Risk in taking a PayPal gift as payment ?

[mike boss]

I'm selling some Sony PVM 2530 monitors via Kijiji.
As always many many many time wasters.
I've found a "serious" buyer asking that I hold them.
I said I can with PayPal (gift) or EMT.

He has agreed.

I know I'm a decent guy and if the monitors didn't work I'd refund him.
But once he hauls off these working beasts am I in risk of having this reversed.
I looked online, I think I am safe.

But you never know if some con has uncovered a way to get a refund.

Thank you

[HaRuMaN]

Gift you are safe as far as I know, it's risky for the buyer.  No buyer protections. 

[Malenko]

Gift you are safe as far as I know, it's risky for the buyer.  No buyer protections.

Sending as a gift pretty much means you cant dispute the charge. As far as I know the only way to even open a case if sent as a gift is if your paypal is compromised.

[mike boss]

For myself I'd give the buyer my info, home phone, etc.
My last name is on my PayPal account......not many with my last name out there.
I'm not looking to dupe anyone.

I just want to make sure I can not get F**KED!

So seems I'm good.

Thanks all

[JDFan]

Not sure but I think the problem with a gift would be if the payment winds up being on a stolen card where they later come back and take the money back out of your account after you've already shipped the item - Since it was a gift you couldn't dispute them taking it back since a gift can not be tied to a purchase (since it was supposedly a "Gift" ) -- Better and safer to just pay the fee so there is some protection if that does happen (not sure how Paypal handles purchases made on stolen cards but would think the fee includes some type of insurance since they are the ones making the approval ) 

[mike boss]

Hmmm......... well I can see if his info matches that of the email, etc.
And I will tell the buyer I'd like to see ID upon pick up, and I will record his license plate.
It's only $175... but still !!!!!

[JDFan]

Just googled and came up with this : ( http://forums.watchuseek.com/f2/beware-paypal-gift-chargeback-fraud-will-defraud-sellers-784828.html )

Exclamation BEWARE paypal GIFT chargeback fraud that will defraud SELLERS

    Many of you know that sending paypal GIFT payments offer little to no buyer protection.

    HOWEVER, there is a loophole where paypal gift can be used to defraud THE SELLER.

    I hesitate to share this info, but I think people should know and protect themselves.

    Here's the scenario:

        The seller asks for the funds to be paid as GIFT, thinking this offers protection for the seller.
        The buyer sends a paypal gift using a credit card by clicking on the pay the associated paypal fees option. (I am paraphrasing the exact option here.)
        The recipient of the payment (seller) receives the GIFT payment and the full amount shows up in their account as a gift.
        Everything looks okay so the seller ships the watch.
        Days or weeks later, the fraudster buyer will issue a chargeback with their credit card company by claiming that their credit card was stolen, etc. The lies are easy.
        Credit card company will issue a chargeback, and in response, Paypal will hold the associated funds--which are now in the seller's account.
        Because this was a GIFT transaction, as far as Paypal is concerned, there was no sale or exchange of goods.
        Because there was no sale, the seller cannot use shipment confirmation to argue a legitimate transaction. Evidence of shipment means nothing when there was no official exchange of goods.*
        Seller's funds are held/retracted and buyer gets a free watch.




    LESSON: DO NOT ACCEPT PAYPAL "GIFT" PAYMENTS IF YOU ARE A SELLER.


    *NOTE: If the PayPal transaction occurred using the "item or service" option, then the seller can at least try to fight chargeback fraud by submitting proof of shipping and/or delivery.

 

If he's picking them up and it's only $175 why not just make it cash ?

[mike boss]

WOW!!!!!

Ok, perhaps I'll just wait til the guy comes CASH in HAND!
I run the risk he will flake, but such in life with Kijiji.
I'd rather run that risk then give away the monitors for free.
Thank you

[nitrogen_widget]

WOW!!!!!

Ok, perhaps I'll just wait til the guy comes CASH in HAND!
I run the risk he will flake, but such in life with Kijiji.
I'd rather run that risk then give away the monitors for free.
Thank you

My brother will give people a window.
If they don't make that window the next person to show up with cash in hand walks away with whatever he is selling & everyone else is forgotten.
He doesn't have time for people that are "on their way" that never show up or 2 hrs late.

