They don't build'em like that anymore....

[Level42]

Well today was a lovely day, and while we stepped outside the house for a nice bicycle ride, I heard a sound that first puzzled me a bit and then immediately I recognized it. The very first thing in my mind said "helicopter" but two seconds later I realised it was something else:



The DC-3 of the Dutch Dakota Association !!!!

Gotta love that sound !!!  And man what a beautiful sight to see it "glide" by on a gracious speed at an altitude of about 500 meters !

I checked their site and it turned out that they were doing "rounds around Rotterdam" today. Since I live very close to the largest accumulation of windmills in the Netherlands (Kinderdijk), I understood that they were flying over them to show it to the passengers on board.

The flights were about 90 euro for about half an hour flight (incl. start and landing) man, I definitely am going to do that next year !

The plane has been in restoration for 12 (!) years. A rep of Boeing/McDonnell Douglas mentioned that the last DC-3 was built in Holland, apparently impressed by the result.

I think there's only one plane that I would rather see fly over (or fly in!) and that's the Conny that they are restoring now in Lelystad:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=72903.0

Anyway, my kid missed it and I told him about it. Couple of hours later it did another flight and it was ALMOST coming right over us and we could see it banking towards the mills and turning back to Rotterdam. Brilliant stuff !!

[Level42]

Some video of an earlier flight from Amsterdam Schiphol to Lelystad:



and the flight back:

[danny_galaga]

Nice (",)

That's a pretty good price for a pretty rare experience. You gotta do it! DC3's are a good restorer. There were so many built, there are still crates of NOS spares kicking around.

A super Constellation landed in my town a few years ago, after it had just been restored. The specs on those engines were amazing. Each one of those four uses something like 35 litres an hour- of OIL! That is about the same in fuel that the plane i learnt to fly in uses 

[SavannahLion]

That's a pretty good price for a pretty rare experience. You gotta do it! DC3's are a good restorer. There were so many built, there are still crates of NOS spares kicking around.

I remember reading somewhere that one couldn't use NOS parts on restores that were expected to fly. They had to have NEW (ie reproduction parts) within a particular time frame in order to fly. Or am I remembering that wrong and it was scavenged parts that couldn't be used? I think I read about it in an article about restoring P-38's. Or maybe it was a discussion about the graveyard in Texas(?). I'll see if I can find it.

[shmokes]

That's pretty cool.  Once when I was about 14 I happened to be outside to see this (or one like it) flying by, which was pretty amazing.  I didn't even know what it was at the time.  I thought it was two planes stacked on top of each other.  Then I saw in the news that it had landed at our airport for a reason I don't remember. 

[danny_galaga]

That's a pretty good price for a pretty rare experience. You gotta do it! DC3's are a good restorer. There were so many built, there are still crates of NOS spares kicking around.

I remember reading somewhere that one couldn't use NOS parts on restores that were expected to fly. They had to have NEW (ie reproduction parts) within a particular time frame in order to fly. Or am I remembering that wrong and it was scavenged parts that couldn't be used? I think I read about it in an article about restoring P-38's. Or maybe it was a discussion about the graveyard in Texas(?). I'll see if I can find it.

I'm pretty sure (but wouldn't bet on it) that the parts just need to be thoroughly inspected by a licenced aeronautical engineer. Some of the parts we are talking about are windscreens, instruments etc

[Level42]

I think all parts need certification. I'm not an expert though.

If you watched the video, you can see that they replaced the (about) the complete instruments set with modern day stuff. I guess it's probably a regulation to get a license to operate the plane again.

Here's an old pic of a DC3 cockpit:


and here's the cockpit of the "Doornroosje" (=sleeping beauty) that I saw:


Apart from safety, could it also be that the relatively young pilots of today are simply not capable of flying an original DC3 set-up anymore ? Think about it: would a train driver of today with all the electric and electronic stuff still be able to run a steam-train ? I doubt it. Maybe the difference is a bit bigger but not really THAT much bigger....

The conny had to be flown to Holland by a (quite aged) American pilot who had flown connies back in the day.

It's almost like in our hobby with the CRT technology: people who can work on them will become old and finally non existing anymore....it will become an ancient art !

