Is Burger King trying to kill us????

[hypernova]

As you all know, in the last few years, many of the restaurant chains have been introducing healthier options.  Salads, yogurt desserts, etc.  McDonald's, Wendy's, and many of the slower restaurants.

But what about Burger King?

It seems as though BK was walking along that road of where their future lay with the others, and while all the other restaurants strayed off the path, trying to offer better options to their customers, especially in such a health conscience time, BK said screw that.  America is fat.  Those other restaurants have responded, in order to keep up their sales.  However, while the other restaurants took a different road, BK stayed on the same path...in fact, it almost seems like it either turned around, or just started walking backwards.  While McDonald's is offering an oriental chicken salad, BK is offering the Enormous Omelet sandwich.  While Wendy's is offering children more choices instead of fries and coke, BK is offering the multimeat breakfast sandwich (had sausage, ham, AND bacon-forgot the name.  Meatnormous Breakfast Sandwich, maybe?)

Now, BKs new Stacker line is just over-the-top I think. 

"The BK Stacker is simple and built with the very ingredients our restaurant guests love best

[NightGod]

I tried that Meatnormous Sammich (wtfever it was called) one morning after a late night bender. Now, I can eat alot of food-maybe not competition level eatting, but I can pretty much eat more than anyone I know if I set my mind to it or am extremely hungry (both of which applied the morning I got that Sammich).

I still barely finished the thing and felt overfull for about 5 hours afterwards-that thing was just brutal. I have enemies I wouldn't wish that monstrosity on.

[MikeDeuce]

Ehh, there's a reason it's called junk food. Americans need to start accepting the liability of their own decisions. Survival of the fittest and all that.

And FWIW, BK sells a Veggie burger, McD's doesn't

http://www.bk.com/#menu=2,42,-1

Although if I ate meat, I'd be all over In 'n Out:
http://www.supersizedmeals.com/food/article.php/20060125050438458

edit:

The stats on the BK Stackers Quad are hilarious:
http://www.bk.com/#menu=3,1,-1

Calories: 1000, Total fat: 68g, Saturated fat: 30g, Trans Fat: 3g, Cholesterol: 240mg

You might want to give the BK veggie a chance if you are ever stuck at a BK...

Calories: 470, Fat: 20g, Saturated fat: 5g, Trans fat: 0g, Cholesterol: 20mg. Not bad for junk food.

[NightGod]

And people wonder why I only eat fast food when I'm too drunk or hung over to make a better decision...

These days I'll literally go hunger before I stop at a fast food joint and if I'm with friends and they go, I *might* get some fries (if it's McDonald's-those things are salt covered crack cocaine, I swear) or onion rings from BK, usually I just get a drink.

[tylerdurden]

I wouldn't say every fast food establishment strayed from the idea that Americans are fat so why not help them add to the padding. Have you been to a Wendy's lately and ordered a combo meal? They did away with the biggie size promo and very quietly they've increased the size of their combo options. A "medium" size combo is now the equivalent to the old biggie size. Order the large combo and you will get a heart stopping tub of fries and a 44oz vat of your favorite drink.

[monkeybomb]

This thread made me hungry.

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...Burgers

[jbox]

Can I get fries with that...

[Vigo]

For the first time in my life, I believe that there is a burger made to my taste. I love the BK stacker!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We have a freedom to choose what we eat, and as long as there are no major suprises as to how healthy it is, that is fine. It is pretty obvious how unhealthy the bk stacker is.

I am in good health, I just make sure that I eat as much healthy stuff as junk food and I am fine. The minute somebody tells me that I can't eat bacon because it is unhealthy, then I will have a complaint...


If you want to pick a fight with a food, pick on diet cola. That crap is so fricken unhealthy it shouldn't be made. Not only is it taste worse than regular cola, It is proven that it will cause more weight gain than regular cola. It also contains artifical sweetners which have been shown to cause cancer in labratory tests.

[NightGod]

I love my Diet Coke-the Phenylalanine helps your body absorb caffine faster. Yum!

(and, honestly, I prefer the taste of it-full sugar pops are too syrupy for my tastes anymore-I drink maybe six full sugar drinks a year-usually RC or a Pepsi/Mt.Dew suicide because I occasionally get the craving for one)

[Vigo]

Hey, more power to you, I know a dozens of people who love diet cola, and I warn them of the consequences. If you can stay healty keep on chugging, but if you start needing a diet, I suggest the diet cola be the first thing to go.

I really can't knock anybody for for what they eat or drink if they are willing to accept the responsibility of what happens to their body. I eat more than my share of junk food, and if someday I get fat, I know it was my fault.

But I do love those BK stackers!! They are so dense and gooey!

[NightGod]

Honestly, I am in the process of losing weight, and I've a) cut back severely on my Diet Coke intake (used to drink about a 12 pack every 2-3 days, plus 2 or 3 32 oz refill mugs a day, now I drink maybe a 12 pack a week and a 32 oz cup a day) and b) jacked up my water intake (I drink about a gallon and a half to two gallons a day now.

That's in addition to alot of other things (like cutting out fast food and doing that crazy exercise stuff). It's amazing how easy it is to make small changes that add up when you're in a society that splurges like we do.

[Sizzler]

If you want to pick a fight with a food, pick on diet cola. That crap is so fricken unhealthy it shouldn't be made. Not only is it taste worse than regular cola, It is proven that it will cause more weight gain than regular cola.

I drink a three liter of soda a day.  You're telling me that it's been proven that consuming zero calories of diet soda will cause more weight gain than 1200 calories of non-diet soda every day?

I'd like to see that study.

[Vigo]

Its not the calorie intake, its the aspartame in the diet soda that prevent calorie breakdown in your body.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159579,00.html

http://www.mercola.com/2005/jun/30/diet_sodas.htm

http://www.mercola.com/article/aspartame/weight_gain_myth.htm

http://www.nancymarkle.com/fatter/

[Sizzler]

That study does not back up your claim that drinking diet soda WILL cause more weight gain than drinking non-diet soda.  The study talks about obesity RISK and you'll see that the RISK is about 10% higher for diet soda drinkers than for regular soda drinkers.

Additionally, there are a ton of other factors involved, which if you get behind the dramatic headline, even those articles admit.   Just because there are more homocides during the summer doesn't mean that consuming ice cream makes people murderers. 

No matter what you claim and what the Fox headline claims, there is nothing in that study that tells me that addiing 1200 calories of non diet Coke to my diet will definitely result in lower weight than the current zero calories of diet soda.   Sorry.

Its not the calorie intake, its the aspartame in the diet soda that prevent calorie breakdown in your body.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159579,00.html

http://www.mercola.com/2005/jun/30/diet_sodas.htm

http://www.mercola.com/article/aspartame/weight_gain_myth.htm

http://www.nancymarkle.com/fatter/

[Vigo]

Fine, thats your decision, and your body your putting that diet cola into. Just don't go blaming the company if you ever have any health problems in the future, cuz I warned ya.

I personally don't like to consume any unnatural chemicals that is put into that diet crap. Nobody can ever convince me that drinking chemicals on a daily basis is not going to kill me.

Doesn't it seem a little suspiscous that our countries weight gain is congruent to the rise in preservatives and chemicals used in our food? Let me hint everybody in...we are the only fat country, and we are the only country to use so much artifical chemicals in our food. The biggest culprit of which is artificial sweetner.

So it isn't proven that artifical sweetner causes cancer, but studies have shown it. They give lab rats enough artificial sweetner to equal a couple diet colas a day (scaled down to their body size respectively), the rats have a much higher cancer rate than the ones of the control group and the ones that they give enough sugar that equals a couple regular colas a day. Thats enough to convince me not to eat it.

If you look at cancer rates of different countries, you will find our cancer rate is higher than other countries with much higher air and water pollution but have natural foods.
CHEMICALS ARE NOT HEALTHY FOLKS...They make it harder to lose weight, and put you at risk of cancer. buy foods where you can pronounce the ingredients, wash off fruits and vegetables. Cook foods from scratch rather than having instant meals every night. I can gurantee this will make you much healthier.


So the study doesn't Prove that it causes more weight gain, but studies can never say that they proved anything. If studies show that I'm at higher risk of weight gain, I'm not going to take the chances.

No matter what you claim and what the Fox headline claims, there is nothing in that study that tells me that addiing 1200 calories of non diet Coke to my diet will definitely result in lower weight than the current zero calories of diet soda.   Sorry.

