Sai's PinCade project [Planning phase]

[Hican]

I haven't really taken into account the wood I'll be using... Wiki suggests MDF 12mm / 1/2" panels for interior and MDF 18mm / 3/4" for the sides. I'll also need some support blocks. Do you think that will keep things stable?

Hi Sai! Very, very nice idea, but I already told you that by phone
I was thinking about the wood you should be using and, even though Wiki suggests it, I wouldn't choose MDF. MDF is good to use for some 'simple' prototypes. It's cheap, easy to 'cut' and easy to put screws / nails in, but it isn't very strong. Next to that it is quite sensitive for damage (spoiled drinks, walking into it with sharp edges, etc).

If I can make a suggestion I would use: Betonplex. I am sorry, but I don't know the English name for it or an English description Basically 'Betonplex' is one of the toughest multiplex wood types. It is very strong and has an expoxy layer on top of it. They use this stuff often to make cement / concrete cases (to put the concrete in). Next to that it is water resistant (always a nice extra ). It is a little more expensive than MDF, but I strongly suggest to use this for the final build.

The second suggestion that I want to make is to make not only the back 'legs' of the table in height adjustable, but all legs. When it is in arcade mode you can higher all legs to a nice standing position (like a normal arcade console in an arcade hall). If you also tilt the screen a bit further backwards (flatten it), it gives the same feeling as a normal arcade and the 'bigness' of a screen is, I think, less of a problem.

Last but not least... to support the weight of the screen when it tilts in arcade mode, isn't it an idea to put (by default) a counterweight on the right side of the console? In pinball mode, the console is big enough (and wide enough) to not fall over because of the counterweight.

Anyways, have great fun at your wintersport and talk to you after it

[Saicho]

@Hican: Thanks for the suggestions!

It's been 3 weeks since my last post already!!
After an awesome snowboard vacation and after a bit of soul searching about what to do with this project I guess it's about time I update this post :-)

At first I've been thinking about what I can use for the flip out control panel. Seems like a "kogel snapper" and a "piano scharnier" (sorry... don't know the English words for it ) would work with the way I planned it:

This way it can hinge on the "piano scharnier" and click into place using the "kogel snapper".


But back to the soul searching part
When would the PinCade design be something for you?
When you have limited space available and want to mainly play pinball games, but have the option to turn it into arcade aswell.

And that is also the reason I decided to not go for this design anymore! I know... After all the work and great feedback from you guys it's too bad, but I've decided I don't want a Pinball cabinet where the screen is up all the time, because I mainly play 2d fighting games. Also for my first time building something like this the whole construction might be a bit too complex.

So now what? Do both ofcourse:
- An HTPC below my TV with two seperate arcade sticks!
- A dedicated Pinball machine!

So first off the arcade sticks. As I mentioned before I currently have 2 Mad Catz Street Fighter 4 T.E. sticks (1x white r1 and 1x black r2):

The top is easily removed (everything between the red borders). I'll create my own top and use a nice 7 button layout for the buttons and use the 8th button on top as a function key when pressed with one of the other buttons. I'll start with some basic art for it later on.

As for the dedicated pinball cab; I think I'm going for a 23 or 24" playfield with the same 19" I still have lying around. This way the materials will be even cheaper, the room needed will be less and it's nice for a first time cab build :-)

So time to Sketch this all up!

[Le Chuck]

Sorry to see that plan go away but I think you'll be happier with your current plan.  Can you post a link to an online retailer of the Kogel Snapper - I have a few applications that may work well in, specifically CP locking for one.

The Piano Scharnier is a Piano Hinge, easy enough.   

[Saicho]

@Le Chuck: Haha, Ofcourse it's piano hinge Thanks. Not sure if they send it outside the Netherlands, but onlinedeurbeslagshop.nl has them.

The measurements with a 24" playfield seem to be pretty small. I measured it out and the size feels more like a small "toy". Would it be still worth it? Or should I go with the 32" like I originally planned for the PinCade design?

-edit- added the correct picture :-)

[Saicho]

Used an existing Sketchup model to modify the button layout and added some imba stuff with mspaint (see attachement) :-)

Also found some awesome wallpapers I could use for back drop!

Would love some feedback on the CP layout.

[ark_ader]

Used an existing Sketchup model to modify the button layout and added some imba stuff with mspaint (see attachement) :-)

Also found some awesome wallpapers I could use for back drop!

Would love some feedback on the CP layout.

Why did you have to have a design that required a CP on the side of the pin?

If you have a screen as your display/score board why not use that as your horizontal games and the pin table for the vertical?

Your arcade controls would be at the same area as your pin controls, just make detachable joys.

[Saicho]

@ark_ader: Because when the CP is on the side I can use the bigass widescreen tv from the pinball playfield About using the scoreboard (19" lcd monitor) as the main screen for arcade games; I don't think it would deliver the awesomeness of the ps3 games. Also to be comfortable for 2 player capcom fighting games the CP will be almost double the width. And maybe the screen would be a bit too far away? I really like the idea of having controls for the vertical shooting games though. Detachable controls with like 3 buttons should be enough for those right?

