One more plug for gameex

[brophog]

Until the whole world becomes anarchist or communist

One of these days I hope someone teaches this country that communism is an actual philosophy and not a swear word.

[headkaze]

Personally, Capitalism the way it is today is communism with invisible leaders. Those in power and all that...

Anyways, I agree with Tom, in that he has put alot of time and effort into a program that is beyond the call of duty when it comes to front ends. And you can call me a fan boy until your head turns blue, but I am a fan of it, but only because I am a coder and know the effort involved in coding such a beast.  For a start I could bag other FE's.. about being written using GDI or VB6, or whatever.. but I won't. It pisses me off seeing other FE developers come into threads bagging other FE's trying to promote their own. It's vein, and the people won't fall for it.. I mean do you believe a post by someone who's bagging a product meanwhile a link in their sig to their own product flashes below them? I think not. Just because it's free dosn't mean their not selling their own ego

A nag screen is to remind you that people's hard work should be rewarded. And when you say FE coders are making money off emulator developers is just completely insaine. Or even to say that it's more complex to code an emulator than a front end means it should be free? Not true. Perhaps your front end is crap and you feel a need to self promote it. Let it go, people like GameEx because it's a kick ass front end. People who come over and play my cab are always amazed by it. And you notice Tom dosn't barge in on other threads promoting his FE. No, cos he knows that quality speaks for itself.

[tspeirs]

Yes I hope someone teaches the country in question that too, along with geography, and about the other countries that don't use dollars and have more freedoms in a lot of cases.

I am not America bashing, all my best friends are American, and I love the country. Just educating.

[Thanks for the backup Headkaze]

[tspeirs]

Anyway, lets not fight anymore, but just help newbies of fans of retro gaming find the best hardware, software and front ends to get the enjoyment we get from it using our arcade cabs and controls, at the price they want with the functionality they want.

I posted my note to educate where possible, I really don't want tit for tat on stuff, and not just because I have more constructive things to do. Everyone choose the best solutions for you which the purpose of this forum is to help with. Lets not comment on our own products, unless its helpfull, and lets not bag others solutions unless its a constructive criticism/review or helps people. How about it? I am sure we can do that. We must be all adults. I mean I could not afford my own cab and live my dream until I was 29.

[headkaze]

Agreed, and perhaps my previous comments were a little harsh [throws candy around the room], but it was getting on my nerves a little about other authors, ok now is the time to rejoice, let us all take a deep breath and walk over to our arcade machines and stroke them with the utter joy they deserve. My arcade machine is me, I is my arcade machine, amen. You may rest.

[squirrellydw]

Just my 2cts! 

I don't like the idea to try to force somebody to pay by displaying a nagscreen.

And have to pay for a Front End is something that hurts me.  A FrontEnd exists because there are emulators. So being paid for a front end  is ,from my point of view, like have profit of others work without deserving it.
I could understand to have to pay for an emulator but not for a Front end.

In addition skills required to make a Front end are far lower than skills required to make an emulator.  A Front end just display a list, few images or video and run an emulators , it consume time to do but it is not so hard at all.

Donation are great, if user likes your work it is a way to encourage you to continue. But try to "force" the donation i don't like the idea.

But the more motivating for me , is to have more and more users which appreciate my work. 

That was my 2cts! 

I agree 100%  MAME is free so I think everything that has to do it should be free also.  If you want to donate to the people that put the hard work into it fine but don't force people to.  I honestly think that we should boycot gameEX for this reason.  He has probably had more donations for his frontend then MAME has ever received.

Let the rants begin 

[markrvp]

I agree 100%  MAME is free so I think everything that has to do it should be free also.

Try convincing Microsoft that their operating systems should be free because MAME runs on them and MAME is a free project.  Maybe AMD and Intel should stop charging for processors because MAME uses processors to run free games.  Tell MAME Marquees that they should provide marquees for free because MAME is a free project.  Tell Happ controls that joysticks should be free because it's hard to play your free MAME games on your arcade cabinet without the proper arcade controls.

That was really an ignorant argument.

[divemaster127]

here, here

[squirrellydw]

I agree 100%  MAME is free so I think everything that has to do it should be free also.

Try convincing Microsoft that their operating systems should be free because MAME runs on them and MAME is a free project.  Maybe AMD and Intel should stop charging for processors because MAME uses processors to run free games.  Tell MAME Marquees that they should provide marquees for free because MAME is a free project.  Tell Happ controls that joysticks should be free because it's hard to play your free MAME games on your arcade cabinet without the proper arcade controls.

