Any chance of banning hot topics

[monkeybomb]

I know it is my responsibility to abstain from a post about religion or GW, but I can't.  And maybe this rant is just a demonstration of poor impulse control.  On those threads I end up learning about peoples religions and political views.  For me this gets in the way of the advice they give and could even be an obsicle in a potential trade.  This should never be the case.

The most prominent example is Drew Karee who has a lot to offer when he's off his soapbox.  But now when I see his name I just cringe and think about the awful things he says in the everything else section. 

I am also probably guilty of offending people.  When I see stuff about the pope I get angry and I can't help myself.  There is no need for that here. 

The thing that is SO great about a forum like this is that we can discuss our common intrest without all that getting in the way. 

If I just need to stop going to the Everything else forum then I'll try.  But it's a shame that I and others will miss out on fun off topic threads (dream girls) and even arcade related threads (Mame licence) just because I don't want to get dragged into a political discussion.

Another solution would be to create a politics and religion section that could be the place for all that garbage.

Thanks (sorry) for the vent.  I needed that.

[Shape D.]

Thats kind of the point of the everything else forum. (I think) I don't agree with everything anyone says in there, but I strangley find it the most interesting forum on this board. No matter where you go youre going to find people with opinions, be it internet or the grocery store. If you don't feel like trading or purchasing anything from drew because you don't agree with his view on some subjects then don't. but I'd advise you not to just discount anyones advice based on thier opinion in a political thread because theres a lot of people here who know a lot about various things. And I've noticed drew in paticular knows a fair ammount about woodworking and tools.

[tommy]

Dont read threads with subjectmatter you see unfit , and dont read topics from people you believe will make you feel uncomfortable.

This is why its in the *everything else* section .....you can tell what a topic is going to cover MOST times by reading the title ,so stay clear if your unhappy.

Hope that helps, sometimes we forget we should be having fun here and learning not trying to change the world.

[General Zod]

I speak from experience when I say this .... the Everything Else forum can surely get you in heaps of trouble. I should know!

Remember this line, and you're sure to stay out of hot water!

There has never been a more wretched hive of scum and villainy!

Keep that handy when entering the Everything Else forum, and I assure you, you'll not be sorry.

[Pixelhugger]

If I just need to stop going to the Everything else forum then I'll try.

[paigeoliver]

Speaking as PROBABLY the only person here who has ever met DrewKaree, and I can promise you that you are never going to meet a nicer person.

You'll probably find that you have widely diverging viewpoints from many of your favorite people. It just comes into play more on the internet because people tend to argue these subjects more on the web than in real life.

Don't read those threads if you don't want to. If I was judging most of you based on your political leanings then I wouldn't like many people here.

Anyway, Drew and I are in the minority here. "Conservatives" and "liberals" might be evenly split in the REAL WORLD, but the kind of the kind of people who tend to be attracted to web forums seem to be HEAVILY slanted toward the "liberal" side of things.

Also, people will ALWAYS disagree with you on things, on hot issues the chances are good that your opinion is as offensive as theirs is.

[saint]

That's because liberals are smarter and know how to use these computer things

Anyway, Drew and I are in the minority here. "Conservatives" and "liberals" might be evenly split in the REAL WORLD, but the kind of the kind of people who tend to be attracted to web forums seem to be HEAVILY slanted toward the "liberal" side of things.

[monkeybomb]

I'm sure Drew is a great guy.  Political views aside he helps anyone that he can in this forum and he has the experience to back up his advice, unlike many.

But in real life I don't mix my common interests with a little dose of "let's fight about abortion"  If I differ from someone in that respect we leave it at that and focus on positive things.

But here, if I want to read about how to move an arcade game it's mixed with religion and politics.

Banning hot topics is a stupid idea.  Creating a forum specifically devoted to them is not.

[APFelon]

Banning hot topics is a stupid idea.  Creating a forum specifically devoted to them is not.

