Monitors galore.. I need help.

[DeathMonk]

I plan on buying an arcade monitor really soon to replace the poopy sansui tv I have in my cab.  I hear a lot of talk about the D9200.  What about other WG monitors or other brands?  I was looking at the 27" K7400 on WG's site, and it seems reasonable.  Has anyone used/seen this monitor?
Are there cheaper places to buy monitors online that any of you know of?
Also, on happs site, their 25" K7400 says it's a replacement for MK and Capcom games (which I mostly play)..  If I went with a different monitor, say, a K7200 for example; would it actually look different (as far as image quality, etc.) goes?  Or is the K7400 just a "replacement" because of the 25" size?

Thanks for the help!

[kspiff]

There are really only a few different types of monitors.. such as standard res, medium res, and.. well.. not sure what the others are, but standard res is used in almost everything.
The K7400 is a straight standard res monitor while the D9200 is more versatile as far as its vert/horiz frequency input range.  I didn't look at the K7200 specs, but would have to assume it is also a regular standard res monitor.
The bottom line between a standard res or digital monitor is what you will be doing with it.. I believe the D9200 -- for instance -- supports higher res non-interlaced display modes -- therefore making Windows and other programs look nicer.  Also, I'm pretty sure that the D9200 would be the optimal choice if you don't use an ArcadeVGA since the 7000-series have a fixed horiz (vert?) freq which most video cards don't support (you could very well even damage the monitor).
When in doubt, read the spec sheets carefully and keep in mind that *almost every* arcade game ever made uses a regular standard res monitor.
Prices?  Sorry, don't know.. but search the threads here as sometimes you can pick up a monitor from a Happ distributor (instead of through the website) and save money.
Hope this helps.

[DeathMonk]

Yes, this does help...  I was doing some studying before you replied and i'm still somewhat confused on what to get..
the D9200 would be a good option for future emulation/current PC games.  People say it's good because it has a VGA input so you don't have to buy andy's card.  But then you still have the games running at windows refresh and standard resolutions--so whats what's the point of buying a $500 monitor if it's not going to look much better than a PC monitor?  The people who now own the D9200 SHOULD have Andy's card, because like you said, most games are standard resolution.  So here's the problem:  Should I get the D9200 + Andy's Card (hoping that he makes a new card specifically for these monitors) or just buy a standard resolution monitor + Andy's card and save about $100 or more?  Oh yeah--If I did go with the later, would the quality of medium resolution games look that bad compared to if it was on an actual medium res. monitor?  Would it at least look better than my flaming piece of sansui?

Thanks,
DM

[Wade]

Yes, this does help...  I was doing some studying before you replied and i'm still somewhat confused on what to get..
the D9200 would be a good option for future emulation/current PC games.  People say it's good because it has a VGA input so you don't have to buy andy's card.  But then you still have the games running at windows refresh and standard resolutions--so whats what's the point of buying a $500 monitor if it's not going to look much better than a PC monitor?  The people who now own the D9200 SHOULD have Andy's card, because like you said, most games are standard resolution.  So here's the problem:  Should I get the D9200 + Andy's Card (hoping that he makes a new card specifically for these monitors) or just buy a standard resolution monitor + Andy's card and save about $100 or more?  Oh yeah--If I did go with the later, would the quality of medium resolution games look that bad compared to if it was on an actual medium res. monitor?  Would it at least look better than my flaming piece of sansui?

Thanks,
DM

First of all, I think the price of a normal standard res arcade monitor is typically more than the D9200.  Secondly, the advantage of the D9200 over a regular arcade monitor is not only can you run windows and mame with virtually no setup, but you can also set the monitor to run TRUE arcade frequencies if your vga card supports it.  

This means you can have your cake and eat it too (run windows and mame with virtually no special config for most games, OR run the games at the true arcade resolution and frequency for the authentic arcade look).

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, I'm learning too...

Wade

[DeathMonk]

I just calculated the prices..  a 27" standard resolution monitor isn't much cheaper than the D9200...  But, will the games loose any image quality since it's a multi-frequency/res. monitor?  Or will it look the same as if I got the standard res. monitor..   Forgive me if i'm being a bug to eveyone--i'm about to purchase one (possibly today) and I need every detail I can get..  After all, this is a big purchase.

[kspiff]

It should look just like the standard res monitor would, maybe with just a little bit of difference in the chunkiness of the scan lines or 'mosaic.'  So if anything, the D9200 would probably be considered higher quality (so it's better unless you're a total authenticity freak -- as in you ---smurfette--- about it when 99.9% of human beings can't tell/ignore the difference in a side-by-side comparison) and definitely more versatile (but be sure to use an ArcadeVGA to take full advantage).