That was really an ignorant argument.

umm no, if he wants to sell his software fine, but do it in two parts.  The frontend for MAME should be free, if users want to use the other features charge for that part.  Happ and MAME marquees have a legitimate business beside MAME.  I hate seeing people use others hard work for there profit and that is what he is doing IMHO.

[tspeirs]

I have a legitamte business too and it aint making anywhere near those other companies.

Your free to boycott it, I don't see I am doing anything illegal, immoral or unethical.

The majority of all MAME related features are free in older versions. When I say older that's newer than most of avaiable front ends where last updated.

You know, GameEx aint the only front end, but it has by far been the most expensive to create, maintain and improve, in addition had the most time dedicated to it.

If you dont like GameEx, dont use it, I dont care about your opinion that anything slightly involved with something that is free should be free to. Its a little immature, and not how civilisation works. I'ts not making me rich. I do it because I enjoy it. I have proof of the finances, but my bank statement is none of your business.

By the way if you think I had utter contempt, do you think I'd post here, even care (and just want money), or had spent 6 hours and also $120 dollars today on the project Today alone??

[markrvp]

I agree 100%  MAME is free so I think everything that has to do it should be free also.

Try convincing Microsoft that their operating systems should be free because MAME runs on them and MAME is a free project.  Maybe AMD and Intel should stop charging for processors because MAME uses processors to run free games.  Tell MAME Marquees that they should provide marquees for free because MAME is a free project.  Tell Happ controls that joysticks should be free because it's hard to play your free MAME games on your arcade cabinet without the proper arcade controls.

That was really an ignorant argument.

umm no, if he wants to sell his software fine, but do it in two parts.  The frontend for MAME should be free, if users want to use the other features charge for that part.  Happ and MAME marquees have a legitimate business beside MAME.  I hate seeing people use others hard work for there profit and that is what he is doing IMHO.

Squirrellydw: you must be on welfare because that is the only explanation for your unreasoned sense of entitlement.  Why do you feel everyone here must serve you for free at the expense of their own time and resources?

In case it hasn't been explained to you before:

squirrellydw: NO ONE HERE OWES YOU A DAMN THING. 

If your welfare check can't cover the cost of GameEx then use one of the free programs, but quit bitching about people who actually give up part of their lives to help out those of us in this hobby who actually appreciate it.  I would gladly pay $100 for a frontend that worked flawlessly, was easy and intuitive to set up, and was well documented.

And in case you think I'm talking out my arse, check my posts and you'll find I'm one of the most helpful people here.  Why don't you contribute something instead of just criticizing others who aren't bowing down to your demands quickly enough?

[tspeirs]

EDIT: Sorry deleting, misunderstood the post. I should learn to read!!

[headkaze]

By the way if you think I had utter contempt, do you think I'd post here, even care (and just want money), or had spent 6 hours and also $120 dollars today on the project Today alone??

I can confirm that Tom has spent $120 on GameEx today, because he donated the money to me for the GameEx theme editor I'm currently writing. Thanks Tom, it's really nice to see that you contribute back to authors supporting GameEx. And I said on several occations that I was not expecting anything for my work. Just goes to show what sort of guy Tom is. Anyway, stay tuned for the theme editor, it's coming soon and should make GameEx much easier to create custom themes for

[LJHalfbreed]

FYI: One of my main annoyances with gameex was the lack of a theme editor, and if anything, was one of the main reasons why I felt it didn't deserve a nagscreen.

If the theme editor comes out and works nicely, I'll definitely give gameex another go. However, at this time, I just don't think it justifies it. I'm not a fanboy of any other FE, just was kinda puzzled by the creator's choice of 'gaining donations'.

[Bones]

I agree 100%  MAME is free so I think everything that has to do it should be free also.  If you want to donate to the people that put the hard work into it fine but don't force people to.  I honestly think that we should boycot gameEX for this reason.  He has probably had more donations for his frontend then MAME has ever received.

Let the rants begin 

[tspeirs]

I'm not a fanboy of any other FE, just was kinda puzzled by the creator's choice of 'gaining donations'.

Don't think I would not do a huge happy dance if I made a lot money of from it, but to answer where you are puzzled in simple terms and not going into costs and my motivation, it keeps the project available, alive, updated, supported and coming on leaps and bound on a weekly basis. The opposite of this is a Dead project. I believe the app is of commercial quality IMHO. The way I see I am only doing what Andy is doing, I am pretty sure he is not making a mint either, but we'd sure miss those arcadevga cards and IPAC's if he's company went backrunpt.

[Directed at all]
Yes MAME is a free project, but can you report a bug in MAME, and have a new release in 2 hours? Can you request an ehancment to it, and have your dream come true within a week? Hey the devs dont give a ---Cleveland steamer--- about your feature request. What do they care there doing it for free, and the project is driven by themselves? GameEx you can, it's not MAME.