Read the third article that is posted, you will see reasons why the zero calorie choice can be harmful due to the aspritame.


My suggestion would be to cut the cola completely though, 3 liters a day??? Holy crap??? How can you think that is the healthy option???

[jbox]

People who drink diet cola are probably unhealthy because they think they can weasal out of eating junk food. *shrug*

But people who want to jump up and down about those nasty chemicals should probably go have a lie down and some aspirin- oh wait, maybe some ibuprofen- ack, I mean some di-hydro-oxide- sodium chloride- egads, they's everywhenereho!     

[Vigo]

I use asprin ibuprofen etc etc, and yes I do eat foods with preservatives in them, I'm just control the amount I use.

If you seriously think that diet chemicals don't do anything negative to your body, you seriously haven't done any research.

Any chemical consumed in large quantities can have a negative effect on your body, drinking too much diet crap is like a long term OD.

People, research this stuff...Its not good for you. I certainly would like to know when there is so many diet products out there, why are people only getting fatter. 50 years ago, a fat person was only seen in the circus. Let me clue you people in. Coke was a regular drink, and mcdonalds hamburgers were very popular. the only difference is that you can get chalked full of aspritame, and mcdonalds hamburgers have so many preservatives that they could last a nuclear fallout.

Has anyone bought a loaf of walmart white bread? I have a loaf that is over two months old. It isn't molding! (I also have a serious mold problem in my house), I have mold that will grow on my walls before they will touch a loaf of bread!!! WTF!? That food ain't natural!

[Ken Layton]

That burger looks delicious! I want one!

[ChadTower]

I drink a three liter of soda a day.  You're telling me that it's been proven that consuming zero calories of diet soda will cause more weight gain than 1200 calories of non-diet soda every day?

Don't know about that one but you may want to look up studies linking synthetic sweeteners to Alzheimers.

Vigo has a bit of a point but is pointing in the wrong direction.  Common sense leads one to look at the societal differences between now and 1950 in order to figure out why people are so fat now.

How many people made their living sitting in a chair, rather than out building or manufacturing or some other physical task, for 45-60 hours a week in 1950? 

How many make their living sitting in a chair now?

That's the major difference.  Sometimes the easy answer is the best one.

[thebrownshow]

I love the people who think they have anyone to blame but themselves for their own health.  It's absolutely hysterical.  Chad's right, I started putting on weight like crazy when I got my job, I sit at a computer for 8-10 hours a day and used to eat like crap.  So now I wake up earlier and counteract that lack of activity with a run before work.  It's all about balance.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go to BK and order that burger and run an extra mile tomorrow morning.

[shardian]

I sit at a desk all day, along with about a 40 minute each way commute. I am mentally exhausted at the end of the day, and that is FAR worse than being physically tired. I don't feel like doing anything other than sitting on my butt and staring at a wall. It is very hard to get motivated to do anything. If I could make the same pay doing a mildly physical job, I would take it in a heartbeat. The best job I ever had is and will most likely always be the produce department at Kroger.

[Chris]

Any chemical consumed in large quantities can have a negative effect on your body, drinking too much diet crap is like a long term OD.

And hey, water in large quantities can cause drowning!

[pointdablame]

oh no... BK made a big sandwich and is forcefully cramming them down the throats of every American man, woman, and child.

Oh no... wait... they're not.  You can eat whatever the hell you want, including fast food 5 days a week if you're an idiot.  I don't get why people complain about this stuff... just don't eat it yourself.

The fact is, BK did this because PEOPLE WILL BUY IT.  Just like previous to this, people would buy 2 double cheeseburgers and eat both instead of one of these things.  Who really cares??  its a person's choice to become a fat slob, and they have no one else to blame.  The creation (or deletion) of this item on the BK menu will do NOTHING to the health of America.  If the didn't sell it, fat people would just buy *more* food to become full.  If they only sold healthy stuff, people would go elsewhere for their guilty pleasures.

I probably eat fast food once or twice a week, and I'm maybe 10-15lbs above my ideal weight.  Am I magic? no... I just have some common sense and don't sit down all day like Chad mentioned.  Fast food doesn't make people fat... eating too much of it, and too much food in general, combined with no exercise makes people fat.

[cdbrown]

I sit at a desk all day, along with about a 40 minute each way commute. I am mentally exhausted at the end of the day, and that is FAR worse than being physically tired. I don't feel like doing anything other than sitting on my butt and staring at a wall. It is very hard to get motivated to do anything.

  But once you get over that hurdle, you'll find that you won't be as mentally exhausted each day and will look forward to some physical activity.  Just do something regularly and you'll feel better.  How about doing something before work?  I now ride to and from work (10km/7mi) each way and feel more alert the whole day.

Get moving, get the heart pumping, the body will produce all those good natural chemicals and you'll be much better off.

I like having fast food every now and again because it generally tastes good - maybe once a week .... maybe.  I know it's no good for me and that's why I have it occasionally.  Blaming BK or McD for not providing healthy alternatives is just rubbish - go somewhere else if you want healthy - they never claimed to be healthy, they claimed to be very tastey and good value for money.  If I want a fresh salad I'll make it myself, if I want a greasy burger then I'll hit BK.  Take some responsibility for what you (and your kids) put in your mouths.

[MaximRecoil]

First of all, you have been duped. There is no "obesity epidemic" in the United States. The obesity statistics did suddenly jump by about 29 million people overnight in 1997 though, simply because the government arbitrarily redefined the words "obese" and "overweight".

The method now used for determining so-called "obesity" is the "Body Mass Index". The main problem with this is that it doesn't distinguish between muscle tissue and fat. It also does not take into account age, gender or race. Do you realize that if we all started working out we would make the obesity statistics worse by these laughable standards? Muscle weighs more than fat.

From the CDC:

If an athlete or other person with a lot of muscle has a BMI over 25, is that person still considered to be overweight?
According to the BMI weight status categories, anyone with a BMI over 25 would be classified as overweight and anyone with a BMI over 30 would be classified as obese.

It is important to remember, however, that BMI is not a direct measure of body fatness and that BMI is calculated from an individual

[gnateye]

As you all know, in the last few years, many of the restaurant chains have been introducing healthier options.  Salads, yogurt desserts, etc.  McDonald's, Wendy's, and many of the slower restaurants.....  While McDonald's is offering an oriental chicken salad...

im definitely not in favor of fast food, all you have to do is watch 'supersize me' or read 'fast food nation' to know the effects of too much fast food (liver issues, kidney issues, high blood pressure, head aches, tummy aches, panceantitus, high triglycerides, etc etc etc) and its also a know fact that most, if not all, fast food chains use chemical enhancers to make us feel fuller when we are done, but to think for a second that now McD's is tryin to help us be more heathly is just falling prey to their propaganda. no, i repeat NO FAST FOOD IS GOOD FOR YOU. its amazing the amount of calories and sodium in some of those burgers but have you looked at the nutritional info for the new salads and mickey Ds? or the supposedly healthy yogurt parfait? they are just as bad as everything else, well maybe not as bad as those crazy burgers but still way over waht is recommended for daily intake:

asian salad (with crispy chicken): 370 calories, 17 grams fat, 65 mg chloresterol, 1030 mg sodium!!!  
yogurt parfait: 160 cal, 2 grams fat, 5 mg chloresterol,  85 mg sodium.

the parfait isnt nearly as bad as most things, but its a lesser of 2 evils.

heres a link to the mcdonalds nutritional info page:
http://app.mcdonalds.com/bagamcmeal?process=menuitems

i wont even get into the diet colas, its the hardest addiction to kick, harder than ciggerettes in my opinion....

[ChadTower]

No one needs gov't stats or definitions to know that most people in the US are fat now.  All you have to do is go out on a hot day and look at all the disgusting landwhales walking around, leaking foot fat out of their sandals, dripping sweat in a Hansel and Gretel return path, complaining that the walk from their chair to their car isn't air conditioned and takes more than 25 steps.

I do agree that the BMI is outdated and completely ignores above average muscularity.  I am overweight now but even when I was 13% bodyfat I was obese by the BMI index.

[thebrownshow]

Shardian: excercise in the mornings before work.  That was my problem too.  When I started running I couldn't run a block, a month later I was running two miles.  Just stick with it.

