making your own frontline style controller

[wugly]

Since buying a frontline controller off of eBay is like buying unobtanium I have constructed a frontline controller for myself.
The heart of the project was to buy an eight position rotary switch with 45 degree separation and able top make full circle rotations. the place I found that makes this switch is electroswitch in weymouth ma as a special order which amounts to about 65 dollars. the switch has two poles which are offset. this means that the top pole can be used for the first seven positions and the bottom can be used for the eight and final position it is a 31302MB. The unit is built into a radio shack project box. A square mount is cut out of rigid plastic in which the switch is mounted. The top of the project box has a hole for the shaft to come out and 4 holes are drilled into it near the where the four corners of the rigid square switch mount, also drill through the switch mount so that the holes in it line up with the holes in the project box. For each of the holes you will install a rod in the project box so that the switch mounting square can move up and down on the rods. The holes in the mounting platecan be enlarged so that tubing may be glued into the holes to allow the rods to slide easier through the mounting plate. springs and washers and nuts are then put over the rods so that the switch mount is held near the top of the project box. The length of the shafts in the mounting plates can be adjusted so that they act as stops so that the plate stops level under the top of the project box case. a radio shack roller switch is then mounted to the inside of the project case so that when the switch is pressed down the moving square switch mount activates it and gives you a fire command. I then increased the length of the switch shaft by using a tight fitting tube over the switch shaft and then inserting a new cutoff 1/4 shaft extention on top of that in the tube. It was all glued together using jb weld epoxy. I then found an old fashioned 2 1/2 inch knob with 1/4 shaft insert off the internet to be used as my control knob. This size seems about right for the control because it fits in your hand well and also gives you enough torque to easily turn the switch.
This concludes the description of the mechanical assembly.

Electronics
Since the switch is just simple on off with no mixing of positions we will have to construct a simple diode array. Each section of the array will consist of two diodes with the center between them joined and the current only being allowed to flow from the center joint out to the ends of the diodes in other words the side with the black line is away from the center joint. four such Assemblies of this two diode array or needed and they are organized into square box with two running parallel top and bottom horizontally and 2 running parallel left and right vertically. This should look line a square box when you are done and the corners where the diodes meet should be soldered together. from the encoder board you should attach the up wire to the center of the top diode array and the right encoder wire to the right diode array in its center and so on, this should look the the 4 corners of a plus sign. the eight terminals of the rotary switch will then be connected individually to the diode arrays in a circular manner. The first wire should be connected to the center of the top array of two diodes, the second wire should be connected to the corner where the top and side arrays join together and continue to go around in a circle until all eight positions are filled. Note make sure that the switch wire rotation and how you wire the array coincide or you will be turning in a backwards direction remember that you are looking at the switch upside down. Also remebr that there are only 7 active terminals on the number one pole and that pole number one for both poles 2 and one is the common terminal. On Pole number 2 you must use terminal number five for you eigth position. Ground is run in through a microswitch that can turn it off to both the negative terminal of the fire switch and to the common terminal of the rotary switch. If you do not use this switch you will always have a stray command being input on other games as the rotary switch will not have an off position.wugly
retro enthusiast
 

[delta88]

I had one back when.. Is the gaem that great that this much effort needs to go into using the controler? IIR isnt there another game from taito that uses the same controller?

[bkenobi]

Any pictures of the project?  I'd like to see what it looks like!

[isucamper]

Whew!  The original post is way over my head.  Does the controller you built interface with the original game or with MAME?

I've been using Groovy Game Gears GPWiz-40 which supports Frontline/Tin Star rotary controls for MAME, in conjunction with Happ's mechanical rotary sticks, and it works pretty good.  Not necessarily authentic, but perfectly playable. 

Frontline is very hard and very fast paced. 

[Namco]

 

[wugly]

This is a picture of my control panel and my built frontline controller project.
about my control panel the sticks are inline to promote tank style play but for single tank play only the two center sticks are used.  the 4 sticks also have thumb buttons that plug into jacks above the sticks and foot pedals may be plugged into there in case I want to remove the spinners and put steering wheels on them instead.  the shafts are bushinged and hence forth no weight is transmitted to the bearings.  the lower right spinner is my primary game spinner and is actually quite comfortable using it.  the control panel unplugs and is removeable to get it through the door.     The steering wheel on the left side is usually a small spinner control but I changed it to show that it could be converted in under a minute

[Spyridon]

Wow, you lost me on the build, but congrats on getting it working.  Front Line is a great game and not at all playable on my MAME cab (luckily I have a dedicated one).

You really have a lot going on with that control panel.  Since this is so game specific, did you give thought to having a separate swappable panel for these games.  It would probably be more comfortable to use.

[cw]

I had one back when.. Is the gaem that great that this much effort needs to go into using the controler? IIR isnt there another game from taito that uses the same controller?

tin star
wild western
frontline

all used the same controls

[bkenobi]

So this is an 8-way rotary disk of sorts?  I looked on MAWS and it indicated dual 8-way rotary joystick.  Looks to me like the left stick is a standard 8-way and the right is a 4- or 8-way rotary joystick that's been smashed into a disk.

If I'm right about those assumptions, couldn't this be played with an 8-way + an Ikari stick?  I'll have to fire it up, but my pair of LS-30's seem like they would be great for this game.