As a side point, you all may have started to notice that various open source projects are developing a commercial side. Basically this is so if you do want to spend your money your'll get a better service.

[Bones]

Really Tom, although I do admire your patience and standing in this matter; I don't think you need to make a single explanation to anybody who questions your product, or the way in which you choose to market and support it.

It really is nobody else

[tspeirs]

OK, Ill shut up now then 

Perhaps some kind moderator would lock this thread, but I've said way to much anyhow.

[LJHalfbreed]

I'm not a fanboy of any other FE, just was kinda puzzled by the creator's choice of 'gaining donations'.

Don't think I would not do a huge happy dance if I made a lot money of from it, but to answer where you are puzzled in simple terms and not going into costs and my motivation, it keeps the project available, alive, updated, supported and coming on leaps and bound on a weekly basis.

Which is quite alright, if that's what floats your boat. I'm merely pointing out that I don't agree with it, that's all. 

The opposite of this is a Dead project. I believe the app is of commercial quality IMHO. The way I see I am only doing what Andy is doing, I am pretty sure he is not making a mint either, but we'd sure miss those arcadevga cards and IPAC's if he's company went backrunpt.

There are also apps created by individuals that are neither funded by donations, nor dead. Some people create things for their own benefit, and share them to be altruistic about it. Other people create it for 'ego' satisfaction. Different things drive different people to create 'commercial quality' apps.  On a side note, comparing apps and hardware is apples and oranges...  Yes, andy does create things for mame, but because there is a physical component involved in the cost besides labor, it changes things just due to the nature of the product. While I'm not knocking the time and effort you've put into your software, comparing your software to hardware is kinda silly and out of place.

[Directed at all]
Yes MAME is a free project, but can you report a bug in MAME, and have a new release in 2 hours? Can you request an ehancment to it, and have your dream come true within a week? Hey the devs dont give a ---Cleveland steamer--- about your feature request. What do they care there doing it for free, and the project is driven by themselves? GameEx you can, it's not MAME.

True, and I'm sure plenty of people appreciate that. However, nearly every other FE i've fooled around with has the ability to change the look. Heck, even mame32 allows backgrounds and such. While I've noticed that you've said you're working on getting a theme/skin maker inside your app, you've had it out for quite a while. I saw nothing about your software that reasoned needing a nag screen for just that particular reason. In addition, I've also noticed that some additional functionality is also not present (gameextender) unless you register. So, instead of just a nagscreen, you also have reduced functionality. And, due to the nature of software in general, would you refund this donation/registration fee if a user found the software to be unuseful/unacceptable?

I just think that between the nagscreen and the reduced functionality, it makes your software much less attractive compared to other FE's available. If I try it, I have a nagscreen and missing features, which means that I can't get a valid idea if this is a good or bad software for my needs. If I 'pay to remove nagscreen and get additional features', I'm out almost 20 bucks, and have no way of getting my money back if the features/loss-of-nagscreen are worth it. Seems like a lose-lose situation. I've always been a fan of time-based shareware just for that reason.

As a side point, you all may have started to notice that various open source projects are developing a commercial side. Basically this is so if you do want to spend your money your'll get a better service.

And also as a side note, out of all the various 'open source' and 'freeware' projects out there, I notice a whole lot more that are free-as-in-liberty and continue to be, as opposed to those that suddenly go 'commercial'.

I have no problem with you trying to get compensated for your labor... I just think a nagscreen plus limited functions is *not* the way to go.

[squirrellydw]

I agree 100%  MAME is free so I think everything that has to do it should be free also.

Try convincing Microsoft that their operating systems should be free because MAME runs on them and MAME is a free project.  Maybe AMD and Intel should stop charging for processors because MAME uses processors to run free games.  Tell MAME Marquees that they should provide marquees for free because MAME is a free project.  Tell Happ controls that joysticks should be free because it's hard to play your free MAME games on your arcade cabinet without the proper arcade controls.

That was really an ignorant argument.

umm no, if he wants to sell his software fine, but do it in two parts.  The frontend for MAME should be free, if users want to use the other features charge for that part.  Happ and MAME marquees have a legitimate business beside MAME.  I hate seeing people use others hard work for there profit and that is what he is doing IMHO.

Squirrellydw: you must be on welfare because that is the only explanation for your unreasoned sense of entitlement.  Why do you feel everyone here must serve you for free at the expense of their own time and resources?

In case it hasn't been explained to you before:

squirrellydw: NO ONE HERE OWES YOU A DAMN THING. 