But that's just the thing. The Everything Else forum didn't start out as a lather-rinse-repeat soapbox. It was actually a pretty fun forum. I left for a few months to find it a cesspool when I returned. Such a cryin' shame, but I don't make the rules around here.

But I DO stay off of that forum now. It was like having a bath in fresh vomit, and now I don't see some of the BYOAC members in the same light after reading some of the most foolish things I think I have ever seen on an Internet forum (aside from one lunitic who said he wanted all humans to die in order to save the animals... but that was in an Unreal Tournament  Instagib forum a number of years back).

So as the saying goes... in some aspects, ignorance is bliss. 

However, if it gets too out of hand (and from past experiences, I have every reason to believe that it will) might I suggest a "no holds barred" forum. This solution was used in a Descent forum I used to frequent a few years back. The forum was passworded, but not "restricted". A user could request the password to flamewar, post insanity, bash religion or a political party, or other things that many find distasteful or rude.

We have a few members that ONLY post political and religious spewings now. A No Holds Barred forum would keep potential new users from seeing BYOAC's "ugly side", metaphorically speaking, and at least give the illusion that all of the members here are somewhat civil and rational if that what it comes down to.

But it's up to the admins. We can have a friendly forum where people see it as a "community", or we can deal with bruised egos, damaged pride and hurt feelings and be a "resourse" that people reference from time to time because they don't want to deal with the pap on a daily basis.

"Free Speech" is protected, and we maintain civility to a greater degree than we might otherwise. Give it a bit of thought.

APf

[Bones]

THIS POST IS RIDICULOUS.

There is a dedicated place for the crazies to gather and discuss non-related arcade topics. That is why it exists. This is why it is called "Everything Else".

I know it is my responsibility to abstain from a post about religion or GW, but I can't. And maybe this rant is just a demonstration of poor impulse control.

Just because you do not have the ability to control your impulsive reactions does not warrant an overhaul of what is obviously a popular forum in which many individuals frequent and are doing little harm.

There is a lot of junk on TV. If you don't want to watch a particular show, grab your remote and change channels. If you don't like the song on the radio, change stations. If you don't want to read the everything else forum, then don't click the link.

The solution is easy and attacking individuals or groups who post in this forum because you don't like the subject matter is appalling and in my opinion immature.

A No Holds Barred forum would keep potential new users from seeing BYOAC's "ugly side", metaphorically speaking, and at least give the illusion that all of the members here are somewhat civil and rational if that what it comes down to.

You have just illustrated the ugly side perfectly with your comments.

Sorry guys, but if you can't take it then don't dish it out. I would understand your frustration if the remaining forums were crawling with off subject ravings but this is rarely the case so grow up or shut up.

[APFelon]

You have just illustrated the ugly side perfectly with your comments.

Sorry guys, but if you can't take it then don't dish it out. I would understand your frustration if the remaining forums were crawling with off subject ravings but this is rarely the case so grow up or shut up.

Wow. Insults from a BYOAC member I have never had any contact with.

Color me amazed and wide-eyed. My jaw is agape and everything. My face is flush and meh heart is all a flutter. Someone fetch a Poloroid, I'm sure I am quite a sight.

Might I suggest practicing what you are advocating?  Part of growing up is knowing when to shut up, and brother, you ain't out of puberty yet.

APf

   

[Bones]

OK.

Walking away.

[SirPeale]

Wow. Insults from a BYOAC member I have never had any contact with.

You thought that was insulting?

[Kremmit]

Hey, somebody move this thread to the No Holds Barred forum! 

[Shape D.]

Wow. Insults from a BYOAC member I have never had any contact with.

You thought that was insulting?

Lets hope he never gets in an argument with howard costo.

[SirPoonga]

Wow. Insults from a BYOAC member I have never had any contact with.

You thought that was insulting?

I'm with you.

