Correct Analog Settings For Space Harrier?

[lettuce]

So i have a Xbox 360 pad and am trying to set it up so the stick 'feels' right in space harrier, i have played the version YS Game Works on the Dreamcast and that analog stick control feels great but i just cant get it to feel right on MAME, any tips??

[BadMouth]

So i have a Xbox 360 pad and am trying to set it up so the stick 'feels' right in space harrier, i have played the version YS Game Works on the Dreamcast and that analog stick control feels great but i just cant get it to feel right on MAME, any tips??

See the mame section of the driving cab info thread stickied in the driving subforum  (IIRC your driving cab is xbox, so maybe you haven't messed with this stuff). 

After fixing the deadzone and saturation in mame.ini, the only setting in game is sensetivity.  Anything marked digital is only for keyboard keys or buttons.

[lettuce]

Thanks for the link....or though it seems thats just for racing wheels, where Space Harrier is an analog Joystick.

I guess i should change the set the joystick deadzone from the default .3  to .05. Is there any other settings in the mame.ini that effects analog joysticks??

Also in Space Harrier settings (TAB Key) there is a return to center settings or something, i have change that to '0' but harrier still centres himself

[BadMouth]

Thanks for the link....or though it seems thats just for racing wheels, where Space Harrier is an analog Joystick.

I guess i should change the set the joystick deadzone from the default .3  to .05. Is there any other settings in the mame.ini that effects analog joysticks??

Also in Space Harrier settings (TAB Key) there is a return to center settings or something, i have change that to '0' but harrier still centres himself

Analog settings do the same thing whether you are using a wheel or joystick.  The default deadzone is still too much.  Never map anything to INC or DEC ( it will make the analog controller behave like a non-analog controller).

Return to center is a DIGITAL adjustment.  As already stated,  It has no effect on analog controls.  Those (and INC/DEC) are for when you don't have an analog controller and are substituting a regular on/off joystick or button.

When using real analog controls, only map the axis and your only adjustment is sensetivity.

[adder]

maybe something useful here:

http://www.mameworld.info/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Number=309201

[lettuce]

Thanks for the info. Have change deadzone to .05 and seems lets 'jittery'

What does the joystick_saturation effect, its on 0.85 atm

[BadMouth]

Thanks for the info. Have change deadzone to .05 and seems lets 'jittery'

What does the joystick_saturation effect, its on 0.85 atm

Covered in the thread I directed you to.

.05 might be too low.  Experiment.

[lettuce]

Hmmm correct me if im wrong but isnt 'deadzone' supposed to refer to an area in the centre of the stick where moving it will not register anything in game and increasing/decreasing this value increases or decrease this area??

If my assumption is correct then MAME does not treat deadzone in this manner.

Let me explain, i changed the deadzone to '0.90' fired up Spacer Harrier and harrier move the full width of the screen left, right, down and up (as he should do) but when trying the diagonals harrier didn't hardly move at all from his centre position! As i slowly lowered the deadzone value harrier moved further away from the centre when trying the diagonals with setting '0.1' being the sweet spot where he move just as far in the diagonals as he does for left, right, up and down.

So the MAME deadzone setting only seems to have an effect on digionals inputs and doesnt effect left, right, up or down inputs what so ever!

[BadMouth]

Post a pic of your control mapping in MAME.

[lettuce]

Here you go...

[BadMouth]

Here you go...

Bah.  Based on your description of how the dead zone setting behaved, I was betting that you had INC and DEC mapped.  Mapping looks ok to me.

Not sure if there is a service menu in tgis game where you would need to calibrated the joystick.
I'll mess around with it later today and see if there's anything else to figure out.

[lettuce]

Here you go...

Bah.  Based on your description of how the dead zone setting behaved, I was betting that you had INC and DEC mapped.  Mapping looks ok to me.

Not sure if there is a service menu in tgis game where you would need to calibrated the joystick.
I'll mess around with it later today and see if there's anything else to figure out.

Ok thanks.

Also if you have any pointer for Road Blasters as well, as with an analog pad its impossible to control the car

[BadMouth]

I'm still on MAME 151 on my laptop.  Not sure if anything has changed since then.

Fired up Space Harrier.

Increased saturation to 1 (100%), this gives you more of the stick movement to work with.  The default 85% means that MAME sees the joystick as being all the way in a direction when physically it's only 85% in that direction.  It's like reducing the already tiny amount of travel on the thumbsticks even further.  The broader the movement of the analog stick, the easier it is to find and hold the correct position.

Decreased deadzone to .05 (the version of MAMEUI I use on my laptop jumps in 5% increments) - again we want more range of motion reported as an analog position data.  We also don't want to be moving the stick and nothing happen

Increased sensitivity to 200 - I didn't mess with trying to fine tune this too much.  200 was much better than the default 100.  255 (the maximum) felt overly sensitive.  There is probably room for more fine tuning here.

