Some local pins I am watching on ebay

[shardian]

He has listed them all as non-working.
Just curious what you guys think if I should even bother trying for one of these things as a feet-wetter pinball machine. what kind of price they could be worth in non-working condition, what does is cost on average to get an ol EM pin running again. Any opinions are appreciated.

http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZwoodrailerQQhtZ-1

[horseboy]

He listed that Tic Tac Toe as working. That one looks pretty sweet. I bet it fetches a pretty penny.

[shardian]

He listed that Tic Tac Toe as working. That one looks pretty sweet. I bet it fetches a pretty penny.

Wasn't interested in that one much. The Skateball is catching my eye the most. Already played it in Pinmame and liked it fairly well. It appears a rubber and lights kit would be about $45, and chip sets are also available on ebay for fairly cheap if necessary. I think I'll ask him if he can tell me what is wrong. I may also swing by there this weekend to have a look-see...assuming the bids haven't put it out of my reach.

[ChadTower]

That Skateball is not an EM.

At those prices, snag them.  They'll go higher, though.  In your area there are a good amount of pin guys.  Unless you have a bunch of spare room I'd advise picking just one and getting it.  If you really want get the Skateball and an EM so you can work on one of each type.  Pins have a pretty long learning curve.

Read the (lack of) descs carefully.  At least one of them is just wrong.  Assume the machines are really lacking and are parts machines that maybe you'll get lucky and can get working.  That's what it looks like a couple of them are.

[shardian]

That Skateball is not an EM.

At those prices, snag them.  They'll go higher, though.  In your area there are a good amount of pin guys.  Unless you have a bunch of spare room I'd advise picking just one and getting it.  If you really want get the Skateball and an EM so you can work on one of each type.  Pins have a pretty long learning curve.

Read the (lack of) descs carefully.  At least one of them is just wrong.  Assume the machines are really lacking and are parts machines that maybe you'll get lucky and can get working.  That's what it looks like a couple of them are.

LOL. Yeah if they stayed at those prices I would be stupid not to buy all of them. I figure they will all go between $100 and $200. I know of most of the pinball people around here. I will also be bugging Wade from this board, but I already know he'll say the same thing as you and will advise me against them.

[shardian]

They seller had this to say about the skateball:

hello
i don't work on digitals, but the game will start up , the ball comes up,but the pop bumpers don,t
work. i would say its mpu board,not sure.
dave

What do you have to say to that Chad?

[ChadTower]

Well, it's a good starting sign, anyway, that the thing isn't completely dead.  It's not enough info to really go very far with.  Find out if the score displays work.  Offhand I'd say you probably have a good first pin to shop there. 

Hard to give a real guess without knowing how recently, if ever, the thing has been shopped.  That sort of symptom really can be anything from bad ICs to transistors to broken wires to burned IDC connectors. 

[shardian]

Hmm, apparently the mpu board used in Bally's of that era were prone to battery acid corrosion. My question is would component corrosion on the mpu board cause certain parts to quit working, or would that be a completely inoperable machine? There is a rebuild kit for it on ebay that has all the components in the area of the battery that would be damaged.
It may definitely be in my best interest to go look at this one.

[ChadTower]

Yes, they are.  I can't remember for this particular machine but the early SS machines usually had permanent batteries on board rather than battery holders for replaceables.  Those permanent batteries eventually would spring leaks and the acid drips down the board or vents fumes that cause components to fail.  This is very common, common enough that they have rebuild kits for it. 

What effect it could have on the machine is random based on what parts are nearby and what parts may have failed.  You may also see acid trashed traces too.  Battery acid damage is something you'd really want to see yourself if the price were enough that it mattered.

The easy path for this is to get a replacement board and then fix this one in your spare time as your skills increase.  The harder one is to just dive in and try fixing it with guidance.  The rebuild kit is definitely a good place to start but it would not address burned traces.

[shardian]

 I remember seeing a pen you can buy to draw traces with. Can you use that stuff to repair traces?

