smart power strip (australian plug!)

[Jeromebechaz]

i really need to know where i can fine a smart strip, the one like "Bits Limited" makes but that will suit australian ports, i went on there site but they dont do this, anyone know of a different kind?
please help

[Howard_Casto]

You can make one yourself, it's really easy. 

All you need is a regular power strip, a 5v relay and computer power connector.  You hook your pc up to another strip and all of your accessories to the one you modified.  That relay is connected to the 4 pin connector on your computer's power supply, so when you turn on your pc, it sends 5v volts to the relay which will in turn switch on the modified power strip and all of your accessories.  The usb port also supplies 5v so you  could use a usb cable instead. 

There are tons of tutorials on the net about how to do this.  Make sure you fully understand what you are doing and the risks (you are working with house current afterall) but other than that it's a really easy hack to do....

I did it for all of my arcade cabs mainly due to the savings in cash. 

Parts list:

Electrical outlet - 0.99
Electrical box - 0.99
Face Plate - 0.99
Micro 5v relay ~ 0.60 (Bought a package of 30 for around 20 bucks off of eBay)
Pc power cord - free (you should have tons of these lying around)
Pc Power Connector 1.00 at the local Dollar Tree

So yeah, I made mine for 4 dollars and 60 cents a piece, as opposed to ~80 bucks. 

[CoryBee]

This ^^^

I just made one in 15 minutes for my 4-Player Build.

I saw this and knew it would be an easy build.

[NiN^_^NiN]

i really need to know where i can fine a smart strip, the one like "Bits Limited" makes but that will suit australian ports, i went on there site but they dont do this, anyone know of a different kind?
please help

Are you talking about one where if the PC turns on then everything else turns on and when the PC turns off then everything else turns off?

If so you can get a Planet Ark power saver board from Coles, Safeway and Bunnings it will allow one Master device that powers on everything if it's got power if that is the correct type of smart strip you are talking about.

Also it's illegal for any electrical work to be done without a license which can come back to bite you on the ass with stiff fines (We don't have the freedom to try it ourselves and hope we don't kill ourselves like USA)

[Vigo]

Also it's illegal for any electrical work to be done without a license which can come back to bite you on the ass with stiff fines (We don't have the freedom to try it ourselves and hope we don't kill ourselves like USA)

You have got to be joking me!

[Jeromebechaz]

thanks for the help nin nin, i will have a look around, do you know the price?

and yeah i dont really care about the legal issues

[Howard_Casto]

Also it's illegal for any electrical work to be done without a license which can come back to bite you on the ass with stiff fines (We don't have the freedom to try it ourselves and hope we don't kill ourselves like USA)

You have got to be joking me!

+1000

I don't think adding a relay to a consumer level device is considered "electrical work" in any country.  Me thinks Nin might just be a little electrically ignorant.

[NiN^_^NiN]

Also it's illegal for any electrical work to be done without a license which can come back to bite you on the ass with stiff fines (We don't have the freedom to try it ourselves and hope we don't kill ourselves like USA)

You have got to be joking me!

No Joking it's very regulated down here it's either a licence to do it or it's illegal if it's 240v electrical work.

thanks for the help nin nin, i will have a look around, do you know the price?

and yeah i dont really care about the legal issues

I don't know the price but these are the places that have the Planet Ark board i was telling you about
http://www.ji.com.au/wheretobuy/

Also if your searching online your better off using what australians call that item which is powerboard. It's very easy to start using american names for things cause of this forum and not find them available down here

Also it's illegal for any electrical work to be done without a license which can come back to bite you on the ass with stiff fines (We don't have the freedom to try it ourselves and hope we don't kill ourselves like USA)

You have got to be joking me!

+1000

I don't think adding a relay to a consumer level device is considered "electrical work" in any country.  Me thinks Nin might just be a little electrically ignorant.

Any work to do with 240v is electrical work that needs a license and no I'm not electrically ignorant although you do seem to be regarding our laws but hey you don't live here so it's understandable 

http://www.justice.qld.gov.au/fair-and-safe-work/electrical-safety/for-householders-and-consumers/dontdiy

[danny_galaga]

What nin nin says is true, and frankly, I don't know why it's not illegal in other developed countries. There is not only the risk of hurting yourself, but others too. Having said that, I am guilty of doing a few 240V repairs/builds myself.

