Miter cuts hate me

[horizon]

So I am trying, in vain, to make some 45* miter cuts to have a (mostly) seamless box.  Having the miter saw on a flat surface, I check the square of the blade to the fence, fence to the work surface, and work surface to the blade.  Everything was aligned to be 90*.  Although not purely scientific, I made a cut at )*, turned over the waste and checked for fit.

I then used a framing square to align the blade (made sure not to rub on a tooth of the blade) to the framing square.  The blade was pointed to my left.  I cut off the edge of my 1x6" to give me something to check with my square, appeared to be spot on.  I then left the blade to the left, and cut each board.  When I needed a reciprocal angle, I rotated the board, and left the blade pointing to the left.  I should also mention I borrowed this guy from my dad, who has used for about 200 cuts total.

When I went to glue and screw everything together, my miter cuts were > 90*. My guess is around 100*, maybe 105*.  Needless to say, this was a huge frustration.  I also discovered that using 18ga nails into a scrap piece wont hold the joints for crap.

The most annoying part:  The scrap piece seemed to fit/align perfectly.

Where am I going wrong with my calculations/methods of aligning the blade?  How do you make sure you make perfect cuts on any saw, be it miter, chop, or otherwise?

[yotsuya]

Sadly, I've learned that that's what wood filler is for, homie.

[horizon]

Yots - Stain has slightly less love for wood filler compared to miter cuts and me.  Where you been in my build thread?

I should also mention that I checked the board for warp, and it was really, really straight when purchased.  In fact, this was the case with 3 different boards.

ETA:  If I can't quickly figure this out, I will end up going with simple butt joints, and that is far from desirable.

[Vigo]

is the blade itself warped? Is it possible the miter clamp is not tight enough and moved a little? Did the wood bow under the weight of your saw when cutting?

Does your saw stop dead at 45 degrees? My miter chop saw and circular saw both do. I never measure the angle when it is 45 and have not noticed anything major enough to warrant calibration.

[horizon]

is the blade itself warped? It's brand new, and I haven't taken it off to check.
Is it possible the miter clamp is not tight enough and moved a little? Definitely possible, but unsure how likely.
Did the wood bow under the weight of your saw when cutting? Not that I could tell.  I went fairly slowly.  I didnt grip it and rip it - this time!

Does your saw stop dead at 45 degrees? My miter chop saw and circular saw both do. I never measure the angle when it is 45 and have not noticed anything major enough to warrant calibration. It does not, and this is why I busted out the squares I mentioned above.

I should probably note this is a compound miter saw as well, thats why i need to make sure it was 90* to the fence/work surface.

[wp34]

At a woodworking seminar I was at recently they showed how to do miters using a 45-degree chamfer.  I haven't tried this yet but it looked really slick.

http://www.woodmagazine.com/woodworking-tips/techniques/routing/miters/

[horizon]

Thats a great link, and I even have that, but Im working with 1x6" boards.  Thats why I busted out the borrowed compound miter saw.

[Vigo]

I have no idea what might be happening, but can you cut the board with a couple inches extra, then test it? If the angle is off, adjust the angle, shave off a little more, and repeat until you get a good 45 degree angle? Once you are good, make the cut exact.

[RoyalScam]

I'm happy with the cuts on my miter saw, but I've been wanting to build one of these for awhile now;


Perhaps, if you have a table saw, this might work better for you.
Regards,
Scam

[horizon]

I have some ideas and videos to make some sleds as well, the problem in this particular project is that the box is made with 1x6's standing tall.  The overall height of the box is 6".

I am going to try and angle the blade 45* and run them flat with my rip fence.  I will report back to see how that goes on my new scrap wood!

 

[BorgDog]

I have some ideas and videos to make some sleds as well, the problem in this particular project is that the box is made with 1x6's standing tall.  The overall height of the box is 6".

I am going to try and angle the blade 45* and run them flat with my rip fence.  I will report back to see how that goes on my new scrap wood!

 

rip fence?  why would you use the rip fence?  I assume you are talking on a table saw, put the blade at 45* and use your miter gauge at 90*.

[horizon]

Borg - I assume by miter gauge you actually meant 45*.  90* would be like putting it on the rip fence.  Yes, that is what I meant, sorry for the confusion.  Spaghetti brain today.

[BorgDog]

We are talking table saws here right? We may be using different terms, hopefully I can put clearly what I'm trying to say.

Below is a miter gauge for a table saw, it is used for making cross-cuts, or in your case a beveled end cut.



Below is a rip fence, made for cutting boards to narrower widths.



What I'm recommending is a cut like the one below with the table saw blade at 45 degrees.



Although you can use a rip fence to do miters it is much more setup work and I would not recommend it for 6" wide stock unless used in combination with the miter gauge.  See this article for that method http://www.instructables.com/id/Cutting-Precision-Miters-in-Ten-Minutes-or-Less/

[horizon]

Yup, I think we are talking about different things, or the same thing with different terms.

I have a rip cut sled that is 90* square to the blade of my table saw.

ie:


I also have a miter gauge, like what you showed above, but its sloppy inside the track itself.

I am planning on moving the blade to a 45* angle and using the factory fence to make the cuts.

I cant use a sled like this:


because the box isn't flat, the 1x6 is on end, meaning its 1" deep, 6" tall. 

And I am attempting to do it like this:

[bfauska]

It sounds like you've got a reasonable amount of experience but just in case I think it's worth mentioning that anytime you cross cut stuff on a table saw (the length of cut is less than the width of the piece) you dramatically increase the risk of kickback. I know far more people with stitches from a kickback accident than people who've had blade to finger contact on a saw (I know more of both than one would hope). If you've got an option to guide the wood with something more like the crosscut sled or miter gauge you will be a lot safer.

[BorgDog]

OK, not to nitpick, but you say "rip cut sled" and the article you pull the picture from is titled "Crosscuts With a Table Saw Sled"    

[horizon]

To be fair, you are nitpicking.  I'm not sure what your post contributes to the conversation.  To address your "point", I grabbed url's from google images, I didn't read the content from the site the images were on.

[BorgDog]

The point is you are not using the correct terminology and hence what you are saying and asking makes no sense to anyone who actually understands what the words mean.

[otsep]

I use this instead of the gauge on my table saw to verify the angle.

http://www.amazon.com/Wixey-WR300-Digital-Angle-Gauge/dp/B001PTGBRQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1422627683&sr=8-1&keywords=angle+gauge

[horizon]

I use this instead of the gauge on my table saw to verify the angle.

http://www.amazon.com/Wixey-WR300-Digital-Angle-Gauge/dp/B001PTGBRQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1422627683&sr=8-1&keywords=angle+gauge

Thanks man, appreciate the help and link.

I stood up a framing square to the table saw last night and dialed it in.  I cut a 1x5 3/4" board three times and everything lined up perfectly.  Just a much better solution than using the miter saw for me.