Emulating newer systems. Last I checked (many years ago), it wasn't possible.

[marioxb]

So.. way back in the PS2/ DC days, the situation was that you couldn't emulate anything perfectly newer than 16 bit. (I think). Now it seems that everything up to the Wii is emulatable. What changed? Have PC's really gotten that much better? How accurate are the post-16 bit emulators? What advantages are there to use a PC rather than the original system? How beefy of a PC do you need? Last I tried, I couldn't get any N64 or PS1 games working without glitches.

[shponglefan]

I've used N64 and PSX emulators.  The emulation is quite good these days and I could easily play through games start-to-finish without issues.

For PSX especially I prefer emulation to the real thing these days (in part because my PSX died ).  You can actually get better quality graphics over the original, although the lack of Z-buffering does rear its ugly head.  And there are advantages like being able to rip PSX games to your HD, thus eliminating load times, and being able to use save states.

FWIW, I'm still using a slightly older E8400 Core Duo and have had no performance issues with either N64 or PSX emulation.

[Rick]

I've used N64 and PSX emulators.

Call me dumb if you will, but what is PSX? PlayStation? Any specific version?

[marioxb]

Are you being serious or sarcastic? In any case, PSX is what everyone used un-officially to call PS1, way back when there was only PS1 (Not really sure why... though I was one of them). People aren't really supposed to use PSX when referring to PlayStation 1 anymore, since a device that's like a PS2 super-glued to a Tivo came out (a long time ago) in Japan, OFFICIALLY called the PSX.

Anyway, shponglefan (or anyone) what about PS2/ Xbox/ Wii/ GameCube/ CDi/ 3DO/ Saturn/ Dreamcast emulation?

[Rick]

Are you being serious or sarcastic?

Dead serious, sir. I've never been a console gamer. In fact, you could say I'm part of the "PC Elitists".

[shponglefan]

Yes, for the record PSX = Playstation (the original)

Anyway, shponglefan (or anyone) what about PS2/ Xbox/ Wii/ GameCube/ CDi/ 3DO/ Saturn/ Dreamcast emulation?

Haven't tried to emulate any of those.  I did look into Dreamcast emulation at one point, but the consensus seemed to be it was better to just buy a used one.

IIRC, Dolphin emulates Wii and Gamecube and is apparently pretty good.

[Malenko]

Anyway, shponglefan (or anyone) what about PS2/ Xbox/ Wii/ GameCube/ CDi/ 3DO/ Saturn/ Dreamcast emulation?

PS2 is emulated pretty great using http://pcsx2.net/ , No XBOX emu's I know of other than the one that runs on a 360. 3DO has a few emulators but the games on the 3DO are pretty weak. Dolphin runs Gamecube and Wii pretty great. CDi really? you wanna play the crummy Link games that badly?
Dreamcast has Demul and NullDC, together they run pretty much everything. SSF i sstill one of the better saturn emulators, but theres also Yabause and Satourne.

[SavannahLion]

Are you being serious or sarcastic? In any case, PSX is what everyone used un-officially to call PS1, way back when there was only PS1 (Not really sure why... though I was one of them). People aren't really supposed to use PSX when referring to PlayStation 1 anymore, since a device that's like a PS2 super-glued to a Tivo came out (a long time ago) in Japan, OFFICIALLY called the PSX.

Anyway, shponglefan (or anyone) what about PS2/ Xbox/ Wii/ GameCube/ CDi/ 3DO/ Saturn/ Dreamcast emulation?

PS-X is the name stamped on the early prototype DTL-H505 dev computers before the PS1 hardware was finalized. Not sure how people found out, probably from a publication like EGM or something. It was probably a way, early on, for gamers in the know to distinguish themselves from the casual gamers. The name stuck for years until Sony made a dumbass move and released their bastard PSX and retroactively renamed the PS1 and PSOne.

I attempted to bid on one when it hit eBay years ago. It's not an easy piece of hardware to find.