I also just found this, but I believe they make it look ALOT easier than it would be in real life.
http://www.circuittechctr.com/guides/4-2-4.shtml

[ChadTower]

I remember seeing a pen you can buy to draw traces with. Can you use that stuff to repair traces?

I wouldn't rely on it.  The best way I've found is to solder in jumpers.  Find the dead trace and solder an appropriate gauge wire from one component leg to the next.  You don't really have to form it the way they do on the page you found, just make sure there is no chance it will short anything if the board gets moved later.

Here is my project thread for my Shadow and Laser Cue.  The Shadow thread may be useful as I had to rebuild a circuit in a similar fashion though that one was just heat burned rather than acid burned.

[USSEnterprise]

IIRC, that Gottlieb Gigi is a $1200 machine when properly shopped.

[shardian]

Well I guess I can forget about this one. It's already over $250 and the reserve isn't even met. Wade told me this one was a $500 pin in working condition, so $250 would have been as high as I would have gone anyways on this one.
Oh well. Maybe one day when I am rich I'll have a pin.

[USSEnterprise]

Keep your eyes peeled for broken EMs on places like craigslist and Mr. Pinball.  They're usually quite cheap. I just spotted a Williams Liberty Bell for $100 and a Chicago Coin Cinema for $200, both non working. Both are great deals, just keep an eye out for similar deals near you.

[shardian]

Well you are in a high population area in NJ. I'm in WV, craigslist here is a joke. There are some hardcore pinballers around here that buy up EVERYTHING usually before it even hits the market.

I really would rather have a working pin, as I don't have time to work on my arcade machines. Where am I gonna find time for a pin? I'll just have to wait and work a side job in a year or two and just buy a good DMD machine.
It sure is fun to get excited over a possible purchase though.

[ChadTower]

A "good DMD machine" isn't going to be any more reliable than an EM or earlier SS.  If all three are shopped equally there's a good chance the DMD pin is going to be the least reliable of the three.  It's probably the highest ratio of points of failure to mass production style quality.

USSEnterprise, NJ is probably the easiest place in the eastern US to get arcade games.  There were ridicuolous amounts of arcades there.  A lot of people say it's mostly due to the ease of money laundering through them.

Criagslist is useless here in MA too.  You can't get anything listed more than 5 minutes after it hits the server and you can't list anything yourself because people flag it as spam and it gets yanked.

Sharidan, you can pretty much assume any working nontrashed pin is worth $500.  Some no higher but that's the usual starting point for any decent game.

[ClubNinja]

If it were within an hour drive, I'd be all over that Travel Time.  Very unique and a bunch of fun.  Not for everyone, though.

[ChadTower]

I'd be careful on that one, it's visibly missing parts.  Who knows what it is missing underneath.

[shardian]

Chad I'd swear if I didn't know any better that you made your living peeing in people cheerios. 

I do value your advice on pinballs though.

[ChadTower]

Chad I'd swear if I didn't know any better that you made your living peeing in people cheerios. 

I do value your advice on pinballs though.

 

[TheOtherBob]

Yes, they are.  I can't remember for this particular machine but the early SS machines usually had permanent batteries on board rather than battery holders for replaceables.

If it's anything like a Bally Evel Knievel I worked on then 'yes' the battery is mounted on the mpu board.

That Skateball looks neat.  I'll have to download that one for the pc to try.

[shardian]

Yes, they are.  I can't remember for this particular machine but the early SS machines usually had permanent batteries on board rather than battery holders for replaceables.

If it's anything like a Bally Evel Knievel I worked on then 'yes' the battery is mounted on the mpu board.

That Skateball looks neat.  I'll have to download that one for the pc to try.

It is neat, but the reversed in/out lanes on the left started ticking me off after a while.

I'm considering getting a Grand Lizard from a local, respectable pinballer right now. Has a supposedly easy power/wiring problem and some upper playfield wear.

[nostrebor]

There is a GL at 1984 here in Springfield. Great pin! At first I was not too impressed, but the more I play it the more fun it has become.

Devin managed to buy this one fully working for cheap. I was chasing it, but he was faster.