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Author Topic: Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!  (Read 27462 times)

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OSCAR

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Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« on: February 04, 2003, 07:59:42 pm »
I knew you would reply anyway, so I figured I'd just get your attention first.  :)


I was getting ready to buy something to go over the monitor on the cabinet I'm working on when I read a post you wrote about using a dark smoked plexi.  I figured I'd give it a shot since you were pretty happy with the results.

I had no idea how good it would look!  I'm pretty happy I decided to go with a smoked plexi instead of just standard glass.  The games & colors looks so much better.  The funny thing is that I thought they looked great before, I didn't know what I was missing, but that tends to be the case unless you actually do a A-B type test....  Check out this link to see what I did, along with a couple more pics.  For reference, the monitor shown here is a W-G 9100 powered by an Asus GeForce 2.  The same exact camera settings were used in the comparison shots.


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2003, 08:48:45 pm »
Hmm, wouldn't turning down the screen or brightness pot have a similar affect? The picture without the smoked plexi looks a little bit too bright for my taste, which is washing out the colours. The whites are blooming as well which means the contrast is probably set too high. If that control is available I would turn that down. Or maybe I've spent too much time calibrating my projector with Avia.  :)


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2003, 08:57:15 pm »
Hmm, wouldn't turning down the screen or brightness pot have a similar affect? The picture without the smoked plexi looks a little bit too bright for my taste, which is washing out the colours. The whites are blooming as well which means the contrast is probably set too high. If that control is available I would turn that down. Or maybe I've spent too much time calibrating my projector with Avia.  :)

Well, that was kinda my point.  It *didn't* look too bright or washed out before I made comparison photos.  Before I took any pictures, the monitor without the smoked plexi looked fine.  I also took the photos in a completely dark room with the monitor producing the only light, and that likely makes it look like the monitor is too bright, but it doesn't seem that way when there is ambient light in the room.  Could you get the same effect by playing with the monitor controls?  Most likely, but then Windows and other apps look funny when I did so.

I should probably add that a photo comparison probably isn't the best way to show the difference between these.  Rather than a difference in brightness/color/contrast, it seems more like a filter effect has been applied that cleans up the image.  Actually, it's exactly like that, since that is essentially what it does.  Many arcade games used a smoked glass for this same reason.  If the same effect could be gained from adjusting the monitor, I'm sure they would have done that, but that's just my opinion.

« Last Edit: February 04, 2003, 09:10:22 pm by OSCAR »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2003, 09:26:42 pm »
Oscar it looks good.

The other advantage to using plexi is that it hides your monitor bezel and when you play vertical games you can't tell your not using the whole screen.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2003, 10:04:45 pm »
This looks like a good solution to me.  I've been wrestling with making my custom bezel look right, and it never has.  Where can you get the smoked plexi???

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2003, 10:44:57 pm »
Eightbit, yes I agree, it makes vertical games on a horizontal monitor not look quite so bad.  It would look even better if I had a larger monitor in the cab, though.

Ashardin, I got mine at a lumberyard.  They had a decent selection of plexiglas there, better than the Home Depot here in town.

BTW, I've uploaded a few more comparison pics.  After playing a few different games now, I see that the Galaga pic isn't the best representation.

www.oscarcontrols.com/smoked


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2003, 10:47:17 pm »
Well, I know what I'm going to use for MY next bezel!  ;)
Thanks for the write-up and comparison pics, OSCAR.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2003, 02:25:33 am »
Wow, that's kind of a bizarre thing to have such a vast improvement on the picture, but it truly does look better, like the colors and such.  I wonder if it would do the same with a computer monitor and an s-video inputed television?  *Hint hint*
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2003, 09:49:45 am »
I knew you would reply anyway, so I figured I'd just get your attention first.  :)


I was getting ready to buy something to go over the monitor on the cabinet I'm working on when I read a post you wrote about using a dark smoked plexi.  I figured I'd give it a shot since you were pretty happy with the results.

I had no idea how good it would look!  I'm pretty happy I decided to go with a smoked plexi instead of just standard glass.  The games & colors looks so much better.  The funny thing is that I thought they looked great before, I didn't know what I was missing, but that tends to be the case unless you actually do a A-B type test....  Check out this link to see what I did, along with a couple more pics.  For reference, the monitor shown here is a W-G 9100 powered by an Asus GeForce 2.  The same exact camera settings were used in the comparison shots.



Sorry I didn't see the descustion about this before.

My DigDug cocktail machine has tinted plexi on it.  I'm not sure what the original was made out of, but it started to bubble and looked like crap.  I went to a plastic fabricator and had them make me a replica of the original using smoked plexi.

Your pictures are very accurate to the results I got when I removed the original plexi that was in the machine.  That's what prompted me to get something to replace it.

Sorry I didn't see the post before or I would had said something.

TM
« Last Edit: February 05, 2003, 09:51:03 am by The Man »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2003, 11:49:13 am »
I'll add my agreement that tinting really makes it look better.  My cabinet came with a piece of smoked glass, so I decided to incorportate it in my plans.  It is hard to describe the difference between just turning down the brightness on the monitor. It cuts the glare. It hides the outline of the monitor case.

Now I just have to seal it a little better so I don't have to keep taking it off to clean the dust off of it  >:(

Rocky

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #10 on: February 05, 2003, 04:33:48 pm »
I've got tinted glass on my cocktail cab too.

It really does make things look minter. (how's that, I made up a word.)  :D Makes my beater EYGO look great.

But let me tell you, 2 Oscar spinners really dress up the cab... (free shameless Oscar plug.) ;D

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #11 on: February 05, 2003, 04:56:27 pm »
Hmm, I might have to give this a shot myself...  Replace the glass in my Showcase with some smoked plexi, see how it works for an S-Video TV instead of an arcade monitor...  :)

One question is will it interfere with the IR signal of the remote?  Only time will tell...


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #12 on: February 05, 2003, 04:57:30 pm »
I knew you would reply anyway, so I figured I'd just get your attention first.  :)

I was getting ready to buy something to go over the monitor on the cabinet I'm working on when I read a post you wrote about using a dark smoked plexi.  I figured I'd give it a shot since you were pretty happy with the results.

I had no idea how good it would look!  I'm pretty happy I decided to go with a smoked plexi instead of just standard glass.  The games & colors looks so much better.  The funny thing is that I thought they looked great before, I didn't know what I was missing, but that tends to be the case unless you actually do a A-B type test....  Check out this link to see what I did, along with a couple more pics.  For reference, the monitor shown here is a W-G 9100 powered by an Asus GeForce 2.  The same exact camera settings were used in the comparison shots.

See?  I can't be wrong ALL the time :)

Nice job on the pics!  You show the effect very well.  You could stand in front of that all day long and not have to rub your eyes once.

