Thinking of going LCD. Any suggestions on "the best" LCD for an arcade cab?

[dekar24k]

Heya guys!

Haven't been active here in ages, but, as always, when I'm in the process of putting together a new cab I get drawn to this forum.

Anyways .. I have seriously been looking months now for a suitable ~23-25" arcade CRT monitor for my cab, but it seems impossible to get. Nieman Displays is out, Wells Gardner no longer produce CRTs and I'm still waiting for Billabs to get back to me (but I don't exactly have my hopes up there).

So .. I read a thread here yesterday where you guys discussed LCDs and many of you, to my surprise, seemed happy with using LCDs for your cab.

So, does anyone here have any experience with LCDs that are made for arcade purposes (like the one SuzoHapp's selling)? Can I get a 22-25" 4:3 LCD with minimal input lag from somewhere?

I'm thinking of setting MAME and all emulators to run at 640x480 and instead use some filters for "CRT emulation".

Any ideas and suggestions are greatly appreciated. Thanks!

[Blanka]

Biggest 4:3 made is 21,3 inch, both in SPVA and IPS flavour, first better blacks, second low lag. But both are hard to find, but still made (You could disassemble a 2000$ Wacom 21 inch display tablet for it!).
Easier to get are the 20 inch 1600x1200 displays. Think HP LP2065 for example. Check tftcentral.co.uk for the exact panel type, and then reverse lookup for all models that you can search on ebay/craigslist and the like (no longer made new).
24 inch 16:10 screens are the exact same size as 21.3 inch when it comes to 4:3 display: both 1600x1200 pixels at 21.3 inch. These are cheaper than 4:3 versions and still made. The Dell U2410 for example has a 24 inch IPS panel. But this means black bars.
Above 27 inch, things get wacky, as there is not much in the non TN-area, although some TN screens have reasonable angles at larger sizes (never suitable for vertical mounting though). You could check the Dell U2711 or some oldies like the Dell U2709, the 2707, or the Samsung 275T, but people having one of these are not often willing to sell, so the chance to get one at a fair price is low.

[dekar24k]

Thanks for the quick reply Blanka!

So, as far as I understand these are all PC monitors? What about their refresh rates? I am really sensitive to juddering/tearing etc. (which is the reason why I never use emulators on my PC, because of my 60hz LCD/LED).

I think what's much more important than black levels are the refresh rates and that the monitor is 100% capable of running games perfectly smooth.

I'm also thinking of getting a 16:9 LCD TV and use a 4:3 bezel on it. But again, what's worrying me the most is if I can get 100% perfect smooth scrolling in both MAME and emulators (WinUAE, SNES, NES etc.) and minimal input lag.

[Blanka]

TV's under 32 inch are crap:
- They are using the cheapest of the cheapest TN panels
- Horrible viewing angles
- Horrible input-lag. These TV's don't have the high-speed optimizing of the larger panels. Since they are TN they have to calculate PWM dithering to get 16 million colours, native they are 262K.

With a PC monitor you have fast display (a good IPS screen only has 8ms lag or so). Yes it is fixed to 60Hz, but most arcade titles are around 60fps non-interlaced as well. You need to set up an emulator to sync to V-refresh though. This means some titles that are originally runnin on 59,95fps will be forced into 60fps. If you worry about that, you should buy original cabs anyway.

[dekar24k]

Thanks again for the input. Well, if all LCDs are fixed to 60hz then it's out of the question for me. If I sync PAL games at 60hz then they play too fast and I want _perfect_ emulation (which I had on my previous cab which used an arcade CRT monitor).

Oh well .. I guess I need to keep looking for an arcade monitor then. Another option would be to de-case a CRT TV and use a VGA-SCART adapter, but I'd rather not. 

[Blanka]

Thanks again for the input. Well, if all LCDs are fixed to 60hz then it's out of the question for me. If I sync PAL games at 60hz then they play too fast and I want _perfect_ emulation (which I had on my previous cab which used an arcade CRT monitor).

Oh well .. I guess I need to keep looking for an arcade monitor then. Another option would be to de-case a CRT TV and use a VGA-SCART adapter, but I'd rather not.  

Why bother with PAL? Just throw in the NTSC games. They either come from the US or Japan, both 60Hz countries. European versions are not original!

And PAL games on a arcade monitor is BS too. They are supposed to be interlaced, arcade monitors are progressive.

[dekar24k]

Thanks again for the input. Well, if all LCDs are fixed to 60hz then it's out of the question for me. If I sync PAL games at 60hz then they play too fast and I want _perfect_ emulation (which I had on my previous cab which used an arcade CRT monitor).

Oh well .. I guess I need to keep looking for an arcade monitor then. Another option would be to de-case a CRT TV and use a VGA-SCART adapter, but I'd rather not.  

Why bother with PAL? Just throw in the NTSC games. They either come from the US or Japan, both 60Hz countries. European versions are not original!

And PAL games on a arcade monitor is BS too. They are supposed to be interlaced, arcade monitors are progressive.

You are right about that when it comes to most consoles, but games for the best computer in the world ever made, the Amiga, are mostly in PAL. I need perfect Amiga emulation basically.

Anyways, I think I just got my hands on a Billabs (Wei-ya) 25" CRT now. It's not digital, but it's trimode and just what I'm looking for. Hopefully I don't have to use a TV, neither an LCD.

Thanks again for your input Blanka, it's appreciated!