HLSL settings for MCR games - whats your settings?

[vettetek]

Hey guys - It seems my HLSL works great with games like Qbert, Dkong, etc, but when I try to load up a MCR game like Tapper or Journey I get a very bad moire' effect. Im sure its because of the resolution difference. Is anyone else experiencing this? Is there settings just for these style games or is there an all around "good for all" HLSL setting?
Please post here if you can.
Thanks!!

[Soundwave]

You can give these a try. Sorry I don't know what an MCR game is, I've been out of the gaming loop for a few years but this is the settings I have used for years. This is the work of a guy who spent 12 grueling hours staring at a real arcade CRT and tweaking to get as close as possible. Of course the type of LCD you have will make a difference. Hope it works for you, let me know what you think.

Code: [Select]

# DIRECT3D POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
hlsl_enable               1
hlslpath                  hlsl
hlsl_prescale_x           6
hlsl_prescale_y           6
hlsl_preset               -1
hlsl_write                1
hlsl_snap_width           2048
hlsl_snap_height          1536
shadow_mask_alpha         0.14
shadow_mask_texture       SlotMask.png
shadow_mask_x_count       6
shadow_mask_y_count       4
shadow_mask_usize         0.1875
shadow_mask_vsize         0.1875
shadow_mask_uoffset       0.0
shadow_mask_voffset       0.0
curvature                 0.10
round_corner              0.15
reflection                0.05
vignetting                0.24
scanline_alpha            0.58
scanline_size             1.05
scanline_height           0.75
scanline_bright_scale     1.30
scanline_bright_offset    0.55
scanline_jitter           0.05
defocus                   1.00,0.50
converge_x                0.4,0.0,-0.3
converge_y                0.0,0.0,0.0
radial_converge_x         0.2,0.0,-0.2
radial_converge_y         0.0,0.0,0.0
red_ratio                 0.90,0.05,0.05
grn_ratio                 0.10,0.80,0.10
blu_ratio                 0.10,0.0,0.90
saturation                1.10
offset                    -0.05,0.03,0.01
scale                     0.96,1.0,1.0
power                     1.35,1.25,1.10
floor                     0.00,0.03,0.03
phosphor_life             0.40,0.35,0.30

#
# NTSC POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
yiq_enable                0
yiq_cc                    3.59754545
yiq_a                     0.5
yiq_b                     0.5
yiq_o                     1.570796325
yiq_p                     1.0
yiq_n                     1.0
yiq_y                     6.0
yiq_i                     1.2
yiq_q                     0.6
yiq_scan_time             52.6
yiq_phase_count           2

#
# VECTOR POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
vector_length_scale       0.8
vector_length_ratio       500.0

#
# BLOOM POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
vector_bloom_scale        0.3
raster_bloom_scale        0.425
bloom_lvl0_weight         1.0
bloom_lvl1_weight         0.35
bloom_lvl2_weight         0.25
bloom_lvl3_weight         0.17
bloom_lvl4_weight         0.15
bloom_lvl5_weight         0.14
bloom_lvl6_weight         0.13
bloom_lvl7_weight         0.12
bloom_lvl8_weight         0.11
bloom_lvl9_weight         0.10
bloom_lvl10_weight        0.09

[MydknyteStyrm]

It's a resolution thing. I changed my scan line height to .55 and it looks way better. Just make sure you create an ini with that setting for each game.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[vettetek]

It's a resolution thing. I changed my scan line height to .55 and it looks way better. Just make sure you create an ini with that setting for each game.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Cool, That made a difference - Ive never changed the scanline height before - with that being said, how many different game HLSL types are you running? Id hate to go through EVERY game and make one up for each.

[vettetek]

As far as the slotmask .png file goes - is there a latest and greatest file for this?
I mean, I understand this is supposed to be a layover mask to simulate the RGB slotmask of an anctual tube, but for some reason it doesnt look as I would think a tube would look.
I have it set as listed in the above code (6&4), however it still doesnt look right.
I imagine that it should look the same on most everyones setup using the same code - shouldnt it?
any recommendations?
Thanks!

[u-man]

I would try a higher prescale, preferable 8 or more and look how this turns out. Sadly there is no other file than this.
you could also try to use a effect file for the shadowmask. I recommend cgwg´s one from here:
http://www.mameworld.info/ubbthreads/postlist.php?Cat=&Board=emuadvice

hope that helps

[vettetek]

Thanks -
I appreciate the help. I guess Im just not getting my head around all the settings and what they do.
Yesterday I ended up giving up and went to the LOTTES GLSL shader and it seems to be the closest I can get to the real thing.
I guess it would be nice to have a settings guide for HLSL thats new and relevant. Something that says:
"if its doing (blank) then change the numbers in the (blank) setting."
Problem is I have no idea what im changing and if its making it better or worse.
The prescale is one, the shadow mask is another, then theres scanlines. How do they all work? And of course the .png file - should I use shadow mask, apature, shadow_mask, etc? I searched and found many different versions and sizes of the files. Not sure which one is right for my resolution and tiling.
That brings up another issue. Im using a 50" plasma on its side with an effecive resolution of 1080x1080. So then what does THAT do to then settings? Ive tried plugging in others .ini files and it just doesnt look right.
 
