Sharpness Groovymame y GroovyArcade vs MVS

[luiser2612]

Good afternoon fellow forum members.
I don't know if anyone has this problem, well it's not a problem, I made the query a long time ago, but they didn't give me an answer.

With Groovymame or GroovyArcade I get native resolutions, the scanlines are visible and everything, but there are times when I see the image as pixelated, for example some artifacts but for example I put an MVS board with a 16 in 1 game from Neogeo and the image is seen with Scanlines and everything but it looks smoother, prettier, I would like to know why it is, and if there is any way to make the Groovy look like this.

The scan lines in original arcades I notice much less, the image looks smoother, as if it had a slight filter. With groovy I see everything more pixelated, and the perception of the image is lost more. It is noticeable more than anything in 224 p games
Hopefully some connoisseur understands me, and can solve the question

[OverRide]

What is the CRT and how is it connected?

I have a newer flat Sharp CRT TV using component as input and the image is a little to crisp for me. At least in comparison to the arcade monitors or my PVM I have. I turn down the sharpness in the menu and it helps a bit.

[Substring]

What TV/monitor ? Got pictures ?

[luiser2612]

What is the CRT and how is it connected?

I have a newer flat Sharp CRT TV using component as input and the image is a little to crisp for me. At least in comparison to the arcade monitors or my PVM I have. I turn down the sharpness in the menu and it helps a bit.

It is connected by a Jamma card and then by VGA to the PC

[luiser2612]

What TV/monitor ? Got pictures ?

The monitor is a generic 26-inch

[luiser2612]

What TV/monitor ? Got pictures ?

The monitor is a generic 26-inch

Send pictures   [https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-PaW94iCA4Ut6XaeHjIUru9CzLuvR4DG/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/14B9YOHOraRZxQBDQKlfB4doVFEfiRgwO/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1CkDCgMQ5QWSlc9_Lc4nY2GRAypOLer7x/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ESTGhQ5-sNhkks6O3_Rth7PIN05Fyt1P/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1NSgMlai7Jd649dNdUl3MW3aYJnEfOj-K/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1QFX4aRpkmJSvg3MOjtkahWu6he5mw3BP/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1iod2QiuS3dyQw5eRbliE8NFATF40Tvo1/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1s7u3v-LLepjQ-afsKWl4BNoB7elbwCZ-/view?usp=sharing]

[makya]

Is groovymame displaying your 224p games at 224/240? Or something like 480? Asking because low res picture looking pixelated is exactly what happens then.

[luiser2612]

Is groovymame displaying your 224p games at 224/240? Or something like 480? Asking because low res picture looking pixelated is exactly what happens then.

Good afternoon, the resolution is fine, what just happens is that the image does not look as bright as the NeoGeo console, apart from the fact that the image has its scanlines, but it looks pixelated, not as smooth as the original Neogeo, my card is an ATI radeon x1550, I had heard that you need to connect through JPAC which I don't have, is that why? It is necessary to amplify the signal, because I do not use the JPAC, I have the video system through a cable directly PC-Monitor Arcade.
I appreciate someone with knowledge can help me.
In the link you see, the images where the brightest colors are seen is the original Arcade, and the other is the emulation

[luiser2612]

And won't it also be like I have everything connected to a card that is not JPAC? I have heard that some cards or monitors play a 5V signal, because sometimes I see that my image is not as bright as when I connect the NEOGEO, and how can I solve that? Since here it is very difficult to get those JPAC, thanks for your help

[buttersoft]

A PC normally outputs the VGA H and V sync lines at TTL, or 5V. But the RGB lines are always at 0.7Vp-p. Arcade monitors normally want anything from 1.5V peak to peak to about ~4V i think. This might be why the image isn't as bright from the PC. In addition, when you lower the brightness of a CRT, the image normally becomes a little clearer, which would also explain why it looks more pixelated. As the brightness increases so does the energy in the beam, and the CRT won't focus quite as sharply. Also, and perhaps more importantly, the phosphors emit more light and tend to smear into one another a tiny bit more. Most people would use a video Amp like a J-pac with an Arcade monitor, but there are other amps. You might try turning down the brightness with the NEO GEO connected and see if you can make things looks like they do from the PC.

There are two other things that might be affecting the picture here, especially if you're not using an arcade monitor, because you haven't said. One is that a lot of older systems output video of poorer quality. This is certainly the case with consoles, though much rarer with arcade boards. It also covers PC video cards, which don't always have greatest VGA output. I had a 5450 that had rubbish colours and just a very dull image. Swapping to another, better 5450 made a massive difference. Some old cards and systems are perfectly fine, but some are a bit disappointing.

