Android console on kickstarter (Ouya)

[knave]

I saw this and am in for one. Of course I'm skeptical but if it will play netflix too and have the android market i think it will be cool.

Hopefully with 6.5 million dollers raised they make something worthwhile. We shall see.

I love my android tablet and even bought the dock for it to output video on my TV.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ouya/ouya-a-new-kind-of-video-game-console

There are just a few days to go...

[Trip]

I personally think we're just a matter of a couple of years from our phones wirelessly transmitting video to TVs and once we've done that, it's inevitable that someone's going to come up with a controller that will work wirelessly with the phone.

That being said, $100 it's hard to turn this down.  I want to see some progress first, though.

Yeah, you can already do that via airplay on iphone or ipad to an apple TV.  I play real racing 2 and grand theft auto 3 all the time that way with my ipad (3rd gen).  You don't need a controller.  With racing games it's a blast with the motion sensing ipad.  Great steering wheel feel to the big tablet.

I already play with android phones using nintendo wii controllers as well. 

If I want to take it even further with mountain lion, I can airplay my iMac to my apple tv and use a range of wireless controllers to play pretty much any game I want.

[pinballjim]

Yes, we all know you can do it already with lots of kludges and extra hardware.  It's really the unified platform and interface that'll take that stuff to the next level.  The problem with Ouya is that nobody will develop software solely for it, so you're going to get ports of games that have you pushing buttons instead of thumping the screen.

In my mind, this system is really just a cheap android device paired to an expensive controller.  If they have any success with it, they'll port the platform and hardware support to several other devices.

[Trip]

Yes, we all know you can do it already with lots of kludges and extra hardware.  It's really the unified platform and interface that'll take that stuff to the next level.  The problem with Ouya is that nobody will develop software solely for it, so you're going to get ports of games that have you pushing buttons instead of thumping the screen.

In my mind, this system is really just a cheap android device paired to an expensive controller.  If they have any success with it, they'll port the platform and hardware support to several other devices.

Just wait for a full blown apple TV and you will just need a iPad/iphone to airplay to it if you don't like a small box.

[ark_ader]

I think the next Xbox will be something along those lines.  More 8 core Arm based and TV-centric.  Cloud based too.

Think how small the Xbox 720 consoles will be without a DVD player, and no heat problems and the mini Kinect.

You will see Android coming close behind and Sony with the Vita/PS4 Console.

Remember you heard it here first.

[Trip]

I think the next Xbox will be something along those lines.  More 8 core Arm based and TV-centric.  Cloud based too.

Think how small the Xbox 720 consoles will be without a DVD player, and no heat problems and the mini Kinect.

You will see Android coming close behind and Sony with the Vita/PS4 Console.

Remember you heard it here first.

I thought Durango showed it would have a blu ray drive.

[knave]

What intrigues me most about the Ouya is that they are embracing 3rd party modification and homebrew. Put XBMC on one, plus netflix, hbo go and pandora and i'll never need to use my Wii and PS3 again. (for media). I like the idea of a small box media player that I got a roku. It's fine for what it does but if I can get a Ouya to do that plus let me install whatever apps I want its totally worth the extra $.  Sure they have the little android media players that are popping up and they are cool. (Pocket TV http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/484889112/the-pocket-tv-makes-any-tv-a-smart-tv)

But I want more...

[Well Fed Games]

I definitely like the idea... did not support the kickstarter but was pretty close a couple of times. The game industry is so predictable; this seems like a bit of a wild card, would love to see it do well, could be a good venue for smaller developers.

[knave]

Now it's official the Ouya will have native XBMC support.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ouya/ouya-a-new-kind-of-video-game-console/posts

[ChadTower]

I just bought three WDTVs.   

[Player 3]

An Android-powered modern Sega Saturn with a FF3 port? Sold!FF5 would have been nicer though.

[Howard_Casto]

I just can't get excited about this one at all.  90 bucks is a lot to pay for a tablet without a screen. 