The reason you don't get the same effect by turning your monitor down is that the black levels of the CRT really don't change much when you do that unless you turn the brightness down REALLY low.  And then your foreground images get dull and ugly.

The same concept is applied in the LCD world.  Except they use a thin film and call it "contrast enhancement".  Most high-brightness LCDs have poor black levels, so this kind of thing is required for a lot of applications.

The only thing you have to watch out for is a slight color shift, depending on the acrylic used. This can usually be brought back to perfect using the video card's color tweakers in the advanced screen properties section.

Warborg:  It has the same effect regardless of monitor type, and the darke plexi only cuts visible light.  IR goes right through it for a remote.

I think we're about to see some converts......


RandyT
« Last Edit: February 05, 2003, 05:02:34 pm by RandyT »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2003, 06:11:46 pm »
Hey Oscar,  

Are you using that brownish colored plexi?  I have smoked glass on my cocktail and horizontal upright but I haven't been able to find plexi with the same tint.  I can post some pics of my glass against a white background if you could post a pic of the smoked plexi by itself.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #14 on: February 05, 2003, 07:19:56 pm »
Funny... I was going to post a question about this.

I have a funky piece of glass I want to use for my hope to start soon cocktail table.  

I was considering buying the stick on tint for car glass for it.  Would this work?  Think it would be as good?

Is there any cheaper ways to get the tint?

thanks  :)

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #15 on: February 05, 2003, 08:55:04 pm »
I just realized thats what we use at work.  I work in a Network operations center, and we have this ungodly large 4 person console.  The damn thing is huge, but only two people have enough elbow room.  Anywho, we use it at work.  Its helpful, I will use it when I build an arcade cabinet.

By the way, how much does smoked plexi cost?

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #16 on: February 05, 2003, 08:58:42 pm »
Doug,  If I had to try to put a color on it, I would almost say a shade of green.  I've seen the brownish colored stuff you mentioned, but this isn't it.  The tint on mine was actually called Transparent Gray.  I'm not sure what the brownish stuff is called.

I've updated www.oscarcontrols.com/smoked with a couple of new pics to show the tint better.  Just let me know if there are any other pics you'd like to see.

CthulhuLuke, the monitor I'm using this with (W-G D9100) really is more of a computer monitor than anything else.  I'd say that you should get very similar results to what I've shown with a PC monitor, too.


Yeah, Randy, I'd say I'm a convert now, too!  I don't see why I would use anything different after trying this.  So far I can't find any disadvantage to using it, and the advantages are shown in the pics.   :)


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #17 on: February 05, 2003, 09:08:08 pm »
Funny... I was going to post a question about this.

I have a funky piece of glass I want to use for my hope to start soon cocktail table.  

I was considering buying the stick on tint for car glass for it.  Would this work?  Think it would be as good?

Is there any cheaper ways to get the tint?

thanks  :)


Lilwolf, I'm not sure how the automotive stick on stuff would work.  I've never used it before, but it normally doesn't look too good on cars I've seen it on.  But that could all be due to the application of it, too.  I only needed a 24" x 24" piece for my monitor opening, and I could only use 1/8" thick because of the distance between the monitor bezel and the glass retainer.  I would have really liked to go a bit thicker, but I got lazy and didn't want to remount my glass retainers to pick up another 1/8".  I'm sure that the thicker you go with this stuff, the darker it gets.  My glass retainers hold this sheet tightly in place against the Happ bezel, so I'm not worried about it rattling around or flexing.  BTW, this sheet cost me about $17.  I actually bought it a while ago, I just didn't get a chance to install it until yesterday!   :)

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2003, 08:44:11 am »
The cabinet I used for my machine had both glass and smoked plexi.  each layer 1/8 in.  Glass first then plexi.  I use a pc monitor  (21" and it was free....) as my display and the results are the same as Oscar's pictures.  It is the only way to go.  On mine it basically hides everything.  The game looks like it is "hovering" in the middle of the cabinet.  You can't see the monitor or bezel (happs bezel in my cabinet).  Games with black backgrounds (DK, Galaga, and Robotron my fav's.) look excellent.  The plexi blocks "the edges" of picture you see on a monitor.  The image is just "there".  I can't see how people who use bright display sources (tv/arcade monitor) can tolerate looking at their screens for long times without the smoked plexi.  Very easy on the eyes.
Actually I didn't realize that most people weren't using it.  

Ok I ramble.  Smoke plexi looks great on PC monitor just like it does on Oscar's pics...
« Last Edit: February 06, 2003, 08:45:42 am by Ted_Striker »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2003, 10:06:12 am »
The only problem I have with my smoked glass is that in some games it is more difficult to see the outgoing and incoming "fire".

Asteroids and Galaga in particular are more difficult. Maybe I need to increase my brightness but i did notice a big difference.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #20 on: February 06, 2003, 10:37:02 am »
The only problem I have with my smoked glass is that in some games it is more difficult to see the outgoing and incoming "fire".

Asteroids and Galaga in particular are more difficult. Maybe I need to increase my brightness but i did notice a big difference.

I don't see the effect you mentioned on mine.

You probably do need to adjust the brightness.  Every monitor is going to be a little different in this regard.  The key is to set the controls of your CRT so that a black background remains invisible, while getting the foreground as bright as possible without washing the colors out.


RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #21 on: February 06, 2003, 07:29:12 pm »
Is there any cheaper ways to get the tint?


Sunglasses.  Gas station, $2.99.


 :D

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #22 on: February 07, 2003, 06:34:47 pm »
Hmm, I might have to give this a shot myself...  Replace the glass in my Showcase with some smoked plexi, see how it works for an S-Video TV instead of an arcade monitor...  :)

One question is will it interfere with the IR signal of the remote?  Only time will tell...



That's what I did on my cab, smoked gray (there's also a brown tint available, that's what was on cabinet originaly) and with a 21" JVC tv on it, works A1. remote and all :)

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #23 on: February 07, 2003, 06:59:29 pm »
So where the heck can you buy smoked plexi?  Can't find it anywhere.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #24 on: February 09, 2003, 08:05:05 pm »
Most home depots should carry it.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #25 on: February 09, 2003, 09:01:07 pm »
Both the home depots near me said they are getting rid of their smoked plexi glass.  All they have left is 1/8" thick...

This isnt nearly thick enough, am I right?  I feel like I need 1/2 inch or something-- but that would be too expensive.

What size are you all using and how well is it working?  Is the plexiglass just for show? and if someone pushed on it it would just bend and fall into the cabinet?

thanks!