[Stingray]

Atariage has a Politics and religion forum, which I think is great. I never even look in there, and it does have the "hive of scum and villany" reputation. That forum leaves me free to peruse the other off topic areas while remaining blissfully unaware of the nasty flame wars over politics & religion that may be going on. I don't discuss those two topics in real life, I'd prefer not to discuss them online either.

I get along with just about everyone here very well. Staying away from the P&R threads helps it stay that way. Yes I can (and do) just avoid clicking on the threads that look like they may be "hot", but IMO it would be better if they were isolated and quarantined until a cure can be found. OK, I'm going back to see what's new in the "Dream Girls" & "Children of the '80's" threads.

-S

[Zero_Hour]

I personally see no reason to change the curernt setup.

It's a wild internet out there folks. BYOAC is one of the most consistantly administered forums that I frequent. Very often it is simple to determine the nature of a thread simply by its title. Don't like it? Skip it.

Other times a thread is more ambiguous or gets off topic. When it hits that point, go for the handy back button on the browser. It's really that simple. I personally like the hodge podge of topics in the 'EE' forum and hope it stays the way it is. What some members consider a "cesspool", others may embrace as "passionate discourse" - opinions may, and in fact, often do vary.

This is not meant as an insult to anyone, but rather a suggestion in general. If doing or seeing something upsets you, but yet you cannot cease that activity, you may have some larger issues to work out.

[monkeybomb]

This is not meant as an insult to anyone, but rather a suggestion in general. If doing or seeing something upsets you, but yet you cannot cease that activity, you may have some larger issues to work out.

I clearly stated that I have issues.

[tommy]

Only you can help prevent forest fires.

[Chris]

If you don't want to read about political stuff or whatever you can usually tell what a post is by its subject.

[quarterback]

As to original poster.

[Chris]

Particularly since, as I read it, it's not that he thinks these topics should be completely banned, it's that he'd like them to be separate from "Everything Else".

[GGKoul]

The BYOAC forum is one of the most civil forums on the internet.

[quarterback]

I'm not sure who this post was directed at (or if it was just commentary in general) but in case it (particularly the last line) was directed at me, I thought I'd respond.

The BYOAC forum is one of the most civil forums on the internet.

[GGKoul]

My post was a general post not directed to anyone..

I'm not sure who this post was directed at (or if it was just commentary in general) but in case it (particularly the last line) was directed at me, I thought I'd respond.

[GGKoul]

Here I am thinking someone said this comment to a BYOAC member in good standing.  Hahaha..   

You missed some of that members other "off the wall comments" in the past and viewpoints.   Hence why he earned the following tag..

"Creator of the Universe - Voted Brilliant by BYOAC Republicans!"

I have never read a rude or racial or "your a dumbass" comment on this board just because you shared your viewpoint.

Again, maybe saying "grow up or shut up" as a response to sombody voicing their opinion isn't rude to you.

[quarterback]

Here I am thinking someone said this comment to a BYOAC member in good standing.

[Chris]

So you think it's okay to call some members (the ones you disagree with) insulting names but not okay to call others (the ones you do agree with) names?

[GGKoul]

You are forgetting that this is an internet forum.  Sometimes people say and act differently on a internet forum then in real life because they get to hide behind a user name.

Its an Everything Else forum.  And Saints tag line fits the board perfectly.
" Things that don't fit on other boards. There is more
tolerance for stronger language on this forum,
but the rules for civility remain the same. Bring strong
feelings and opinions -- leave hate at the door. "

Here I am thinking someone said this comment to a BYOAC member in good standing.

[GGKoul]

Another thing about Polictial Threads.

[monkeybomb]

I wrote the first post in a fit (as if it wasn't obvious).  But the subsequent discussion has made my point.  The everything else category has tons to offer INCLUDING ARCADE SPECIFIC TOPICS, but some aren't accessing it because of the politics.

I was definitely wrong in my fit about banning but there seems to be genuine intrest, by many, in a P&R forum.  All it changes is the location of those threads, and nothing more.  They would still be aloud.  It would bring many back to the EE category who have left and I think make it better.

