Gyruss and Time Pilot, the way they were meant to be played

[leapinlew]

Big thanks to bratwurst who shared his copy of spinmame. I'm pretty sure this is the same copy I was using. I tested and it's working as expected.

Send me a PM if you want a copy of it.

[Derken73]

it works brilliantly
got to stage 9 on my first try 

many many thanks!

[negative1]

thanks to lew for getting to try this out.

i'm already an expert at both games, and can flip both of them with the normal controls.

however, playing with an analog dial gives a lot more precision of course, and makes it much
easier to play.

so for beginners, this is a good way to train.

later
-1

[leapinlew]

thanks to lew for getting to try this out.

i'm already an expert at both games, and can flip both of them with the normal controls.

however, playing with an analog dial gives a lot more precision of course, and makes it much
easier to play.

so for beginners, this is a good way to train.

later
-1

For me, it makes the games much more playable, but since the game is designed to work with a joystick (for some reason), the game was designed to be not as difficult as they would have made it if you had analog controls. To me those games make more sense with a spinner.

It takes out some of the challenge, but that's because it's using bad controls.

[opt2not]

It takes out some of the challenge, but that's because it's using bad controls.

[leapinlew]

It takes out some of the challenge, but that's because it's using bad controls.

Oh yeah! Goes without saying.

Plenty of folks love the controls and gameplay as it is. With a spinner, it’s like a game genie hack. Since the game was programmed to be used with a joystick the game is much easier. If you could play tempest with a joystick, it would probably be super difficult because it’s meant to be played with a spinner. Different strokes...

[Mr. Peabody]

Gyruss and Time Pilot controllers seem weird when you think laterally rather than circularly. A little re-programming and off to the races. Or at least in Gyruss you could stay in the lower third of the screen....

[opt2not]

It takes out some of the challenge, but that's because it's using bad controls.

Oh yeah! Goes without saying.

Plenty of folks love the controls and gameplay as it is. With a spinner, it’s like a game genie hack. Since the game was programmed to be used with a joystick the game is much easier. If you could play tempest with a joystick, it would probably be super difficult because it’s meant to be played with a spinner. Different strokes...

Except it’s not different strokes. It’s just plain wrong.
The original designer didn’t intend to use a spinner for those games. This is especially true with Gyruss. It’s apparent to how positioning and spawn patterns cater to an 8-way joystick, and memorizing the spawn locations with the ability to quickly move your ship to a specific location is a major part of the game. You don’t get specific location movement with a spinner. In Gyruss Down-right will always move your ship to the 4-o’clock position. Up, will always move your ship to 12-o’clock. If you are truly familiar with the game you’d know that being able to get to these locations quickly for enemy spawns is 80% of the gameplay.

Let’s not construe this more than it is. It’s a neat hack to mess with the game. But to try to spin this as “it’s better with spinner” is just ridiculous. It’s like saying, Leonardo Da Vinci shouldn’t have painted the Mona Lisa with a sfumato technique, layered painting is better. Or Picasso should have done Impressionism rather than cubism because people can digest it easier.
 

[negative1]

i wonder if anyone got good at the crystal castles joystick version, which came after
the original trackball.

i tried the emulated version, and did ok, but it made it harder.

marble madness had a trackball, and the plan was for marble madness 2 to use joysticks.
but that didn't pan out.

some games feel more natural with certain controllers, others, the limitations of them,
can complement the game.

later
-1

[leapinlew]

Except it’s not different strokes. It’s just plain wrong.
The original designer didn’t intend to use a spinner for those games. This is especially true with Gyruss. It’s apparent to how positioning and spawn patterns cater to an 8-way joystick, and memorizing the spawn locations with the ability to quickly move your ship to a specific location is a major part of the game. You don’t get specific location movement with a spinner. In Gyruss Down-right will always move your ship to the 4-o’clock position. Up, will always move your ship to 12-o’clock. If you are truly familiar with the game you’d know that being able to get to these locations quickly for enemy spawns is 80% of the gameplay.

Let’s not construe this more than it is. It’s a neat hack to mess with the game. But to try to spin this as “it’s better with spinner” is just ridiculous. It’s like saying, Leonardo Da Vinci shouldn’t have painted the Mona Lisa with a sfumato technique, layered painting is better. Or Picasso should have done Impressionism rather than cubism because people can digest it easier.
 

I did say it was a hack because, well, it clearly is and it's also pretty obvious that "it's better with a spinner" is my opinion.

Your points about Gyruss are well placed. You zeroed in on the one game where game play was designed well for a joystick. I don't like the game all that much, but I did enjoy it with the spinner. That's why I prefer it with a spinner - I just liked it and would actually play it. The more random games, such as Time Pilot, Star Castle, Asteroids - those work much better out of the box with a spinner than Gyruss.

We had a version of Track'n'field with trackballs at our local bowling alley. That was a total blast and I really pumped some quarters into it. To me, that's a good example where controls were switched and it made a different, and some would say, better experience.

[negative1]

I did say it was a hack because, well, it clearly is and it's also pretty obvious that "it's better with a spinner" is my opinion.

Your points about Gyruss are well placed. You zeroed in on the one game where game play was designed well for a joystick. I don't like the game all that much, but I did enjoy it with the spinner. That's why I prefer it with a spinner - I just liked it and would actually play it. The more random games, such as Time Pilot, Star Castle, Asteroids - those work much better out of the box with a spinner than Gyruss.

time pilot was designed by the same guy that did gyruss.

i don't feel like anythings missing out when playing that game with a joystick.

same with time pilot 84 which also used a joystick. but that was a much harder game.

later
-1

[Mr. Peabody]

Set the spinner sensitivity to match the rate of the movement in the original.

Time Pilot '84 has peculiar elements that constrain flight patterns, especially in later levels. However, the game is not in Spinmame.

Marble Madness is fine with a trackball, and finer with a joystick. Fast run areas are easier with a stick with sensitivity of analog directions set to 100.

[MoonPatrol76]

Sorry to dig up this ancient post   
But since I am just now in the situation of building a spinner MAME cab I'd linke to ask if someone could share his "spinner mame version" with me for playing Gyruss and Time Pilot with it ? Would be highly appreciated.
Thank you.

[leapinlew]

Sorry to dig up this ancient post   
But since I am just now in the situation of building a spinner MAME cab I'd linke to ask if someone could share his "spinner mame version" with me for playing Gyruss and Time Pilot with it ? Would be highly appreciated.
Thank you.

PM Sent!

[haynor666]

Is there new source for recent mame available ? I would like to integrate this diff into groovymame.

[leapinlew]

Nope!

I run a couple different versions of mame to play the different games that work differently on different versions of Mame.