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #26 on: February 09, 2003, 09:19:47 pm »
Well, I bought smoked plexi today at home depot and had them cut it for me, it was going out and was on sale for 8 bucks a sheet.  My cuts were pretty large for a 25 inch monitor, but the trick is to have a frame painted black as the bezel around the monitor, that way the plexi (which is plenty strong) has support...  I can take a picture of what I mean with my cab if you want it.  Just post and let me know.

- Matt
Of course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #27 on: February 10, 2003, 01:23:42 am »
How thick was the plexiglass you bought?

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #28 on: February 10, 2003, 02:10:06 am »
The stuff I picked up was really quite thin, maybe 1/4 or even 1/8 inch.  I didn't want it so thick it got hard to see through, and with my system of resting it against a black bezel base there is no worry if it breaking....  it's durable and man oh man does it help the screen color, I really had to see it to believe it.
Of course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #29 on: February 10, 2003, 02:24:07 pm »
How about everyone else?  What thickness plexiglass did you all use?

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #30 on: February 10, 2003, 02:32:19 pm »
How about everyone else?  What thickness plexiglass did you all use?

1/4"  

The stuff is priced by volume, so 1/4" is going to cost more.  I paid $24 cut right to size for me (lazy :))  Just look in the phone book under "plastics".

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #31 on: February 10, 2003, 02:57:43 pm »
the area that my plexiglass will need to cover is about 2.5 feet by 2 feet-- it seems to me that if i put in 1/4 inch thick plexiglass, someone can just push the middle of it and it will fall through...How are you guys dealing with making sure it stays in place?

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #32 on: February 10, 2003, 05:11:06 pm »
the area that my plexiglass will need to cover is about 2.5 feet by 2 feet-- it seems to me that if i put in 1/4 inch thick plexiglass, someone can just push the middle of it and it will fall through...How are you guys dealing with making sure it stays in place?

I'm guessing you don't have much experience with plexi  ;)

1/4" doesn't flex much at all.  It's a pretty hard material, which means it can shatter, but it also means it's rigid.  The piece I used was 2x2, and hardly moves when pushed on.  If you had a 1/4" deep slot  on both sides of the material, you have to bend it so far to pop it out that it would probably break first.  But to be safe, hold it by 3/8" on a side, given the extra width.


Now, 1/8" is a different story.  A backer of some sort is probably in order for this thickness.

RandyT
« Last Edit: February 10, 2003, 09:05:03 pm by RandyT »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #33 on: February 10, 2003, 09:42:49 pm »
I'm Using a 1/4" thick 24" x 24" piece of smoked lexan instead of plexiglass for my MP3 jukebox (Virtual Jukebox)(Another Plug) in front of a LCD flat screen monitor. and it makes a big difference. Cuts glare down damaticly. However lexan does cost more. about $40.00 for the sheet I bought (That's including cutting it to size)  

Lexan is tougher and more resistant to cracking. You can make 90 degree bends in it with a sheetmetal brake without it breaking.

If you heat up Lexan, you can even bent it entirely in half without it breaking.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #34 on: February 10, 2003, 10:13:52 pm »
How does the smoked plexi/lexan look with vector games?  Is it too dark?  Usually the vector games are pretty dim for me, and I'm worried if I go with something like this it will be even worse...

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #35 on: February 10, 2003, 10:18:50 pm »
What size are you all using and how well is it working?  Is the plexiglass just for show? and if someone pushed on it it would just bend and fall into the cabinet?

Mine is 1/8" thick, but is very well supported.  I have it sitting on a shelf, runners going full length both sides, and it is kept from moving because it is trapped behind the marquee speaker board and the rear of the control panel.  I have a Happ bezel behind it, so that also adds extra support.

This method of installing the front glass seems to be common on arcade machines, and the best part is that you don't need to mess with any tools or hardware to remove it.  Flip up the control panel and you can have the plexi and bezel off in seconds.  Here are a couple of screen grabs from my cad file to show what I'm talking about (the pink in the first shot is the plexi).

You can see the plexi supports in some of the photos here:  http://www.oscarcontrols.com/unnamed/.






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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #36 on: February 11, 2003, 08:01:31 am »
wow that really is a marked improvement I know what sort of plexi I am going to be getting for the cab I currently constructing

Hopefully will be able to pick up a piece in the UK
« Last Edit: February 11, 2003, 08:01:59 am by canardo »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #37 on: February 11, 2003, 12:30:45 pm »
Well, I bought smoked plexi today at home depot and had them cut it for me, it was going out and was on sale for 8 bucks a sheet.  My cuts were pretty large for a 25 inch monitor, but the trick is to have a frame painted black as the bezel around the monitor, that way the plexi (which is plenty strong) has support...  I can take a picture of what I mean with my cab if you want it.  Just post and let me know.

- Matt

Hey mattudland, I'd be grateful if you could post a picture.  I'm curious as to how much of the case on your monitor i.e. the white part, is covered by the black bezel, and how much is actually covered by the plexiglas.

If you put smoked plexiglas over the white of the monitor case, does it really hide all the white?  I was picturing myself having to build a black bezel that covered the entire white area of my monitor, leaving only the glass showing, but maybe I won't need to do that though (although I'll still need a bezel to support the plexi, right?)

Thanks a lot

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #38 on: February 11, 2003, 12:51:07 pm »
i have a question for everyone who knows about this.. :)

FIRST,how much do these smoked plexi cost..?
is it a lot?

WHERE can i get..anyone from NYC(Randy T maybe?)?

Can you really not see anything inside the cabinet?
anyone got any pictures that shows installed smoked plexi that shows that you REALLY cant see anything inside cabinet?

thanks in advance for any answers/reply. ;D

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #39 on: February 11, 2003, 01:40:10 pm »
Sure when I get home tonight I'll take pictures.  My setup is similar to the one shown above.  I have both a cardboard-like bezel for the inside that is sprayed black, then a wooden bezel to frame the plexi so it won't get pushed onto my 25 inch monitor.

The plexi realliy does help a lot, not just because it helps mask the edges of a monitor, but also because the picture really REALLY looks a ton better.

As for cost, like i said mine was on clearance at Home Depot, so maybe go check it out there.  They'll even cut it for you for free...

- Matt
Of course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #40 on: February 12, 2003, 12:16:46 am »
Okay, here is what I have and I hope you can tell what I tried to do...

1st picture:  Monitor without any bezel, glass, notta.  Just inside the cab.


2nd Picture:  Monitor with a black piece of posterboard cut to fit the edge and act as a soft bezel that will follow the curve of the monitor


3rd Picture:  Monitor with black posterboard, as well as the wooden frame that I drill into place with the cabinet.


4th Picture:  Monitor with black posterboard, wooden bezel/frame, and another piece of black posterboard cut to fit the wooden frame.  It has the street fighter decal on it...