By the way, that burger is awesome. 

[cdbrown]

im definitely not in favor of fast food, all you have to do is watch 'supersize me' or read 'fast food nation' to know the effects of too much fast food (liver issues, kidney issues, high blood pressure, head aches, tummy aches, panceantitus, high triglycerides, etc etc etc) and its also a know fact that most, if not all, fast food chains use chemical enhancers to make us feel fuller when we are done,

If you ate large amounts of the exact same food day in and day out I'm sure you would see similar problems to what supersize me has shown.  One guy in Aus took the challenge of eating the large meal deals at McD every day to see for himself, but he had different varieties of what was on offer (before the healthy option came about).  But he exercised. Guess what - he was more healthier, had lower cholesterol, blood pressure etc than before.  He didn't want to step foot into another McD after that but he showed it's not all bad, have a varied diet and get some exercise and you'll be fine.

[Vigo]

I just think that people just don't understand all the weird crap that is in food today, and that we don't know enough about it to really understand what it does in our bodies.

Artificial sweeteners and preservatives aren't some scary bedtime story, we are finding that these foods are linked to health conditions like cancer, and as chad mentioned Alzheimer's.

And yes, a lot of the equation is that people don't exercise, that's true, we have grown so accustomed to sitting that in a few years babies will start being born with evolved extra appendage that looks like a swivel chair.

I do have to mention though my wife's school in taiwan, they went from monday to friday from 8am to about 9pm. They have such a stong education program there. Anyway, at her school, they didn't have recess, and they only had PE a couple years out of their whole k-12 experiance...enough lack of physical work that it would make a doughboy out of anybody. Oh, they are fed well too, and since their night school classes start about 45 minutes after their daytime classes, they have to drive over to the classroom, and pick up some fast food on the way. Daily.

They are still a country of stick people. I went over there, and they think I'm fat. I am only five pound over my recommended weight. They just eat natural foods. Their fast food is like a fresh soup and some fried egg.

I really have to say, I was not blaming food until I went to taiwan, changed my who perspective on what Americans eat. I started eating a lot more natural, preservative free foods, and I just feel better. (but of course, this isn't a replacement for exercise)


Ok, I made my point, take of it what you will, but I'm not going to really wanting to start a debate over it.

  Have a good day everybody!

[Chris]

Ok, I made my point, take of it what you will, but I'm not going to really wanting to start a debate over it.

Too late... once you started in with the "Let me clue you people in" attitude you got one.

[MaximRecoil]

No one needs gov't stats or definitions to know that most people in the US are fat now.

That's a useless statement. I look around and most people I see are not fat. My observations cancel out yours. Should we start taking pictures of random crowds of people?

Here is one of the first Google image results for "crowd". Surely, since you used the word "most", we could expect at least 51% of the people in that picture to be "fat". Well? Where are they? What about here? I see two women who would be called "fat" in that picture, but there are a lot more than two people in the crowd. How about this? You find me a picture of a crowd of Americans where most of them are "fat", hell, even one where a large percentage of them are "fat" ... and make it a random picture, not a Weight Watchers' meeting or something like that.

This American "obesity epidemic" bandwagon got rolling via the media, who got their information from the useless "statistics" pertaining to the matter.

[Vigo]

First of all, you have been duped. There is no "obesity epidemic" in the United States. The obesity statistics did suddenly jump by about 29 million people overnight in 1997 though, simply because the government arbitrarily redefined the words "obese" and "overweight".

Hey Maxim, I just have to ask, How old are you, cuz if you are 40 or older, you will have seen a good image of how people have gotten fatter over these few decades. chad's point is on the mark, don't look at statistics to show how fat people are, use your eyes. 50 years ago about 1 out of every 100 people had a weight problem, now it is about 3 out of 5. Ask anybody who is older. They will be able to verify this. They will say that when they saw a fat person, they all stopped and stared.

oh well, take it easy dude.

[ChadTower]

MaximRecoil, if you're going to be a tool at least prove that that photo is recent.  If it is old then it doesn't fall within the relevant timeframe of now.

Trust me, go anywhere, nearly everyone is fat compared to how they would have been even in 1980. 

[cdbrown]

I don't think posting a picture of a bunch of young people at a party (which looks like it was taken about 20 years ago) would be any indication apart from that all the thin people were at the front of the stage.  A crowd of McD regulars or non-exercise types and the results may be different.

[MaximRecoil]

To you people nitpicking over the pictures, I was using ChadTower's flawed "logic" of "look around". If we are going to do that, we might as well get a better view. Now, you guys obviously have better pictures that show "most" people being "fat" since you didn't like mine, so let's see them.

[ChadTower]

Okay, I'll run with the "look around" concept.  I just took a pic of some women standing around the parking lot by the smokers' spot.

[cdbrown]

you may want to gouge your eyse out though

http://images.google.co.uk/images?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-GB%3Aofficial_s&q=fat+people&hl=en&btnG=Search+Images

[MaximRecoil]

Brilliant. Allow me to quote myself:

and make it a random picture, not a Weight Watchers' meeting or something like that.

I like your Google search terms there Cdbrown, "fat people". Try "skinny people" next to get another irrelevant result. Then try searching for "midgets" to show that most Americans are midgets...

[ChadTower]

He DID try skinny people but they were all hidden behind the fat people.

[shardian]

Well, recently I did dig out the old dance pad for the playstation. I do go to the YMCA every once in a while, but when we go, it ends up taking up our whole evening.
I have tried going to the YMCA before work, but I am not a morning person and can barely wake up in time to go to work.

[Vigo]

Chad, you blocked out the wrong part of the photo



Ahh, thats better

[ChadTower]

 

[MaximRecoil]

Anyway, the statistical relevance of "look around" is practically nill. That is why statisticians and epidemiologists go a bit beyond that in their line of work. First of all, what you see when looking around is hardly a representative sample of Americans, and secondly, I don't see anyone posting any detailed data on the localized samples that they do come in contact with day to day.

In short, if there are no real statistics with any semblance of validity to back up your assertion that "most" Americans are fat; the "look around" "statistics" that you then pull out of your hind quarters are not going to cut the mustard either.

[Vigo]

If you believe in statistics more than your own common sence, you have serious issues

[thebrownshow]

Who cares if most Americans are fat... bottom line is it's their own fault, not BK's.

[ChadTower]

That's pretty much what we're all trying to get beyond MaximRecoil and head towards.

Personal accountability.  If it went into your mouth, you are responsible, having put it there yourself.

[MaximRecoil]

If you believe in statistics more than your own common sence, you have serious issues

You don't read so well do you? First of all, there are no statistics on this matter that are even remotely valid, so which statistics do you think I am believing?

Secondly, it is obvious that you have jumped on the "most Americans are fat" bandwagon, not because of your own personal research (if you have any personal research, let's see the data), but because of the crap post-1997 statistics that are floating around that are being trumpeted by media outlets. It is you who are believing [flawed] statistics rather than using "common sense" which should tell you that there is no relevant data on the subject, which is prerequisite to forming a conclusion. 

Third, I'll quote myself again:

I look around and most people I see are not fat.

Now, in the manner that you are using the term "common sense", the obvious conclusion is that most Americans are not "fat", right? Of course, that is an extremely simplistic and innaccurate approach, just like your claim that 3 out of 5 Americans are fat when you look around (a claim that I find highly improbable) and it has lead you to believe that most Americans are fat.

[MaximRecoil]

That's pretty much what we're all trying to get beyond MaximRecoil and head towards.

Why do you think that unsubstantiated claims ("most Americans are fat") should go unchallenged?

Personal accountability.  If it went into your mouth, you are responsible, having put it there yourself.

I already said that in so many words:

Is Burger King trying to kill us?

Oh, of course they are. I can't tell you the number of times that Burger King employees have held a gun to my head and forced me to eat there.

[Vigo]

okok, lets settle this...Calling all BYOAC members who are old enough to remember the 60's...

Question: Are Americans much fatter today than 50 years ago?

Let the proof be in the pudding.

[ChadTower]

Someone ate the pudding.

[Vigo]

First my walmart bread won't mold, now no pudding!!!! ITS A CONSPIRACY

[thebrownshow]

I'm starting to get the feeling that someone's in denial about their own weight or something, because I really can't think of any other good reason for arguing about the fatness of America on the Internet...