[Howard_Casto]

Are you being serious or sarcastic?

Dead serious, sir. I've never been a console gamer. In fact, you could say I'm part of the "PC Elitists".

So you are saying you willingly quarantined yourself from many of the best games in the past 30 years then?  Seriously man, pc gaming is great and all, but almost all of your best franchises are either console only or have very poor pc ports. 

PC elite has always been a dirty word to me.  You can't be elite unless you are getting the best stuff... in regards to gaming, pcs rarely give you that, unless you don't care that 90% of the commercial games you get are fps and mmo's, so long as their graphics run at a higher resolution. 

[Rick]

You can't be elite unless you are getting the best stuff... in regards to gaming, pcs rarely give you that, unless you don't care that 90% of the commercial games you get are fps and mmo's, so long as their graphics run at a higher resolution.

Once I started playing WASD, I was hooked. So yeah, most of my games have been FPS. I never got into handheld controllers, and have been a PC tech for over 20 years - which meant I always had the best stuff... ...and still do to this day. So, even a PC game on medium settings have always dwarfed what I've seen in consoles, and that's what's drawn me in.

(I still get pwned on Halo when on a console, but am/was good enough to hold my own against CAL-I players in CS.)

[rpgposer]

OP - Your assumption is more or less correct.  PS2 and Dreamcast emulation still have a ways to go, though.  I suggest an Intel I5 and 8GB of ram to emulate newer systems.  I have a core 2 duo with 4GB of ram and it is not enough.  Don't expect to see the original xbox emulated anytime soon.

[Malenko]

PS2 and Dreamcast emulation still have a ways to go, though.

Whole heartedly disagree. Well, to clarify, PS2 emulation requires a fairly beefy PC; but as far as completeness goes, it is downright amazing that pcsx2 has over 75% of the PS2 library completely playable. I played from beginning to end "Tales of Abyss" it was over 50 hours and I didnt have a single issue and the game looked better on my PC running at a higher than native resolution. I used a PS3 controller, so it was pretty authentic. 

As for dreamcast, the few games I have played ran pretty great too, I have a dreamcast and a boatload of games, so I dont use the emulator much.

[ark_ader]

Are you being serious or sarcastic?

Dead serious, sir. I've never been a console gamer. In fact, you could say I'm part of the "PC Elitists".

PC elite has always been a dirty word to me.  You can't be elite unless you are getting the best stuff...

I wasn't too impressed with PC Elite either, but I hear there is an Elite 4 that should be pretty good.

[Rick]

I wasn't too impressed with PC Elite either, but I hear there is an Elite 4 that should be pretty good.

And they said you didn't have a sense of humour.

[rpgposer]

PS2 and Dreamcast emulation still have a ways to go, though.

Whole heartedly disagree. Well, to clarify, PS2 emulation requires a fairly beefy PC; but as far as completeness goes, it is downright amazing that pcsx2 has over 75% of the PS2 library completely playable. I played from beginning to end "Tales of Abyss" it was over 50 hours and I didnt have a single issue and the game looked better on my PC running at a higher than native resolution. I used a PS3 controller, so it was pretty authentic. 

As for dreamcast, the few games I have played ran pretty great too, I have a dreamcast and a boatload of games, so I dont use the emulator much.

My experience with pcsx2 is a crash (reboot) within a few minutes after starting any game.  What you state above is correct, but no other emulator I use crashes my PC.  This tells me that regardless of performance or compatibility, the emulator has other issues, which is why I stated it still has a ways to go.
As far as Dreamcast emulation goes, demul is the best as far as I can tell, and many games have strange behavior.  Compare that to dolphin, which plays most gamecube and wii games flawlessly (yet slowly on my pc).

