Spinner Problem

[eyal8r]

Hey guys-
Got 2 Model 3 spinners hooked up to the OptiPac.  The Player 1 spinner doesn't work- it just 'vibrates' the cursor when I spin it. Player 2 works great. So, do I have this hooked up wrong? On the optipac- there's spots on it for X1/X2 AND Y1/Y2 for EACH spinner. I hooked BOTH up to X1/X2 for each player. Am I supposed to hook ONE player to X1/X2 and the other player to Y1/Y2? Thanks for any help- it's almost done!!!
D

[Oddfeld]

Hey guys-
Got 2 Model 3 spinners hooked up to the OptiPac.  The Player 1 spinner doesn't work- it just 'vibrates' the cursor when I spin it. Player 2 works great. So, do I have this hooked up wrong? On the optipac- there's spots on it for X1/X2 AND Y1/Y2 for EACH spinner. I hooked BOTH up to X1/X2 for each player. Am I supposed to hook ONE player to X1/X2 and the other player to Y1/Y2? Thanks for any help- it's almost done!!!
D

Well it's simulating a mouse, so you can only have 2 analog inputs, 1 x-axis and 1-y-axis. If you want to use more than this (e.g. 2 trackballs at once for Marble Madness or something) you have to use something that will recognise 2 mice connected at once, like MAME Analog+, or some strange mouse driver voodoo. If you just have 2 spinners though, they only use one axis each, so you can hook 1 up to be the mouse x-axis and one to be the mouse y-axis. In other words, I guess you should stick one spinner on the player 1 x1/x2 terminals and the second one on the player 1 y1/y2 terminals (both on player 1, since player 2 would be the second 'mouse').

[eyal8r]

I should've clarified a little more here-

I am running Analog+, XP Home. I have 2 spinners and 2 TBs as well.

That being said- what do you suggest now? I assume the Y1/Y2 refers to the up/down of the spinner- so if I hook it up there, it won't go left/right like it should.  Right?  Or am I mistaken?
Thanks
D

[Oddfeld]

If you've already got 2 mice working, then it shouldn't matter what axis you've got hooked up. It sounds like you just need to configure MAME to use the right one. If the cursor is wobbling, it's probably set to the other axis at the moment, so just change MAME's default controller settings to be mouse2 x-axis instead of mouse2 y-axis for the p2 spinner (in the input settings in the TAB menu...), or just swap the wires over to the y-axis.

[eyal8r]

hmmm- I'll give that a shot. An additional thing has come up as well- while using the Player2 spinner- occasionally when I spin the thing, the entire screen will slide across in the same direction- as if I'm moving the tv or something. How do I correct this, and is it linked to the original problem?
Thanks
D

[Oddfeld]

An additional thing has come up as well- while using the Player2 spinner- occasionally when I spin the thing, the entire screen will slide across in the same direction- as if I'm moving the tv or something. How do I correct this, and is it linked to the original problem?

That sounds like some sort of virtual desktop thing - are your video card drivers configured to use a MAME-like hotkey combination to activate some sort of desktop zoom/vitual desktop panning feature (maybe something is set to kick in when you hit ctrl+alt+space or something).

Or is MAME switching into a video resolution that your monitor doesn't support but your video drivers are letting you use anyway, but running it as a virtual desktop so that when your mouse hits the side of the screen it pans (e.g. you have a 'virtual' resolution of 1024x768 but your monitor is acting as an 800x600 window on this area, say).

[eyal8r]

Not hotkey setup that I know of here- I just installed the card and went for it- didn't customize anything at all (except I just told it to use 640x480 resolution).  If it is the latter of the two, how do I correct it?  I also notice that certain games the resolution is all messed up- the bottom 1/4 is cut off on some, or, it is soo bad that the bottom half of the screen is up on top, and vice versa. How do I correct this, and, is it related to my original spinner problems?
Thanks
D

[Oddfeld]

It might help if you told us what card and drivers you're using, then someone may be familiar with the virtual desktop settings on that combo.

There may be a checkbox to disable virtual desktop features buried deep in your video driver config screens (in the advanced section of display properties - right click on the windows desktop). Or you may have to disable all the resolutions that your monitor doesn't support but your card does - may just be a case of installing an appropriate driver for your monitor so that Windows knows what resolutions it supports, or it may mean a lot of black magic editing ini files or the registry. I really don't know going by the information given, and probably wouldn't even if you gave more detail - try asking in the monitors forum.

[u_rebelscum]

Got 2 Model 3 spinners hooked up to the OptiPac.  The Player 1 spinner doesn't work- it just 'vibrates' the cursor when I spin it. Player 2 works great. So, do I have this hooked up wrong? On the optipac- there's spots on it for X1/X2 AND Y1/Y2 for EACH spinner. I hooked BOTH up to X1/X2 for each player.

Sounds to me like
A) one of the player1 spinner sensor wires (X1 or X2) is not connected,
B) one of the same sensors is broken, or
C) the sensor spacing incorrectly match the encoder wheel spacing.

[eyal8r]

Hmmm- ok, using the latest Analog+, with a Radeon 7000 card. If anyone knows anything on that, can you please post?

I'll check the wires tonight and make sure it's all connected just right.

