MAME Cabinet Video options

[toyguy]

I'm embarking on a MAME cab project.  Controls are on the way, along with the I-PAC.  I'll be ordering an Opti-PAC also along with Happ Trackball and OSCAR Spinner later this week.  I've got cabinet plans.  The only unknown is the video system.

I'm building a new PC for the cabinet - P4 2.8GHz, probably 256MB RAM to start, expanding to 512MB later.  Now, what to do for video?

I want to go reasonably large on the monitor, at least 21".  Computer monitors of that size are awfully pricey.  I can pick up a nice S-video 27" TV for about $240, so that's attractive.  I'd love to hear from anyone doing the S-video method as to how you like it, does MAME handle it well, any cautions or concerns etc?  I'll be staying horizontal with the monitor for now and I'll live with the smaller image on vertical games.  

If I decide to go the S-video route, any recommendations on graphics cards?  Does MAME benefit in any way from a high-end accellerated card?  I can pick up either a GEForce 4 MX420 or Radeon 9000, both with S-video out, for about $100.  That leaves me well under the price of either a computer monitor, an arcade monitor or a Wells-Gardner VGA unit.  The Radeon 7500, also with S-video out, is only $80 but certainly not as fast as the others.

Anybody's thoughts on this decision would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks!  I can't wait to get started.  Should be picking up the wood this week  

[CM]

I use Radeon 7500 with S-Video out and it has more than enough horsepower for Mame.  The console emulators use the hardware acceleration to a much higher degree and still work great.  I debated the same thing you did, and when it comes down to it ... these games don't take too much to run so save your $$$.    

[android]

Unless you are planning on running PC games on your PC, you don't have to go all the way on the video card. Mame does not use the 3D capabilities nor memory of your card, so spending on a good card for a dedicated mame PC is a waste of money. Pick the cheapest ATI with S-Video. Radeon 7000/7200 are cheap nowadays (I would even go for the Xpert series). CPU speed is more important than 3D video performance/memory; however, 2.8Ghz is overkill for mame. You will do fine with half that speed. With the cash you will save you can buy a nice 27" Wells Gardner D9200 monitor: that will do more for your games than an expensive video card.

[toyguy]

OK, this is good info!  The PC that will go in the cabinet will be just for emulation - MAME, Stella, Raine, etc.  I guess I'll go for a mid-range card, as I want to use Emulaxian's virtual arcade mode as my front end, so I can use some 3D acceleration there.

Anybody care to comment in more detail on monitor choices.  A 27" TV is about $240 locally, whereas the Wells Gardner units range from $350 for the 3100-series 19" SVGA units up to about $500 for the 9200 series VGA unit in 27".

What am I looking at in tradeoffs between the 2 WG units, and between the WG units vs. a TV with S-video?

Any input is welcome as I want to get this right the first time...

Thanks!

Dave

[CM]

I put a 27" Toshiba TV in my cabinet and have no complaints with image quality at all.  The only word of advice I would give you in the TV area is find a set that remembers its input settings when it powers down.  The Toshiba I have has to be reset to input=S-Video on every power-up which can be annoying.  Best way to test this is set the input to S-Video in the store, unplug it, then plug it back in to see if it comes back up in S-Video.

[android]

Anybody care to comment in more detail on monitor choices.  

Check out Oscar's website and judge for yourself. He has pictures of TV's, arcade monitors and hybrid VGA monitors running mame side by side. I agree with CM on the S-Video quality of the Toshiba brand in particular: my 36" sony doesn't come close to the quality of my 20" Toshiba.

For painless setup and more than decent quality without the price tag, I'd go S-Video; for quality at a moderately high price (although relatively painfull to setup) I would go with a new arcade monitor. And if money is no objection, I would go for the d9200: painless setup and high quality arcade-like image.

-- android

[u_rebelscum]

CPU speed is more important than 3D video performance/memory; however, 2.8Ghz is overkill for mame.