The liscensing stuff is going to be an issue.  "Real" developers are going to be very nervous about making any worthwhile software for a device that's designed to be hacked.  Why invest time in making a nice game/app when the box will be hacked and people will just pirate it?  Their "free to play" model is going to be an issue as well.  Try to convince HBO to give away some of their paid content for free... it ain't gonna happen and thus services like HBO go and netflix will most likely never make it to the device.

I HATE the way hardware companies like Microsoft are so anal about hacking but I do understand why they have to be that way.  Developers need confidence in a hardware manufacturer that they will try to protect their IP.

Now ironically if they just sold it as some hardware without any software what-so-ever (maybe a sdk or something) I think it would do a lot better. It's specs blow the Rasberry Pi away, for example, and it doesn't cost that much more.  Trying to make it a legitimate console, which it will never be, is going to do nothing more than give the device legal troubles. 

[knave]

...they just announced a partnership with Namco-Bandi...so at least Pac-Man, Tekken and fam are likely.

I'm not in any danger of becoming a Ouya fanboi or anything but it has been fun to watch the development.

If all it does is play Pac-man and XBMC I will be pretty happy with it. I am also hopeful that a standard Netflix app will work. HBO go might as well...I use it on my tablet...why not on my "tablet without a screen"? I admit that HBO is a bit more guarded but there is no requirement for media to be free to play...just the games as far as my interpretation goes.

I'm willing to take a chance...And I like talking about it. I do share your fears though...what if it doesn't amount to much?
Perhaps the homebrew community can still make something of it?

[Player 3]

I just can't get excited about this one at all.  90 bucks is a lot to pay for a tablet without a screen. 

The liscensing stuff is going to be an issue.  "Real" developers are going to be very nervous about making any worthwhile software for a device that's designed to be hacked.  Why invest time in making a nice game/app when the box will be hacked and people will just pirate it?  Their "free to play" model is going to be an issue as well.  Try to convince HBO to give away some of their paid content for free... it ain't gonna happen and thus services like HBO go and netflix will most likely never make it to the device.

I HATE the way hardware companies like Microsoft are so anal about hacking but I do understand why they have to be that way.  Developers need confidence in a hardware manufacturer that they will try to protect their IP.

Now ironically if they just sold it as some hardware without any software what-so-ever (maybe a sdk or something) I think it would do a lot better. It's specs blow the Rasberry Pi away, for example, and it doesn't cost that much more.  Trying to make it a legitimate console, which it will never be, is going to do nothing more than give the device legal troubles.

The catch is that every game for the OUYA has to have some aspect of it free of charge, whether it be a demo or freemium model. Services like Netflix use accounts as DRM. Every OUYA comes with the SDK for it. Calling it a tablet without a screen is a bit undermining for a console, as a physical controller is the biggest part of it. Games no longer have to rely on touch screens with virtual buttons to do things. The "welcoming" of modifying it is like the Arduino or Raspberry Pi; it can be rooted without voiding warranties or used for other stuff. The ARM processor type seems to be gaining quite a bit of significance.

[Sparkolicious]

I backed it... Hell.. I have changed my pledge twice...  If it blows up, I'll be all happy.. If it sucks balls, I'm out a good weekend drunk.... Final Fantasy III on my TV!!! woot!

[Howard_Casto]

The catch is that every game for the OUYA has to have some aspect of it free of charge, whether it be a demo or freemium model. Services like Netflix use accounts as DRM. Every OUYA comes with the SDK for it. Calling it a tablet without a screen is a bit undermining for a console, as a physical controller is the biggest part of it.

But it IS a tablet without a screen!  Look at the specs!  You can hook game controllers up to tablets right now.... many of the higher-end tablets support 360 and ps3 controllers and nearly all tablets support keyboard inputs, which can be used for a ipac-like interface.  A lot of your games support at least keyboard input as well... the problem is it's only the good games... and 99% of tablet games are crap. 