Can we get back to discussing how delightful a burger with three patties and three pieces of cheese is... plus BACON?

[Vigo]

God, I think I'm going to have that for lunch.

p.s. You can get it with four of everything

[pointdablame]

God, I think I'm going to have that for lunch.

p.s. You can get it with four of everything

I'm going to buy two of them and stack them together.

[MaximRecoil]

I'm starting to get the feeling that someone's in denial about their own weight or something, because I really can't think of any other good reason for arguing about the fatness of America on the Internet...

Are you referring to me?

LOL

You should call the crystal ball repairman.

But anyway, follow the money. This issue is very political and it is based on a farce.

[ChadTower]

Fat people are usually very lazy and very lazy people don't vote.

[thebrownshow]

But anyway, follow the money. This issue is very political and it is based on a farce.

I finally come out of P&R and I end up posting in a thread that is apparently political.  Figures.

[Zakk]

I do like the sound of 8 pieces of bacon, but MAN, that sounds like a whole lot of crap.

As for pop, I drink regular, cuz I too read the horror stories of cancer-ridden lab rats.  Plus, they once told us to use saccahrine (sp) in our coffe and tea.  That stuff killed my fish, my kittens and my grandparents!

Gimme gold ole sugar any day.  God bless bacon, and Dr. Pepper.

[Vigo]

*cracks open a can of coke classic

  To our health!

[SithMaster]

Lets look not at how bad the burger is for you (nothing is anymore) but at how gay their ad campaign is.  when i walk inside a burger king for some reason the sign "we manage your meat"  doesnt come off right.

enjoy that one.

[thebrownshow]

Would it be gay if the BK staff was full of chicks?

[ChadTower]

Dude I LOVE the Stackers' Union commercials.

[cdbrown]

i just had 6 pints of beer and 2 big macs and 1 quarter pounder with cheese - I feel quite full and happy, although tomorrow I'm sure my heart will be trying to pump blood around my clogged veins harder than ever.   Ahh the life.

[USSEnterprise]

The BK stacker is GOD! I love it. I'm also 280 pounds, but I still love it!

[SirPeale]

How many people will order a Quad Stacker, King sized, with a Coke?  To satisfy anyone's curiosity, that's 1990 calories, 207 carbs, 101 total grams of fat (38 saturated, 10 trans) 2800 milligrams of sodium, and 240 milligrams of cholesterol.

What part of that is trans fat?  Trans fat only comes from hydrogenated oils.

[Chris]

Bun?  Aren't there trans fats in the bun?

[Vigo]

AAH! THE BUN WON'T MOLD!!! WHY?

[n3rrd]

That burger looks delicious! I want one!

Your posts are always so concise, I love it.  Haha... that is all.  Oh, but... go burgers! 

[SirPeale]

Bun?  Aren't there trans fats in the bun?

I doubt it, and if so, it's got to be negligible.

I'm thinking it's the fries.

[Howard_Casto]

From where I see it BK is holding strong by not caving in while the other restaurants are chicken. 

See here's the whole deal on this "healthier choices" trend.... they were forced into it.  See this guy from my home state made a documentary called "Super-Size Me!" documenting the detrimental health effects of Mc-Donalds.  The flick caught on to the point that the federal health board started looking into it and McD's in particular got a TON of bad press.  Since McD's knew that the feds would make em anyway they decided to come out with a lien of healthy choices.  Their competitors played copycat and quickly followed suit.  Also the restaurants cut back on portions as well.

The thing is most of these "healthy choices" are cheaper for the places to make and yet we still pay the same price as if we were getting the standard combo.  Also while the portion sizes of the food have went down, the price has not.  So yeah they are great humanitarians by charging us 6 bucks for a super-sized meal that is actually the size of what used to be a large.

Also the argument is irrelevant in the particular case of McDonald's as all of their food, even the healthy choices are virtually inedible.  There isn't a real product on the entire menu.  Most are conglomerated pastes made of the waste material of the real cuts of beef or chicken. Also they are very bad about putting unhealthy artificial flavoring in their foods. The fries aren't even real potatoes!  They have some potato in em, but that is about it.  Their healthy choices aren't  healthy either.  They have less fat, but they also have the artificial flavoring and preservatives in them, making them too unhealthy to compensate for any nutritional value they might have. 

And on a personal note, McDonald's food is inedible, you guys (and by you guys I mean a large population of the world) must be addicted because nearly every item they have takes like crap.  I used to eat McD's a LOT when I was a kid but by the time I was 8 I got over it and never ate there again, aside from occasionally forcing myself when someone else with wants to eat there.  You only realize how utterly awful their food is when you stop eating it for a while and then try to eat it again. 

And don't misunderstand, I eat a LOT of fast food, but the difference between McD's and virtually any of the other joints is the difference between a prime rib steak and steak-flavored dog food.

Getting back on topic......

Wendy's has healthier food because they don't do all of that.  It's more fattening but that doesn't make it unhealthy.  Also they are very sparring on the artificial flavors and preservatives.  I think they use a little on the chicken sandwiches, but that's it.  Although since Dave Thomas died, the menu has really went down hill, mostly due to the fact that the menu actually changes now.  See Dave learned from the best (Mr. Sanders) and he knew that if you keep the menu simple then you can buy in bulk, which allows you to make a higher quality product for a cheaper price and you can strictly control the preparation and cooking process, thus making every meal taste good and consistant.  He'd literally be rolling over in his grave if he knew of these 30 some odd menu additions over the past few years. 

Now we get to Burger king.... they use the highest quality of meat, use all natural chicken, and fries cooked in peanut oil.  Also they are the only company that didn't make their portions smaller, meaning you actually get 6 bucks worth of food.  They have healthy choices too, but they have had them for a long time, and unlike the others they aren't trying to get good p.r. by blabbing about it in all their commercials. 

Don't confuse fattening foods as being unhealthy.  Unhealthy foods are unhealthy, fattening foods are fine, you just shouldn't eat a lot of them (duh!).  This recent trend of making sure everything is low fat and this trans-fat b.s. is media propaganda.  The danger in today's food isn't how fat it is, it's how fake it is.  The fake-ness also makes the food taste unnaturally good, which means we eat more, which means we get fatter than we normally would.  And of course the chemicals are very bad for your health causing side-effects too numerious to mention, the primary ones being liver and kidney problems.

With that being said, the reason you and your kid are fat aren't because the fast food industry is evil and intentionally want to hurt you (they probably are but regardless), it is because you don't have enough self-control to keep from eating at these places constantly.   

Finally I'd like to add that apple squares and salads for lunch are for girls.  I'm not a rabbit or else I wouldn't have these nice canines up front.  We are omnivores people, we eat everything... just don't go crazy.

[ChadTower]

Dude, ANYTHING with 100+ grams of fat is bad for you.

And Peale, I'm betting there is trans fat in the fake cheese and bacon.

[SirPeale]

Dude, ANYTHING with 100+ grams of fat is bad for you.

And Peale, I'm betting there is trans fat in the fake cheese and bacon.

*only* if they use hydrogenated oils in the process.  Bacon doesn't have it, neither does cheese.

[ChadTower]

Yeah but they don't use cheese.  They use "cheese food".  And I would bet the bacon is at least half synthetic.

[MaximRecoil]

Dude, ANYTHING with 100+ grams of fat is bad for you.

Fat is food ("food" being defined here as any substance which humans can metabolize for energy, i.e. fat, protein or carbohydrates). Food by definition is not "bad for you". Now, the lack of food ... that is demonstrably "bad for you" in that it will prove fatal within a relatively short amount of time with no exceptions.

Out of the 3 nutrients which humans can metabolize for energy, fat is the best energy source. It has over twice the energy of protein or carbohydrates (9 Calories per gram for fat vs. 4 Calories per gram for protein or carbohydrates). Calories are a measurement of energy. Energy is a good thing. Without energy we die.

[Vigo]

Yep, calling something bad for you because of how fat it is is relative to your diet.

People get fat because they have too many carbohydrates, and as a survival mechanism, our body stores extra carbs as bodyfat rather than pooing them out. When we don't have enough energy in our bodies, we pull from that reserve.

[thebrownshow]

You can eat what you want, as long as you burn it off.  Now cholesterol and other things are going to be a factor as far as your overall health is concerned, but weight gain is a simple matter of calories in vs. calories burned.  Or as I like to call it, the Sit-On- vs. Get-Off-Your-Ass ratio.