Can you tell me about this sensor spacing thing? How do I know if/when it's spaced correctly?  Thanks
D

[anoon]

I thought that MAME Analog+ didn't work with XP? (or is Analog+ not required as you are just splitting the mouse axis'?)

Has anyone tried to get Off the Wall (2 player tennis game,) working with 2 spinners?

[u_rebelscum]

Can you tell me about this sensor spacing thing? How do I know if/when it's spaced correctly?  Thanks

The way the sensor work is they are alternately covered and uncovered by the teeth.  So, if 1 meant covered and 0 uncovered, the two sensors are supposed to go 00 .. 10 .. 11 .. 01 .. 00 (repeat) if turned in one direction, and the opposite if turned in the other direction.  The circuits can tell which direction it is turning by comparing what it changed from to what it changed to.

However, if the spacings are ill matched, it could go 10 .. 01 .. 10 .. 01 (repeat), or 00 .. 11 ..  00 .. 11 (repeat). 

Or if one of the wires is bad, or it a sensor is broken, you get something like this:   00 .. 00 .. 01 .. 01 .. 00 (repeat) (red zeros noting it should be 1, but the sensor or wire is bad.)  This is the most likely "wiggle back a forth one pixel" cause IMO.

More mouse info.

I thought that MAME Analog+ didn't work with XP? (or is Analog+ not required as you are just splitting the mouse axis'?)

Umm,
current official mame can remap mice axes, but difficultly.
Most recent analog+ (0.87 zero) doesn't add any multiple mice (that's why I called it a zero).
The prior analog+ version, however, does do multiple mice in XP.

I need to get analog+ up to date, but "Real Life" has been in the way.

[Rocky]

jittering mouse = hooked up wrong / sensors not working


good luck,
Rocky

[eyal8r]

Hmmm- so when you guys talk about switing it over to the Y1/Y2 axis- wouldn't the effect the way they are played in the games?  Won't it tell the game to move the character up/down instead of left right?  So in a driving game, it won't steer since it's moving up/down instead. Is that the case?

I've checked all the wiring on the thing. It's hooked up and nothing disconnected. I hope the Oscar guys can post a little for me and clear this up. If the sensor is bad- will they replace it, since this is brand new...

Thanks guys!
D

[Oddfeld]

Hmmm- so when you guys talk about switing it over to the Y1/Y2 axis- wouldn't the effect the way they are played in the games?

[eyal8r]

ok- I'll give that a shot.

Also- when I do the Tab menu- and this is a dumb question here- is the spinned considered the 'paddle'? Or is it called something else? What do I type in to modify it?  See- configuring Joysticks and buttons are the easy part- I can just type in on the keyboard what I want each to be. But a mouse or TB in the Tab Menu- I don't know what to type to tell it to recognize it.
Thank you guys!
D

[u_rebelscum]

Also- when I do the Tab menu- and this is a dumb question here- is the spinned considered the 'paddle'? Or is it called something else?

If you mean the arcade spinner, mame calls it "Dial".
If you mean your spinner, mame calls it mouse # ? axis.

What do I type in to modify it?  See- configuring Joysticks and buttons are the easy part- I can just type in on the keyboard what I want each to be. But a mouse or TB in the Tab Menu- I don't know what to type to tell it to recognize it.

Analog+:
tab, "mouse controls" instead of "Input (this game)" (need either switchablemice or switchableaxes enabled), enter, up/down to scroll through selection.

Official mame, post 0.84:
tab, Input, go to an analog input, enter, spin.  After that doesn't work, repeat enter, spin until it does, or use the ctrlr cfg file.

[eyal8r]

u-rebel-
I cannot thank you enough for all your help, and your programming for Analog+.

I still cannot get it to recognize the spinners. Let me ask you this- when I'm just in XP navigating around, both TBs control 1 mouse pointer. I try spinning the spinners at that point, and nothing happens. Before you even get into Mame, should the SPINNERS work while operating in XP as is? Or, will they only show movement once you get into Mame? 

If they're not working in XP, and are supposed to, that could explain the 1st problem.

Thanks for your help- I really appreciate it!
D

[u_rebelscum]

If they're not working in XP, and are supposed to, that could explain the 1st problem.

Yes, the spinners need to be seen in windows for them to work in mame or mameAnalog+. 

Note on the optipac (IIRC), the trackballs need to be NOT moved for 3 seconds before the spinners can take over, and once the spinners have control they need to not be moved for 3 seconds before TBs get control.  (Actually, each player is individual)

[eyal8r]

ok- that could be the problem- something's wrong with either the OptiPac, wiring, or the spinner sensors themselves.  Let me go check on that stuff and see if I can figure anything out.
Thanks
D

[eyal8r]

GOT THE SPINNERS WORKING!!!  Yup- the wires were slightly touching eachother- corrected that and I instantly got movement!

THANK YOU for all your help!
D

[Kremmit]

Three days and 20 posts later, eyal8r checks his wiring. 

[eyal8r]

OOOOUUUCH DUDE!!!  LOL!!!
D

[eyal8r]

BTW- I did check the wiring, it's just that there was one little teeny tiny strand of wire touching the other prong, and that was doing it. Grrrr....  LOL
D