I also think the change the channel analogy is dead on.  I don't watch shows I don't want to and I'm glad they are aloud to be aired.  Just like the topics should be aloud.  But, I view the subject title like I do commercials on a show I chose to watch.  If I'm watching 'The Simpsons' and fox does their thing, showing me something completely offensive in a commercial, then I can't watch the channel at all if I am to avoid this stuff.  Just like many have left the EE forum entirely.

[Bones]

About 10 seconds after posting my original reply, I regretted clicking the post button. Not because I felt I had said anything wrong or offensive, but I should have chose the high ground and walked away in silence.

As it stands my post has brought offence to some and therefore my actions were wrong.

My comment "grow up or shut up" has left a bitter taste and although I used this term as a closing comment to enforce my earlier remarks, I could have worded it in a more friendly manner.

I am broadminded, from a different culture and impossible to offend, I sometimes forget that other people have different levels of sensitivities.

[Hoopz]

About 10 seconds after posting my original reply, I regretted clicking the post button. Not because I felt I had said anything wrong or offensive, but I should have chose the high ground and walked away in silence.

What is frustrating is that some people should take the high road more often.

[saint]

(saint is following this discussion and mulling it over)...

Particularly since, as I read it, it's not that he thinks these topics should be completely banned, it's that he'd like them to be separate from "Everything Else".   Just entering the "Everything Else" forum and scanning for arcade related or generally entertaining threads can introduce inflammatory subject lines to the equation.  (and, as Chris just noted, politically inflammatory sigs and avatars do that as well)  It's no longer just a forum for fun, goofy, off topic discussion.  It's pat that and part pointless debate between polarized groups/individuals who will never convince each other of anything.

Perhaps a "Free-For-All" forum needs to be created as a subforum under Everything Else, then, so this content doesn't overwhelm less controversial topics that find a home in Everything Else.

(You've already noted that telling someone to "grow up or shut up" isn't insulting from your perspective) And, as I've always said, what happens on this board is up to saint afaic.

I personally found it very insulting (even though it wasn't directed at me), enough to hit "Report to Moderator".  Obviously it didn't help in this case.  I'm interested to see Saint's take on whether that is the kind of interaction he wants to see around here or not.

--Chris

[saint]

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,35408.0.html

[Crazy Cooter]

I voted "no".

C'mon guys, there's no reason for a daughterboard.  If you can't help but read and reply to topics in EE that you know will lead to "trouble", what says you can't help but do the same in a daughter board?  I think it would be better to hand out 48-hour suspensions or warnings if things turn ugly.  We're all here for the same reason, we just need to keep that in mind.

Threads on the internet are like conversations in a restaurant.  You can choose to partake, or you can choose to walk by.

Exercise self control and self responsibility guys.  [Said the black pot to the kettle. ]

[quarterback]

I voted "no".

C'mon guys, there's no reason for a daughterboard.

[Bones]

I voted "no"

Apart from my earlier comments, I don't feel the admins who volunteer to "police" these newgroups should have their time monopolised in maintaining extra child boards of existing newgroups. Not for something as trivial and non-arcade related such as the EE forum anyway...

[monkeybomb]

I voted "no"

Apart from my earlier comments, I don't feel the admins who volunteer to "police" these newgroups should have their time monopolised in maintaining extra child boards of existing newgroups. Not for something as trivial and non-arcade related such as the EE forum anyway...

2 things

First my main push for the separation is the fact that EE often includes arcade and video game related topics.   If you were right about this then I would have just left it some time ago.

second - Saint and the other mods can take care of themselves.  This is not a labor issue.  Do you know the system that each mod uses to check things out?  I don't.  Saint is the one who started the poll, I think he can handle his side.   Also are you sure this wouldn't just make it easier to moderate?