If you want to see more in-depth discussion of hands-on experiences, you should do a forum search for D9200.. don't think I've ever heard anyone complain about one of these beauts, though.  As for the previous post, Wade should be correct.. the advantage is that you can run Windows and arcade apps at their intended frequency/resolution -- but keep in mind that even the D9200 only goes up to 640x480 max;  a std res arcade monitor does 640x200 max and it's at a lower frequency.. but the difference?  Probably not something I would care about, unless I planned on playing PC games.

So if you play PC games, too, care how Windows looks, and have the cash to spare, I'd say go D9200.  If you're strictly a retro man, just save some $$$ and get a std res.

[SNAAAKE]

I was looking at the 27" K7400 on WG's site, and it seems reasonable.  Has anyone used/seen this monitor?
Are there cheaper places to buy monitors online that any of you know of?

I have it..it ROCKs !...no $hit bro..its awsome..color is awsome and I am probley the pickiest guy in the world when it comes to monitor so I am happy and that proves its an awsome monitor !  ..you can buy that and use andy's vga arcade monitor video card.

Check your pm for more info..

Here is a picture..

[DeathMonk]

Thanks for the info guys..  I think I will be going with the D9200 after all..  I emailed a tech (or the tech) at WG and he said if I bought the D9200 and another monitor and put them side by side he said the D9200 would look better, and this is in regards to std. resolution games.  I also want to consider future emulation..  Although there's a personal preference thing that goes into choosing a monitor, I have to go with the majority!

again, thnx for the input!

DM

[SNAAAKE]

d9200 IS better...no matter what..i bought k7400 because i had no money thats all..total was $272 shiped while d9200 is like $500...it cost a lot but other then that..s'all good .

[DeathMonk]

OKies..  I'm about to buy andy's card and the D9200..  Is there any accessories that I need to get? I know I need to get a cable from andy...  what about the monitor?  Does it come with eveything I need?  How about the video amp from ultimarc?  Is that something that you think I will need?

[SNAAAKE]

naw no need amp...WHY do you wanna buy andy card?

you want your games to looks as arcadish as possibe?

I dont think d9200 comes with that 0.56 oem header(i am not sure how you call this).

You know its that plug that goes to your monitors 15 khz connection.

My monitor didnt have one so i went to my local arcade and asked the guy for that.

Here is an advice,first get the d9200 then if you are not happy with how games look then you CAN get andy's card.I already know you will like it without andy's card but just in case.I mean it runs games at 640x480 and it looks awsome so why bother with another video card thats like another $100 while your monitor works perfectly..

the monitor already looks really nice without any extra gizmo.

[DeathMonk]

I just want the games to look as authentic as possible.  I would wait until andy made a card that supported multiple frequencies to match this monitor but who knows how long (if ever) that will be.

Well, since there is no arcade nearby anymore, getting this header plug may be difficult..  Not unless they sell them online somewhere...  Any suggestions?

DM

[SNAAAKE]

Bob Roberts.He probley has em..email the guy.

Wells garnder might sell them too.

you dont need the oem header until you buy andy's card so now when you get the monitor,you can play games without anything.

then later when you get andy's new card(whenever it comes out) then you worry about getting that 0.56 oem header.

[DeathMonk]

Bob Roberts does have these...  But there's a ton of products regarding this .156 connector on his site... what do I need?

DM

[kspiff]

I think the product in question would be his "Replacement Video/Sync Harness" (which you can terminate as you please).. but doesn't the D9200 come with a .156 (monitor PCB) -> DB15 (Arcade VGA) connector cable?  The only reason I can think of you would need one of these is if you were hooking the monitor up to a JAMMA/etc. harness or if the D9200 didn't include a .156 -> molex/DB15 connector.

I would expect that the monitor, the ArcadeVGA, and the accessories included with the 2 would be all you need.

[DeathMonk]

If that's the case, then that would be great.  I just didn't want to solder the cable directly to the monitor.  I was thinking of it as kind of like a car stereo wiring harness--you don't want to cut and solder to the original stereo harness in case you ever had to put the original stereo back in...

[SNAAAKE]

you should just email bob..the guy responds quick !

He will know which connecter you need..

[DeathMonk]

He replied and said he had no idea what I needed..  He said he has never heard of the D9200 monitor before..

[SNAAAKE]

He replied and said he had no idea what I needed..  He said he has never heard of the D9200 monitor before..

WHAT !