[ChadTower]

Fat is food ("food" being defined here as any substance which humans can metabolize for energy, i.e. fat, protein or carbohydrates).

I didn't say fat is bad for you.  I said 100grams of fat is bad for you.  It is horribly excessive and out of balance with what your body needs.  Any of the three major dietary elements (fat, protein, carbs) in excess is bad for you, with fat being the most damaging of the three.

100 grams of fat in a single meal is bad.  Pure and simple.  Doesn't matter if you add protein and carbs to balance it.  If you did that you would simply be making two days' worth of food into a single meal.

[MaximRecoil]

Yeah but they don't use cheese.  They use "cheese food".  And I would bet the bacon is at least half synthetic.

They use American Cheese. All "American Cheese" would technically be categorized as "cheese food" (process cheese), but I don't think that is going to change the tradition of Americans using it on cheeseburgers, whether making them at home or eating out. Anyway, here are the ingredients for Burger King's American Cheese:

American Cheese Slice

Cultured Milk, Water, Cream, Sodium Citrate, Salt, Sorbic Acid (Preservative), Sodium Phosphate, Artificial Colors, Enzymes, Acetic Acid, Lecithin. Artificial Colors may consist of one or more of the following: Annatto Extract, Beta-Apo-8'-Carotenal, Beta-Carotene, Canthaxanthin, Paprika Oleoresin, Tumeric Oleoresin.  Contains Milk and Soy Lecithin.

You would lose the bet about their bacon:

Bacon

Fully Cooked Bacon. Cured with Water, Salt, Sugar, Smoke Flavoring, Sodium Phosphate, Sodium Erythorbate, Sodium Nitrite.

[Daniel270]

I don't think McD's ever lied that their food was fattening.....  otherwise, Grimace would've been skinnier......

[ChadTower]

I have stood in front of a case of their "bacon".  I don't care what their website says.  It is not real.  It is closer to plywood than meat.

[Howard_Casto]

Fat is food ("food" being defined here as any substance which humans can metabolize for energy, i.e. fat, protein or carbohydrates).

I didn't say fat is bad for you.  I said 100grams of fat is bad for you.  It is horribly excessive and out of balance with what your body needs.  Any of the three major dietary elements (fat, protein, carbs) in excess is bad for you, with fat being the most damaging of the three.

100 grams of fat in a single meal is bad.  Pure and simple.  Doesn't matter if you add protein and carbs to balance it.  If you did that you would simply be making two days' worth of food into a single meal.

No offense but that's the biggest load I've ever heard of.  Your required fat intake greatly varies depending upon your body type, lifestyle and metabolism.  Personally I could eat 100 grams without batting an eye, and I'm not some horribly obese freak and my cholesterol and blood pressure are perfect.  

[MaximRecoil]

Fat is food ("food" being defined here as any substance which humans can metabolize for energy, i.e. fat, protein or carbohydrates).

I didn't say fat is bad for you.  I said 100grams of fat is bad for you.  It is horribly excessive and out of balance with what your body needs.  Any of the three major dietary elements (fat, protein, carbs) in excess is bad for you, with fat being the most damaging of the three.

100 grams of fat in a single meal is bad.  Pure and simple.  Doesn't matter if you add protein and carbs to balance it.  If you did that you would simply be making two days' worth of food into a single meal.

There are far too many variables to make a blanket statement like - "100 grams of fat in a single meal is bad." For example, I can and often do eat 100 grams of fat in a single meal. I don't gain weight no matter how much I eat; I never have and I doubt I ever will. The result of my last physical was all normal. I generally eat twice a day, each meal usually being between 1000 and 1500 Calories, sometimes up to 2000 Calories. The food I eat always has plenty of fat, such as Hamburger Helper, Pepperoni Pizza, Macaroni and Cheese w/hotdogs, etc. If I am active all day I eat 3 times.

Anyway, the point is, your claim doesn't apply to me in any demonstrable, tangible way and it is a safe bet that I am in no way biologically unique.

[Howard_Casto]

Talk about everyone being online at once.... I think there were like 8 replies in the last 5 minutes. 

[MaximRecoil]

I have stood in front of a case of their "bacon".  I don't care what their website says.  It is not real.  It is closer to plywood than meat.

You have nothing to stand on with this claim. Do you really think that a massive worldwide corporation would risk the legal and PR consequenses of a fraudulent ingredient list for one of their products?

[ChadTower]

Gee, you'd think a little common sense would be enough.  I don't need to stand on anything.  This is the innernets.

So, you only want verified, tangible, innernets published facts when it suits you... and yet you just used a real world common sense observation about your own metabolism.

All you managed to support is that every human being is unique.  Gee, no one has ever thought of that before.

100 grams of fat in a single meal is bad.  Simple fact.  Worse for some people than for others but it is never good and rarely if ever a nonfactor.

[MaximRecoil]

Gee, you'd think a little common sense would be enough.  I don't need to stand on anything.  This is the innernets.

Common sense? How is this for common sense? A giant worldwide corporation with its team of lawyers and consultants would not risk the legal and PR disaster of publishing a fraudulent ingredient list for their bacon considering they could be busted by any high school chemistry student.

Secondly, what you are talking about is a previously unknown product, i.e. a hybrid natural/synthetic which has not been "chopped and formed" -- bacon strip. So we are to believe that Burger King spent all the money on R&D to come up with something like this (assuming it is even possible to create such a thing while still retaining the natural structure of pork and fat), for unknown reasons, and with a cost likely exceeding that of simply using ordinary bacon which is readily available.

So, you only want verified, tangible, innernets published facts when it suits you... and yet you just used a real world common sense observation about your own metabolism.

The observation about my own metabolism is a verifiable exception to your supposed "rule". The fact that I am an exception means that there will be plenty of other exceptions among the 6.5 billion other people on Earth. That means that your "rule" is not a rule at all -- but rather it is a ChadTower hunch, much like your "analysis" of Burger King's bacon.

100 grams of fat in a single meal is bad.  Simple fact.  Worse for some people than for others but it is never good and rarely if ever a nonfactor.

Not a "fact" at all. If I eat 100 grams of fat in a single meal, which test would you use to show me the damage?

[Howard_Casto]

100 grams of fat in a single meal is bad.  Simple fact.  Worse for some people than for others but it is never good and rarely if ever a nonfactor.

Ok I was nice before but let me be blunt.  I eat somewhere around the range of 250-300 grams of fat a day.  I am a average sized man... if I didn't eat that much I'd fall over from weakness.  Just because YOU can't eat that much doesn't mean the rest of the world can't.  

About the bacon thing... I'm sure it is technically bacon. Technically chicken McNuggets are chicken, but if you understand the process in which they are made you understand that the only difference between mcnuggets and particle board is that one is mostly glue with some left over wood scraps and the other is mostly glue with some left over chicken scraps.

[fredster]

Hey, I remember the 60's. I can't remember for sure, but people are fatter now it seems to me.

I'm 45. I run and work out on a fairly regular basis. I'm hovering over the government's standards by a few lbs. I was into the standards for a while and really felt like weak and wimpy. I like to have a little extra lbs to get the mo going anyway.

Fast food is all the same to me. If I'm hungry, I'll eat any of it. (I don't remember what I don't eat, just stuff that moves around too fast)

I laugh at people who blame resturants for weight problems. Hell, they are open 24/7 and so is their refrigerators. If you think they are wrong, then don't eat.

It's like blaming a gas station for your car engine blowing up.

Who the hell has the right to tell a business like Wendys or McDonalds to simply re-do their business model? You have the right NOT to walk into a store, and that's your vote. McDonalds wouldn't have made those salads unless they thought they could sell them.

That's why they don't sell soy milk and switched to Sweet Tea here in the south.

They would sell beer if they got a licence (they do overseas).

So vote with your dollar if you don't like Fast food. If someone thinks eating fast food all the time is okay, let 'em.  We wasted our tax dollars on their education anyway.

[shardian]

A note: Even skinny people can get congestive heart failure and have ridiculously high cholestorol. Later in life, eating whatever you want wil catch up to you.

On a side note, I sure wish I was one of the skinny people who can eat anything...

[ChadTower]

I believe I've proven my point. 

[hypernova]

What part of that is trans fat?  Trans fat only comes from hydrogenated oils.