Can you really not see that more people would go back to the EE forum and you can still have your debates?  Where's the harm?  Everything you want to express would still be posted with the same people.  Those that don't want politics mixed with arcades don't have to have it.

We have expressed why it would help our experience on this board.  You have been critical but have not explained how it will harm your experience on this board.

[Bones]

First my main push for the separation is the fact that EE often includes arcade and video game related topics. If you were right about this then I would have just left it some time ago.

Fair enough....

Saint and the other mods can take care of themselves. This is not a labor issue. Do you know the system that each mod uses to check things out?

No I do not. I only assume that the postings have to be viewed & read to be moderated.

Can you really not see that more people would go back to the EE forum and you can still have your debates? Where's the harm?

I simply do not know if this would attract a larger audience & no, I see no harm.

You have been critical but have not explained how it will harm your experience on this board.

This will not harm my experience on this board & I only gave my opinion. How you view my opinion is your business, if you see it as being critical that is unfortunate.



As I said earlier, lets move forward.

[Crazy Cooter]

Those that don't want politics mixed with arcades don't have to have it.

You can already do that though, don't read or don't respond to that thread.
Everything else is just that: Everything else.

[GGKoul]

We need a Control Panel discussion thread here before we a Political/Religion thread.

[GGKoul]

My answer in another thread..

No we don't need one... As there will be MORE mud slinging in this Debate board then good.

Plus having a Debate only board will bring Debate first people to the forum then BYOAC first people who happen to like Debating.  As 99% of the people that on are this forum found this site because they were interested in BYOAC first... not debating.

As I for one don't want see more TAPilots on this forum.  As we should be debating the concepts of building Arcade Controls, and not get in to a hard core debate on Religion and Politics were peoples feelings get hurt.  I say, we "ban" these topics instead of building another forum.

I'm Canadian, and I travel to the US all the time for work.  And there is a couple of small talk topics I don't bring up with my American colleagues...  Gun Control, Who you voted for and Reglion.  As there is nothing I can say nor they can say that will change mine or there outlook to the world.

And I don't want my favourite forum to become a place of "bickering" between members that are here to share experiences building Arcade Controls.

[quarterback]

Since both you and CC touched on the same topic, but yours is later in the thread, I'll just quote your post:

No we don't need one... As there will be MORE mud slinging in this Debate board then good.

Plus having a Debate only board will bring Debate first people to the forum then BYOAC first people who happen to like Debating.

[quarterback]

Everything else is just that: Everything else.

[tommy]

I see no need in splitting up the EE , whats so hard about not reading a thread if its not what your looking for in a topic.

[GGKoul]

I see no need in splitting up the EE , whats so hard about not reading a thread if its not what your looking for in a topic.

Thats appears to be too hard for people... 

[APFelon]

Not difficult at all.

Let's say you are a die hard Democrat and you flip on your digital cable and hit "channel menu". And let's say that 80% of the titles of programs bash Democrats, Clinton, Kerry Pelosi, Reid, and the rest of the Democrat heirarchy.

OR, let's say that you are a die hard Republican, and all of the titles of the programs bash Reagan, W, etc, etc, etc...

How long would it take you do complain to the cable company or cancel your cable subscription outright, despite the fact that you never watch the programs?

Look, in my initial response (with much verbal flare and dramatization because that's what I do) all I was advocating was precisely what has come to congeal with an opinion poll and debate on this very thread: Split off the EE forum from political hot topics and create a subforum dedicated to it.

And I don't quite understand why such debate has raged around the idea, frankly. In the simplist terms, we get a new forum dedicated to elephants versus donkeys and the endless rantings of creationists and Darwinists, Euro opinions on US foreign policies and a slimy pit where abortion is discussed... and EE is reserved for goofy crap we spot on the Internet or whatever (as it used to be).

AND, for those of us who won't visit the new forum at all (me), we won't have to deal with that nagging voice in the back of our heads when we answer technical questions (IE he is wondering how coin mechs work, but he believes that an alien spaceship is coming to take him away to a promised planet... should I even bother answering this guy when he is clearly out of his mind?)