The only thing bothering me at all is the price point.  It's roughly 1/3rd the price of your average game console and judging by it's processor, specs and ect... I've gotta think that the majority of games ported to it, at least initially, are going to be cruddy tablet games.  I think everybody and their brother has a tablet at this point and most have hdmi out.  That is specifcially why I made a comparison to a tablet. 

I hope I'm wrong on this one... but when it comes to gaming trends I rarely am. 

[DaveMMR]

I've gotta think that the majority of games ported to it, at least initially, are going to be cruddy tablet games.

This may be the direction the industry is going in though. Don't get me wrong, there will always be the market for the hardcore games. But those simple tablet games (Angry Birds, et. al.) are raking in lots of dough and reaching the 'non-traditional' gamers. Does it even make sense anymore for struggling publishers to sink a few million into a title that reaches fewer people rather than spend a tiny fraction of that on a simple game that can reach a wider market and is less of a risk? For what it's worth, a device like this - that's inexpensive to purchase - is better suited for it than the Wii/PS3/360.

I don't know - looks cool though. I'll be watching.

[ChadTower]

Netflix will be available here.  I have no doubt.  It's available on Android phones now.  So is Hulu Plus.

[ark_ader]

So what is the difference between this Ouya and my Tegra 2 Tablet that outputs on my HDMI display?

[Howard_Casto]

I've gotta think that the majority of games ported to it, at least initially, are going to be cruddy tablet games.

This may be the direction the industry is going in though. Don't get me wrong, there will always be the market for the hardcore games. But those simple tablet games (Angry Birds, et. al.) are raking in lots of dough and reaching the 'non-traditional' gamers. Does it even make sense anymore for struggling publishers to sink a few million into a title that reaches fewer people rather than spend a tiny fraction of that on a simple game that can reach a wider market and is less of a risk? For what it's worth, a device like this - that's inexpensive to purchase - is better suited for it than the Wii/PS3/360.

I don't know - looks cool though. I'll be watching.

I pretty much agree with this sentiment actually.  And for your kids or your grandma or mom, I can see it being a nifty little device.  But for the people around here (moderate to hardcore gamers) I don't see a use for it.  I've got to imagine that most of us have at least one modern gaming console and they have services to buy low-end games (xbox arcade, wiiware, ect...) so why pay another hundered bucks for games we are likely going to see released on those console anyway?

And like I said, these are tablet games... most of us and even the casual crowd have tablets.... and they will usually hook up to your tv.

ChadTower:  It's the Ouya's oddbal liscensing requirements that make me think they might not make it.  It's on your tablet/phone now because netflix and Hulu aren't required to give anything away for free.... on the Ouya they will be. 

[Well Fed Games]

"Examining the Kickstarter [description] immediately highlights one misleading detail in that description, which is the notion that the games will all be free-to-play. Ouya's definition of this model is not one where the majority of the game is freely accessible and microtransactions support it, but one where something is playable for free. In other words, having a demo and then allowing players to purchase the full thing -- you know, like every game on Xbox Live Arcade -- would be enough to classify a game as free-to-play."

http://www.1up.com/news/ouya-fails-inspire-confidence

That is to say, I don't think the "free samples" thing is as revolutionary as they are making it out to be.

[Howard_Casto]

"Examining the Kickstarter [description] immediately highlights one misleading detail in that description, which is the notion that the games will all be free-to-play. Ouya's definition of this model is not one where the majority of the game is freely accessible and microtransactions support it, but one where something is playable for free. In other words, having a demo and then allowing players to purchase the full thing -- you know, like every game on Xbox Live Arcade -- would be enough to classify a game as free-to-play."

http://www.1up.com/news/ouya-fails-inspire-confidence

That is to say, I don't think the "free samples" thing is as revolutionary as they are making it out to be.

I agree... you aren't going to get something significant for free, that is misleading.  All it is doing is hurting potential games/apps producers because there are some companys that flat out refuse to offer anything for free... netflix and hbo go come to mind, as I mentioned earlier.  That sort of liscense works on a popular, established console, because developers are begging to get their game on there, but on a console that is trying to prove itself, making demands of the developers might not be the best way to go.