There's .5 in the cheese slices (total), and 2 in the patties (.5 each patty), and then 7 more in the fries.

I'm not so sure the public is going to completely embrace this sandwich.  Part of my point was that it's been introduced in such a time where everyone's concerned about America's weight problems.  I'm not so sure this sandwich will stay on for very long.

And of course, I wasn't blaming BK, or anyone else for that matter.  I was just confused because of all these artery clogging, heart attack foods they've been introducing.  It's a step in the opposite direction compared to everyone else.

And they have a veggie burger?  Oh, that's right, all those advertisements.   [/sarcasm]  (Not towards you Mike!)
Everyone check their local BK menu, both drive-thru and walk-in!  I'm curious to know if it's on those particular menus?  Or is it something you're just supposed to know that they have, but it's not actually listed?  (Like the McD's double/triple ham/cheeseburgers used to be years ago.)

Certainly didn't expect 90 replies that fast.  Or 90 replies at all.

[MaximRecoil]

LOL @ "trans fat" BTW.

Who cared about "trans fat" a few years ago? Now people care; and why? Because they heard about it on the T and the V? As if any new and important discoveries are being made these days in the strange and mysterious world of ... nutrition. If "trans fat" wasn't a big enough deal to have been blabbed about all over the TV and singled out on nutrition labels in say, 1980 or 1990 or 2000, then it is not a big deal now.

Oh, but it is a hell of a marketing angle for Lay's potato chips (among many other products). "0 grams Trans Fat" they now boast. Didn't "No Cholesterol" used to be their schtick? I guess that is "passe" now. "Step aside Cholesterol! Move over generic Fat! There's a new guy in town!"

A few years ago, no one's packaging said anything about "Trans Fat". Why not? Because no one cared. But, someone dove down into the deep, dark and hidden mystery known as ... nutrition ... and when they surfaced they had a fistful of "Trans Fat"; and when the folks with all of their existing products scrambled to see if their stuff had the lastest health scare buzzword that the busybodies had conjured from that wild and unexplored frontier known as ... nutrition ... there was much rejoicing at the new free marketing tool that had been handed to them; well, free aside from the new package design that proudly boasts "0 grams Trans Fat"; you know; none of that stuff that we know is evil, because Mike Wallace told us so.

[ChadTower]

BK fries - now 100% placenta free!

[sez]

BK fries - now 100% placenta free!

I prefer the term "box jellyfish".

[ChadTower]

It's the egg yolk.

[ashley]

MMMMMM fat goooood! OOOOOOOOH donuts.

[Vigo]

I found a buy one get one free quad stacker coupon and used it today. I ate over 4 hours ago and I still feel full. I'm sick of them right now, but I'll probably wan't more in a couple weeks.

Oh, and somebody made a point about cholestorladdsadsl. Yeah, they got those free checker things everywhere. Its a good idea to use them.

Hey hypernova, you should have posted this topic in P+R. 

[thebrownshow]

Holy crap, you ate TWO QUADS?

 

[Vigo]

yes, it is now been 11 hours since then, and I am still full....

[NightGod]

LOL I bet you are.

That said, considering the way my body digests meat and cheese (reminants of my old Atkin's days), I could probably eat two quads for lunch and still eat a normal dinner.

[SirPeale]

LOL @ "trans fat" BTW.

Who cared about "trans fat" a few years ago? Now people care; and why? Because they heard about it on the T and the V? As if any new and important discoveries are being made these days in the strange and mysterious world of ... nutrition. If "trans fat" wasn't a big enough deal to have been blabbed about all over the TV and singled out on nutrition labels in say, 1980 or 1990 or 2000, then it is not a big deal now.

LOL @ "lead" BTW.

Who cared about "lead" a few years ago? Now people care; and why? Because they heard about it on the T and the V? As if any new and important discoveries are being made these days in the strange and mysterious world of ... toxic substances. If "lead" wasn't a big enough deal to have been blabbed about all over the TV and singled out in say, 1980 or 1990 or 2000, then it is not a big deal now.



This statement just *screams* ignorance.  Do you even know how hydrogenated oils are treated inside your body?

And hydrogenated oils are 100% man-made.  They use them because they're cheap.  There are better solutions available, but because they cost far less to use, they'll use this substance that, over time, will have a heavy negative impact on your body.

[Vigo]

Yep, we put crap into our foods before we even understand what it does to the human body. Only when they have enough evidence of long term dangers will they ban the use of a man-made substance put into food. and thats only if enough research is ever done.

[MaximRecoil]

LOL @ "trans fat" BTW.

Who cared about "trans fat" a few years ago? Now people care; and why? Because they heard about it on the T and the V? As if any new and important discoveries are being made these days in the strange and mysterious world of ... nutrition. If "trans fat" wasn't a big enough deal to have been blabbed about all over the TV and singled out on nutrition labels in say, 1980 or 1990 or 2000, then it is not a big deal now.

LOL @ "lead" BTW.

Who cared about "lead" a few years ago? Now people care; and why? Because they heard about it on the T and the V? As if any new and important discoveries are being made these days in the strange and mysterious world of ... toxic substances. If "lead" wasn't a big enough deal to have been blabbed about all over the TV and singled out in say, 1980 or 1990 or 2000, then it is not a big deal now.



This statement just *screams* ignorance.  Do you even know how hydrogenated oils are treated inside your body?

And hydrogenated oils are 100% man-made.  They use them because they're cheap.  There are better solutions available, but because they cost far less to use, they'll use this substance that, over time, will have a heavy negative impact on your body.

Your analogy is ridiculous.

If one injests lead, the damage can be established.

If I eat French Fries, show me the damage.

And I think you'll find that the term "lead poisoning" dates back hundreds, if not thousands of years.

Oh, and there is no such thing as a "100% man-made" vegetable oil.

Busybody Do-Gooder long term wild guesses mean nothing to me.

This is far more a political issue than it is a health issue.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&rls=GGLG%2CGGLG%3A2006-13%2CGGLG%3Aen&q=trans+fat+law

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&rls=GGLG%2CGGLG%3A2006-13%2CGGLG%3Aen&q=trans+fat+legislation

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&rls=GGLG%2CGGLG%3A2006-13%2CGGLG%3Aen&q=obesity+legislation

Follow the money. Politics = big business.

Now excuse me while I call the Poison Control Center. I just ate some margarine and I might be on death's door!

[thebrownshow]

I think MaximRecoil works in a Crisco factory and is worried about his job.  You sound like a Tabacco company CEO.

"Blah blah blah, it's not really bad for you, it's all politics, I ignore facts..." 

[ChadTower]

It is good that he now sees it our way.

[MaximRecoil]

"Blah blah blah, it's not really bad for you, it's all politics, I ignore facts..."  

Where are your facts? I want a "Trans Fat Damage Detection Test

[ChadTower]

Marlboro couldn't have said it better themselves.

[thebrownshow]

I don't even know what the hell you're arguing about at this point.   

[ChadTower]

Nor does anyone care.

[MaximRecoil]

Marlboro couldn't have said it better themselves.

Nor does anyone care.

Nice non sequitur. Do you ever tire of throwing your paper cups from the sidelines?

[ChadTower]

That's not my style.  Ask someone who knows me.

[NightGod]

Yeah (Xenical) there's (Splenda) nothing (Nutrasweet) new (hamburger isn't a diet food?) in (Fen Phen causes heart attacks?) the (free radicals? You mean like Che Guevera?) world (what are anti-oxidants?) of nutrition (Olean). It's stayed the exact same for the last 50 years.

Trans-fat is called a risk factor-there has been a higher incidence of heart disease in those who have high amounts of trans-fat in their diets. Studies like these take decades and thousands of participants to perform. Further studies based on those findings are then done in more controled situations and have consistantly backed the findings.

Does this mean that *every* person who eats a large amount of trans-fats will have heart disease? No, of course not. Just like there are smokers who smoke two packs a day from age 14 and live to be 105 when they die of kidney failure. It's an overall statistical trend.

Personally, I'd rather stop eatting as much margarine and cook with olive oil if it means a 10% statistical reduction in my overall risk of heart disease.

[pointdablame]

Oh will all of you just stop your bitching and go eat a quad stacker.


 

[shardian]

I can't believe I waste precious minutes of my life reading this thread...

[NightGod]

Oh will all of you just stop your bitching and go eat a quad stacker.
 