If your welfare check can't cover the cost of GameEx then use one of the free programs, but quit bitching about people who actually give up part of their lives to help out those of us in this hobby who actually appreciate it.  I would gladly pay $100 for a frontend that worked flawlessly, was easy and intuitive to set up, and was well documented.

And in case you think I'm talking out my arse, check my posts and you'll find I'm one of the most helpful people here.  Why don't you contribute something instead of just criticizing others who aren't bowing down to your demands quickly enough?

Your right, no one owes me anything.  It was my opinion.  You are just typical and attack someone with out knowing anything about the person.  FYI, I work for DHS and make nice money, it was my opinion you have yours, who is more mature you or me.  I didn

[markrvp]

This is a great website which is why I am offended when people like you who don't contribute anything come in and slam the people who do actually contribute. 

On a side note, comparing apps and hardware is apples and oranges...  Yes, andy does create things for mame, but because there is a physical component involved in the cost besides labor, it changes things just due to the nature of the product. While I'm not knocking the time and effort you've put into your software, comparing your software to hardware is kinda silly and out of place.

Another ignorant statement.  Both Tom's software and Andy's hardware are facilitating the use of MAME.  Neither is necessary to use the software, but both make its use more enjoyable.  Believing software has no value because you can't hold it in your hands is what is silly and out of place.


I know the anonymity of the internet emboldens people to say things in threads that they would be too cowardly to say face-to-face, but the lack of class you guys are showing by knocking Tom for giving the option to donate is beyond belief.

Here is a good general rule in life and specifically for this forum.  If you don't have something nice to say then STFU!

[Goz]

Is it a coincidence that the ones that are crying the loudest about Tom's software are n00bs? They both have 50 posts or so and think the world should be free and then believe they are the ones who are being attacked. This train of thought is common more and more amongst todays youth. I don't know if these people are are young or old and frankly don't really care. Just because you don't believe something is of use enough to you to warrant the nag screen doesn't mean that you should crap on someomes product or are required to post your opinion.

I have machines running Mamewah and GameEx and they are both excellent software packages but Tom by far is the most responsive to requests and bug fixes. Not a slam on Minwah but rather a praise for Tom. It is hard damn work doing what the FE developers do and to have passion and continue to move forward with a vision takes a real set of balls and determination.

With that said... This thread should be locked or the negative comments including this one removed.

-Goz

[brophog]

With that said... This thread should be locked or the negative comments including this one removed.

Just lock it. No need for censorship.

[LJHalfbreed]

On a side note, comparing apps and hardware is apples and oranges...  Yes, andy does create things for mame, but because there is a physical component involved in the cost besides labor, it changes things just due to the nature of the product. While I'm not knocking the time and effort you've put into your software, comparing your software to hardware is kinda silly and out of place.

Another ignorant statement.  Both Tom's software and Andy's hardware are facilitating the use of MAME.  Neither is necessary to use the software, but both make its use more enjoyable.  Believing software has no value because you can't hold it in your hands is what is silly and out of place.

Actually, I never said that, nor did I imply that. Hardware implies that you need physical components, access to those components, and the ability to get those components put together the way you need them to. Software (or, if you prefer, Intellectual Property) indeed *does* have value, but comparing it to hardware (Physical Property) does not hold up, for multiple reasons, and if you need more info on the subject, just google up some pages containing Intellecutal property, MPAA/RIAA/**AA, DRM, and similar.

Read up on it, and you'll see why I think it's foolish to compare the two.

It's an ok software, but there are problems with it that I voiced, and reasons why I believe some things shouldn't be the way they are on said software. I'm just voicing my opinion (or review, if you will). Sorry if you think it needs to be censored.... Perhaps if I gave it a rave review would be better? 

[Brad]

Is it a coincidence that the ones that are crying the loudest about Tom's software are n00bs? They both have 50 posts or so and think the world should be free and then believe they are the ones who are being attacked.

With that said... This thread should be locked or the negative comments including this one removed.

-Goz

It's also a common misconception that anyone with thousands of post counts MUST know vastly more than someone with 50 or less and that anyone with a post count less than 2000 is obviously a fool Afterall massive post counts equates to the combined IQ of the whole world! 

Other than that I would agree in that this thread should probably be locked. I wouldn't censor it though.

Brad

[Goz]

Brad you miss the point entirely but this is not about a flaming low posters. I don't harbor anything against you as you've been arround for years and only have 120+ posts. My post count is above 2000 as most of my posts are helping others... but i digress. I should have said 50 posts and most of them not benefiting the community.

[Goz]

This thread should be in EE as the direction has gone from a praise to flame.