FYI, those pictures are terrible It's impossible to tell which is which or what's brighter than what.

[luiser2612]

A PC normally outputs the VGA H and V sync lines at TTL, or 5V. But the RGB lines are always at 0.7Vp-p. Arcade monitors normally want anything from 1.5V peak to peak to about ~4V i think. This might be why the image isn't as bright from the PC. In addition, when you lower the brightness of a CRT, the image normally becomes a little clearer, which would also explain why it looks more pixelated. As the brightness increases so does the energy in the beam, and the CRT won't focus quite as sharply. Also, and perhaps more importantly, the phosphors emit more light and tend to smear into one another a tiny bit more. Most people would use a video Amp like a J-pac with an Arcade monitor, but there are other amps. You might try turning down the brightness with the NEO GEO connected and see if you can make things looks like they do from the PC.

There are two other things that might be affecting the picture here, especially if you're not using an arcade monitor, because you haven't said. One is that a lot of older systems output video of poorer quality. This is certainly the case with consoles, though much rarer with arcade boards. It also covers PC video cards, which don't always have greatest VGA output. I had a 5450 that had rubbish colours and just a very dull image. Swapping to another, better 5450 made a massive difference. Some old cards and systems are perfectly fine, but some are a bit disappointing.

FYI, those pictures are terrible It's impossible to tell which is which or what's brighter than what.

Thank you very much, it shows that you know about the subject, if my monitor is a generic 26-inch Arcade monitor without a brand, when I connect it to the arcade it looks smoother and brighter, I have an ATI x1550 card and I have tried it with mame and groovymame, the scanlines and the resolution are noticeable but it looks pixelated and a little darker, you would not have any way that I could upload the signal with a device that is not JPAC, any device, the link that I send is of the image of the Neogeo on my monitor, you can see the softness and more brightness[https://drive.google.com/file/d/1iod2QiuS3dyQw5eRbliE8NFATF40Tvo1/view]

[mrchrister]

Just a quick note from my limited experience:

I have a Donkey Kong cabinet running with an original DK PCB and an optiplex PC with a JPAC connected to a Radeon 8490 series card. I installed a switcher from Vectorlabs so I can hotswap between original PCB and Groovymame PC. Both brightness levels and sharpness are very much on par (even though the Vectorlabs adapter also converts the inverted Sanyo signal). I used to have a much darker image coming out of Groovymame because I used an older style Jamma adapter (with Parallel port). Switching to JPAC and using a Vectorlabs inverter made the picture really shine on the DK CRT (Sanyo EZ20) and it looks as good as from the original PCB.

If you don't use a JPAC, how do you connect to your Jamma adapter? I would strongly suggest you getting a JPAC. Biggest issue for me with it was I needed audio out and JPAC doesn't have an amp onboard so I had to disassemble some amazon PC speakers for a little amp. I also needed to turn my stereo headphone jack output from stereo to mono. It was worth the effort. Vertical games like Cave shooters or golden era games like Ms. Pacman play amazing on it.

[buttersoft]

...you would not have any way that I could upload the signal with a device that is not JPAC, any device

PLug and play i'm not sure. There's the jpac, and maybe some stuff on Arcadeforge.de. OR Ozstick sells this one - https://www.ozstick.com.au/product/video-amplifier/

I tend to build my own amps from THS7314, 7136 or even better, THS7374 chips.

[mrchrister]

I can only vouch for JPAC, maybe somebody has experience with this one:
https://www.arcadexpress.com/en/video-converters/42-interfaz-pc-a-jamma-usb.html

[buttersoft]

I can only vouch for JPAC, maybe somebody has experience with this one:
https://www.arcadexpress.com/en/video-converters/42-interfaz-pc-a-jamma-usb.html

That one doesn't have video! It says that in the description. I was looking at it wondering how the hell you get video through a USB-B connector...

The other one they sell does video - https://www.arcadexpress.com/en/video-converters/257-tarjeta-jamma-asd.html

[meyer980]

I can only vouch for JPAC, maybe somebody has experience with this one:
https://www.arcadexpress.com/en/video-converters/42-interfaz-pc-a-jamma-usb.html

That one doesn't have video! It says that in the description. I was looking at it wondering how the hell you get video through a USB-B connector...

The other one they sell does video - https://www.arcadexpress.com/en/video-converters/257-tarjeta-jamma-asd.html

First time I'm seeing that JammASD V3 thing. It includes an audio in and audio amp as well - something I've always felt the j-pac is missing.