5th Picture:  Monitor with black posterboard, wooden frame, black frame number 2, and smoke plexi-glass in place.


That piece of wood they all rest on at the angle, is then covered up by my control panel when it is screwed in place.  Thus, you cannot remove any of the monitor pieces without the CP being taken off.

The smoke-plexi is 1/8th inch, and it does wonders.  It is plenty strong too especially with the wooden brace back there.

If you need any other pics or explanations, let me know!

- Matt
Of course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #41 on: February 12, 2003, 12:30:36 pm »
my cabinet is refurbished.  It had smoked plexi and glass.  both 1/8th thick.  Somebody asked how to support 1/8th plexi... put glass behind it.  My cabinet looks alot like the autocad drawings earlier in the thread.  Just lay it in...   And yes with a happs bezel and my computer monitor case painted black I see nothing inside the cabinet but image... looks nice.  I don't think the pictures above do it justice (although the pictures are quite helpful).  I think smoked plexi works perfect.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas
« Reply #42 on: February 17, 2003, 04:02:00 pm »
Well,

A few people asked about using car/limo tint... being lazy/cheap I grabbed a roll of insta-cling dark tint.

It's basically static cling tint.

Here *was* my thought process.  I currently have glass (1/8" thick)

... and of course when I was in high school ( geez about 10 years ago) I had an aborted attempt at tinting my car windows...  and felt the problem was the cramped space/poor leverage, curves, and trying to line up multiple sheets  (rear window)

... so... a rectangle that was smaller than one sheet width laid out on my kitchen table should be no problem... right? er.... read on...

I coulda used regular application tint, but thought the insta-cling static cling stuff would be easier to manuever.  I also noted that the static cling stuff was a thicker/bigger mil...

Well... long story moderatley long...  I'm glad I measured the glass while it was out ( 22 11/16"  X   23  3/4" for my future reference) so that I can look for  smoke plexi at HD/lowes. =P

It looks "ok" in the spots that don't have bubbles... (I got ticked after my 3rd application of film and said good enough for now)... but not as good as smoke plexi would have...

*Shrug*  just thought I would share my misadventure...

note: if you were reasonably skilled in real tint application it might not be that bad an idea to try it, otherwise just go for the smoke plexi...

rampy


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Glass or plexi?
« Reply #43 on: February 18, 2003, 04:05:23 am »
I wanna go with smoked glass, too (1/4") - but wonder if I should use real glass or just plexi?

Wouldn't it be better to clean and less sensitive to scratches, maybe even clearer to view as plexi?
I noticed most of the cabs (all?) used plexi, but I guess this was more to avoid getting broken if anyone has lost to often in the game. :)

Last but not least, anyone tried brownish instead of grayish tint?



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Re:Glass or plexi?
« Reply #44 on: February 18, 2003, 09:21:52 am »
Wouldn't it be better to clean and less sensitive to scratches, maybe even clearer to view as plexi?
Glass won't scartch like plexi will. Its tough to put scratches in glass. Plexi is easy to scratch. Glass would also be clearer to view. Plexi is harder to break because it is flexible and its cheaper.

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Re:Glass or plexi?
« Reply #45 on: February 18, 2003, 09:36:20 am »
I wanna go with smoked glass, too (1/4") - but wonder if I should use real glass or just plexi?

Wouldn't it be better to clean and less sensitive to scratches, maybe even clearer to view as plexi?
I noticed most of the cabs (all?) used plexi, but I guess this was more to avoid getting broken if anyone has lost to often in the game. :)

Yes and Yes.  But there are a couple things to consider.  The type of glass with the properties you are looking for is likely to be expensive.

The other thing is that this acrylic material probably lets through about %25 of the light that enters it without a substantial color shift.  Finding glass with these properties could be difficult at best.

You also would probably want to make sure that the glass is tempered for safety reasons.

Quote

Last but not least, anyone tried brownish instead of grayish tint?

Haven't tried it, but don't recommend it.  The best case scenario is a material that approximates what is known as a "neutral density filter".  This cuts the frequency of light evenly across the visible spectrum as not to impart changes in color.  The gray material is much closer to having this property than the brown.

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #46 on: February 18, 2003, 10:57:41 am »
Quote
The other thing is that this acrylic material probably lets through about %25 of the light that enters it without a substantial color shift.  Finding glass with these properties could be difficult at best.

Guess I'll need an expert here in Germany to find out about this and what to buy. The price isn't that much of a problem (or is it really expensive?), I spend so much time on this cab that I want it to be as good as it can!

Tempered glass is this security glass that doesn't break in sharp pieces, right? Well, you never know, although I wonder if this is availabe as gray smoked. :-[
« Last Edit: February 18, 2003, 10:58:30 am by Carsten Carlos »



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Re:Glass or plexi?
« Reply #47 on: February 18, 2003, 02:15:30 pm »
Last but not least, anyone tried brownish instead of grayish tint?

My DigDug cocktail plexi is more brown than gray and it looks great.

TM

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #48 on: February 21, 2003, 10:57:55 am »
Quote
Mine is 1/8" thick, but is very well supported.  I have it sitting on a shelf, runners going full length both sides, and it is kept from moving because it is trapped behind the marquee speaker board and the rear of the control panel.  I have a Happ bezel behind it, so that also adds extra support.

This method of installing the front glass seems to be common on arcade machines, and the best part is that you don't need to mess with any tools or hardware to remove it.  Flip up the control panel and you can have the plexi and bezel off in seconds.  Here are a couple of screen grabs from my cad file to show what I'm talking about (the pink in the first shot is the plexi).

You can see the plexi supports in some of the photos here:  http://www.oscarcontrols.com/unnamed/.






What I wonder (and this is my current problem on my cab) what do you do with the small gap between the glas and the panel? I'm still searching for a good solution that I still can easy change panels, have no gap, and can put the glass as near to the panel as possible.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2003, 10:58:42 am by Carsten Carlos »



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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #49 on: February 22, 2003, 01:40:31 am »
Heh, sure Carsten, go ahead and point out my short-cut...  :)

The gap isn't very noticable when you have a black control panel and black bezel, but here is the "proper" way to do it:

There is a retainer that should go on the back of the control panel.  To do this correctly, your front glass should stop just above the back edge of your control panel so the retainer lays flat against the glass.  On my cab I didn't want to fabricate a retainer (read as "lazy" :) ) so I moved the glass ledge beyond the control panel so the rear of the control would lay up against the glass.

To replicate the original design faithfully, you would have to make fairly accurate cuts and bend the retainer to the correct angle as to not put too much pressure against the glass.  If the angle on the retainer is too shallow, you would still have a gap...  I chose to avoid the trial and error process on my project, but if you have the means and skill to do this correctly, then it would be well worth it!

