KeyWiz 1.5 & Assigning 2 buttons to one command???

[stace]

Guys,

I want to wire two coin buttons to the same key command.  Is there any reason why I shouldn't do it??

There a few extra buttons I want to add to my cab and it will make me one input short (I'm using a keywiz 1.5).  My thought was, if I wire both of the credit buttons to the same input, irrelevant of which is pushed will still give credit.

I only went with two credit buttons for aesthetics, I don't need them to do anything different?

Will 'dual' wiring cause me problems with the key-wiz, I don't want to blow it up or anything!!


Thanks
Stace

[brock.sampson]

I have the keywiz eco and I did something similar.  I have a couple buttons next to my spinner that are wired to to button 1 and 2 for player 1.  I'm not connecting both directly to the keywiz but to the buttons.  I haven't had any problems.  I think this is a pretty common practice and used a lot when you have an eight way and dedicated four way joysticks for player 1.

[Tiger-Heli]

Wiring two buttons to an input is not a problem.

There are a few games (Gauntlet is one I believe),  that require separate coin inputs for each player, but if you don't care about these.

Another option is to use the one-click Shazaaam! adapters that RandyT's sells for a couple of additional inputs.

Hope This Helps!!!

[stace]

My other option might be to wire to buttons to the 'enter' command then?

Enter for mame and then maybe map enter to the plunger for pinball???

What do you think?

[Tiger-Heli]

I'm not following you, but I probably need more info on what you're doing.

[stace]

If Gauntlet requires two credit buttons (its only a two player cp) then I can accomodate but it will mean I'll have to try and pair up a different two  buttons so I don't go over my 32 input quota.

I will use a button wired to 'Enter' in mame and could potentially wire in another button into the 'Enter' input for pinball (assuming pinball accepts enter, or can be configured)


Does that make sense?

[Tiger-Heli]

If Gauntlet requires two credit buttons (its only a two player cp) then I can accomodate but it will mean I'll have to try and pair up a different two  buttons so I don't go over my 32 input quota.
I will use a button wired to 'Enter' in mame and could potentially wire in another button into the 'Enter' input for pinball (assuming pinball accepts enter, or can be configured)
Does that make sense?

Still not following you.

Enter is Input N on the default Keywiz codeset.

If you don't want a dedicated button for Enter - you can reprogram that to something else (and assign a start menu shortcut to load the new codeset) and there's your extra input.  You can then use Shazaaam!-Button 1 to send enter.

If you do want a dedicated button for Enter and Coin 2 you just get one of the $1.50 adapters are use it to wire a button to send Shazaaam!-Terminal J (Default P2 Start) and you now have 33 inputs.

Hope that made sense!!!

[Green Giant]

A much easier method for the 2nd player coin button is to just map it in mame.

You can map the player one and player two coin buttons to the same button.  Only difference is that when either player hits coin it will add one coin for both players.

You don't really have to worry about the default keywiz settings as everything can be changed.  Just hit tab, go into the default key settings and assign to your hearts delight. 

As for multiple buttons to the same input, it works great.  I have two pause buttons for each player wired to the same input.  I also have two exit buttons wired up in series to the same input so that both buttons are required to exit, keeps sore losers from quitting.  Just make sure if you want the buttons to act independently, wire them in parallel.

[stace]

OK COOL

Thanks 

[SavannahLion]

If Gauntlet requires two credit buttons (its only a two player cp) then I can accomodate but it will mean I'll have to try and pair up a different two  buttons so I don't go over my 32 input quota.

Just a thought, don't take this the wrong way.

What is it that you're doing to a 2 player CP that you need to start pairing up inputs?

Is there a possibility that you can reconsider your CP design? For instance, a properly designed CP shouldn't need any admin controls at best or would need enough to be counted on one hand at worst. Too many more and you risk having your CP look like a skittles bag barfed all over it.

Most cabinets, once set up and configured, never need most of their admin functions. A keyboard hidden away inside can be pulled out for those rare times when you do need to do some admin functions.