I really need to decide (and stick with) a playfield size. A 23" 16:9 screen is almost the same width as a 24" 16:10 screen (which I use as my current pc monitor). My 2 choices then:
23": Dell Ultrasharp U2312HM for 180 euro's
32": Samsung UE32D5000 for 390 euro's

The 23" has a lot going for it:
+ IPS panel; great viewing angles
+ PC monitor; low reponse times, input lag and ghosting
+ Cheaper; more then 200 euro's cheaper

But the most important factor is the size.

Is 23" big enough for a proper Pinball experience or do I need a 32"?
I know that 42" - 46" screens are popular in full sized pinball machines, but I'm just looking for the sweet spot for use in a smaller living room

[TopJimmyCooks]

Le Chuck,
stateside the Kogel snapper would be referred to as a dual ball catch. 

https://www.google.com/webhp?rlz=1C1GPEA_enUS314US314&sourceid=chrome-instant&ix=seb&ie=UTF-8&ion=1#q=dual+ball+catch&hl=en&rlz=1C1GPEA_enUS314US314&site=webhp&prmd=imvn

Although I like the sound of Kogel snapper over dual ball catcher, to tell the truth. 

[Le Chuck]

TopJimmyCooks is today's favorite person!  Let's all give Jimmy a hand 
You're awesome.  Thanks man! 

[menace]

Is 23" big enough for a proper Pinball experience or do I need a 32"?

I have a 42" in mine and its a tad too big to be honest--sure the length is better but it makes every table a widebody.  I've heard that 37" is the sweet spot so the closest you could get to that would be approaching the most realism.  Since space is an issue though the 32" would be a good compromise.  With a 23" i think you are now down into "mini" pin country.  Which is fine but you are going to get "awwww isn't that cute.."  rather than "holy shite is that ever cool..."

[Saicho]

@menace: The whole "awwww isn't that cute.."  rather than "holy shite is that ever cool..." part of your comment really got me thinking again I then watched a LOT of video's/pictures of people that have a mini-pin with a 23/24" screen and... Well... Some are cute, but still cool as hell

I made a mockup of my fightstick layout with cardboard and found out that the position of that 7th button doesn't feel better then the current layout... Maybe I have a weird handshape, but my thumb rest really good on the lowerleft button in the current stick layout.

So I ordered some stuff from Arcadeshop.de for my fightsticks.
Of the 8 buttons on the stick I'm going to remove the 2 on the right and put button plugs in 'em:

I'm going to use 2 colors for the remaining 6 buttons. The top 3 and the first button from the bottom will be will be white on the white version of the stick and on the black version those will be red:

The remaining 2 buttons on both fightsticks will be the black ones that got buttplugged :-)

That way it's easily to see what buttons are used for 4 button games (eg NeoGeo games and the Blazblue series). Added bonus besides it feeling better then the 7 button layout is ofc that I don't need a new faceplate! Just need to add some new art later on and it's done (for now).

[Lord Hiryu]

Hi Saicho.
Nice idea.
Maybe, my project can help you to find new ideas for the monitor mech... (it's not finished yet....)

http://arcadeforever.forumfree.it/?t=55006687

Cheers.

[Le Chuck]

Hi Saicho.
Nice idea.
Maybe, my project can help you to find new ideas for the monitor mech... (it's not finished yet....)

http://arcadeforever.forumfree.it/?t=55006687

Cheers.

Cool.  That's pretty slick man, look forward to seeing it come together, kind of a vewlix meets pincab kinda deal.

[Saicho]

@Lord Hiryu: Wow! That's awesome. Thanks for sharing :-)

[Saicho]

So for now I'm going for a 24" 16:10 playfield and 19" 4:3 backboard. This way I don't have to buy anything and find out how hard this building thing really is
Latest version of the minipin has been added.

[Saicho]

Sooo... Things forever keep on changing. So I ordered and received a 23" Dell U2312HM (16x9 1080p) monitor. I wanted to keep my current 24" screen for PC use.
But while I was in the shower (best place for new ideas ) I thought about the possiblity of a mini version of Sai's PinCade

This is what I came up with:


Orange: The monitor goes up to cover the top. Still not sure on how to apply the glass on it...
Green: The entire CP is inside the cab when closed and covers almost the entire side. To get the CP down I could use some handles. These handles can then be used for support when CP is out. I could make the left pinball button to be build in the CP or maybe shave some off the bottom right of the CP so it's on the main body... Have to try this with a cardboard version to get a good feeling on placement.
Purple: The backscreen can be turned towards the players while playing arcade games to show art and/or control layout

It doesn't require any "tricks" or what not. Just some simple hinges and a pivot.
I'll make a cardboard version soon.

Any thoughts?