Here are a couple of shots of my converted Main Event cab.







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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #50 on: February 23, 2003, 10:54:23 pm »
That's cool.  Can you show us a pic of the smoked glass with the room lights on.  Does it look tinted?  8)

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #51 on: February 24, 2003, 12:19:42 am »
My Star Wars Cockpit has 1/4" thick glass.  Very brown looking and it works great.  Of course it's a vector game, don't know if that makes a dif.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #52 on: February 24, 2003, 02:11:40 am »
Thanx, Oscar, that pictures did really help! (as usual  :D)

I found something similar at the local hardwareshop - but made of rubber. If it should work, I'll post it here!



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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #53 on: March 01, 2003, 10:13:02 pm »
Hey all,

Just wanted to say that I picked up some 1/8" smoke/tinted plexi (31 beans cut to size - from a local glass store/company)...

it really made a huge difference in the over all look and presentation of my cab... it hides the bezel and monitor mounts etc beautifully...  and it does make the vertical games look a little better on my horizontal 21" PC monitor

thanks to oscar and randyT for  pointing out this technique.

I took some digital pics but not sure if they're really good representations cuz i'm lousy w/my camera.. *shrug*

Is there arny tips for adjusting brightness/contrast and colors for maximum effect? Bueller?

Rampy


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #54 on: March 02, 2003, 12:54:28 am »


Is there arny tips for adjusting brightness/contrast and colors for maximum effect? Bueller?

Rampy



yeah..dont resize more then once and jack up the contrast and brightness a little...post some pictures will ya?I am thinking about this for a while now.i hear it make the screen look little better.didnt have any luck finding this tinted plexi.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #55 on: March 02, 2003, 12:25:42 pm »


Is there arny tips for adjusting brightness/contrast and colors for maximum effect? Bueller?

Rampy



yeah..dont resize more then once and jack up the contrast and brightness a little...post some pictures will ya?I am thinking about this for a while now.i hear it make the screen look little better.didnt have any luck finding this tinted plexi.

Snaaake, I *know* how to resize digital images - it would also make my picture comparison invalid...

Sorry if I wasn't clear.

What I was (am still) asking for is suggestions on how to adjust the MONITORS b and c for maximum effect with the smoked plexi...  *shrug*

Rampy

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #56 on: March 02, 2003, 12:41:03 pm »
LOL !..allright..sorry for that..
I pulled a "Howard_Casto" on you ! :D
someone else have to help you on this..have no idea myself..never used this kind of plexi..never even seen em..well car windows but thats it.. ;D
« Last Edit: June 26, 2003, 09:46:14 pm by SNAAAKE »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #57 on: March 04, 2003, 03:49:28 pm »
did anyone find any other sources to purchase this stuff

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #58 on: March 04, 2003, 06:05:59 pm »
did anyone find any other sources to purchase this stuff

No major stores in my area carried it. However, I did find several smaller businesses that carried lots of different tints and would cut to any size for a $5 fee. I think your best bet is to ask around at the larger chains in your area about where you might find it and then hit the phone books, I spent about 40 minutes on the phone and ended up with 5 different stores that all carry what I am looking for and are reasonably priced.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #59 on: June 24, 2003, 11:54:26 pm »
OK, so I'm convinced I need tinted plexi.

now, can someone tell me what percentage of darkness to use?  Just asking for 'tinted plexi' might not be enough.    Wouldn't want something that would harldy let any light through!

I'm figuring this is like 50% dark?  or am I speaking out of my arse?  ???
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #60 on: June 25, 2003, 12:20:20 am »
OK, so I'm convinced I need tinted plexi.

now, can someone tell me what percentage of darkness to use?  Just asking for 'tinted plexi' might not be enough.    Wouldn't want something that would harldy let any light through!

I'm figuring this is like 50% dark?  or am I speaking out of my arse?  ???

I know what you mean.  I, too, want something that's dark enough to cover up the bezel and any gaps that might be showing, but to also let vibrant colours through from the monitor.  Anyone have any ideas for me and Justin?  :)

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #61 on: June 25, 2003, 10:27:31 am »
OK, so I'm convinced I need tinted plexi.

now, can someone tell me what percentage of darkness to use?  Just asking for 'tinted plexi' might not be enough.    Wouldn't want something that would harldy let any light through!

I'm figuring this is like 50% dark?  or am I speaking out of my arse?  ???

I know what you mean.  I, too, want something that's dark enough to cover up the bezel and any gaps that might be showing, but to also let vibrant colours through from the monitor.  Anyone have any ideas for me and Justin?  :)

Odonadon

Well I'm not sure you can have BOTH necessarily... I mean if you get decent quality smoked plexi that doesn't color shift dramatically the colors will be similiar but kinda the idea is to "tighten up" the colors a bit (see oscars original pics on first page).  

I'm sure you can get lighter smoked plexi for a less dramatic effect....

I know Oscar and myself didn't have the light transmission ratings available when picking out our respective smoked plexi pieces.  The glass store who ordered my piece was much more general.  They needed to know thickness (1/8th inch in my case)... material (plexi)... and what color (brown versus grey).  If there were ranges available they didn't offer them to me, I'm guessing I got the "medium" range of smoked grey plexi.

*shrug*

rampy

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #62 on: June 25, 2003, 02:04:48 pm »
I just put a peice of tinted plexi (1/8 inch) on my MAME cab and it looks great. I did have to adjust the monitor brightness a bit, but after doing so everything looked so much better.

I bought mine at Lowes. It was like 20 bucks for a 24" x 48"  sheet and they even cut it to the size I needed.

When I had the clear plexi on, I could see very clearly that there was a black bezel covering up a spraypainted monitor case. It looked a bit "amateurish" if you ask me. The good news = the new smoked plexi makes the monitor case and the black bezel completely indistinguishable. A 500 percent improvement.

BTW, In case it matters, this particulary plexi I bought has the brand name Lucite and is tinted bronze, not grey --- looks great, though.

Can post pics if you so desire ... LMK.

MM

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #63 on: June 25, 2003, 02:05:09 pm »
Sad thing...

I just bought a true happs bezel for my EYGO 27" monitor... but no my next project, I think I'm going for a smoked Plexi after this thread...  Shipping was REALLY expensive!

So the question is.  Is there any good smoked plexi that will work well UNDER another piece of glass?  And how do I attach it?

I already have the glass for my cocktail table, so it will also have to hold horizontally.

Thanks!

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #64 on: June 25, 2003, 11:27:33 pm »
Can post pics if you so desire ... LMK.


Please do.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #65 on: June 26, 2003, 09:38:45 pm »
For anyone who is wondering:

My experience has shown there to be 4 varieties (more if you count thickness, but I'm not :) ).