Not all inputs need to be fed through the KeyWiz. For instance, there aren't very many reasons to justify feeding volume controls through the keywiz.

Tiger_Heli already mentioned it, but it seems to have been ignored as an option. If you absolutely must have all those additional keys. Consider leveraging the Shazaaam! function of the KeyWiz. WIth careful wiring or purchase of an adapter, the Shazaaam! allows you to eek out an additional 24 inputs on top of the existing 32. Randy has updated his schematics (or I finally have a grasp on what the Shazaaam! actually does) to better illustrate the Shazaaam! function.

[Tiger-Heli]

WIth careful wiring or purchase of an adapter, the Shazaaam! allows you to eek out an additional 24 inputs on top of the existing 32.

I agree with SavannahLion, but I do want to clarify, the adapters can give you an addition 24 ADMIN inputs.  You can't use them for action inputs b/c when you send the Shazaaam! input, it Shazaaam!'s any other input as well.

[stace]

OK This is how its looking.......

Keywiz Has 32 Inputs

My config - Not all on the CP!

Player 1
Joystick    - 4 inputs
6 buttons - 6 Inputs

Player 2
Joystick    - 4 inputs
6 buttons - 6 Inputs

Enter        - 1 Input
Exit           - 1 Input
Pause       - 1 Input

Tab           - 1 Input

Player1     - 1 Input
Player2     - 1 Input

Coin1        - 1 Input
Coin2        - 1 Input


Pinball

Left Flipper - 1 Input
Left Nudge - 1 Input

Right Flipper - 1 Input
Right Nudge - 1 Input

Plunger        - 1 Input


Total of 33 Inputs 

[Fozzy The Bear]

Pinball

Left Flipper - 1 Input
Left Nudge - 1 Input

Right Flipper - 1 Input
Right Nudge - 1 Input

Plunger        - 1 Input

OK I see where you're going wrong.... Pinball...  I hit my head against a wall with this one for a while as well. Till the guys on here straightened me out with it..

Look at it this way... You're not going to be using your six buttons per player when you're playing pinball.  Connect your pinball buttons to the same contacts as your normal player 1 (six buttons) and player 2 (six buttons). That gives you 12 inputs to use. Then all you have to do is map the controls in your pinball game to use those inputs.  OR if the particular pinball game doesn't have mapable controls, then create a pinball profile for the keywiz itself and you can play your pinball game with your pinball buttons.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Tiger-Heli]

Fozzy typed faster than me.

I would combine the pinball inputs.

Most likely map left flipper and nudge in parallel with P1B5 and P1 B6 and right flipper and nudge with P2B5 and P2B6.

Only drawback to this is if someone mashes the flipper buttons in a 6-button game (Street Fighter) or mashes the 5 and 6 buttons in a pinball game, it would be bad, but classic games with 3-buttons would be unaffected.

That takes you down to 29 inputs, so you should be good.

Keywiz uses MAME defaults, so if you're Pinball Emu keys are assignable, just reset them to match the MAME inputs.

If they aren't, you just need to re-program the KeyWiz to match - you will need to do this each time you re-boot, but you can run the programming utility from a shortcut, so it happens in the background.

Post back if you have more questions.

[SavannahLion]

Whoops, forgot to mention that. Thank you Tiger-Heli.

Enter        - 1 Input
Exit           - 1 Input
Pause       - 1 Input

Tab           - 1 Input

I was going to suggest Shazaaam!, the above. You'll go down to 29 inputs. Use the data lines from Player and Coin 1 & 2 to minimize any conflicts during play when hitting the Pause button.

But Tiger-Heli's and Fozzy's method don't require the use of diodes. Mine would.

Hell, now that I think about it. You could gain even more free inputs if you combine all our techniques.

In any case, If you need help with wiring, let us know.

[stace]

Thanks!