OR, if someone doesn't agree with me for some view of some sort... do you think HE would bother answering my questions if he knew of the beliefs I held?

Grudges last, hard feelings remain and vendettas for some are eternal.

I say lop that forum in half with something REALLY heavy and let the kids play that roped off area.

Or at LEAST dedicate the EE forum for debates of political and philosophical nature and move all of the fun/fluff to the Misc. subforum. This forum is old enough to consider that a big population may call for stronger modding and topic isolation.

APf

[APFelon]

Oh, and Peale- I don't understand why I would be insulted by his comments, either.

THIS POST IS RIDICULOUS.

He dismissed my ideas outright with a rude statement.

Just because you do not have the ability to control your impulsive reactions does not warrant an overhaul of what is obviously a popular forum in which many individuals frequent and are doing little harm.

Insinuated that Monkey and I have no self control.

The solution is easy and attacking individuals or groups who post in this forum because you don't like the subject matter is appalling and in my opinion immature.

And we are immature.

You have just illustrated the ugly side perfectly with your comments.

Implied that I embody the ugliness on this forum with my comments, which were simply suggestions and opinions.

I would understand your frustration if the remaining forums were crawling with off subject ravings but this is rarely the case so grow up or shut up.

And my opinions didn't fly, so he told me to shut up.

How on EARTH could I have been insulted by that? 

APf

[Crazy Cooter]

Right now, the EE forum has maybe 3 topics that could possibly offend someone.  1 political, 1 religious, and 1 racial.

I don't see that as something that warrants a separate discussion board.  All 3 are appropriately titled so you'd know what the topic is before you clicked the link.  Would you keep your cable company if 99% of the channels were arcade related and the other 1% had a program guide?  I think that would be a more accurate representation of this forum (as a whole).

Who cares if somebody thinks an alien ship is coming for them?  If they want to know how coin mechs work, tell them.  What somebody thinks shouldn't have any influence on how you treat them.

[screaming]

  Wait a second, back up.

  Am I missing something here?  Isn't this an Arcade Controls message board? I don't know about you guys, but if I have a problem or question about anything arcade, electrical or even computers, or even if I'm looking for a new PacMan Jr. thumper, I know this is BBS is the place to be. 

  So, then, tell me again what's so wrong about having everything else go into an Everything Else forum?  ..And then when you're done with that, please tell me again why you need to log on to the Arcade Controls BBS and not talk about arcades in the Everything Else forum?

  Why is it such a big deal?  If you don't like everything else, why don't you just stop going into the Everything Else forum?  That forum has nothing to do with arcades and presumably that's why you're here in the first place... right?

*shrug*

-sab

[screaming]

Oh, and if there does end up being a new debate forum I vote this is the first thread to get moved to it!

-sab

[Shape D.]

I'd just like to know what your looking for in the EE forum that you would need the other stuff out of there.

If you need control panel advice, questions on building a cab, hardware questions you'd look in the main forum.

questions about front ends and any other sorftware would go into the software forum.

questions about your monitor? check out the monitor forum.

need artwork help or advice........artwork forum

any audio related questions, speaker help would go in the audio/mp3 forum.

have a question about a pinball machine?   --> arcade miscelaneous.

whats really left for byoac topics that you need to learn? EE is filled with the knee high layers of drudge because thats where it goes, and theres no need to post any arcade related topics in there cuz' they are covered everywhere else.

[quarterback]

So, then, tell me again what's so wrong about having everything else go into an Everything Else forum?

[screaming]

  So, then, tell me again what's so wrong about having everything else go into an Everything Else forum?

So then, tell me again what's so wrong about having nasty-debate go into a nasty-debate forum?

   I find this post offensive and I would like for it to be moved out of this otherwise useful thread.

  Thanks.

-sab

[GGKoul]