Bronze or Gray, light or dark.  Those are the options.  If you have the luxury of selecting what you want, I recommend Gray, dark.

BTW, I haven't tested it with a transmission meter, but I'd be surprised if it were over 30%.

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #66 on: January 09, 2004, 11:13:13 am »
Thanks to Rampy for pointing this thread out in another related thread. I'm only posting in it to bring it back to the top. I think a lot of the new guys like myself who are just building a cab could benefit from reading through this one. I belive I'm sold on using tinted plexi in mine.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #67 on: August 26, 2004, 07:08:51 am »
i assume grey tinted glass will give same result as smoked plexy - thats what i've just ordered for my cocktail cab.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #68 on: August 26, 2004, 07:36:51 am »
I see you brought this dinosaur back to life too  ;D

Glass is better than plexi though. Otherwise people would use plexi in their windows.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #69 on: August 26, 2004, 07:53:14 am »
I see you brought this dinosaur back to life too  ;D

Glass is better than plexi though. Otherwise people would use plexi in their windows.

Glass is better than plexi for a cocktail.  It doesn't scratch and it's just an overall better surface for a table.  Make sure it's tempered though.

For a cabinet, it doesn't really matter.  Good luck finding the tint talked about in this thread in glass though.  If you do, you can bet it will cost 5-10X more than the plexi (I work in the glass industry).

And some do use plexi in their "windows", it depends on the application.

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #70 on: August 27, 2004, 03:22:41 am »
What is the difference in tint between glass and plexi?  Would the glass tint be lighter, darker, or a different color.  I was all set on glass but might have to change that.  I was quoted $33 for 1/4" thick so I'm guessing this would be the wrong type?

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #71 on: August 27, 2004, 04:04:36 am »
This makes so much of a difference. I used mine with a clear piece of plexi for the longest time, and then recently I got a nice piece of smoked plexi. It's easier on the eyes, and for some reason things just look better. And too, I botched my make-it-at-home-bezel, which is covered up nicely behind the plexi.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #72 on: August 27, 2004, 04:22:52 am »
What is the difference in tint between glass and plexi?  Would the glass tint be lighter, darker, or a different color.  I was all set on glass but might have to change that.  I was quoted $33 for 1/4" thick so I'm guessing this would be the wrong type?
The tint is the same (or at least you can order it to be the same). Glass just looks a lot better. You can get away with plexi if you don't have much money to spend, but who cares about a few bucks.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #73 on: August 27, 2004, 06:23:33 am »
What is the difference in tint between glass and plexi?  Would the glass tint be lighter, darker, or a different color.  I was all set on glass but might have to change that.  I was quoted $33 for 1/4" thick so I'm guessing this would be the wrong type?
The tint is the same (or at least you can order it to be the same). Glass just looks a lot better. You can get away with plexi if you don't have much money to spend, but who cares about a few bucks.

That's what I would have thought, but RandyT clearly knows his stuff on the subject.  Just looking for clarification on his statement above.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #74 on: August 27, 2004, 07:03:08 am »
Randy "works" in every business that comes up here. Just go to a shop and compare them yourself. Glass looks better but costs more. Plexi works ok too, but looks less nice (for tinted plexi it's less difference than for clear plexi, but still) and will deteriorate quicker over time.

So both work, but it depends on your importance on the looks issue if it's worth it. I don't think anyone else can decide that for you.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #75 on: August 27, 2004, 08:13:42 am »
Randy "works" in every business that comes up here. Just go to a shop and compare them yourself. Glass looks better but costs more. Plexi works ok too, but looks less nice (for tinted plexi it's less difference than for clear plexi, but still) and will deteriorate quicker over time.

So both work, but it depends on your importance on the looks issue if it's worth it. I don't think anyone else can decide that for you.

Patrick,

Are you naturally a jerk or did the bullies at your high school turn you into one after years of systematic pummeling?

I've been in the precision optics business for the last 13 years and now design and build "glasses-free" 3D optical systems, many of which are currently being built into interactive kiosks.  My name is on 3 patents related to such. We also have a company that wants these systems built into arcade machines.  So yes, much of what gets discussed here are things I deal with every day in a professional capacity.  What does your resume look like?


To answer the other poster's question, the cost difference would be based on the rarity of the material, as well as any tempering that might need to be done for safety reasons.  You can't cut tempered glass (at least not in the conventional way), so tempering must be done after it is cut to size.  And, the very dark tint (in glass) has little demand, therefore the production batches are smaller and the prices are higher.

The plexi transmits roughly 18% of the light from the monitor.  Check the transmission of the glass you are considering, or ask for the specifications, they are usually available.  Over 25% transmission, and you will start to see the outline of the monitor, which will spoil the effect when a vertical game is displayed on a horizontal monitor.

33$ isn't a bad price, but you should check on the transmission specs and, especially if you have kids, the tempering.

RandyT

BTW, whoever resurrected this one, thanks.  I actually have tested the transmission since this one was last active and forgot to update it with my findings. The real numbers are in this post. Oh, and the plexi appears to be formulated in such a way that the transmission doesn't vary much whether it is 1/8 or 1/4 in. thick.  They are both pretty much the same.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2004, 09:34:38 am by RandyT »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #76 on: August 27, 2004, 09:49:15 am »
Randy "works" in every business that comes up here. Just go to a shop and compare them yourself. Glass looks better but costs more. Plexi works ok too, but looks less nice (for tinted plexi it's less difference than for clear plexi, but still) and will deteriorate quicker over time.

So both work, but it depends on your importance on the looks issue if it's worth it. I don't think anyone else can decide that for you.

Patrick,

Are you naturally a jerk or did the bullies at your high school turn you into one after years of systematic pummeling?
He,he, no, but are you that insecure that you need to claim "I have been in this business for x years" on just about every subject. If I add them all up you should probably be 100 years old now, but more importantly "precision optics" is quite a bit away from the "glass industry" or comparing smoked plexi vs glass.

My resume is simply that I compared the two side by side and I saw that smoked glass looks much better (apart from the advice to buy glass from people who actually ARE in the glass/plexi industry). Indeed it was more expensive and it had to be made by order, but that does not negate that it looks better. Also I always notice a substantial amount of scratches on plexi.

There is a difference, but it's up to people to decide for themselves if it's worth the extra cost.

I'm really surprised so many people choose smoked plexi over smoked tempered glass (on upright cabs). I think the only one outspoken about using glass would be paigeoliver. But then, he can get it pretty cheap.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #77 on: August 27, 2004, 11:01:55 am »
Thanks RandyT, that's exactly what I was looking for.  I should have mentioned that the $33 was for "tinted and tempered glass", maybe I should have asked for smoked but I would think it's the same thing.  I'll ask for the light rating today, Thanks again. :)

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #78 on: August 27, 2004, 12:13:44 pm »
He,he, no, but are you that insecure that you need to claim "I have been in this business for x years" on just about every subject. If I add them all up you should probably be 100 years old now, but more importantly "precision optics" is quite a bit away from the "glass industry" or comparing smoked plexi vs glass.