I got my 2-for-1 coupon in the mail today-I know what I'm having for dinner!!

[ChadTower]

Don't eat the coupon, dude. 

[thebrownshow]

Oh please, chad.  I have yet to see evidence that eating coupons is bad for you.  It's all politics.  Show me some proof.

[ChadTower]

I once got a paper cut on my tongue.

[thebrownshow]

Where are your facts? I want a "Coupon Damage Detection Test

[ChadTower]

 

[MaximRecoil]

Where are your facts? I want a "Coupon Damage Detection Test

[ChadTower]

It will be bad for you if the paper is coated in hydrogenated oils.

[thebrownshow]

See that's just the thing, if it appears as if I'm lacking an argument it's because I'm not arguing!  I don't even know what/who you're arguing wth at this point.  Holy hell... MaximRecoil, relax man, I'm just messing with ya.  Maybe we've discovered another side-effect of trans-fats... it destroys your ability to take a joke

[ChadTower]

But it may lube his ability to take less funny things.

[jbox]

Be afraid, be very afraid...

[somunny]

 cut the mustard in an argument.

Appropriately misstated given the subject matter. 

[ChadTower]

Mustard is high in lead.

[SithMaster]

I tried a quad and it was okay.  yummy but the bacon was sweet and wasnt crispy.  i like crispy bacon.  that and i dont recall any ketchup on it which was lame.  and i had a diet coke to balance it all out.

that comic pic was good.  KGB lol thats the russian cia correct?  lol.

[NightGod]

In communist Russia, Burger Comrade Quad eat YOU!!

[Dartful Dodger]

I was going to post some nonsense in this thread, but I see there are 4 pages of nonsense, so I'm just going to ignore it instead.

[ChadTower]

In communist Russia, Burger Comrade Quad eat YOU!!

 

[SirPeale]

Your analogy is ridiculous.

If one injests lead, the damage can be established.

The analogy is sound.  Sure, lead damage has been 'known' about for a while.  Ben Franklin wrote about a connection between painters and a crippling effect they had later in their lives, attributing it to the paint they were ingesting.  Yes that's right...ingesting.  To make sure they had enough lead in the paint they'd taste it.

But it's only within the last twenty years (1987) that lead has gained as much attention as it has.  Lead paint is still available, but only for industrial applications.  It's been banned for household use since then.

If I eat French Fries, show me the damage.

Unlike lead, trans fats are not a directly damaging substance.  What happens is your body converts hydrogenated oils directly into cholesterol, which in turn begin depositing themselves on your arteries.  Will eating a little of it hurt you?  Unlikely.  Eating a lot certainly *will*, however.  Hence the link to heart disease.

Oh, and there is no such thing as a "100% man-made" vegetable oil.

Okay, that was a goof.  They take straight vegetable oil and add hydrogen to it.

Busybody Do-Gooder long term wild guesses mean nothing to me.

This is far more a political issue than it is a health issue.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&rls=GGLG%2CGGLG%3A2006-13%2CGGLG%3Aen&q=trans+fat+law

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&rls=GGLG%2CGGLG%3A2006-13%2CGGLG%3Aen&q=trans+fat+legislation

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&rls=GGLG%2CGGLG%3A2006-13%2CGGLG%3Aen&q=obesity+legislation

Follow the money. Politics = big business.

Now excuse me while I call the Poison Control Center. I just ate some margarine and I might be on death's door!

*shrug* it's your body.

[ChadTower]

*shrug* it's your body.

DING DING DING DING DING

Let this guy do what he wants.  None of us will remember him when he dies at 48.

[MaximRecoil]

The analogy is sound.  Sure, lead damage has been 'known' about for a while.  Ben Franklin wrote about a connection between painters and a crippling effect they had later in their lives, attributing it to the paint they were ingesting.  Yes that's right...ingesting.  To make sure they had enough lead in the paint they'd taste it.

But it's only within the last twenty years (1987) that lead has gained as much attention as it has.  Lead paint is still available, but only for industrial applications.  It's been banned for household use since then.

The analogy is not sound for the reasons I stated above. The rest of your text here is fine, though it did nothing to establish the validity of your analogy.

Unlike lead, trans fats are not a directly damaging substance.  What happens is your body converts hydrogenated oils directly into cholesterol, which in turn begin depositing themselves on your arteries.  Will eating a little of it hurt you?  Unlikely.  Eating a lot certainly *will*, however.  Hence the link to heart disease.

It is a crap shoot. There are people who eat these "bad" foods indiscriminately for all of their lives and outlive people who don't. With a real 1:1 correlation we could say something along the lines of "given X quantity of trans fat consumed, person A will develop heart disease within Y amount of time." There is a problem with that though; namely the people who eat the "bad" foods all of their lives and do not develop heart disease, but rather they die of "old age". Saying that something is "bad" is not an accurate statement if it does not apply to everyone, every time.

[NightGod]

There is a problem with that though; namely the people who eat the "bad" foods all of their lives and do not develop heart disease, but rather they die of "old age". Saying that something is "bad" is not an accurate statement if it does not apply to everyone, every time.

So cigarettes aren't bad then? There are people who smoke multiple packs a day for their entire lives and never get lung cancer. Playing Russian Roulette must be OK, too, since that only kills one out of every six times. Guess this also means I can stop wearing my seat belts and they should stop selling motorcycle and bicycle helmets.

What a rediculous statement.

[MaximRecoil]

*shrug* it's your body.

DING DING DING DING DING

Let this guy do what he wants.  None of us will remember him when he dies at 48.

Longevity runs in my family.

Let's see ... Genetics vs. Chad "The Soothsayer" Tower's prediction ...

I'll have to say that genetics wins by default.

I don't mean to take away from your brilliant cold-reading parlor trick though!

[MaximRecoil]

There is a problem with that though; namely the people who eat the "bad" foods all of their lives and do not develop heart disease, but rather they die of "old age". Saying that something is "bad" is not an accurate statement if it does not apply to everyone, every time.

So cigarettes aren't bad then? There are people who smoke multiple packs a day for their entire lives and never get lung cancer.

There is no such thing as "death by cigarette". Smoking may increase the likelihood of certain ailments, or it may not, as you have pointed out.

Playing Russian Roulette must be OK, too, since that only kills one out of every six times.

Being shot in the head is bad. Not being shot in the head is not bad. It is not rocket science. The game itself is a foolish one, given the 1 in 6 chance of instant death, and is not even roughly analogous to eating "bad" foods.

Guess this also means I can stop wearing my seat belts and they should stop selling motorcycle and bicycle helmets.

You can do whatever you want to. It is when you or the government want to force other people to play the odds in the manner that you or they approve of -- that is what I take issue with.

[SirPeale]

There is no such thing as "death by cigarette". Smoking may increase the likelihood of certain ailments, or it may not, as you have pointed out.

...

...

...

I'm not touching this with a ten foot pole, and Chad holding it.

[thebrownshow]

Well, if smoking isn't bad for you, and if trans-fats aren't bad for you... I wonder what the long-term health effects are for people who argue on the internet.

[MaximRecoil]

Well, if smoking isn't bad for you, and if trans-fats aren't bad for you... I wonder what the long-term health effects are for people who argue on the internet.

Or for people who construct strawman fallacies ...

[NightGod]

There is no such thing as "death by cigarette". Smoking may increase the likelihood of certain ailments, or it may not, as you have pointed out.

And you've FINALLY made my point for me-thank you!

See...trans-fats do the exact same thing, they can increase the likelyhood of certain ailments, or may not.

How is informing people of these risk factors and requiring companies to present the information on their packaging in a way that allows people who choose to respond to those risk factors to make an informed decision be a bad thing? I see the listing of the amount of trans-fats in a product on the label as analgous to listing the amount of Sodium or Carbohydrates. Noone is calling for a world-wide ban on trans-fats, they're calling for informational packaging.

[MaximRecoil]

And you've FINALLY made my point for me-thank you!

See...trans-fats do the exact same thing, they can increase the likelyhood of certain ailments, or may not.

Of course. But, maybe you haven't really been following along. I am arguing with people who are declaring trans fat to be universally "bad", across the board; despite the fact that there are people who have never or will never experience any negative effects from it.

How is informing people of these risk factors and requiring companies to present the information on their packaging in a way that allows people who choose to respond to those risk factors to make an informed decision be a bad thing?