It should be like same for all the monitors..wait lill you get your monitor and post a picture of the pinout..i still have another one that the arcade guy gave me..i will probley send you that free if you want.. .

[kspiff]

I would suppose that the D9200 would have the same .157 in-line headers on the main PCB that all standard res monitors seem to use to output R/G/B/sync/etc.  I would also have to assume that the D9200 includes a vid/sync harness that terminates at a DB15 (for easy connection to a kiosk PC or what-have-you).  If you are using an ArcadeVGA, -- even if you want to run at 15KHz -- I would think it is as simple as connecting the included cable from the in-line header on the PCB -> ArcadeVGA's DB15 and firing it up.

[SNAAAKE]

I would suppose that the D9200 would have the same .157 in-line headers on the main PCB that all standard res monitors seem to use to output R/G/B/sync/etc.  I would also have to assume that the D9200 includes a vid/sync harness that terminates at a DB15 (for easy connection to a kiosk PC or what-have-you).  If you are using an ArcadeVGA, -- even if you want to run at 15KHz -- I would think it is as simple as connecting the included cable from the in-line header on the PCB -> ArcadeVGA's DB15 and firing it up.

I dont think that is how it works..there is gotta be a seperate pinpout unless its some auto multi frequince(spelling) monitor..call wells gardner..they should have those .056 oem hearders right(in the parts department) maybe?
First get the monitor then post back.

[DeathMonk]

I emailed the WG tech and here's what he said:

Hi Nick,
You can put a 15khz signal into the DB-15 connector and
it will work if it is wired correctly. We don't provide a connector or a harness for the .156 header because that harness is on the game.

That's good news...  But how much different can you wire a vga cable?

[DeathMonk]

Well here is the question and answer!  

Thats good news for me.  I am going to be using a modified PC video card that will be outputting a 15khz signal.  You say that it will work if it's wired correctly--does this mean I couldn't use a standard vga cable?  Or would I have to modify the vga cable?

**The VGA cable would work.
**Chuck

[DeathMonk]

Does anyone forsee any downgrade in quality, etc. using the DB-15 connection over the .156 header?  I would think that it wouldn't make a difference, but I guess it's a good question  

[SNAAAKE]

Does anyone forsee any downgrade in quality, etc. using the DB-15 connection over the .156 header?  I would think that it wouldn't make a difference, but I guess it's a good question  

Since wells did confirm that it will go though db15 cable then i dont think there is any quility problem over 0.56 pinout..same thing..
I dont even think you need to modify anything if you wanna use andy's video card.Dont anydays card has a vga female connecter.all you do is hookup your male vga cable coming out of the monitor and you will have 15khz windows.
I dont have andy's video card so i am only assuming it works like that..post how thing go after you get your monitor.
you DONT have to hack any vga cable(unless i am missing something).
 

[Frostillicus]

From what I understand after reaming the message board archives - you DO NOT need Andy's card with the D9200.  The info you are looking for is here: http://easymamecab.mameworld.net/html/d9200.htm
Hope it's okay to link to that page, I'm not sure who the owner is.  But the info is fantastic.

You just need a card that is capable of lower resolutions, like the Trident, which is why it's so popular.

I bought a d9200- it comes with a standard PC VGA (15pin) cable.  I was confused, as well.   The arcade RGB special harness/cable is connected separately, and only needed if you will just run it at 15 or 25 khz(meaning no windows).   The whole point to the 9200 is that you can plug it into a regular pc, and it will switch between 15, 25, 31, whatever without having to unplug and use special adapters.  Most people use advancemame because it automatically switches to the correct resolution.

[DeathMonk]

From what I understand after reaming the message board archives - you DO NOT need Andy's card with the D9200.  The info you are looking for is here: http://easymamecab.mameworld.net/html/d9200.htm
Hope it's okay to link to that page, I'm not sure who the owner is.  But the info is fantastic.

You just need a card that is capable of lower resolutions, like the Trident, which is why it's so popular.

I bought a d9200- it comes with a standard PC VGA (15pin) cable.  I was confused, as well.   The arcade RGB special harness/cable is connected separately, and only needed if you will just run it at 15 or 25 khz(meaning no windows).   The whole point to the 9200 is that you can plug it into a regular pc, and it will switch between 15, 25, 31, whatever without having to unplug and use special adapters.  Most people use advancemame because it automatically switches to the correct resolution.

The monitor is capable of displaying 15, 25, and 31khz signals.  It's my understanding that regular video cards will output a 31khz signal no matter what.  Although the resolutions can be switched to mach the games original, your still not going to get the same picture as if you had Andy's card--which you can still use with windows and automatically switches resolutions.  I assume though, you can use advancemame to switch frequencies along with resolutions (?), but i've heard it's hard to setup; and aren't there some limitations to it hardware-wise (i.e. memory usage, etc)?