One can't create and or design precision optics without knowing about the materials one would use to do so.  That would be like a carpenter not having any knowledge of the woods he uses.  

I made that statement because, in public forums like this one, there are often individuals (like yourself) who make comments about things they have little to no experience with, in attempt to make themselves appear to be more intelligent than they actually are, often resulting in disservice to people looking for help by leading them down incorrect paths.  In your specific instance, this happens as a side effect of what appears to be a personal feud with me or anything with my name on it.

Here's the deal.  I own and am proficient with virtually every piece of hardware used in the creation of an arcade machine.  I personally own (2) 36" printers, a 40" vinyl cutter, a 4'x8' CNC router table, a complete electronics assembly station, etc. , etc.....    I write software, design electronics, cabinetry and kiosks.  All of these things I seem to do well enough that people keep paying me (well) to do them.  Should I apologize for trying to help people through my considerable experience in this field?  It doesn't mean that my opinions are more valid than any one elses, but I can certainly identify BS when I see it.

Quote
My resume is simply that I compared the two side by side and I saw that smoked glass looks much better (apart from the advice to buy glass from people who actually ARE in the glass/plexi industry). Indeed it was more expensive and it had to be made by order, but that does not negate that it looks better. Also I always notice a substantial amount of scratches on plexi.

So in other words, just more of the same subjective commentary this board has come to expect from your posts.  I was hoping you actually had a frame of reference on this one and not just "the guy at the glass shop told me so, and the context of the discussion isn't important."

After years of abuse in a commercial environment, glass will look better.  In your living room, it just won't matter.

This thread pertained to a specific effect that could be achieved using a specific material with certain specifications.  You won't find glass like this "off the shelf", if you can find it at all.  The closest inexpensive glass material like this is "architectural glass" for environmental management.  This glass has a coating that reflects more light on both sides of the material than uncoated stock, which is undesireable in an arcade machine unless you like looking at an image of yourself superimposed over the game you are playing (then again, you'd probably enjoy that).

But as usual, you've convoluted a thread full of good, simple advice by adding uncertainty and criticism about something you appear not to fully understand.

Well done.

RandyT

Darktemp:  PM me if you have any questions.  I think this thread is starting to go downhill fast :) .


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #79 on: August 27, 2004, 12:37:07 pm »
Hmm, I might have to give this a shot myself...  Replace the glass in my Showcase with some smoked plexi, see how it works for an S-Video TV instead of an arcade monitor...  :)

One question is will it interfere with the IR signal of the remote?  Only time will tell...



Holy crap!  I hadn't thought of that.  I'm just about to start my cabinet and am planning on using a ~25" TV w/S-Video input.  I really hadn't thought about how I was going to turn that thing on.  Now've I've got some planning to do.  I don't want to have to keep track of a remote.  SHAZBOT!

dot

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #80 on: August 27, 2004, 01:16:58 pm »
Hmm, I might have to give this a shot myself...  Replace the glass in my Showcase with some smoked plexi, see how it works for an S-Video TV instead of an arcade monitor...  :)

One question is will it interfere with the IR signal of the remote?  Only time will tell...



Holy crap!  I hadn't thought of that.  I'm just about to start my cabinet and am planning on using a ~25" TV w/S-Video input.  I really hadn't thought about how I was going to turn that thing on.  Now've I've got some planning to do.  I don't want to have to keep track of a remote.  SHAZBOT!



IR can pass through materials that allow no visible light to pass.  I was using a remote with mine (before the RGB monitor) and had no problems.

So don't worry, it'll work :)

And if you are worried about losing the remote, velcro it just out of sight on the top of your machine, or tether  it inside the coin door.  Better yet, find a TV that remembers that it was on and set to S-video ;)


RandyT

*edit*
spelling
« Last Edit: August 27, 2004, 03:56:25 pm by RandyT »

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #81 on: August 27, 2004, 02:10:21 pm »
He,he, no, but are you that insecure that you need to claim "I have been in this business for x years" on just about every subject. If I add them all up you should probably be 100 years old now, but more importantly "precision optics" is quite a bit away from the "glass industry" or comparing smoked plexi vs glass.
But as usual, you've convoluted a thread full of good, simple advice by adding uncertainty and criticism about something you appear not to fully understand.
I only stated an obviously true fact that glass looks better than plexi. For some reason you seem to need to turn even that into a a pissing contest.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #82 on: August 27, 2004, 02:26:16 pm »
i'm a little confused.  my cab has tempered monitor glass.  would it look better if i also used a sheet of smoked plexiglas also?  and if so, would I put that in front or in back of the tempered glass?  thanks for any help.

Tim

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #83 on: August 27, 2004, 02:31:06 pm »
I only stated an obviously true fact that glass looks better than plexi. For some reason you seem to need to turn even that into a a pissing contest.

From 6" away, you wouldn't be able to tell.  Most of the people where I work have to tap on it to know for sure, and even then some of them have trouble.  Yeah, real obvious.

As for why we are here, one just needs to look at your posts.  (now don't delete them like last time)

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #84 on: August 27, 2004, 03:23:58 pm »
i'm a little confused.  my cab has tempered monitor glass.  would it look better if i also used a sheet of smoked plexiglas also?  and if so, would I put that in front or in back of the tempered glass?  thanks for any help.

I wouldn't try to use both.

You didn't state whether the monitor glass had a tint to it or not, so I'll assume that it doesn't.  

Placing the dark plexi in front would be the least offensive, but would have no advantage to using it alone.  Placing it behind the monitor glass would just add more stray (distracting) reflections, so it would also not be better than just the plexi or monitor glass alone.

If you are looking for the effect that OSCAR documented at the beginning of this thread, you may well like the dark smoke plexi better than what you are currently using.

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #85 on: August 27, 2004, 03:55:45 pm »
The midway cocktails had clear tempered glass tops with smoked plexi under that covering the monitor.  Are you sure this wouldn't look ok?

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #86 on: August 27, 2004, 04:46:13 pm »
The midway cocktails had clear tempered glass tops with smoked plexi under that covering the monitor.  Are you sure this wouldn't look ok?

Without knowing the properties of all the materials and whether any of them were treated with an AR (Anti-Reflective) it's hard to make a comparison.

Regular clear glass reflects about 2% from each surface (4% total).  Plexi also comes very close to this, so you have the possibility of ghosted images unless the two plates are very close together.