[Malenko]

My experience with pcsx2 is a crash (reboot) within a few minutes after starting any game.  What you state above is correct, but no other emulator I use crashes my PC.  This tells me that regardless of performance or compatibility, the emulator has other issues, which is why I stated it still has a ways to go.
As far as Dreamcast emulation goes, demul is the best as far as I can tell, and many games have strange behavior.  Compare that to dolphin, which plays most gamecube and wii games flawlessly (yet slowly on my pc).

Well your experience isn't the same as the majority of others. Ive run pcsx2 on numerous systems without issue and judging by their forums, no one seems to have the issues you are.  Perhaps you should update all your drivers and what not and try the latest build. Im not syaing you didnt have a bad experience, Im just saying its more of the exception than the rule and since they have new builds out every few hours, it cant hurt to try a new one 

[rpgposer]

Sigh.  I am not the only person with this particular issue.  Here is a forum post dated 7/22/2013 that describes a similiar problem to mine:  http://forums.pcsx2.net/Thread-PCSX2-has-stopped-working--37873?highlight=crash.  I have xaudio configured.  I have updated my drivers, have the latest BIOS, switched video card brands and even updated my OS from XPx86 to Win8x64.  I have the correct Visual C++ libraries installed.
I update to the latest SVN version every couple of weeks in vain hopes that the issue will be resolved.
I don't expect you to help me, I can help myself. 
The only reason I made this post was to try get you to understand I am not an emulator newb.

Thank you.

[Malenko]

didnt mean to imply newb, sorry.

Win8 is horrible, Im forced to use it at work, so I feel your pain. I have only ran pcsx2 on Win7x64 systems, I don't know how much of an option it is to try that. Dont know if its any help, but all 3 major PCs I use are ASUS mobos using onboard sound and nVidia video cards. 2 intels (i5 and i7) and 1 AMD, an OLD SKOOL Phenom 9600. I believe I actually ran direct sound on all of them because for some reason the audio was better, and perhaps thats why I never had it crash. I did have 3 or 4 hour long marathon sessions of Tales of Abyss.

I meant to imply that the emulator is exception and more often than not it works for most end users. It sucks you're having a problem with it, but you are more of the exception and not the rule.

[ark_ader]

Wi 8 is the same as win7 with a new interface which can be remedied with some registry changes or software modification.

I just upgraded (ignore the 8.1 upgrade just screws up everythig) to 8 on the arcade pc and everything runs perfectly.

If you have emu problems it will be your xp dated hardware. Upgrade or stick to xp.

DC, PS2 and Xbox run their own libraries,  there is nothing like the real deal, especially on an xarcade enabled cab. 

[Rick]

Wi 8 is the same as win7 with a new interface which can be remedied with some registry changes or software modification.

Not entirely true. There are a good number of changes made to the kernel to harden it against rootkit and malware attacks, not to mention the obvious changes required to make the UI more "tablet friendly".

So no, it's not as simple as a "rebadged Windows 7".

[Howard_Casto]

Eh... yeah it is. 

The differences between 7 and 8 aside from the gui are the differences between vista and 7, or 2000 and xp.  In other words not that big a difference other than the fact that one is newer and they've added a few things. 

[Howard_Casto]

You can't be elite unless you are getting the best stuff... in regards to gaming, pcs rarely give you that, unless you don't care that 90% of the commercial games you get are fps and mmo's, so long as their graphics run at a higher resolution.

Once I started playing WASD, I was hooked. So yeah, most of my games have been FPS. I never got into handheld controllers, and have been a PC tech for over 20 years - which meant I always had the best stuff... ...and still do to this day. So, even a PC game on medium settings have always dwarfed what I've seen in consoles, and that's what's drawn me in.

(I still get pwned on Halo when on a console, but am/was good enough to hold my own against CAL-I players in CS.)

There are other genres besides the fps you know... it's actually the weakest and most generic genre.  You've kind of proved my point if that's what you primarily play.

[Rick]

There are other genres besides the fps you know... it's actually the weakest and most generic genre.  You've kind of proved my point if that's what you primarily play.