So - since theres no authority on this or a guide I just went with what seems to work for me and is generic.

[rball5]

I used this as my source of information when modifying my hlsl settings:  http://gamingnos.blogspot.com/2011/10/quick-start-mame-hlsl-filter-guide-up.html

I set up my mame.ini file for roms with one resolution. 
When I was happy with that result, I created a batch file to make individual ini files for all roms with other resolutions.  In these files, I set shadow_mask_x_count & shadow_mask_y_count to match the original rom's resolution.  I also set hlsl_prescale_x = 1920/'original x_resolution' & hlsl_prescale_y = 1080/'original y_resolution' (I'm using a 1920x1080 display). 
I also created ini files for vector games to improve display, but there were no special resolution settings for these.

I'm still very new to this, but I'm quite happy with the hlsl effects I got using this method.

edit to add:  I'm using aperture.png rather than slotmask.png - I don't know how this affects settings (I've not messed with slotmask.png).

[lamprey]

I used this as my source of information when modifying my hlsl settings:  http://gamingnos.blogspot.com/2011/10/quick-start-mame-hlsl-filter-guide-up.html

I set up my mame.ini file for roms with one resolution. 
When I was happy with that result, I created a batch file to make individual ini files for all roms with other resolutions.  In these files, I set shadow_mask_x_count & shadow_mask_y_count to match the original rom's resolution.  I also set hlsl_prescale_x = 1920/'original x_resolution' & hlsl_prescale_y = 1080/'original y_resolution' (I'm using a 1920x1080 display). 
I also created ini files for vector games to improve display, but there were no special resolution settings for these.

I'm still very new to this, but I'm quite happy with the hlsl effects I got using this method.

edit to add:  I'm using aperture.png rather than slotmask.png - I don't know how this affects settings (I've not messed with slotmask.png).

Since the HLSL update on Mame 0162 that isn't how it works anymore. I wasn't sure myself how it worked, so I asked over at MameWorld and the dev responded with some more detailed information:

http://www.mameworld.info/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=mamechat&Number=341037

Cheers!

[vettetek]

Lamprey,
Yeah I stumbled upon that thread - I just didnt understand the explanation given.
Hes showing 2 different layers then? 1 for slot mask and one for the aperture grill?
So im guessing I should do some math to figure out the size of my texture based on my display size? (1080x1080)
However, if im running a virtual bezel then do I use the complete resolution size or the emulated game "screen" size?
I see alot of .ini files that have 0 prescale - why is that if its recommended as at least 6?
Id really like to use this as it seems to be the most adjustable and current in development, I just cant get the look as good as GLSL.

[lamprey]

Lamprey,
Yeah I stumbled upon that thread - I just didnt understand the explanation given.
Hes showing 2 different layers then? 1 for slot mask and one for the aperture grill?
So im guessing I should do some math to figure out the size of my texture based on my display size? (1080x1080)
However, if im running a virtual bezel then do I use the complete resolution size or the emulated game "screen" size?
I see alot of .ini files that have 0 prescale - why is that if its recommended as at least 6?
Id really like to use this as it seems to be the most adjustable and current in development, I just cant get the look as good as GLSL.

What Jezz provided (ignoring the Math parts) is what your settings should be for those given mask images (adapture-grill, slot, etc). You only use one at a time, depending on the affect you like best. You shouldn't, in theory, need to take into account your screen resolution or the games resolution anymore as this should be calculated HLSL now.

As far as prescale goes, that changed too. Prescale 0 used to be Auto. Now, a Zero (0) is none. I've generally gone away from HLSL to GLSL, but like Uman mentioned you need to set the prescale pretty high now: 8 seems to be about right. But, that might tax your video card, so it's always good to test things out to see that your system can handle.

[vettetek]

thanks for the clarification - so you have gone to GLSL too? Can I ask why? Is it better in your opinion? Less processing power needed? Or just the look?
Id LOVE to use HLSL but I just cant get it to look as good as GLSL.

[lamprey]

thanks for the clarification - so you have gone to GLSL too? Can I ask why? Is it better in your opinion? Less processing power needed? Or just the look?
Id LOVE to use HLSL but I just cant get it to look as good as GLSL.

I love HLSL because you can really tweak it without having to know how to modify shaders. I think it's pretty damn awesome for what it does. I love tweaking it so that the screen as a slight flicker and the pixels are slightly mis-aligned. It's just too cool to make your perfect LCD looks like a crappy CRT..

