Time for another "best graphics card" thread

[big10p]

Hi

The old thread I read hasn't been posted to in 2 years, so am wondering if the HD 4890 is still the best card that works with GroovyMAME?

I've upgraded my cab PC to an i3 3.1GHz but am still getting slowdown in some games (eg. Ibara & Death Smiles). I'm guessing my HD 4350 is the bottleneck as my other i3 PC, with a low-mid range nVidia card, can run these games full speed, no problem.

[Sledge]

Yeah i don't think it's the video card that's the issue
3.1Mhz is pretty darn slow...

Even 3.1Ghz would be considered slow i think...

[Calamity]

It's definitely not a video card issue. A 4350 will perform just as well as a 4890 for MAME use, with much lower power consumption, heat, size, etc. I bet you're not using vsync at all with your other PCs with Nvidia cards.

People by the 4890 because they want to be able to run certain emulators different from MAME (whether they end up running them or not has not been a subject of serious study however).

[big10p]

Yeah, I'meant GHz, obviously (OP fixed).

3.1GHz is slow?! Like I say, MAME runs the games mentioned on my other i3 PC...

[big10p]

It's definitely not a video card issue. A 4350 will perform just as well as a 4890 for MAME use, with much lower power consumption, heat, size, etc. I bet you're not using vsync at all with your other PCs with Nvidia cards.

People by the 4890 because they want to be able to run certain emulators different from MAME (whether they end up running them or not has not been a subject of serious study however).

I am using vsync on my other PC, with full-screen HLSL, too.

I can't understand why I'm still getting slowdown if it's not the GFX card, then. 

[Calamity]

Anyway... I don't want to anticipate things, but I wouldn't like to induce wrong investment decisions so please please stick with your video hardware by now as there might be changes in the near future.

[big10p]

Anyway... I don't want to anticipate things, but I wouldn't like to induce wrong investment decisions so please please stick with your video hardware by now as there might be changes in the near future.

OK, will do. Thanks.

[Calamity]

I am using vsync on my other PC, with full-screen HLSL, too.

I can't understand why I'm still getting slowdown if it's not the GFX card, then. 

It is not the video card, trust me. Don't waste your money. Search for the problem somewhere else.

Besides, make sure you are comparing apples with apples. Either both CPUs are different (even if they are i3), or OS is different, or vsync is different (you don't know what tricks could the Nvidia drivers be doing with your frames behind scenes).

[big10p]

Yes, I did wonder if the difference in the two CPUs has something to do with it - the i3 in my desktop PC is a newer generation 3.5Ghz chip. The speed/power difference between the two i3 CPUs seems pretty big though, which surprises me.

[Calamity]

Yes, I did wonder if the difference in the two CPUs has something to do with it - the i3 in my desktop PC is a newer generation 3.5Ghz chip. The speed/power difference between the two i3 CPUs seems pretty big though, which surprises me.

Yeah I'd say the Intel labelling (i3/i5/i7) is misleading because generations is what actually makes the biggest difference.

[big10p]

Certainly seem so, Calamity. Just checked my desktop PC and it's actually a 4th generation 3.4GHz i3 (4130). MAME runs wonderfully on it - the only game I've played that I've seen any slowdown on is Radiant Silvergun. Think I'll look into swapping PCs as I don't use my desktop as much since getting a cab.

[lacanian]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the ATI HD 4890 is the most powerful card supported by CRT_EMU_DRIVER.

"Best" is subjective depending in your requirements.

[haynor666]

big10p if you are using Radeon on XP x64 than expect much worse performance than on other systems.

I had the same problem when comparing Pentium G3258 overclocked and i5 4670k. Solution will be enable mt in demanding drivers or switch to other systems like 7x64.

[big10p]

I'm using Windows 7 Pro 64-bit.

[haynor666]

Then you should have any problems even with Radeon 4350. I suggest to replace your processor with G3258 - cheaper but can be overclocked to 4,2 GHz very easy. Single core performance will be much better than i3.

Just look at passmark scores. 4130 is only 1979, stock G3258 is close but once you overclock it can get more 2500 in passmark score and that's a lot.

You can look at my benchmarks: [link removed - outdated]
Those tests was done using mame 148 or close (don't remember exact version) so right now scores could be a bit worse. I'm planning to make benchmark again once dev ends with opengl bgfx changes.

[adder]

as Haynor suggested perhaps have a look into the world of overclocking. I had never done it before until a few months ago when I decided to get stuck in. it was fun and I ended up overclocking a 3.06ghz core2duo to 3.83ghz, by doing something called a 'pad mod'.
really pleased how it turned out, I didn't even have to change anything in the pc bios, my temps barely went up, and I stuck with the stock Dell fan (OptiPlex 755)

[big10p]

I can't afford another CPU - only just got this i3/mobo/RAM bundle, albeit second hand. I'm in the process of swapping it for the better one in my desktop PC, so will see how that works out.

I used to mess about with overclocking a lot, years ago. The BIOS in the 'new' i3 mobo seems to have lots of overclocking settings, so I will have a look into that, if needs be.

Cheers.