As a side note, most of those units were in places like bars (thus the name "cocktail table") where there was very subdued lighting.  IIRC, some of those units looked pretty ugly in the daylight.  I suspect that it was done this way as a cost saving measure, as it was probably cheaper or easier to get than the dark smoked glass tops and you couldn't tell the difference in a dark bar room anyway.

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #87 on: August 27, 2004, 05:33:04 pm »
Maybe putting the smoked layer under the clear layer is to make the bezel more visible. Only the monitor would then be covered by the smoked layer.
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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #88 on: August 27, 2004, 05:46:51 pm »
Maybe putting the smoked layer under the clear layer is to make the bezel more visible. Only the monitor would then be covered by the smoked layer.

Maybe, but I have my doubts on that.  The bezels are engineered to mate pretty close to the face of the CRT.  I'm having a hard time envisioning how a bezel would mate with a piece of plexi between it and the CRT.

The bezels are used by necessity to cleanly interface the CRT to surrounding fixtures.  We tend to be  the weird ones that find beauty in them.  I can't imagine an arcade company making a design decision only to accentuate their visibility. ie. if you don't have to see them, all the better.

But that's just conjecture on my part.

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #89 on: August 27, 2004, 05:48:24 pm »
Thanks RandyT, looks like i'm going to start looking around for plexi instead.  Just to recap, I will be asking for 1/4" grey smoked plexi with a light transmission rating of around 18%.  And if 1/4" is expensive I could go with 1/8" and it would look about the same.  Hope that sounds right.

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #90 on: August 27, 2004, 05:53:00 pm »
Maybe putting the smoked layer under the clear layer is to make the bezel more visible. Only the monitor would then be covered by the smoked layer.

Maybe, but I have my doubts on that.  The bezels are engineered to mate pretty close to the face of the CRT.  I'm having a hard time envisioning how a bezel would mate with a piece of plexi between it and the CRT.


Hmmm, I thought he was most likely talking about the artwork underlay and referred to it as "bezel".  I could be wrong...patrickl???

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #91 on: August 27, 2004, 06:04:17 pm »
Maybe putting the smoked layer under the clear layer is to make the bezel more visible. Only the monitor would then be covered by the smoked layer.

Maybe, but I have my doubts on that.  The bezels are engineered to mate pretty close to the face of the CRT.  I'm having a hard time envisioning how a bezel would mate with a piece of plexi between it and the CRT.


Hmmm, I thought he was most likely talking about the artwork underlay and referred to it as "bezel".  I could be wrong...patrickl???
Ehm yeah. I meant the graphic bezel of course (forgot it was called underlay on cocktails).
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RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #92 on: August 27, 2004, 11:34:26 pm »
Ehm yeah. I meant the graphic bezel of course (forgot it was called underlay on cocktails).

Ahh, that's probably a good possibility.  Anyone have any pictures of the construction of one of these units?  I'd have to believe that they would put the two layers pretty much in direct contact with each other to avoid reflection problems.   Of course, as I said earlier, low ambient lighting probably hid a good portion of these kinds of potential problems..

I don't think I would personally bother to do something like that on a stand-up unit though, as I don't feel there is compelling enough a reason to do so.  For the sake of image clarity, usually fewer layers of material is better, unless they are optically bonded together.

But if you really want to, go for it :)

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #93 on: August 29, 2004, 12:56:35 am »
Anyone out there have the smoked plexi and use an Act Labs TV gun?  I was wondering if it would have a negative effect on it.

Thanks

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #94 on: August 29, 2004, 05:45:56 pm »
I use smoked glass over my PC monitor and have no problem with the Act Labs PC light gun.

Incidently, the Q*bert machine I use as my MAME machine originally had smoked glass over the monitor and clear glass over the smoked glass  (It's an upright).


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #95 on: August 29, 2004, 11:58:24 pm »
I use smoked glass over my PC monitor and have no problem with the Act Labs PC light gun.

Interesting.  Any idea what the transmission of your glass is?  Light? Dark?  I somewhat expect that the dark plexi discussed in this thread would have a negative impact, but possibly only on range.

Quote
Incidently, the Q*bert machine I use as my MAME machine originally had smoked glass over the monitor and clear glass over the smoked glass  (It's an upright).

It would be the only choice for a machine where contrast enhancment was desired as well as a graphic bezel.  If this were the case on a home machine, you'd need to do it this way too, unless you stuck the graphics to the exterior (bleah :) ) .
 
In my case, the machine was barely large enough to accomodate the 27" monitor, so no room for a graphic bezel anyway (it would block parts of the screen.)  Therefore, no reason to use both types of glass.  But in vertical mode, I have a perfect 19" vertical screen with no screen outline, and in horizontal mode the screen is massive.  So it's worth it (to me anyway) to forego the extra decorative touch for something that "feels" right in either mode.

RandyT

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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #96 on: August 30, 2004, 03:28:46 pm »
I use smoked glass over my PC monitor and have no problem with the Act Labs PC light gun.

Interesting.  Any idea what the transmission of your glass is?  Light? Dark?  I somewhat expect that the dark plexi discussed in this thread would have a negative impact, but possibly only on range.


Actually I have no idea. It is dark enough that I can barely see the PC monitor through it. The monitor is painted black on the visible areas.

The tint of the glass in the Q*bert machine is similar in tint to the glass on my Moon Patrol cab (if that helps anyone?) The cabinet was converted and most of the art work was removed from the glass. Although I can still make out that it is orignal to Moon Patrol


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Re:Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #97 on: November 04, 2004, 08:02:16 am »
I'm just about to purchase some Gray tinted, tempered glass.  The guy at the Glass merchants told me they only have one tint of gray.  From the other posts in this thread (particularly from Randy), I've gathered that I need to go for glass with a transmission of no more than 25% MAX?  Maybe I need to shop around first!

Finally, I'd like to see how other people fix/retain their glass/plexi in place.  My cab has been built from the ultimate arcade II plans.  Anyone else used these plans and if so how do you retain your's?  I was thinking of simply using a couple of strips of beading (quadrant moulding etc) to hold the glass against the two wooden slats I have on the inside of the cab?  Does this sound ok, as I want the solution to be as invisible as possible?

many thanks in advance

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Re: Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #98 on: November 21, 2012, 07:12:07 am »
Guys, I could see the A/B-comparism image once, but now not anylonger. No matter what link I open, I get the messege "404 error"

Please, if there is no other possibility send me the A/B-pic to hannes.slanec@gmail.com

Thanks

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Re: Using smoked plexiglas - Hey RandyT!
« Reply #99 on: November 21, 2012, 07:20:05 am »
You're a little late to this party.  Maybe try starting a new thread?
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