Maybe being 110V it's considered not as dangerous    (and before anyone says it's not the voltage that kills you, it's the amps. No, it's V/I x R. Doesn't matter what voltage mains you have, your bodies resistance is much the same)

I'm sure I've mentioned this before, but in my home town there was a manager of a tyre shop who decided to fix a bench grinder. An apprentice was electrocuted and died. The manager went to gaol for manslaughter. Obviously the legislation didn't stop him doing it, but it means people are less LIKELY to...

[Howard_Casto]

Well I think my question would be why in the blue hell is your country running on a 240v system?  That's extremely dangerous.

Over here we use 110v because, while not recommended, you can literally stick your finger in a light socket and be just fine.  Mind you it'll do more than just tickle, but you get my point.  Typically in your average household there are only two devices that require 220 (note that's still not 240)... the washing machine and potentially your heat/ac unit.  For that we put two 110 lines together and use a larger circuit breaker on the other end. 

So there's the answer to your question... over here in the states we have a relatively safe power grid and you guys don't. 

I apologize for the confusion.    I'm not sure if I'd be messing with relays and what-not over there now that I know this.  On our system accidentally touching a wire/contact would result in various curse words to spew out of your mouth, but 240, damn that could really kill you. 

(Btw I am NOT suggesting that 110v is safe to touch, it isn't.  It's just typically it doesn't result in serious injury)

[ChadTower]

Typically in your average household there are only two devices that require 220 (note that's still not 240)... the washing machine and potentially your heat/ac unit.

This varies by region.  In my house for 220v I have the oven, the clothes dryer, one outlet in the kitchen that isn't being used and a line to the subpanel in my shed.  It's a small house without central air.  There are no natural gas lines were I live so people have electric ovens but no gas lines also means we have oil heat.  Furnaces only need electricity for the controls and the blower and I believe mine is 110v.

I haven't seen any 220v home model washing machines in New England.

[Howard_Casto]

That's certainly true.. I forgot about electric stoves and 220 dryers, not washers (that was a flub on my part, sorry) are certainly almost extinct at this point (they do exist though).  But what I was getting at was any appliance that uses over 110v is fairly rare. 

[Vigo]

I've wondered, is there a significant advantage to 240 power supplies these days? I know it is common in a a number of countries, had me cussing that I couldn't plug anything in HK. I have to wonder if it is just because that's how it was back when everything took more power. It seems half the stuff I plug into the walls these days only takes 5v.

As far as the law about electrocution goes, I personally think it is ridiculous, but maybe it is related to the voltage difference. I have been zapped a few times, but can't imagine ever being compromised enough where it would be harmful. I think the batteries on cars would be far more dangerous. You guys are some of the most brilliant DIY'ers I've ever seen, and it from my point of view it seems a tad silly that you can't *legally* do your own electrical work.

I've done so much electrical, I can't imagine the amount of money I would've had to put down over the years to have a licensed electrician do it. It would probably be in the 10's of thousands. I'm pretty darn thankful I have been able to put custom lighting and electrical all over my house, and the modern three phase wire makes standard work so ridiculously easy.

[ChadTower]

I did the electrical on the gameroom I am building now.  When I started I only had basic house wiring skills enough to replace fixtures.  I ended up learning enough to put in 1 new 20A circuit with a series of quad outlets and 1 new 20A circuit with more quad outlets and two zone track lighting on dimmers.  This is legal, I have an electrical permit, and it is subject to full inspection by the town wiring inspector.

I am pretty sure some states do not allow a layman to do their own electrical work like this.  Massachusetts allows it but I think Rhode Island does not.  In Rhode Island people get around that by hiring an electrician to pull their permit for them.

Learning the wiring codes can be tricky but they do make sense once you understand what you're doing.

[Howard_Casto]

It's politics I'd imagine.  Edison wanted the world to run on DC current, which is ridiculous and he had so much political power that he almost got his way.  Americans are eternally grateful for Tesla. 

Anyway... when the power grids across the globe were in their infancy, your major household appliances included a lightbulb, an iron and...... well that was it.  Aside from industrial parks (which typically generated their own power back then) there weren't any real power needs when most nations grids first started popping up.  So long story short, no it wasn't because of greater power needs in the past. 

It's been some idgit that said "yup we've gonna run 240" and now it's too late to rectify that mistake. 