[knave]

My interpretation of the Ouya liscensing was that the games and only the games on the console had to have some form of free to play aspect. a demo or trial of some sort. really easy to do and not threatening to developers IMHO.

Netflix, will just be an App, and will function as it does on any device, same as HBO go, if it runs. (I'm hopeful)

I expect the Ouya to be able to install and run any android app in addition to it's console duties. It's usefulness to me is more as a low cost media player that can play angrybirds when I can't decide what to watch. Oh hey that sounds like the new roku only better.

[SithMaster]

Couldn't Netflix just be installed using any android compatible version to get around potential licensing issues?  As for other streaming services one would only need something similar to a frontend app to handle all the login info and emulating inputs in case certain apps aren't updated to support ouya controls.

PBJ - Apparently the 4 controller bundle is 200 for preorder so unless it becomes another Wii incident its doubtful you will have to spend more than the current advertised price unless the makers decide to price gouge a month after release.

It doesn't seem like a horrible idea but it may be competing with valve if they decide to make a "tv box" that runs linux and steam.

[Well Fed Games]

It doesn't seem like a horrible idea but it may be competing with valve if they decide to make a "tv box" that runs linux and steam.

I couldn't give Valve my money fast enough in that case.

[Howard_Casto]

As for other streaming services one would only need something similar to a frontend app to handle all the login info and emulating inputs in case certain apps aren't updated to support ouya controls.

This is something else I didn't touch on because I hate to be so damn negative but...

The ouya controller has a touchpad in the center.  Sounds cool right?  Well yeah until you realize what it's there for.  They are anticipating crappy android ports and/or straight installs of tablet-designed apps on the device.  The touch pad is for the lazy dev that doesn't want to add controller support.... so expect angry birds, but don't expect to be able to properly use the gamepad with it. 

[Bender]

I think it pretty cool, I grabbed one
My thinking is worst case, just turning it into a Mame TV console
I haven't seen any tablets for $100 plus a controller, not bad IMHO
I think it's more comparable to the AppleTV but much easier to hack and with controller inputs
Plus it's going to support Plex, woot!

[knave]

I haven't seen any tablets for $100 plus a controller...

That right there is the bottom line.

[Howard_Casto]

I haven't seen any tablets for $100 plus a controller...

That right there is the bottom line.

I don't see how that can be considered the bottom line?

Most people already have a tablet..... buying the Ouya is an additional expense. Also most gamers already have a 360 controller or a ps3 controller, so again, no need to buy anything.  Tablets are also portable as well and offer a greater functionality.

They haven't announced a single game worth buying yet.  100 bucks would be rather cheap, if they had some cool games to play on it (or ANY games aside from tablet games for that matter), but thus far you are buying blind and for me a least, I'm not going to waste 100 bucks on something I may never use.

[sharpfork]

I look at this and other android -> TV boxes like the Vizio CoStar as potential replacements for Mame/emu PCs when hooking up to HD displays more than hoping for new games on the platform.

One cool thing about the Ouya is that there business model seems to be looking toward making the initial hardware purchase cheep and making their revenue off a share of the game sales:
http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/ThomasGrove/20120810/175731/Threats_to_Ouya__Developers_Win.php
If they want to sell me unlocked & subsidized hardware to use for unrelated stuff while maybe picking up a few of their games along the way, great!

My main issue with the Ouya is the proprietary controller interface which I read is using 802.11x instead of BT- I can't find the source but it was an interview with Ouya folks on Google+.  If it has BT, there are a bunch of alternatives that would work with emus at least.

[knave]

I guess Howard it is because I buy a bunch of gagets anyway. I do already have a tablet, and I have a dock for it to output it on my TV. What I want and the reason I'm willing to put some cash up front is a device that is "like" my tablet for my TV. I want it to be dedicated to the TV plugged in all the time ready to play my netflix, HBO go, web browse, pandora, stream off my network and play a few spur of the moment games. I Like the idea that I can-if-I-want install vanilla android apps to this device.

