Need some help with crt_emudriver setup

[steve8091]

So I'm not terribly tech-savvy, but I'm not completely inept either.  I recently picked up an ATI Radeon 4350 to put in my MAME machine (Windows XP SP3) to be able to hook up to a standard arcade monitor.  Here is what I did:

Installed video card (note that the output is a single DMS-59, which I've used a dongle to get to VGA)
Tested on standard computer monitor, no issues
Ran Soft15khz, shut down
Plugged into J-Pac, to arcade monitor
Started up

The BIOS and Windows startup screens showed on the monitor, but scrolled as if vertical hold were off.  Once Windows started, however, I totally lost picture.  So I hooked back up to my computer monitor.  The BIOS and Windows screens appeared, but here again, once Windows started, I totally lost picture.  I was able to get back into safe mode and get picture back.  I tried to revert the registry using the file that Soft15khz generated, but that didn't get me back to working on the computer monitor again.

Help!  What should I do next?  Do I need special drivers for the 4350?  One thing that I noticed is that when I restarted, my resolution was at 800x600, and I wasn't physically able to go any lower with the driver that was installed.  I'm thinking that maybe I need to update the driver and change to a lower resolution.  Honestly I'm not sure whether I can even do that in safe mode?

[steve8091]

Alright, I was able to get soft15hkz uninstalled for the time being, so now I am able to use my monitor.  Somehow now I have two different monitor entries for the 4350, one with 640x480 and 800x600 only, and the other for all other resolutions.  I tried to set it at 640x480 and reload soft15khz, and I had the same issue described above - no picture once I enter Windows.  I've also lost sound somewhere in this process...WTF?

[Yeltsew7]

Although I am not terribly knowledgeable about this, over the past few days I have learned that CRT_emudriver seems to be a better alternative to soft15khz. I'm not sure if your card is supported, but you would.  I think that instead of using a registry hack it is actually a modified driver, which seems like it would work smoother.  Make sure to read all of the readme files, they are the most informative.

[steve8091]

Thank you, sir.  I downloaded the CRT EMU Drivers here:

http://mame.3feetunder.com/windows-ati-crt-emudriver/

Unfortunately I had little success - I do get a picture now, but it scrolls, as if the vertical hold (I suspect the refresh rate) were off.  The file I downloaded had no readme...it did have one file in Spanish, but that was all.  Do you have English versions of the readme's?  I'm starting to wonder - my card has two ports, a DMS-59, but also an s-video.  Is it possible that the s-video is the "primary" port?  I think I like the idea of these drivers better, but can't get them working.  Other ideas?

[rCadeGaming]

Yeltsew is right, you should be using CRT_Emudriver, it's much better than Soft15kHz. 

Coincidentally, a Radeon HD4350 is one of the best cards for CRT_Emudriver and is the same one that I use.  Yours is an HD4350 though right?  If so, no special drivers are needed other than CRT_Emudriver, and no, the s-video port is not the primary output.  The DVI/DMS-59 port is and it is designed for use with a VGA dongle.  Also, what brand is your video card (ASUS, MSI, etc.)?  My ASUS HD4350 works great with CRT_Emudriver, but some users have reported incompatibility with HD4350's by other brands.

Here are some other thoughts as to why it may not be working:

What is the model of your monitor?  Are you sure it's 15kHz/CGA?

Are the jumpers on your J-Pac set correctly for a 15kHz monitor?

https://www.ultimarc.com/jpac2.html

What version of CRT_Emudriver did you download?  You should be using 9.3 for an HD4350 and the 32-bit version for

Is the monitor correctly wired to the JAMMA harness?  Have you seen it work with other JAMMA sources? 

The J-Pac outputs composite sync, make sure the monitor works with that and it's connected to the right place.

If everything above checks out you should try reformatting and starting over.  There could be something left in the registry from Soft15kHz that is screwing things up.  You should also get this thread moved to the GroovyMAME section to get more help.

[steve8091]

Many, many, many thanks, rCade!  I am out of town at the moment, but will answer what questions I can.  I'm looking forward to getting home and checking on your points.

Yours is an HD4350 though right?  Also, what brand is your video card (ASUS, MSI, etc.)?
Yes, mine is an HD4350, and it is a Visiontek (link.  It's only partially a coiincidence that it works well with EMU Driver...I bought it because it was known to work well with soft15khz (and it was low-profile, which I need for my case), but I'm psyched to know that there is a cleaner solution.  Any idea if this is one of the incompatible cards?

What is the model of your monitor?  Are you sure it's 15kHz/CGA?
I'll have to check on this, though I'm fairly sure it's a 15kHz/CGA.  I believe it is a common 25" Wells-Gardener, but again, I'll have to check on it.

Are the jumpers on your J-Pac set correctly for a 15kHz monitor?
This is an excellent point, and one that I failed to check on.  I REALLY hope that this is the solution!

What version of CRT_Emudriver did you download?  You should be using 9.3 for an HD4350 and the 32-bit version for
I downloaded 9.3, the 32-bit version.

Is the monitor correctly wired to the JAMMA harness?  Have you seen it work with other JAMMA sources?
Yes, I'm putting this setup into my normal JAMMA cab, into which I've swapped many, many boards over the years.

If everything above checks out you should try reformatting and starting over.  There could be something left in the registry from Soft15kHz that is screwing things up.
Even if I get things working, I may have to do this anyway to restore my sound (though I'll try to uninstall/reinstall my driver first).

[rCadeGaming]

Not sure about Visiontek.  Some brands of 4350's have just needed their PCI ID added to CRT_Emudriver to get working.  See here:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=135214.0

You need to ask Calamity (creator of CRT_Emudriver and GroovyMAME) about this, it could be the problem.  You can find him in the GroovyMAME section.