I think some countries have a rather "bass-ackwards" way of looking at things.  I know here in the US and I'm pretty sure in most of the UK, anybody can do any work they want on their homes or appliances legally.  The thing is, to make your work legal you have an official inspector come in and look at the work.  This varies by region of course (pretty sure CA is afraid of diy) but it makes a lot more sense to me to do it this way.  In terms of appliances, it might effect your insurance coverage, but then again it's nearly impossible that the mods we are talking about could cause a fire. 

In terms of house wiring, a moron could do it in most cases.  You get your local regulations book, make sure you do what it says in terms of terminations, conduits, ect... and it's literally as simple as screwing three wires to a fuse box. 

[ChadTower]

I don't know any place in the US or Canada that won't allow you to work on an appliance that is plugged in.  Maybe some places won't allow you to work on hard wired appliances but even then I think that's only if you have to modify the wiring going into it.  Usually the issue is something like replacing an old furnace with a new one and having to bring the whole thing up to current code in the process.  The old stuff can stay adherent to the code from when it was installed but if you update the appliance you have to update the whole setup related to the appliance.

[Howard_Casto]

Sure you can.  It voids the warranty of the device in most cases, but that isn't the same as being illegal. 

[ChadTower]

Sure you can.  It voids the warranty of the device in most cases, but that isn't the same as being illegal.

If a permit is required, and the permit can only be pulled by a licensed <whatever>, it would be illegal to DIY.  I'm pretty sure that's the case in RI for a lot of things.  Then again the permit process in RI is more like sliding an envelope under the table than filling out an application.  RI has put more elected officials in jail for corruption than I even want to think about.  It's a vicious circle.

[Vigo]

I've personally never run into that issue because I never gotten a permit over work that is not *cough* publicly visible *cough* *cough*. 

[danny_galaga]

Ah, ok so it is about the difference in voltage. 240V sure as hell can kill you! I've been zapped with 110V plenny of times since when I was an apprentice auto electrician we had a 110V step down transformer for testing armature windings. Vigo, the only danger of a car battery is if you drop it on your foot 

When you guys are talking of doubling voltage for heavier appliances in the US, are you talking about 3 phase, because here it gets REALLY scary- 415V    I wonder if in the early days the higher voltages we have here and in Europe/Uk was to do with keeping voltage drop down?

Anyway, here's another question for you, and why I'm surprised it's legal to fool around with mains wiring state-side. No matter what the voltage, the wattage will be much the same for similar appliances. Therefore, as far as I can tell, there is just as much risk of an electrical fire over your way as here. Where do you stand if there is an electrical fire caused by amateur wiring over there? Here, your insurance company will tell you it sucks to be you. Do they not mind over there?

edit: from wiki-

A 230 V distribution system will use less conductor material to deliver a given amount of power because the current, and consequently the resistive loss, is lower than for a 120 V system. While large heating appliances can use smaller conductors at 230 V for the same output rating, few household appliances use anything like the full capacity of the outlet to which they are connected.

[ChadTower]

Where do you stand if there is an electrical fire caused by amateur wiring over there? Here, your insurance company will tell you it sucks to be you. Do they not mind over there?

This is the purpose of the permit and inspection process.  If you make anything more than trivial wiring changes without a permit, and those changes cause a fire, the insurance company may say it sucks to be you.  It is the permit that tells the insurance company that the changes were inspected and approved by the city inspector.  The permit is not so much permission to make changes as it is a record of the changes and inspections involved.  Once the town has a passed inspection on record you are good with the insurance company.  This is the process I am going through with my gameroom project right now.

This is also why places that do not allow laymen to do this work will not allow laymen to pull permits.  The accountability for the safety of the work falls on the person who signed the permit application.  If the location does not allow laymen to pull permits then it basically limits that sort of work to licensed electricians.  Not many electricians are willing to risk their license by signing permits for other people who are going to do crappy work.  Some might, for a fairly high fee, and then inspect the work themselves before the city inspector comes in.  That happens in Rhode Island here at times.