You neglected to say "in my opinion"... ...and really, who cares? I play on PC because the power, graphics and controls are superior. Do some console "specific" titles offer a better experience overall? Maybe. Did I miss out on something that would have given me some life changing Epiphany? Probably not.

[Rick]

Eh... yeah it is. 

The differences between 7 and 8 aside from the gui are the differences between vista and 7, or 2000 and xp.  In other words not that big a difference other than the fact that one is newer and they've added a few things.

Not that big a difference between VISTA and 7? You're either trolling or seriously out of the loop.

[ark_ader]

Eh... yeah it is. 

The differences between 7 and 8 aside from the gui are the differences between vista and 7, or 2000 and xp.  In other words not that big a difference other than the fact that one is newer and they've added a few things.

Not that big a difference between VISTA and 7? You're either trolling or seriously out of the loop.

Nope he is right.  This is from a person who has professionally supported every version of windows (and Mac) for the past 25 years

In other words I ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- you not.


I feel old now....

[rpgposer]

So, I admit, Malenko was correct in part:
I updated to the latest SVN of PCSX2 and changed the audio from xaudio2 to directx and voila:  ffxii ran at pretty much full speed using GSDX set to original resolution with texture filtering and edge AA turned on.  I played for an hour with no crashes.  Pretty impressive for 7 year old hardware.
Not complaining about win8, I think it's great, except for the start screen, which I have workarounds for.  It's stable and fast.
Not budging on my stance regarding PS2 and DC emulation, it's not at the SNES/PS1(X)? level.
 

[Malenko]

Im just happy you got it all working 

[SithMaster]

I need to look into getting this setup to play Time Crisis 3.  Seems my biggest hurdle will be trying to get my guncon2s to work though it appears some of their forum members have been working on that though I might be mistaken and they are all using wiimotes.  Still better than overpaying for a used ps2 or fixing my slim with the selfdestruction laser.

[marioxb]

I need to look into getting this setup to play Time Crisis 3.  Seems my biggest hurdle will be trying to get my guncon2s to work though it appears some of their forum members have been working on that though I might be mistaken and they are all using wiimotes.  Still better than overpaying for a used ps2 or fixing my slim with the selfdestruction laser.

I was under the impression that the slims didn't break as much as the old ones? In any case the slims don't have the firewire port to link 2 PS2's if that what you were trying to do.

Speaking of which, any way to play Time Crisis 4 linked on 2 PS3's or 2 PC's or anything? I'm sure it's not playable in MAME yet...

[SithMaster]

I need to look into getting this setup to play Time Crisis 3.  Seems my biggest hurdle will be trying to get my guncon2s to work though it appears some of their forum members have been working on that though I might be mistaken and they are all using wiimotes.  Still better than overpaying for a used ps2 or fixing my slim with the selfdestruction laser.

I was under the impression that the slims didn't break as much as the old ones? In any case the slims don't have the firewire port to link 2 PS2's if that what you were trying to do.

Speaking of which, any way to play Time Crisis 4 linked on 2 PS3's or 2 PC's or anything? I'm sure it's not playable in MAME yet...

The first model slims were prone to having what can only be considered a defect were the laser would draw too much power and die.  I forgot about being able to use the firewire for time crisis but I meant using the guncons with the pc emulator using a plugin.  The guncon2 required the composite video connection so I have no idea how they get it working though I havent dug too far into the subject.

[ark_ader]

Works My Guncon2 with a TV via Laptop composite I have the 3-1 Joybox.  I haven't Tried it with the MagicVGA (composite to VGA box ) yet.

Also possible with TopGun (pain to configure and you need a powered USB hub) with Guncon Emulation for the PC, PS3 PS2 and Xbox, but with the projector! 

Note: Move Controller is possible (cabinet friendly) with Razing Storm and HOTD Overkill. 

[SNAAKE]

So you are saying you willingly quarantined yourself from many of the best games in the past 30 years then?   

"PSX" had an amazing library of games.