[saint]

I don't like flying small prop planes. One day we were going to fly into a small airport, and so transferred from our nice big jet into a small (12-16 seater?) prop plane for the last leg.

When we got on the plane into our assigned seats, the flight attendant came on board, looked at those of us on the plane, laughed and asked us to move to the back of the plane. I started to ask why, then realized "it's so we don't crash, isn't it?"

I want to fly planes where my weight doesn't make a significant difference

Since I knew we were going to be flying a small prop plane, I had a few libations before hand for medicinal purposes. Small prop planes don't have bathrooms....

[Vanguard]

I try to avoid it but sometimes flight schedules force me to fly into L.A. to get a connection to San Diego.   It's always a commuter flight on little puddle jumpers.   I swear those planes feel like they aren't going to make it off the runway.   Every little gust of wind throws them around.   Once in the air, it isn't much better.

[Level42]

I've actually never flown anything smaller than a Fokker F50. But I do want to

You guys seem to fly like I use my car

[Vanguard]

I flew in sailplanes with my dad when I was a kid.  That's probably the smallest thing I've ever been in.  Oddly sailplanes feel a lot more stable than a small piper or cesna.  My dad was also building a BD-5 when we lived in California.   Thankfully I never had to fly in that. 

[Level42]

Think the stability of a sailplane is caused by it's comparatively huge wing-span ?

Since your handle is Vanguard, which one do you like better, the Centuri or the Zaccaria version ?

(totally off topic of course )

[Malenko]

Ive jumped out of a few Cessnas if that counts for anything. 

[Level42]

Ive jumped out of a few Cessnas if that counts for anything. 

Not if they're not up in the air though....

[Vanguard]

Ive jumped out of a few Cessnas if that counts for anything. 

Isn't that like step #3 in the Censsna flight manual?

[Vanguard]

Think the stability of a sailplane is caused by it's comparatively huge wing-span ?

Since your handle is Vanguard, which one do you like better, the Centuri or the Zaccaria version ?

(totally off topic of course )

Centuri.  I use to ride my bike a mile to a pizza place to play one.   My other favorite game they had was Phoenix which I believe was Centuri also.

[Malenko]

Ive jumped out of a few Cessnas if that counts for anything. 

Not if they're not up in the air though....

How exactly do you skydive then? its not much fun if the planes on the ground, but at least I guess you wouldnt have to repack the chute?

[Vanguard]

Think the stability of a sailplane is caused by it's comparatively huge wing-span ?

I think the flexibility of the wing helps too.   On a plane like censna , the rigid wing translates any sudden gain or drop in left directly to the aircraft.

The sailplanes long and very flexible wings act to buffer a lot of the sudden changes.

[ark_ader]

Wasn't the DC3 still being made in South America until the early 70s?

[danny_galaga]

I think all parts need certification. I'm not an expert though.

If you watched the video, you can see that they replaced the (about) the complete instruments set with modern day stuff. I guess it's probably a regulation to get a license to operate the plane again.

Here's an old pic of a DC3 cockpit:


and here's the cockpit of the "Doornroosje" (=sleeping beauty) that I saw:


Apart from safety, could it also be that the relatively young pilots of today are simply not capable of flying an original DC3 set-up anymore ? Think about it: would a train driver of today with all the electric and electronic stuff still be able to run a steam-train ? I doubt it. Maybe the difference is a bit bigger but not really THAT much bigger....

The conny had to be flown to Holland by a (quite aged) American pilot who had flown connies back in the day.

It's almost like in our hobby with the CRT technology: people who can work on them will become old and finally non existing anymore....it will become an ancient art !

It actually doesn't matter. The DC3 is a relatively modern aircraft. Most mono wing aircraft from about the 1930's on fly the same. For any type of aircraft you want to fly, you need to be certified in it by a qualified pilot. So whatever the setup of the aircraft, that's what you are going to learn in. There is nothing very complicated about those instruments in the original DC3 pic, OR the modern console. I'd say they used newer instruments purely because they were relatively available. Plus updated radios.

They still tell the same story- direction, attitude, altitude, engine RPM, manifold pressure, vacuum, inches of mercury for the constant speed props (can't think what that is called, never needed to know), etc etc...