   I guess you haven't tried playing some of the new games added in .62:  Prop Cycle, Cruis'n USA, Cruis'n World, Race Drivin', etc.  You need 3.0+Ghz for these games.  And more games of this level of emulation are around the corner.  

True, 2.8Ghz is more than what most games in mame need.  But not enough for some games.  That "some" will increase to "many" over the next few releases of mame.  It's a good idea to "future proof" your computer as much as you can without spending too much money.  (Absolute "furture proof" is impossible, that's why I say "as much as possible.")


Toyguy, as for the video card, depends if you will use windows mame w/ hwstretch.  The Radeon 7500 will be fine for this; no need for $300 Gforce 4ti or anything like that.  If get too old of a card, however, you will see slowdown if you hwstretch.  Hwstretch is one of the few things (if not the only thing) that slow down mame if you have a slow video card.  If you are going to use hwstretch, Xpert series cards are too slow.

[android]

 I guess you haven't tried playing some of the new games added in .62:  Prop Cycle, Cruis'n USA, Cruis'n World, Race Drivin', etc.  

You are right: I haven't tried *all* the games in .62, but the ones I tried (the ones I care about) worked perfectly on my 1.2Ghz Athlon with Radeon 7000 (solvalou, starblade).

It's a good idea to "future proof" your computer as much as you can without spending too much money.

Toyguy, as for the video card, depends if you will use windows mame w/ hwstretch.  The Radeon 7500 will be fine for this; no need for $300 Gforce 4ti or anything like that.

So I guess the right technical answer to Toyguy is: spend the money on the latest mb/cpu generation to ensure future performance. As for video, a card one or at most two generations old will work fine for mame.

However, my recommendation was based on what I would do (I guess I should've qualified it as such): I'd rather save 200 on the card and another 200 on a slower mb/cpu in order to buy a d9200 to play the games I care about, than playing all the games in mame.

Of course if you want to run *everything* and future proof your cabinet, then expect to pay $$$. As for me, I think that's a waste of money for a dedicated cabinet: I'd rather future proof my desktop PC. But again, that's just me.

[ashardin]

You are getting good replies here and you probably are going to want to go bigger, but I am building my 3rd Mame cabinet (1 for me, the other for family and a friend) and each time I have gotten a 21" SVGA monitor off ebay, and the highest I paid was $150 shipped.  The are refurbished or used, pulled out of graphics stations, but work great.  Two have been HP's and one was a rebadged Sony.  I pull the outer plastic case off, mount it to the monitor mounts, and then lay a bezel over the top and under the plexy/tempered glass.  

The benefit is that you have the option of putting a PC game on there if you chose.  I have the computer edition of Golden Tee running at 1024x768 and it is gorgeous.  

[toyguy]

Thanks for the good input!  I have a good desktop already, so I don't need to go whole-hog on the dedicated MAME box.  I can pick up a decently fast GeForce4 MX420 with 64MB of DDR video ram for about $100, that offers S-video out, or I can go with a similar ATI for about $120.  Since I want to use Emulaxian as my front end, I can use the 3D acceleration those cards offer and the price differential isn't much.  So I think that decision is made.

I'm still waffling on the monitor.  I like the sounds of that D9200 WG unit, but it's double the price of a decent S-video TV.  Let me ask this question - how much desktop resolution can you get on a TV using S-Video?  Will they handle a 1024x768 picture decently?  That's Emulaxians preferred resolution.  I think the WG 9200 might be easier to mount, however, if I decide to try for a rotatable monitor.  I'm not planning on that at first, but I might try retrofitting it later.  I also expect that the WG unit will have an "arcade-like" picture quality to it that might be desireable.  Such decisions! :^)  At least I have a while to think about it while I gather the rest of the parts.

First batch of controls have arrived.  Gotta order the spinner, trac-ball, joystick with top-mount fire button and Opti-Pac tonight.