[Howard_Casto]

As did the nes/snes/n64/genesis ect.... if he had said for the last couple of years or so that would have been one thing, but 20.... yeah in that case having on a pc is like getting only the 4 network channels on tv. 

[DillonFoulds]

I've been through phases.... My gaming credentials:
Played nearly every NES title, then it was all PC (Win95-98se; From DOOM to MS Puzzle Pack to Rayman to CnC 95 to Diablo 2) until N64 (Tons of 007, SM64, MK64, SSB, CBFD, Mario Party) and PSX (MANY RPGs, some racing like GT2 100% but also some platformers like Spyro or Gex). Then I got a job and was back into PC gaming (far cry 1 era, Barton 2500+ then 3200+) and HALO came around and I got sucked back into consoles for xbox LANs, but primarily PC gaming. Then the girlfriend came along, and I moved out of my parent's house and gaming fell to the side, with the odd gaming binge (WC3's DotA primarily for PC, Metal Gear Solid franchise and Just Cause 2 99.60% on variety of consoles) on the side. Now finally I'm getting back into gaming, and most console games just don't grab me, especially not on xbox. PS3 has a few titles that have been taunting me, but I'm not sure I'll ever get around to playing. Now I've gone and upgraded my HTPC (i5 3570k, GTX 560ti) and Desktop (i5-4670k and GTX 770) and I'm starting to get back into PC gaming, mostly for Diablo 3, DotA2 and various Steam games.

TL;DR - I've played a variety of titles across a variety of platforms.

No point sticking to one platform. There's so much out there, and the control schemes just work better for some games (GAMES, NOT GENRES). Sometimes the experience is just -better- on a different platform. I was 100% Sony and hates xbox, but I was a quick convert, and I've flip-flopped between Nintendo, to Microsoft, to Sony.

[GibsonRiddler]

I was a fanboy once then I realized I was missing out.

[Warborg]

Wi 8 is the same as win7 with a new interface which can be remedied with some registry changes or software modification.

Not true...  I worked in an Intel validation lab where we used various flavors of Linux and WinXP/7/8 in both x86 and x64 flavors and Win8 did have some moderate changes under the hood as well, certainly caused some compatibility issues and odd behavior.

[Warborg]

There are other genres besides the fps you know... it's actually the weakest and most generic genre.  You've kind of proved my point if that's what you primarily play.

Hmm...  Well, I didin't see him state or even imply FPS superiority over other genres, while you have declared apparently as the authority on games that FPS is the weakest?  And here I thought it all boiled down to personal preference of the player...  silly me...

I have played consoles since the Atari VCS...  I've had a VCS, a Colecovision, Atari 5200, Vectrex, NES, SMS, SNES, Genesis, N64, PSX, Dreamcast, Gamecube, PS2, XBOX, Wii, 360, PS3, and probably a couple I forgot...  Along with home computers from the Tandy MC-10 up...  So I have plenty of console experience, and love a lot of console games and do think they are superior for certain types of games...  And yet, I still think FPS on the PC is the most fun *for me* (although, I've been on a real Batman Arkham Asylum/City kick on my PC right now...  With a few bursts of Super Punch-Out with ZSNES).

Anyway, I think this has spun off topic, and I didn't help with my little tirade, so I guess I'll leave it at the "best" type of game(s) are the ones you enjoy the most, even FPS games if that's your thing.  Now, as to emulation of the newer consoles, at least my experiences with the newest versions of PCSX2 and Dolphin have been pretty positive, they have run most of the stuff I've thrown at them and ran them at least as well as the original consoles, and at times with enhanced graphics over what the original console could do.  My main focus for PCSX2 has been to run the SDF Macross import, along with Another Century's Episode and some Armored Core and all run great (also briefly tried Kingdom Hearts and Aggressive Inline and had those running well too).  I've also been experementing with the newest Demul for Dreamcast/Naomi/Atomiswave stuff and been pretty impressed, although have had some mixed results depending on the game.