I really have been searching for the right device. perhaps the Ouya is not it but to me it's a pretty inexpensive opportunity to try something new.

Yes, I could buy another tablet so I have one to dedicate to my TV...but it would be more than $100, or I could buy a pocket TV android device that I mentioned above...but I liked the Ouya better because it hopefully will do all that plus play a few games.

Another issue is that I would like to cut down on my device clutter. I have the capability to do everything I want right now with all my toys. but currently it spans several devices and while it's very little trouble to switch between them it would be handy to combine a few.

And mostly I supported the Ouya because getting the updates and talking about it is Fun!

[SithMaster]

Not sure if its really appropriate to call this competition but valve created an interface for using steam while connected to a tv.  I haven't looked too deeply into it but seems very useable with a 360 controller Linky.

[knave]

See, I thought of it in the other direction. I'm hoping for Big Picture to come to the Ouya just like XBMC.

In any case I love the Big Picture Idea, I've been connecting my Laptop to my TV and playing with a wireless Xbox 360 controller for a while now.

Now its just easier. Go Valve.

[ChadTower]

ChadTower:  It's the Ouya's oddbal liscensing requirements that make me think they might not make it.  It's on your tablet/phone now because netflix and Hulu aren't required to give anything away for free.... on the Ouya they will be.

Hulu gives away stuff for free.  It's all two minutes clips and barely disguised advertising content but they do have a large amount of free material.


Netflix doesn't have anything at all free so that might be an issue for them.

[knave]

on the Ouya, only games require a free to play aspect, like a demo or some such. Not apps like netflix.

The page also states that the Ouya can play any android app, so it's pretty likely that Netflix will work out of the box..."besides the App is free anyway."

[shmokes]

Yep, Steam just took a big dump all over the Ouya.  Here's hoping it's not just vaporware.

But, Steam requires a PC . . .

[versapak]

I personally think we're just a matter of a couple of years from our phones wirelessly transmitting video to TVs and once we've done that, it's inevitable that someone's going to come up with a controller that will work wirelessly with the phone.

That being said, $100 it's hard to turn this down.  I want to see some progress first, though.

Yeah, you can already do that via airplay on iphone or ipad to an apple TV.  I play real racing 2 and grand theft auto 3 all the time that way with my ipad (3rd gen).  You don't need a controller.  With racing games it's a blast with the motion sensing ipad.  Great steering wheel feel to the big tablet.

I already play with android phones using nintendo wii controllers as well. 

If I want to take it even further with mountain lion, I can airplay my iMac to my apple tv and use a range of wireless controllers to play pretty much any game I want.

How can you actually play those games via AirPlay mirroring? I find the latency to be horrible.

[RandyT]

I was about to agree with Howard, until I checked on pricing for Android devices based on  the Tegra3 processor. 

These are still in the $300+ range, and no included gamepad.  If nothing else, the OUYA will have a market based on the price point (if it goes out at $100) and the "ready to play" nature of the package.  The "no development restrictions" will definitely encourage third party development, but I highly doubt that any officially sponsored marketplace will have that same lack of restrictions.  Too many possible legal liabilities.

As for the controller, that's one piece of hype I'm not currently ready to buy into.  Everyone has their own idea as to what the "perfect controller" is, and I'm sure it won't universally satisfy.  After all, think of all the third-party controllers for just about any video game system ever made.  The folks who designed those thought they were great as well, and a lot of them got severely panned.

Still, it was this kind of open philosophy which got me to purchase the GP2X so long ago, so I suspect I will have some interest in the final product.  But I'll probably wait to see some of the potential realized before buying.  Who knows, by time the rubber meets the road on this one, there could be other contenders in the same market, worthy of consideration.

[pinballjim]

Yeah, like Steam on your TV with an Xbox 360 controller.

 

[northerngames]

I'm in for one when they come out, I already got some idea's rolling around.