[Malenko]

I dont think an inaccurate post from 2013 should be taken as the gospel.  If you arent comfortable taking it as a gift, take it as a regular payment and eat the fees, or have him pay cash.

[menace]

The other thing to keep in mind is that paypal almost always finds in favour of the buyer in the event of a dispute with no signature handy (like on a pickup).  So he could come, take the monitors then dispute that he never received them--you have no proof so paypal refunds his money.

I sold a friends DS for him on ebay, shipped to buyer, buyer then send he never received it (even though it had a signature required and he signed it --phew--) paypal reluctantly (after a week or two of back and forth) found in my favour...

I would never take paypal on anything picked up--will paypal accept his signature on a piece of paper?  dunno--hate to pay to find out--kijiji is cash.period.

[Malenko]

exceptions to every rule.

Ive sold stuff to reputable buyers when they've paypalled, and Ive had people let me paypal when I picked things up.  But like I said, when in doubt, cash in hand.

[JDFan]

exceptions to every rule.

Ive sold stuff to reputable buyers when they've paypalled, and Ive had people let me paypal when I picked things up.  But like I said, when in doubt, cash in hand.

+1 - there are always cases where you make an exception if they have a long history on the site with good feedback etc. and you feel comfortable enough to make the exception that's your decision. Personally I would think if they have time to come and pick the item up they have time to stop by an ATM on the way (or go to a local ATM after looking at the items if they don't feel comfortable bringing cash to an unknown meeting place.) and if they can't get the cash and only have paypal to pay for it that kind of makes me wonder if somethings up anyway ! 

I dont think an inaccurate post from 2013 should be taken as the gospel.  If you arent comfortable taking it as a gift, take it as a regular payment and eat the fees, or have him pay cash.

OR you could look at it as if there have been people warning of the situation occurring since 2013 then there is fair reason to worry and/or look for other contradicting or confirming info. I'd much rather tell him the cautious side and be incorrect than tell him there will be no problem and be incorrect !

[pbj]

Or... you stop being an idiot and register two paypal accounts.  Funnel all hobby related business to one.  As soon as there's a balance on it, bounce it to your other account.  Then you stop worrying and doing weird creeper stuff like writing down license plates.

10,000th time I've posted this.   

[HaRuMaN]

Or... you stop being an idiot and register two paypal accounts.  Funnel all hobby related business to one.  As soon as there's a balance on it, bounce it to your other account.  Then you stop worrying and doing weird creeper stuff like writing down license plates.

10,000th time I've posted this.   

Well if you hadn't deleted the first 9,999 times you wrote it... 

[pbj]

 

[Malenko]

RE:ATMs

Some people, like me, don't like carrying large amounts of cash through places we've never been before. Hitting an ATM 5 minutes from the guy's house is still 5 minutes more than Id want to have a couple hundred bucks cash on me. Also, my bank limits ATM withdraws to $500 /24hours so if I wanted to pick up something costing more than that, I'd have to carry the difference with me.

Re:2013 post
What you linked is about a credit card charge back, not a paypal gift issue. CC charge backs can happen on both gift and non gift paypal transfers; but gift transfers cannot be disputed through Paypal.

[yotsuya]

Or... you stop being an idiot and register two paypal accounts.  Funnel all hobby related business to one.  As soon as there's a balance on it, bounce it to your other account.  Then you stop worrying and doing weird creeper stuff like writing down license plates.

10,000th time I've posted this.   

Well if you hadn't deleted the first 9,999 times you wrote it... 

[RayB]

You have to wonder WHY would a buyer want to send payment as gift when that means THEY will pay the FEES instead of the seller? Makes no sense, does it??

[Malenko]

You have to wonder WHY would a buyer want to send payment as gift when that means THEY will pay the FEES instead of the seller? Makes no sense, does it??

payments sent as gift from a paypal balance or bank transfer have no fees.

[pbj]

As a show of good faith when you're dealing with someone that isn't a vendor?  I've gotten and received "paypal gifts" for several hobby related deals.


 

[Vigo]