[cw]

you could the only diff would be not being able to push to fire which would make it much harder to take your hand off of the stick to hit a button to fire
but....

[wugly]

ikari sticks are 12 position rotary  sticks not 8 position. You can use two  eight way sticks and two fire buttons too move aim and shoot two different weapons.  This is sort of similar to robotron but you do not get as many rapid fire shots to make up for being sloppy as you do in robotron, this can get very confusing at times.  Second most rotary sticks I have ever tried to use in mame never worked 100 percent perfectly and they always had too much motion in the different directions compared too my regular joystick which also screwed me up.  Anyways frontline was always my favorite game and they only way I could truly enjoy it is with a good facsimile of a frontline controller

[cw]

12 or 8 you can use it to control the rotation.....

[SavannahLion]

Wow, you lost me on the build, but congrats on getting it working.  Front Line is a great game and not at all playable on my MAME cab (luckily I have a dedicated one).

Yeah, same here. A simple circuit diagram could easily shave off nearly the entire last paragraph describing the controller. I had a vision of one layout, then I got confused 1/2 way in, either because I lost track of the diodes or got confused on the "square" bit. I'll digest it later and figure out what he's trying to do.

What is the name of the supplier of the switch? Is it available through Digikey or Mouser? Is that 31302MB supposed to be a part number?? What is the switch schematic?

Lots of useful information, there's just too much to glean.

[wugly]

Here is the simple circuit layed out with my bad drawing and the switches technical specs.  The switch terminal 1-1 and 2-1 are attached to gnd.  terminal 1-2 thru 1-8 are connected to points 1-7 with terminal 2-5 connected to point 8.  I take no responsibilty for the knob not lining up with where the gun is pointing just arrange the knob to point in the right direction when you are done.  With my knowledge of rotary sticks as it is I do not see how a rotary encoder which sends one set of pulse when you turn the stick cw and a different set when turned ccw would be able to work on my version of mame 109 for frontline.  My version of frontline has only 8 way joystick inputs for turning the guns.  I might be wrong on newer technology or mame version but as to what I know at this point I do not see how you could use a rotary stick to play the game.  The name of the company that makes the switch is Electroswitch, it is in weymouth Ma usa.  This is a special order switch and is something that they do not normal stock so a 1 month delay is to be expected for an order

[Spyridon]

Does your controller spin freely or does it "click" into position at each section?  That's what is neat about the Front Line controller.  You have that clicking at each position.  (kind of like changing the channel back before remote controls)

For reference for those not familiar with the controller, here are some photos:

[brandon]

Does your controller spin freely or does it "click" into position at each section?  That's what is neat about the Front Line controller.  You have that clicking at each position.  (kind of like changing the channel back before remote controls)

For reference for those not familiar with the controller, here are some photos:

ahh.. so pressing the knob made it fire?  when you turn the knob did it have an actuator that hits the micro switches in the same way that a 8-way joystick does?  I'm assuming its some sort of off centered cam type thing that does this..

[brandon]

Does your controller spin freely or does it "click" into position at each section?  That's what is neat about the Front Line controller.  You have that clicking at each position.  (kind of like changing the channel back before remote controls)

For reference for those not familiar with the controller, here are some photos:

ahh.. so pressing the knob made it fire?  when you turn the knob did it have an actuator that hits the micro switches in the same way that a 8-way joystick does?  I'm assuming its some sort of off centered cam type thing that does this..

[wugly]

Yes the switch clicks and locks in when you turn it.  actually untill I got the bigger knob it was a little hard to turn with such a small knob in a playable fashion but the bigger knob allows you to put enough tourque on it so that it feels right.  the roller switch mounted on the left fires the unit when you press down on the spring mounted switch, very simple but it does require a little effort to have adjusted properly during assembly. My controller solution is different then the factory due to the fact that I do not have access to machinists and machine shops,  I use the switches inherent attributes to simulate most of the controllers functions but it requires a little bit of corrections with the diode array to emulate how the microswitches are positioned and actuated on a machined mounting plate. my version is a down and dirty backyard version that anyone with a dremel, a drill, a saw and a soldering iron can build.

[brandon]

my version is a down and dirty backyard version that anyone with a dremel, a drill, a saw and a soldering iron can build.

awesome   That's what BYOAC is all about

[bkenobi]

OHHHH, I get it!  So this is a rotary joystick that's been split into 2 with a disks of tron push spinner thrown in there.   

So, to play this without a Front Line rotary controller would be easiest with either 1 8-way + 1 8-way trigger stick or 1 8-way rotary joystick + 1 button.

[wugly]

OHHHH, I get it!  So this is a rotary joystick that's been split into 2 with a disks of tron push spinner thrown in there.   

So, to play this without a Front Line rotary controller would be easiest with either 1 8-way + 1 8-way trigger stick or 1 8-way rotary joystick + 1 button.

[/color]
fairly close except you are missing one more trigger that either throws hand grenades or makes the guy jump into or out of the tank.  A truly cool game that is impossible to really play without reliable controls.  My first version of this control had me smacking my head against the wall with frustration.    I also had to change the spinner knob to make the control easier to turn and too look cooler then the dinky arrow knob they originally sent with the control.