My CP idea

[naomi+]

With a control panel the biggest concerns are space and comfort. My mammoth CP with be about 40", a good 10 to 12" wider than the cab itself. Its only a two player cab, but I like elbow room! Im 6'5" and everytime I play in the arcades im elbowing someone! Anyway heres a pic of my design and here are some reasons behind it.

Non-linear button layout, linear buttons hurt yer hand after a bit, so I went with the good old Sega/Agetek layout. The 7th and 8th buttons will prolly never be used, except for one day when the xbox goes in there...

Since the players are angled away from each other, it helps for elbow space, but also helps you focus on the screen without having a corner of the cp cutting into ya... Also this helps move you away from the two light guns located in the center. I will mark cp near the joysticks with arrows so you can see that you are meant to aim at an angle, and i think ppl will notice that it is easier to position their bodies that way anyway...

It looks kinda funky, but it seems to work well on a fullsized cardboard test run. Any opinions?

[Codger]

I assume ergonomics are a factor? If so..

The buttons and the stick seem a little too close together.

Also, the 6 buttons at the end for each player seem to angle down slightly, meaning you'd have to twist your right hand slightly clockwise.

Only real way to make sure is try it yourself and get other people to try also.

[TazMan]

It looks kinda funky, but it seems to work well on a fullsized cardboard test run. Any opinions?

IMHO, if the cardboard mock-up feels right to you, I'd say you have yourself a winner.
Did you test it for an extended period of time?  That is, it might feel good if you only pressed the buttons and moved the joystick for a couple of minutes; but, if you get lost in gaming like some of us   and spend a few hours playing at a time - you don't want to find out that your wrist is angled in an uncomfortable manner, etc.  

Good Luck

[OSCAR]

Angled joysticks would make dual joystick games pretty difficult, if not impossible I would guess.  But if you don't play dual joystick games, then it shouldn't be a problem.  Here's a list of dual joystick MAME games, but it's probably not complete...

Crazy Climber
Crazy Climber 2
Black Widow
Robotron
Karate Champ
Smash TV
Krull
Total Carnage
Inferno
Splat
Boot Hill
Gunfight
Warrior
Space Dungeon
Battlezone
Assault
Vindicators
Cloak and Dagger
Rescue
Lost Tomb
Minefield
Firetrap

[eightbit]

Also this helps move you away from the two light guns located in the center.

Do you have 2 lightguns or are you planning for the day when they get 2 lightguns working?

I don't like angled sticks. Playing donkey kong or most 4 way joystick games is hard for me if I'm not square to the screen. Its  like playing q-bert on a joystick that is square to the screen.

[naomi+]

First thanks for the response, here I go to answer on my design thoughts.

Yes I have two light guns and a fishing rod actually, takes up a good bit of space in the middle of the cab. This isn't for Mame just yet, mostly the DC and SS since they have such a great modern library of arcade games.(cheaper than a pc and it has gun games   )

The button spacing and joystick spacing come from the capcom standard, maybe the pic being so small doesnt show that well.

The buttons are indeed angled, because it is more ergonomic than a straight line. If you look you will see your pinky fingers are nearly as long as the rest, so with buttons pulled down a bit, your fingers rest naturally on the controls. Another thing to think about is ergonomic keyboards, your wrist does not sit perpindicular to a keyboard/cp, it is angled. Sega has made some of the most usuable joysticks by doing this.



Well it seems like the general concensious is that  no one likes to sit/stand on an angle to the screen!   I think most of the comments stem from that.  IF you stand at an angle, which I am always forced to, your controls seem natural, albeit non-standard.  At the same time I'm trying to keep the cab somewhat standard and not have to say, "sit at an angle". I want ppl to be able to just walk up and use. This is for my friends as much as me soooo. Me thinks I will put the joysticks straight to the monitor, and leave the buttons curved. I know the angled buttons work for anyone who try em, but you have pointed out everyone is used to being straight in front of the monitor. THX back with more as production starts

[Garrett_N]

Word on those two lightguns,
Have you gotten them to work together in 2 player games? If so we'd all like to know how.
>>Garrett

[Dr. J]

I've got 2 of Act Labs newer USB guns and I can use both of them at the same time.  I'm using Analog Mame32 62.1(http://www.urebelscum.speedhost.com/)
and Windows 98se (XP won't allow 2 mice at once).