It is not a bad thing, though with the suddenness that this burst onto the scene this late in the game; I am more than a little cynical regarding the motives. And, as usual, there is the generous helping of not-so-hard "science" accompanying this latest "health scare".

Noone is calling for a world-wide ban on trans-fats, they're calling for informational packaging.

You are wrong.

Canadian Government Trans Fat Task Force
recommends regulations to limit
partially hydrogenated oils

Canadian food industry
supports recommendations

http://www.bantransfats.com/

Chicago Weighs New Prohibition: Bad-for-You Fats

http://travel2.nytimes.com/2006/07/18/us/18chicago.html

Lawsuit Targets Trans Fat at KFC

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=62493

[NightGod]

Canadian Government Trans Fat Task Force
recommends regulations to limit
partially hydrogenated oils

Canadian food industry
supports recommendations

http://www.bantransfats.com/

Limitation, not banning.

Chicago Weighs New Prohibition: Bad-for-You Fats

http://travel2.nytimes.com/2006/07/18/us/18chicago.html

Most people, including the mayor of Chicago, think this is a bit nuts.

Lawsuit Targets Trans Fat at KFC

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=62493

Filing a lawsuit is different than calling for a ban. Besides, all that lawsuit is seeking is informational packaging.

And just because some people do not experience deletarious effects from something does not mean that it ceases to be bad, it just means that they are immune to it's effects. Is smallpox any less of a "bad" disease simply because the majority of the world is immune to it? No, it just means it is less dangerous-that still does not make it into a good thing.

[jbox]

Well, if smoking isn't bad for you, and if trans-fats aren't bad for you... I wonder what the long-term health effects are for people who argue on the internet.

[NightGod]

Hye Jbox, since you're the self-proclaimed Star Wars expert here, answer a question that came up in another forum for me. What prevents a Jedi from just shutting off the lightsaber of an opponent during a fight?

I personally thought it had something to do with needing the Force to use on in the first place, so the saber would constantly be 'in tune' with the Jedi who was weilding it, but then someone else pointed out the whole "Han Solo cuts open an tuantuan on Hoth" thing, which pretty much blew my idea out of the water (unless you just say George made a continuity error, not totally outside the realm of reason).

/thread hijack

[jbox]

Nothing. Some Jedi Masters have been able to drain the power cell for an opponents lightsaber, and sometimes you can knock it out of their hand if their grip is loose enough. The issue is how strong in the force you are, since the concentration required to manipulate parts that small needs to take less effort from you in the grand scheme of things then it takes your opponent to cut your head off while you are distracted with trying to zap their saber.

It's like how kung fu movies show people's guns being snatched from their hands, it's just that it's not going to be anywhere near that easy to pull that trick off against another kung fu master. 

[NightGod]

OK then, why didn't Darth just snatch the saber out of Luke's hand in ESB? Luke was NOWHERE near as powerful as Darth at that time and if all he wanted to do was subdue him so he talk him into coming over to the Dark side, I would think that would have been the first thing he did.

I mean, I understand it was an excuse for a really cool battle scene, but really...

[jbox]

Huh? Why did Darth keep fighting Luke, taunting him with his superior skill, making him more exhausted and more pissed off, more angry, less in control of his thoughts and taking him closer and closer to going over to the Dark Side, instead of simply capturing him and talking to him calmly from the other side of prison bars? Let me guess, you also ask why bad guys don't just shoot the hero in the head with a gun ("bam bam, we can do it together like father and son!") and instead try to taunt them into breaking down and turning on their own side..... 

[MaximRecoil]

Limitation, not banning.

I guess you didn't notice the name of the site?

http://bantransfat.com/

BAN TRANS FATS
THE CAMPAIGN TO BAN PARTIALLY HYDROGENATED OILS

Most people, including the mayor of Chicago, think this is a bit nuts.

It is nuts; what of it?

Filing a lawsuit is different than calling for a ban. Besides, all that lawsuit is seeking is informational packaging.

No, CSPI also asked the judge to order KFC to use other types of cooking oils. So yes, that is calling for a ban; specifically a ban on KFC's use of their current cooking oils.

And just because some people do not experience deletarious effects from something does not mean that it ceases to be bad, it just means that they are immune to it's effects. Is smallpox any less of a "bad" disease simply because the majority of the world is immune to it? No, it just means it is less dangerous-that still does not make it into a good thing.

Trans fat has yet to be established to have any "bad" effects on anyone. It is all conjecture and not backed by any real science. There have been no studies which have established a statistically significant correlation between the consumption of trans fat and any "bad" effects.

And no, being exposed to a disease that one is immune to is not a "bad" thing; not that your analogy is even valid in the first place.

[pointdablame]

I had a double stacker yesterday.  It was good.


I asked for extra trans fat too.

[NightGod]

Huh? Why did Darth keep fighting Luke, taunting him with his superior skill, making him more exhausted and more pissed off, more angry, less in control of his thoughts and taking him closer and closer to going over to the Dark Side, instead of simply capturing him and talking to him calmly from the other side of prison bars? Let me guess, you also ask why bad guys don't just shoot the hero in the head with a gun ("bam bam, we can do it together like father and son!") and instead try to taunt them into breaking down and turning on their own side..... 

I didn't say throw him in a prison cell, I just said take away his weapon (which would have made him feel even more powerless in out of control).

I'll respond to MR in a bit, got a Hapkido test I need to prepare for.

[DrewKaree]

I had a double stacker yesterday.  It was good.


I asked for extra trans fat too.

I was going to try one today, but with "Sunday.  SUNDAY! SUNDAY!!!!!! QUOTE WARS GOING ON THAT WILL BLOW. YOUR. MIND!!!!!!! SUNDAY!!!!!!" I was afraid I was going to puke. 

Will someone please post the definition of "picayune" and "obtuse"?

[ChadTower]

I tell you what.  How's about we meet someplace, say halfway in the tween.  I come with a bucket of trans fat.  I'll show you how harmful it can be.  In the tween.

[DrewKaree]

I tell you what.  How's about we meet someplace, say halfway in the tween.  I come with a bucket of trans fat.  I'll show you how harmful it can be.  In the tween.

I look forward to the method you're gonna use to get it into his arteries.

If you can, please get video.  I'm sure we can find some way to host it

[ChadTower]

In the tween.

[sez]

And you've FINALLY made my point for me-thank you!

See...trans-fats do the exact same thing, they can increase the likelyhood of certain ailments, or may not.

Of course. But, maybe you haven't really been following along. I am arguing with people who are declaring trans fat to be universally "bad", across the board; despite the fact that there are people who have never or will never experience any negative effects from it.

How is informing people of these risk factors and requiring companies to present the information on their packaging in a way that allows people who choose to respond to those risk factors to make an informed decision be a bad thing?

It is not a bad thing, though with the suddenness that this burst onto the scene this late in the game; I am more than a little cynical regarding the motives. And, as usual, there is the generous helping of not-so-hard "science" accompanying this latest "health scare".

Noone is calling for a world-wide ban on trans-fats, they're calling for informational packaging.

You are wrong.

Canadian Government Trans Fat Task Force
recommends regulations to limit
partially hydrogenated oils

Canadian food industry
supports recommendations

http://www.bantransfats.com/

Chicago Weighs New Prohibition: Bad-for-You Fats

http://travel2.nytimes.com/2006/07/18/us/18chicago.html

Lawsuit Targets Trans Fat at KFC

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=62493

All this talk about "fats" is making me horny 

[fredster]

All this talk about "fats" is making me horny 

Yep, you have to be nicer to skinny chicks. Don't you hate that?

[ChadTower]

Would this idiotic conversation be easier if someone concluded that yes, Burger King is in fact trying to kill us?

Why is BK so evil for this and yet McDonald's, which has just introduced the Bigger Mac, is not?

[thebrownshow]

Why is BK so evil for this and yet McDonald's, which has just introduced the Bigger Mac, is not?

While the Burger King is a tyranical dictator that has sworn vengenance upon moderation in the American diet, Ronald McDonald better multicultural marketing and a charity that helps children.

[DrewKaree]

Don't forget, he also has teh kewler shoes too!

[SirPeale]

Why is BK so evil for this and yet McDonald's, which has just introduced the Bigger Mac, is not?

Really?

*shudder*

How evil.

[NightGod]

Bigger Mac? I appear to have missed something-my arteries are already begging for leniency!