[Sledge]

I'm not sure about now, but in the 'old' days, raw clock speed (Ghz) was what benefited mame the most rather than newer generation cpu's.
I am tempted to build a new PC for mame as well.. but it's the above that has held me back as i just don't know if it would be a waste of $$ as the current CPU's haven't progressed much in clock speed

[big10p]

I'm not sure about now, but in the 'old' days, raw clock speed (Ghz) was what benefited mame the most rather than newer generation cpu's.
I am tempted to build a new PC for mame as well.. but it's the above that has held me back as i just don't know if it would be a waste of $$ as the current CPU's haven't progressed much in clock speed

Well, I can confirm Calamity is right saying generation of CPU is what counts, and GFX card makes little difference... I've just finished installing my 4th gen i3 into my cab setup (with it's Radeon HD 4350) and it plays Ibara, Deathsmiles at 100%, no problem, just as it did when fitted to my desktop PC with the higher-powered nVidia card.

The difference in performance between my 4th gen i3 (3.4GHz) and the 2nd gen one (3.1GHz) is night and day! I'm quite shocked at the difference. The 2nd gen one didn't perform much better than the core2duo it replaced, frankly.

[haynor666]

I have i5 2400 at work and it's very poor for cv1k. In fact it was a little better than overclocked E8500 to 3,80 GHz but if you read my benchmarks you know this already If you can buy G3258 and overclock it. It's best option money/performance for mame.

[adder]

also agree, cpu architecture certainly makes a difference
I had a P4 3.4ghz ages ago, and then on trying a core2duo 2ghz, the core2duo was actually as fast as, and better in some cases (eg. the game shienryu)

[lettuce]

Hmmmm I have an i3 ivybridge Intel CPU I believe and don't remember deathsmiles performance issues at all. May I suggest backing up your Mame.ini file and starting with a fresh ini file, maybe a setting got borked in the old ini file??

[big10p]

Ivybridge is 3rd generation though, isn't it (when Intel moved to 22nm tech)? Mine is a 2nd gen chip. However, now I've fitted into my desktop PC with the nVidia card, MAME does seem to run a bit better. The graphics card seems to make a little difference, just not a lot.

[big10p]

< weird double post deleted>

[haynor666]

Graphics cards does difference only if you run game unthrottled but this not make sense. For example when I test 250GTS vs GTX770 with the sameprocessor configuration with GTX770 was faster  but only because with GTX770 higher framerate in D3D than 250GTS. For groovymame graphics card really does not matter unless you are using XP x64 with Radeon 4xxx family.

[Calamity]

For groovymame graphics card really does not matter unless you are using XP x64 with Radeon 4xxx family.

It shouldn't matter anyway. I think you're generalising based on your specific case/problem.

[u-man]

It's definitely not a video card issue. A 4350 will perform just as well as a 4890 for MAME use, with much lower power consumption, heat, size, etc. I bet you're not using vsync at all with your other PCs with Nvidia cards.

People by the 4890 because they want to be able to run certain emulators different from MAME (whether they end up running them or not has not been a subject of serious study however).

Demul is the culprit...   The bad thing is, that it depends heavily on Direct X 11.  Off course, you can run Demul with Direct X 10 too, but 10 will be not more supported in the future and comparing 10 vs. 11 makes a huge difference.

So it would be nice, to have a ATI DirectX 11 card with reasonable power supported by the CRT-Emu Drivers. All Naomi and Sammy / Atomiswave Lovers would appreciate it

[apfelanni]

got 2 dell core2duo here with 3,x ghz and x600 / 4350 ati , windows xp 64 and both are running the cave sh3 titles with 100 % speed .  using crt emudrivers with conventionell 64 bit nonguimame .

[haynor666]

That depends on game. Benchmark from old version (about 0.148 I think):
mmpork - 206,31
ibara - 224,91
ibarablk - 232,56
pinkswts - 295,62
espgal2 - 304,32
futaribl - 312,76
futari15 - 325,85
ddpdfk - 337,83
deathsml - 415,10
dsmbl - 436,60
mushisam - 438,52
mushitam - 535,03

Teoritically stock E8500 is enough but during test 299 seconds you have attract mode, title screen etc. When You play there are several serious slowndown, very noticable on mmpork and ibara. Even on G3258 overclocked I have sometimes speed dropping to 99 or 98 %.

[adder]

When You play there are several serious slowndown, very noticable on mmpork and ibara. Even on G3258 overclocked I have sometimes speed dropping to 99 or 98 %.

you might try underclocking the cpu which the game uses, as games like that often would use a cpu more powerful than is needed, but mame still has to try to emulate the cpu at 100% (even though the game itself may never use eg. more than 75% of what the cpu is capable of).
try enabling cheats in mame.ini, then when you have launched the game, in the mame interface slider controls menu, go to where it says overclock cpu: maincpu and perhaps start by seeing what happens if you set the game cpu to 90% instead of 100%.

[haynor666]

Yeah, I remember this method
This can make unxpected slowdowns in game, this time not from emulation but rather too slow CPU for game not to mention possible errors during emulation :/