Wii doesn't use Dolby digital 5.1 audio

[versapak]

Subject matter experts, such as senior game designers and programmers, make a  lot of money.  Things that take up their time, like thoughtfully integrating 5.1 sound into gameplay, costs more than most people would think.  Think in the range of $125-150 PER HOUR PER PERSON.

That is factoring in their actual salary divided by their hours, the per diem cost of their corporate benefits, the upkeep of their development environment, the upkeep of their physical environment, and various other costs related to corporate business.  These things cost money.

This is why the games that use such features are always either short independent games (with people working insane hours for the same pay for companies that put their whole stash on one or two games) or huge budget we expect to sell 5 million copy games.

Then why is the majority of the Xbox library, and so far all of the 360 library in digital surround?

The same goes for PC games. Surround is common place, and that is an environment where I'd bet the % of surround setups is far less than that of the console gaming audience.

I don't doubt it costs to develop, but it seems it is standard development costs, and not some extra premium.


I don't expect the Wii to suddenly get surround sound. It ain't happening. I am not trying to figure what it would cost to now implement something not already implemented.

I am just saying that it is already a standard part of game development these days on a majority of games.

It is not like the Wii would have been breaking into new ground had they included the ability for it. It also does not mean that a developer would have to support it.

There were games on the Xbox that didn't support it. Why would Trivial Pursuit bother with it? Ya know.

But the option was there, and it was predominantly used.

The PS2, which unlike the Xbox, didn't have hardware for real time surround encoding, but it did at least have an optical port for digital sound. This did allow for some games to actually be released that did real time surround sound through software only.

The Wii could have at the very least, and for very cheap given an optical audio port for digital sound. This would have been right there with the cost of an RJ45 port. As it is now, the Wii doesn't even match the audio capability of the weakest ("power"wise) console of last generation.

It just would have been nice. Tis all I'm saying. I don't really care about development costs on the subject, because game developers have already proven in mass numbers that it is something that they are willing to happily support. If the option is there, it adds to a gaming experience.

[ChadTower]

You're talking simulatneously about games that "have 5.1" and "games that are immersive with the 5.1 functionality providing actual gameplay feedback".

They're not the same and you know it.

Most of those games "in 5.1" are just munged stereo extended out for a couple more channels.  And the cost of developing these two types of "5.1 compatible game" are very, very different.

[versapak]

You're talking simulatneously about games that "have 5.1" and "games that are immersive with the 5.1 functionality providing actual gameplay feedback".

They're not the same and you know it.

Most of those games "in 5.1" are just munged stereo extended out for a couple more channels.  And the cost of developing these two types of "5.1 compatible game" are very, very different.

No, I'm not.

I am talking about 5.1 surround period.

If I stand in front of a fire, I hear that fire in front of me. As I turn around 360° I will hear that fire travel around the room accordingly.

If I am racing down the street at 150mph in a rear engine car I hear that engine predominantly in the rear. I hear the car I am passing on my left go from the front left channel to the rear left channel.

As I am peeking around the corner, and I hear footsteps behind me, I know I may be in trouble, and I know exactly where to look first.

When I am online playing _______, I can hear where my enemy's gunfire is coming from. I am not just surprised by a loud bang, but I know exactly which way to look to return fire in case I lived.

As I am snowboarding down a mountain, and a snowman calls out to me (it's an Amped thing ), I can pick out exactly where on the mountain it is coming from by the direction I hear his voice.

I know what discreet surround sound is.

I am not talking about 4-5 channel stereo. I do know the difference.

Most games had real discreet digital surround sound on Xbox last generation. they have had it on PC for years even before that. They have it on the 360 and PS3 this generation.

That doesn't mean there weren't games that didn't have it, but they were the minority, and will only continue to be such.


I don't know what kind of development you do do, but it does not seem to be modern game development.

I don't develop games, but I sure as heck can tell when something is using real surround sound. As much of a common place thing as it is, it just doesn't seem to be as hard to implement as you make it out to be.

[ChadTower]

Right, so you're talking feedback based 5.1.

I've played a lot of 5.1 encoded games.  A LOT of them were basically 5 channel stereo simulated from 2 channel stereo.  More were a little better than that but still the audio didn't provide any interactivity, only rear channel sound.

And yes, in a 3d game environment, it actually is fairly based on location, direction, and sounds emanating from specific objects within the interactive environment.  Much like in making a movie.  That is how a game engine works, the simulation of reality within the rules of physics (light, sound, gravity, etc) as defined (and implemented) within that specific environment.

Because doing it another way is just multiple channels of stereo.

[versapak]

Right, so you're talking feedback based 5.1.

I've played a lot of 5.1 encoded games.  A LOT of them were basically 5 channel stereo simulated from 2 channel stereo.  More were a little better than that but still the audio didn't provide any interactivity, only rear channel sound.

And yes, in a 3d game environment, it actually is fairly based on location, direction, and sounds emanating from specific objects within the interactive environment.  Much like in making a movie.  That is how a game engine works, the simulation of reality within the rules of physics (light, sound, gravity, etc) as defined (and implemented) within that specific environment.

Because doing it another way is just multiple channels of stereo.

What games are you talking about then?


I am not at all talking about anything like mastering audio for a movie where an audio engineer would deal with placing scripted sound. I am talking soley about you being in a central location, being able to spin around in that location, and thus hear all the sounds of that world spin in relation to you.

That is something the Xbox had for a majority of games.

The norm was not to just extend the stereo channels to the rear, not to say that some games didn't do this, but it was not the norm, and it certainly isn't the norm this generation either.

[ChadTower]

We'll disagree on that one.  The majority of games I played, and I don't play most violent games or racing games, were definitely not all that interactive in in terms of the rear channels.

Either way, good discussion.  All we can say is that Nintendo made a business decision you don't like, I guess.

[versapak]

We'll disagree on that one.  The majority of games I played, and I don't play most violent games or racing games, were definitely not all that interactive in in terms of the rear channels.

Either way, good discussion.  All we can say is that Nintendo made a business decision you don't like, I guess.

Yep