[SNAAAKE]

you can try to force your current video cards to run at 15 khz using powerstrip..if your card dont support then get a new card..i hear lot of ati cards outputs 15khz.

[Frostillicus]

The monitor is capable of displaying 15, 25, and 31khz signals.  It's my understanding that regular video cards will output a 31khz signal no matter what.  Although the resolutions can be switched to mach the games original, your still not going to get the same picture as if you had Andy's card--which you can still use with windows and automatically switches resolutions.  I assume though, you can use advancemame to switch frequencies along with resolutions (?), but i've heard it's hard to setup; and aren't there some limitations to it hardware-wise (i.e. memory usage, etc)?

I said you need a card that is capable of running those resolutions.  Some are, like the Trident T64(you have hopefully run across that one during your research), and some aren't.   Look at the advancemame website and they have a list of cards that are compatible.  Most of the popular ones(and almost all recent ones) are able to do this.  

Do a search on these boards for 'D9200' or 'advmame' or similar and you'll find a wealth of info - including some threads that point to other threads.  This topic comes up all the time and has been hashed out quite a bit.  Read it all and you'll understand.

[DeathMonk]

I must have misunderstood you..   I thought you meant that even in windows with a regular vid card all you have to do is hit a button on the d9200 and it switches frequencies...

[SNAAAKE]

I must have misunderstood you..   I thought you meant that even in windows with a regular vid card all you have to do is hit a button on the d9200 and it switches frequencies...

You know what Deathmonk,you are worrying WAYYYY too much about this..just use whatever video card you have now in there and your d9200 should give you better picture then anything..I mean you cant do wrong with this(640x480)..IF you are not happy then look for other solution(i already know you will like it).
Just dont use windows XP and use either windows 98,me,2000 and your monitor should give a VERY clear picture..

[DeathMonk]

I'm not worried about the monitor one bit!  It's just that I purchased andy's card also...

[Frostillicus]

It's just that I purchased andy's card also...

sorry, might have come off a bit harsh up there.  anyways, post the arcadevga card to the buy/sell forum and i'm sure someone would take it off your hands.    If it's any consolation, I had no idea what i was doing the first time, and snaaake is right, everything looks great at 640x480 anyways.  Plus no hassling with advmame.  Though my next cab I will really try the advance configurations.

[kspiff]

Hell, I'll probably take it off your hands if you want.  I have some std. res. arcade monitors and would like something I can test them with without finishing my Pac-Land -> JAMMA conversion first and testing them in-cab.

Are you in the US?

[SNAAAKE]

I'm not worried about the monitor one bit!  It's just that I purchased andy's card also...

I SEE  .

You should just get rid of it..you could get atleast $100 shiped for it(i would buy if i needed one but no need).

[DeathMonk]

Hell, I'll probably take it off your hands if you want.  I have some std. res. arcade monitors and would like something I can test them with without finishing my Pac-Land -> JAMMA conversion first and testing them in-cab.

Are you in the US?

Yes, in Missouri

[DeathMonk]

I'm not worried about the monitor one bit!  It's just that I purchased andy's card also...

I SEE  .

You should just get rid of it..you could get atleast $100 shiped for it(i would buy if i needed one but no need).

Well, since I will have a regular card and Andy's card in my possesion, I might as well try both and see what the results are..

[DeathMonk]

Both the monitor and the video card came today! I have my plans for this weekend!  

[kspiff]

Keep us posted, I've got 1 19" to fix and test, 1 19" to test and adjust, and a 13" I'll want to test on the way, need to get an ArcadeVGA or something soon

[BombProofPlane]

ive got to disagree with this anti xp thing youve been carrying on

my experience with xp is that games are pixel perfect (ie you can see the pixels) on the other hand my 98 machine always blurs the pixels

is this your idea of clean???

its all really a driver issue with nvidia cards but whatever (different drivers for 9x vs XP)

I must have misunderstood you..   I thought you meant that even in windows with a regular vid card all you have to do is hit a button on the d9200 and it switches frequencies...

You know what Deathmonk,you are worrying WAYYYY too much about this..just use whatever video card you have now in there and your d9200 should give you better picture then anything..I mean you cant do wrong with this(640x480)..IF you are not happy then look for other solution(i already know you will like it).
Just dont use windows XP and use either windows 98,me,2000 and your monitor should give a VERY clear picture..