees each mouse as both a normal mouse and a lightgun, whether it's a lightgun or a normal mouse.

So in practice (currently), -lightgun and -mouse options are the same, and so the -lightgun option is redundant and can be ignored.  I don't know if that's what/why MameUI devs are graying out lightgun options, but it doesn't matter AFAICT.  Just enable mouse and you're fine.

[Cananas]

So in practice (currently), -lightgun and -mouse options are the same, and so the -lightgun option is redundant and can be ignored.  I don't know if that's what/why MameUI devs are graying out lightgun options, but it doesn't matter AFAICT.  Just enable mouse and you're fine.

It is not exactly the same. If you enable mouse you can not reload shooting off screen even if shotofscreen _reload is enabled, because Aaron considered that this is a hack for mice.

But if you enabled lightgun and have a lightgun (obvious) and (not sure) a mouse working with absolute coordinates, you can reload shooting off the screen if the proper option is enabled.

[Optics]

I've been reading over this thread but it left me a bit confused - I'm hoping to buy two lightguns for an arcade system i'm building but if mame cannot support them I don't want to waste my money.  Is the case that mame doesn't "offically" support lightguns but you map the lightgun to a mouse?  That's what I seemed to have gathered from this thread, correct me if i'm wrong. Thanks - and sorry to the orginal poster for hijacking but I felt it was better to ask here then start a whole new thread.

[Green Giant]

I've been reading over this thread but it left me a bit confused - I'm hoping to buy two lightguns for an arcade system i'm building but if mame cannot support them I don't want to waste my money.  Is the case that mame doesn't "offically" support lightguns but you map the lightgun to a mouse?  That's what I seemed to have gathered from this thread, correct me if i'm wrong. Thanks - and sorry to the orginal poster for hijacking but I felt it was better to ask here then start a whole new thread.

Mame does officially support lightguns.  Mame sees a lightgun as a type of mouse, but unlike the way it sees a trackball.  Dual lightguns work but don't ever expect the exact gameplay you had on house of the dead.  For example, you typically have to stand 5-6 feet from the screen when using the lcdtopguns, most popular lightguns for cabs.  Tracking is suprisingly good for the number of games that have to be supported, but not everything is supported as many lightgun games are still in use and required special hardware to run, mame isn't setup fast enough yet.

[Rob L]

I am using Mame32 and have dual act labs light guns and after installing them and testing out one I could not get the offscreen reload to work.

I will spend more time this weekend with them since I didn't have much time when I installed them. Hopefully I can just uncheck that offscreen reload thing and just have the back button on the gun do the reloading.

[u_rebelscum]

There's often some confusion on what the -offscreen_reload option does.  Mame uses it to translate from the PC "standard" of an offscreen shot to the arcade "standard".  Offscreen in PC lightguns: button 2 + location of last onscreen shot.  Offscreen in arcade: trigger (button 1) + location of (0,MaxY).

If the original game did not have a reload button, neither will mame.  In this case, you couldn't do a simple map a button to reload, and need the -offscreen_reload to reload (and it's not buggy).

So in practice (currently), -lightgun and -mouse options are the same, and so the -lightgun option is redundant and can be ignored.  I don't know if that's what/why MameUI devs are graying out lightgun options, but it doesn't matter AFAICT.  Just enable mouse and you're fine. Edit: see below for how it sort of works, AFAIK.

It is not exactly the same. If you enable mouse you can not reload shooting off screen even if shotofscreen _reload is enabled, because Aaron considered that this is a hack for mice.

But if you enabled lightgun and have a lightgun (obvious) and (not sure) a mouse working with absolute coordinates, you can reload shooting off the screen if the proper option is enabled. 

Ah, I see what you're saying, but mame's code seems halfway between what you & I said.  (I can't test my lightgun machine because it's, um, hiding under a pile of other stuff; what small games are good to test reload on?)

From my tests, it seems the remapping (tab) is influenced by what option is selected, much like you mentioned:

-mouse    enabled	-lightgun    enabled	Input    hardware	Remaps    as
Yes	No	mouse	mouse
No	Yes	mouse	lightgun
Yes	Yes	mouse	mouse
Yes	No	lightgun	?mouse?
No	Yes	lightgun	lightgun?
Yes	Yes	lightgun

*the lightgun hardware was NOT tested, just my guesses.

However, mame's source code seems to look at the code type, mouse or gun, for if offscreen reload works. (FWIW, mame has four code types: key, joy, mouse, & gun.)  And if either -lightgun or -mouse is enabled, both code types are enabled.  So if the input is mapped to the gun and not the mouse code type, it seems that the hardware doesn't matter.  I'd not sure what happens if both types are mapped (the default), nor am I sure what happens with lightgun hardware, nor was I able to actually test how well the reload works with a mouse.

[Rob L]

Well I was playing around with my lightguns saturday and I can't get the reload to work. I have tried:

-enable off screen reload checked on (and in the mame32.ini have it with a value of 1) and nothing

-enable offscreen reload off and nothing

-turning off the enable mouse option in mame32 and the gun won't even register a shot on screen when I shoot

I have no clue how to get this working. Since the back button on the lightgun is used as a reload thing I notice when I press it the cursor goes to the bottom left corner and the screen flashes but again, no reload. If i just point the gun off the screen and press the trigger then I think the cursor doesn't move and the screen just flashes.

I really wish I knew how to get this working.

Oh and in the controller mapping section I have "lightgun" selected under lightgun. I havent tried selecting mouse in that dropdown menu...wondering if maybe I should.

[traig]

I just went through this frustration and was on the verge of giving up. No matter what I did I could not get the offscreen_reload to work. Finally, after seeing this thread, I edited the mame.ini file to enable lightgun, offscreen reload, and, what ultimately made it work, dual_lightgun. This is with an ActLabs usb s-video gun, and MameUI32 .123.

I'm happy to report that offscreen reload works, and it has also enabled the buttons on the back and right side of the gun to reload as well.

By the way, this thread was what did the trick, but my Google searches for "offscreen reload" and variants of it did not turn it up. I had to remember to try coming directly to BYOAC and searching here locally.