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Author Topic: HDTV monitor  (Read 2150 times)

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ArcadeUtah

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HDTV monitor
« on: November 02, 2004, 01:37:45 pm »
I was just wondering if anyone was thinking about the possibility of using an HDTV monitor (like a 27" or 32") in an arcade cabinet.  It wont be long before these tv's will be a lot cheaper than traditional computer or arcade monitors (in terms of $ for size). I wonder how well this type of setup would work and how games would look.  I gues you would have to force games to run at the tv's native res (192x1080 or 1280x720 or the 4:3 equivilent)

b3atmania

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2004, 03:25:38 pm »
HDTV resolution is too high for most of the stuff MAME emulates. By the time HDTV is affordable they will all have a 16:9 aspect ratio and flat screens. This will make 80s and 90s games look bad.

DYNAGOD

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2004, 01:21:19 pm »
i have a 36" 16:9 HDTV and ive used it for mame before...
the image quality is poor, or at least no better than a standard analog tv.
the 16:9 screen just meakes for alot of wasted space..and as was stated above the resolution is too high..its an abvsolute waste of a good television.
money much better spent on a nice multisync.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2004, 01:22:05 pm by DYNAGOD »
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AmericanDemon

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2004, 01:50:31 pm »
Hey Dynagod, how'd you have it hooked up though?  

DYNAGOD

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2004, 07:49:28 am »
i had a geforce 4 ti4600 with tv out..
also had an ATI all in wonder..
I mean it was playable, if thats all your looking for, but it was nothing to write home about..
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ericball

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2004, 12:24:17 pm »
Well DYNAGOD, if you connect is like a TV, then it won't look much better than a TV.  (Depending on how much de-interlacing etc the HDTV has.)  The trick is to understand what the HDTV is best at and how to take advantage of it.

Okay, one big assumption: we're talking about a true HDTV with 720p or 1080i resolution, not some widescreen TV which has only 480 lines.

HDTV has two 16x9 hi-res modes: 1280x720@60fps (or 720p) and 1920x1080@30fps interlaces (or 1080i).  Not all HDTVs can display both modes, but rather they use scaling to display the other.  Most HDTVs will also upscale other resolutions (e.g. 480i or 480p) to a higher, preferred or native, resolution for display.

Now, if you connect your PC to the HDTV via TV-out then you are, in effect, converting whatever resolution the game is in to 640x480i to send it to the HDTV.  The HDTV then will upscale, and probably deinterlace, that to fit it's preferred display mode.  Some graphics cards may support progressive output, which means avoiding deinterlacing artifacts.

Now, if you connect the PC to the HDTV with a VGA or DVI cable, then the PC will either scale the game to fit the HDTV's resolution or the HDTV will scale the resolution used by the PC to it's preferred mode.  Good for vector games, okay for high res (VGA) games, but not so good for medium and standard res (EGA & CGA) games.

Okay, to summarize:
1. HDTVs will scale and probably deinterlace to suit their preferred display mode.
2. The less scaling and other modifications which get done to the signal the better.

Therefore connect the HDTV via VGA or DVI and have the PC use the HDTV's preferred resolution.
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DYNAGOD

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2004, 02:18:05 pm »
ive gone DVI ,against my TVs warranty,its the same result..
at those resolutions the image would be so fuzzy and smooth it would not be appealing,,
the original is in the 640x480 area , upscaling to HD that far is going to worsen the image quality not improve it..
« Last Edit: November 04, 2004, 02:22:22 pm by DYNAGOD »
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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2004, 02:29:50 pm »
OMG... Anoterh BYOAC'er in Utah. Now theres two of us! We should form a club! lol

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #8 on: November 05, 2004, 11:22:53 am »
I've got a 32" sanyo HDTV that looks exactly like a normal TV.  It's not wide screen and I'm happy with that.  Everything I throw at it looks beautiful, and the TV does a great job of resampling, even with stuff hooked through RCA jacks (the yellow, white, and red jacks).  I can read the labels on the icons on my windows XP desktop with shadows underneith at 1024x768 using a crappy s-video out video card (my laptop's card sucks) from my couch!  So basically it comes down to the type of HDTV you get.  I agree those rear projection TVs suck.  Those are the ones that you see in wal-mart for $1000+.  But get a 4:3 picture tube HDTV and it should work for you.  My only annoyance with it when I first got the tv was that low res games (like the playstation games) looked blocky instead of having the native scanlines.  I've gotten used to it but I doubt any normal video card can output that type of signal anyway.  I'm gonna try hooking my cab's computer up to my HDTV using a radeon and s-vid and see what I get and report back.

-Matt

Matt, GoC

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #9 on: November 05, 2004, 01:30:53 pm »
Well I found that low res games like the NeoGeo ones look incredibly crisp on the HDTV.  Certain games look blurry but that's because of the blur effect that mame does.  I'd try to find a TV like mine and stick it in your cab.  If I'd known that I was going to stumble upon a HDTV for so cheap ($350) I'd have made a showcase cab instead, so I could still use the TV like normal.  While technically my HDTV will fit into my cab, I'm not gonna use it for just that.  It's really up to you if you want to dedicate an HDTV to a cab or not.

Dave_K.

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #10 on: November 05, 2004, 02:38:15 pm »
You can still find 32"-36" VGA monitors for cheap (~$200-$300) search for Gateway Destination.  The Desintation is not a TV with upscan, but is a real non-interlace multisync monitor capable of HDTV resolutions (up to 520P).  I use mine to play xbox, and DC at 480P.  These also use standard VGA input plugs.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2004, 02:39:32 pm by Dave_K. »

ArcadeUtah

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Re:HDTV monitor
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2004, 03:16:49 pm »
Currently I have a 20"  monitor in my cabinet and most games end up running at 1024x768 and I really don't mind how it looks. Ideally I would like to have a 27" monitor  in there. The system gets used for PC games as much as it does for mame, so higher resolution is more important than it would be in  a regular dedicated MAME machine. I have not yet tried hooking up a PC to an HDTV so it is good to hear from those who have.