I could get into the service menu, but couldn't select most of the options.  Not sure what is going on there.
I get a pop-up when launching it saying there might have been a bad dump.

I think it plays much better with these settings.  Never played it on the dreamcast, so can't compare.

[BadMouth]

Road Blasters originally used an optical encoder, but had stops so it wouldn't spin all the way around.
I think something is screwy with the way MAME is translating analog input to the original optical controls.
It's way too sensitive.
It could probably be tweaked in the MAME code to work better, but I am not a coder.

Here is what I came up with for the way it is now:

Saturation to 1 (as always)
Cranking the sensitivity all the way down to 1 gets it fairly playable, but far from perfect.
Raising the dead zone to 10 or 15% will prevent the car from turning automatically when you take off.

[lettuce]

Thanks for your help, ill give your settings a go.

Whos the best best to reach out to regarding Road Blasters and what needs to be done to get it playable with an analog stick?

[Paul Olson]

I'm still on MAME 151 on my laptop.  Not sure if anything has changed since then.

Fired up Space Harrier.

Increased saturation to 1 (100%), this gives you more of the stick movement to work with.  The default 85% means that MAME sees the joystick as being all the way in a direction when physically it's only 85% in that direction.  It's like reducing the already tiny amount of travel on the thumbsticks even further.  The broader the movement of the analog stick, the easier it is to find and hold the correct position.

Decreased deadzone to .05 (the version of MAMEUI I use on my laptop jumps in 5% increments) - again we want more range of motion reported as an analog position data.  We also don't want to be moving the stick and nothing happen

Increased sensitivity to 200 - I didn't mess with trying to fine tune this too much.  200 was much better than the default 100.  255 (the maximum) felt overly sensitive.  There is probably room for more fine tuning here.

I could get into the service menu, but couldn't select most of the options.  Not sure what is going on there.
I get a pop-up when launching it saying there might have been a bad dump.

I think it plays much better with these settings.  Never played it on the dreamcast, so can't compare.

The min/max analog setttings were wrong in the driver, and that was fixed in .152 to match the manual. I tested it with an original controller, and it worked great. Just mentioning it since something was changed since your version, but I don't know how much it would affect other controllers.

On Road Blasters, I would guess that it just is not going to feel quite right using an analog controller. I tried before I got a real controller, and it just always felt wrong no matter what settings I used. 

[keylimesoda]

How does this work for 49-way games, like NFL Blitz?

[Howard_Casto]

Well a 49 way is a digital controller, not analog, so I doubt anything but a 49 way joystick is going to feel completely right. 

[BadMouth]

Well a 49 way is a digital controller, not analog, so I doubt anything but a 49 way joystick is going to feel completely right.

I don't see why the original 7x7 grid couldn't exist in software and be accurately triggered by an analog stick.


OP was trying to get analog sticks working in Blitz though, which apparently MAME isn't (or is no longer) configured for.
It's a MAME issue.

[lamprey]

Well a 49 way is a digital controller, not analog, so I doubt anything but a 49 way joystick is going to feel completely right.

I don't see why the original 7x7 grid couldn't exist in software and be accurately triggered by an analog stick.


OP was trying to get analog sticks working in Blitz though, which apparently MAME isn't (or is no longer) configured for.
It's a MAME issue.

I don't' want to spread misinformation, but I thought I read someplace that analog support was taken out of the Blitz driver (seattle?). I could be wrong and I should double check, but I don't think it supports 49-way sticks either (or didn't the last time I tried). Maybe Haze or some one more knowledgeable than myself can confirm/deny.

EDIT: When I say doesn't support 49-way sticks, I mean when you set the input to a 49-way via dip switches. It only worked for me as an 8-way stick.

[BadMouth]

I don't' want to spread misinformation, but I thought I read someplace that analog support was taken out of the Blitz driver (seattle?). I could be wrong and I should double check, but I don't think it supports 49-way sticks either (or didn't the last time I tried). Maybe Haze or some one more knowledgeable than myself can confirm/deny.

EDIT: When I say doesn't support 49-way sticks, I mean when you set the input to a 49-way via dip switches. It only worked for me as an 8-way stick.

I also thought I remembered people complaining about 49-way support being removed, but couldn't find anything to support it.
It isn't mentioned in the MAMEInfo.dat section on progettoemma.net

I was going to suggest trying an older build (in the other thread about blitz controls), but changed my mind when I couldn't find any info to back it up.
IIRC, MAME was around the late v120's to early v130's at the time people were mentioning it, but it could have been done earlier.