Last time I built a cab was about 9yrs ago with a keyboard hack, things have move on alot since then 

[Tiger-Heli]

I was going to suggest Shazaaam!, the above. You'll go down to 29 inputs. Use the data lines from Player and Coin 1 & 2 to minimize any conflicts during play when hitting the Pause button.
But Tiger-Heli's and Fozzy's method don't require the use of diodes. Mine would.
Hell, now that I think about it. You could gain even more free inputs if you combine all our techniques.

Personally, I would recommend avoiding the one-click Shazaaam! adapters if there's a way not to do so.

Not that there's a problem, but you're really going beyond what the board was designed for.

If you have (somewhere I posted one) a four-player panel and are using all 32 buttons for action items and don't want to spend the money on an I-PAC/4 or GP-Wiz for the other admin buttons or you absolutely need 2 more admin inputs, they're fine, but if you can figure a way to not use them, I would do that.

[SavannahLion]

I was going to suggest Shazaaam!, the above. You'll go down to 29 inputs. Use the data lines from Player and Coin 1 & 2 to minimize any conflicts during play when hitting the Pause button.
But Tiger-Heli's and Fozzy's method don't require the use of diodes. Mine would.
Hell, now that I think about it. You could gain even more free inputs if you combine all our techniques.

Personally, I would recommend avoiding the one-click Shazaaam! adapters if there's a way not to do so.

Not that there's a problem, but you're really going beyond what the board was designed for.

How do you figure that? Randy has the "one-click" wiring diagrams right there on his website. As long as you restrict the use of the Shazaaam! to admin functions and not try and use them for action buttons, there really shouldn't be much of a problem.

[Tiger-Heli]

How do you figure that? Randy has the "one-click" wiring diagrams right there on his website. As long as you restrict the use of the Shazaaam! to admin functions and not try and use them for action buttons, there really shouldn't be much of a problem.

Basically what you said in the second part of your reply above.

For some reason it's easier for me to keep track of "Okay, don't hit the pinball flippers b/c it will send a High Punch when I don't want to" than  "Okay, I'm going to press Enter now, so I need to be sure not to press any of the action buttons b/c they will send a different key than they normally would."

In practice it works fine, but the concept bothers me - but that's mostly just me ....

[SavannahLion]

Oh I see. Different strokes, different folks.

I'm just giving the OP all of his options. My personal opinion is that I abhore the use of admin buttons on the CP. Put them under, put them on the side, put them up near the speakers, whatever. But putting admin buttons on the CP is like having volcano zit on your forehead. You don't want anyone to notice, everyone pretends not to notice, but everyone knows it's there.

[Green Giant]

Another idea to drop your number down to 32 buttons, lose the tab button.

On my CP I mapped tab to the pinball buttons and nudge buttons.  So I have to press all 4 to get the menu to show up.  This works really well as I don't play mame pinball, and my pinball emulator can be mapped to the pinball buttons.
You don't want easy access to your menu system on your CP, don't trust your friends.  Make it where the dumbest person can play it without ruining everything.

[bfauska]

Another idea to drop your number down to 32 buttons, lose the tab button.

On my CP I mapped tab to the pinball buttons and nudge buttons.  So I have to press all 4 to get the menu to show up.  This works really well as I don't play mame pinball, and my pinball emulator can be mapped to the pinball buttons.
You don't want easy access to your menu system on your CP, don't trust your friends.  Make it where the dumbest person can play it without ruining everything.

I would think that the dumbest person (and several others in frustration) may be very likely to press the two flippers and nudges at the same time at the end of a frustrating game of pinball.  Probably just me, but it seems you may be safer with a combination of right flipper and nudge, plus a joystick move, or something else on the CP.  Either way your probably safe, but I thought I was safe with default mame settings until I had two little kids mashing buttons who managed some sort of alt+another key  combination that dumped them to the desktop.

[stace]

Thanks guys.

The tab button will be recessed on the back of the cabinet up out of the way of kids hands.

My Enter/Exit/Pause/1Plyr/2Plyr buttons will be positioned under the monitor glass.



Out of interest, whats an OP? 

[bfauska]

Original Poster.