However, I changed before the last HLSL update because GLSL, at the time, really gave me a crisp clean look I wanted with less demand on the CPU. That having been said, I can get the "new" HLSL to look pretty damn close (if not identical) to GLSL (lottes' shader), but it takes more processing power do the prescale. But, honestly, the difference between the two are pretty minimal now. HLSL gives you a lot more control though if you want to play around.

I can't remember off the top of my head, but there are some games that GLSL doesn't look so good on (on my machine) which I think is due to the game resolution, generally the higher resolution games. But, I have been able to tweak HLSL to look good with them so I am using HLSL for a handful of games and vector games.

[vettetek]

Thanks for the explanation.
I have the same thing - most classics (PAC,DK,etc.) look great on GLSL. However I have an affinity towards MCR games - although they look ok, they have a distinct moire pattern about them. Im sure other games of that res and higher have the same issues.
Can you post what your settings are for those and vector games please?
Thanks!!

[rball5]

Since the HLSL update on Mame 0162 that isn't how it works anymore. I wasn't sure myself how it worked, so I asked over at MameWorld and the dev responded with some more detailed information:

http://www.mameworld.info/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=mamechat&Number=341037

Cheers!

Well dang! 
I'm running 0161, but maybe I'll start playing with 0162 to see what's new with hlsl.  Thanks for the info!

[lamprey]

Can you post what your settings are for those and vector games please?

My settings are probably slightly different than most people would want. My main Mame machine is "virtual cabinet" so that it displays marquee and bezel artwork for the game. So, I didn't want the actual game screen to 100% black, so it'll stand out a little bit from a black background. At any rate, below are the settings I use for HLSL raster and vector. Attached is the Lottes' GLSL shader that I've tweaked a little.

Raster:

Code: [Select]

#
# CORE SCREEN OPTIONS
#
brightness                1.02
contrast                  1.05
gamma                     0.80
pause_brightness          0.65
effect                    none

#
# DIRECT3D POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
hlsl_enable               1
hlslpath                  hlsl
hlsl_prescale_x           8
hlsl_prescale_y           8
hlsl_preset               -1
hlsl_write               
hlsl_snap_width           1920
hlsl_snap_height          1200


------------------- crt_shadow_mask settings -------------------

shadow_mask_texture shadow-mask.png
shadow_mask_x_count 6
shadow_mask_y_count 8
shadow_mask_usize 0.1875
shadow_mask_vsize 0.25

shadow_mask_alpha         0.40
shadow_mask_uoffset       0.0
shadow_mask_voffset       0.0
curvature                 0.15
round_corner              0.00
reflection                0.00
vignetting                0.00
scanline_alpha            1.0
scanline_size             1.0
scanline_height           1.0
scanline_bright_scale     1.0
scanline_bright_offset    0.45
scanline_jitter           0.00

defocus                   0.2,0.2
converge_x                -0.1,0.0,0.1
converge_y                0.1,0.0,-0.1
radial_converge_x         0.0,0.0,0.0
radial_converge_y         0.0,0.0,0.0

red_ratio                 1.050000, 0.000000, 0.100000
grn_ratio                -0.100000, 1.000000, 0.250000
blu_ratio                -0.250000, 0.250000, 1.250000

saturation                1.60000
offset                    0.0,0.0,0.0
scale                     1.00,1.00,1.00
power                     1.00,1.00,1.00
floor                     0.01,0.01,0.02
phosphor_life             0.0,0.0,0.0
Vector:

Code: [Select]

#
# CORE VECTOR OPTIONS
#
antialias                 1
beam                      0.8
flicker                   1

#
# VECTOR POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
vector_length_scale       0.8
vector_length_ratio       500.0

#
# BLOOM POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
raster_bloom_scale        0.6
vector_bloom_scale        1.00
bloom_lvl0_weight         1.0
bloom_lvl1_weight         0.23
bloom_lvl2_weight         0.19
bloom_lvl3_weight         0.18
bloom_lvl4_weight         0.17
bloom_lvl5_weight         0.16
bloom_lvl6_weight         0.15
bloom_lvl7_weight         0.14
bloom_lvl8_weight         0.13
bloom_lvl9_weight         0.12
bloom_lvl10_weight        0.11

[vettetek]

Thanks!
Im starting to wrap my head around it a bit more.
So now Im running HLSL on everything - different setups based on resolutions.
Plugging in your vector ini code on TEMPEST, it doesnt seem to work - at all. Is there something "special" about setting up the vector inis?

[lamprey]

Plugging in your vector ini code on TEMPEST, it doesnt seem to work - at all. Is there something "special" about setting up the vector inis?

Humm, not that I know of.

If you put only the potion I posted into a Vector.ini then you still need to have HLSL enabled in the MAME.ini. Unless you Vector.ini has all the settings already in it. Past that, I'm not sure what you would need to do. You could generate a new mame.ini and use that as a base for applying my vector settings...?