The only problem is that every once in a while, when both guns are shot at the same time, they both go to where one gun is aiming.  This happens like once in 20 or 30 shots.  I was just testing it out today on zero point.  It can get annoying, but it's definately playable, and better than single player.

btw,  can someone tell me how to post a pic.  I have pics of my cabinet on my hard drive, but I don't have a website yet.  Thanks, Jay


Edited:  I should probably add that I never installed the cd that came with the guns.


I've tested these guns out a lot more since this post and put my opinions on this thread: http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=3957
So before you get your hopes too far up, or go spend a lot of money, read those.

[SirPoonga]

Word on those two lightguns,
Have you gotten them to work together in 2 player games? If so we'd all like to know how.
>>Garrett

naomi said they are for the dreamcast.

[CthulhuLuke]

If you want a reallly good button design to base your button curve off of, this is what I got my ideas from,

my bro and I owned two of those, and they were daaamn good for games like X-men vs Street Fighter, and such games as that.  And if you want the best pushbuttons for fighting games, go with competitions, very light action, very good feel.
   -CthulhuLuke

[neuromancer]

Well it seems like the general concensious is that  no one likes to sit/stand on an angle to the screen!  

Personally, my eyes have problems changing focus as I look back and forth across an angled screen. If any of your friends have eyes like mine, they will be happy you made the change.

Make sure your 40" panel is removable because it won't fit through a door!

Bob

[Dartful Dodger]

Angled joysticks would make dual joystick games pretty difficult, if not impossible I would guess.  But if you don't play dual joystick games, then it shouldn't be a problem.  Here's a list of dual joystick MAME games, but it's probably not complete...

Crazy Climber
Crazy Climber 2
Black Widow
Robotron
Karate Champ
Smash TV
Krull
Total Carnage
Inferno
Splat
Boot Hill
Gunfight
Warrior
Space Dungeon
Battlezone
Assault
Vindicators
Cloak and Dagger
Rescue
Lost Tomb
Minefield
Firetrap

WHAT!?!?

How can you forget Karate Champ?

[Dartful Dodger]

ooops, sorry.

[Darkstalker]

DId you consider adding a trackball and/or a spinner?  Since you've got so much realestate, you might as well put it to use for single player stuff...

[naomi+]

Update: Friends said go back to the angle, we all laughed about how we were forced to on angles anyway due to elbow issues...

The cp is removeable, that as well as the upper half, that was a primary requirement of the project actually, for weight and movement issues.

No trackball as I dont even know any games on a trackball! Besides its not really for mame, but im sure one day I'll have a mame machine in there.

thx all

[Darkstalker]

No trackball as I dont even know any games on a trackball! Besides its not really for mame, but im sure one day I'll have a mame machine in there.

OOoo...I missed the part about not having MAME involved and this was console only. Sorry...

Here's my take on your layout:



- Move the lightgun holsters to the sides where they will be completely out of the way.  At 40" wide you'll have to take the CP off to fit through a standard door anyways, so the extra width won't kill you.

- The red lines are from the players belt buckle to center screen.  The yellow lines are from the player's belt buckle straight ahead when at the controls ignoring the screen.  There's a big angle difference there, meaning you'll have either wrist or neck strain with that setup.

You might consider turning each control more towards the center of the video screen (Get the yellow in line with the red), and use the red line as a pivot point to get both players as close as possible without bumping elbows.  That'll help cut down on strain and give you the space you want.

Keep testing with cardboard/paper, and make sure it's setting right next to a TV so you can get a good feel of what it's going to be like on the actual cabinet.  Maybe even play a DC game or two with the arcade stick on a board, and mark how you have the panels turned and placed...

Just my opinion though, I don't want to sound like I'm telling you what to do.  

[naomi+]

Actually I like your idea with the guns...

THe reason the controls are angled as much is actually from a bit of testing..it really looks funny and perhaps awkward, but we have been having a blast testing on the wood cut(granted cutting the lexan is harder than i pictured). Hopefully Ill have some prints up soon! THX for all the feedback...I gotta think about the gun thing, that could work....