[Vigo]

Vigo, the only danger of a car battery is if you drop it on your foot 

You know, I wondered about that. I've done plenty of auto work, and since it is battery power, I assume there is low danger about getting zapped. But then I read those mechanical repair manuals for the cars when I need to fix something, and the recent ones I see all tell you to disconnect the battery for everything. I can understand on the complex repairs, but simple things get to me. Replace brake shoe? Step one: Disconnect battery.  Change oil? Step one: Disconnect battery. Then the manuals have these huge warning pages about how a battery can discharge on ya and kill ya. I dunno, maybe it is a huge liability reason that they try to freak me out about battery discharge, maybe it is because of hybrids. 

[danny_galaga]

Vigo, the only danger of a car battery is if you drop it on your foot 

You know, I wondered about that. I've done plenty of auto work, and since it is battery power, I assume there is low danger about getting zapped. But then I read those mechanical repair manuals for the cars when I need to fix something, and the recent ones I see all tell you to disconnect the battery for everything. I can understand on the complex repairs, but simple things get to me. Replace brake shoe? Step one: Disconnect battery.  Change oil? Step one: Disconnect battery. Then the manuals have these huge warning pages about how a battery can discharge on ya and kill ya. I dunno, maybe it is a huge liability reason that they try to freak me out about battery discharge, maybe it is because of hybrids. 

A 12V battery can't possibly "discharge on ya and kill ya". The human body has roughly 500 ohms resistance- V/I x R means 12/500= 24 mA. The battery would probably discharge as quickly due to it's own internal resistance! You can hold on to the terminals of a 12V battery all day and you probably won't feel anything at all. I can tell you that you CAN feel 24V quite easily. It's a tingly sensation much like (and obviously for the same reasons as) putting your tongue on a 9V battery to see if it's charged. A series of batteries, say in a hybrid would be a different matter, although being DC would still be safer than AC of the same voltage. It's the cyclic nature of AC that really messes with your heart. If doing any electrical work on a car, a manual will probably tell you to disconnect the battery, in case of shorts. For any other reason, all I can think of is to prevent the car being started accidentally 

Interestingly, just found this while looking for the resistance of a body-

The current may, if it is high enough, cause tissue damage or fibrillation which leads to cardiac arrest; more than 30 mA[3] of AC (rms, 60 Hz) or 300 – 500 mA of DC can cause fibrillation.[4][5] A sustained electric shock from AC at 120 V, 60 Hz is an especially dangerous source of ventricular fibrillation because it usually exceeds the let-go threshold, while not delivering enough initial energy to propel the person away from the source

also

There were 550 electrocutions in the US in 1993, which translates to 2.1 deaths per million inhabitants. At that time, the incidence of electrocutions was decreasing.[13] Electrocutions in the workplace make up the majority of these fatalities. From 1980–1992, an average of 411 workers were killed each year by electrocution.[11] A recent study conducted by the National Coroners Information System (NCIS) in Australia [14] has revealed three-hundred and twenty-one (321) closed case fatalities (and at least 39 case fatalities still under coronial investigation) that had been reported to Australian coroners where a person died from electrocution between July 2000 and October 2011.[15]

So 120V is not quite as safe as you guys are making out.

Chad, even a 'trivial' change of wiring could lead to a dangerous situation if done incompetently. Where would an insurance company draw the line? That's rhetorical, because I reckon the insurance company won't be drawing any lines if it means they don't have to pay 

Edit: got the resistance wrong. Looks like the resistance is much higher. It only goes down to say 500 ohms if you are being electrocuted by a really high voltage such that the skin suffers dielectric breakdown...

[ChadTower]

Chad, even a 'trivial' change of wiring could lead to a dangerous situation if done incompetently. Where would an insurance company draw the line? That's rhetorical, because I reckon the insurance company won't be drawing any lines if it means they don't have to pay 

I imagine they would draw the line at any noninspected change that caused a fire.  I don't know that they would be able to detect something as simple as a badly swapped outlet, though.  Wiring layout changes are fairly obvious to an inspector.  A bad new termination inside a box that was put there 25 years ago?  Not so much.

[danny_galaga]

Chad, even a 'trivial' change of wiring could lead to a dangerous situation if done incompetently. Where would an insurance company draw the line? That's rhetorical, because I reckon the insurance company won't be drawing any lines if it means they don't have to pay 

I imagine they would draw the line at any noninspected change that caused a fire.  I don't know that they would be able to detect something as simple as a badly swapped outlet, though.  Wiring layout changes are fairly obvious to an inspector.  A bad new termination inside a box that was put there 25 years ago?  Not so much.

Oh, they'll find it alright...