[steve8091]

I was able to find out what monitor I'm using - it is a Wells Gardner K7000, specifically a 25K7191.  According to the manual, the horizontal scan for this is 15.1kHz to 16.8 kHz standard, with higher frequency options available, and the vertical scan is 47kHz to 63kHz.  The resolution is 560x240.  I've PM'ed Calamity to find out if the Visiontek is or can be made compatible.  Other thoughts?

[Calamity]

Hi Steve,

It looks like at least one Visiontek 4350 is not a real 4350 but a "mobility" HD 4330 that simply doesn't work. Have a look at these threads:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137059.msg1413716.html#msg1413716
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,134490.msg1387071.html#msg1387071
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,122208.msg1297013.html#msg1297013

[DeLuSioNal29]

For $25 (free shipping) you can avoid the headache and buy a different brand.  Found this on ebay (and it has 1 gb of ram, plus it's low profile like the one you already have):  http://www.ebay.com/itm/XFX-ATI-Radeon-HD-4350-HD435XZAHR-1-GB-DDR2-SDRAM-PCI-Express-2-0-Graphics-/261440254741

DeLuSioNaL29

[rCadeGaming]

Steve, your monitor is perfect.  No other thoughts than that.  +1 on Calamity and Delusional's advice.  Just make sure XFX doesn't have a similar problems.  I've used several ASUS HD4350's without problems.  They're about the same price.

[cools]

XFX are fine, I'm using one.

[rCadeGaming]

 

[steve8091]

I had to let my MAME project sit for a while, but I'm back now.  Thanks again, everyone, for the tips.  I went ahead and ordered the XFX HD4350 card, more than anything because all of the low-profile ASUS cards I could find occupied two slots (which my machine doesn't have).

I've also reformatted the machine, though now I'm working through some USB issues.  I'll report back again once I have the card in hand and the PC ready to go.

[steve8091]

Alright, everything is finally back up and running, and I've installed crt_emudriver.  After ensuring that my on-board video drivers were uninstalled, I shut down, physically installed my video card (the XFX 4350), booted up, then canceled all of the auto-detect stuff from Windows.  I then ran the crt_emudriver setup, which detected my 4350, and after the driver successfully installed, I restarted my machine.

If I go to my display settings, I have two display options, both named E151FP (this is a crappy old Dell monitor I'm using for setup) on ATI Radeon HD 4350.  One of them allows for only 800x600 or 1024x768, and the other allows for a multitude of resolutions, however all of them are 800x600 or higher.  I then shut down and  attempted to connect to my arcade monitor (via my j-pac), and absolutely nothing shows on the screen; I'm thinking I need to set the resolution before I hook up to the j-pac, but I don't have any appropriate options?

What SHOULD be happening?  What am I missing?  I'm not sure where to go from here.

[Calamity]

Run VMMaker, it will install the required modes.

[steve8091]

Many thanks for the quick response.  I should've mentioned that I did that as well, and it installed 9 nodes (with the exception of GroovyMAME, I essentially followed the guide here: http://forum.arcadeotaku.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=24216).  I'm sorry for the n00b questions, but where do I then select them prior to shutting down, hooking up to the CRT, and booting back up?  I'm just not seeing anything in my display settings, but maybe I don't know what I should be looking for?

[Calamity]

Hi steve,

The last version of VMMaker (1.3c) is required for recent versions of MAME: http://mame.3feetunder.com/windows-ati-crt-emudriver/

[steve8091]

Alright, I upgraded VMMaker, and after re-running, I got about 110 modes.  I then ran ArcadeOSD, selected the 640x480 15khz resolution, and restarted.  I get an 'Out of Range' on my standard LCD, which is a good sign, but I still get a vertically scrolling picture on my CRT arcade monitor.  The j-pac jumpers are set appropriately (I've tried both the 15khz alone and the 15/35khz settings).  Any ideas?

[cools]

You need to adjust the hold pots on the chassis.

[steve8091]

Many thanks!  I'm equal parts ashamed and happy to say that it was that simple.  I'm a n00b when it comes to MAME, but not arcade machines in general...I really should have known that.   

It has taken me entirely too long to get this thing up and running, but I'm VERY close now.  I just need to get the controls working and do some things to hide Windows, and I'll be set!!  This has made my month - thank you all for your help!!

[Sledge]

It has taken me entirely too long to get this thing up and running,

You started around March 22 ??
Many people including myself took MUCH longer... don't worry about it

[cools]

Took me since 2000/2001 or thereabouts to get a setup I was happy with 

[steve8091]

In fairness, it's probably been a couple of years getting to this point.  My original setup used a de-cased television, but at some point something shorted on the TV's monitor board, and while it still worked, the colors were off after that.  I've had the cabinet that I put this into for a while; it was one I used to swap JAMMA boards in and out of, and I figured I'd try to MAME it and sell off my PCB's.

I'm not crazy about the PC I'm using - it gives me all sorts of goofy auto-detect problems when any new hardware is added (and apparently it's notorious for doing so).  Any time I try to hook anything up to it, it asks for a driver, so right now I'm fighting to get the J-PAC controls working, since it's looking for a driver, which doesn't exist.  I'm thinking that maybe I can try to get it working using a standard PS2 keyboard driver when I get home tonight.  It's been a fight every step of the way with this one.  I'm on my third Windows re-install!

UPDATE: I'm thrilled to say that using a standard keyboard driver worked!  The machine is now fully up and running; just need to put on some finishing touches and call it done.  Thanks again, everyone.  It's one thing to help a solid community member, but quite another to help some guy in off the street.