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Author Topic: Slikstik sucks!!!  (Read 8987 times)

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crashwg

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Slikstik sucks!!!
« on: April 01, 2004, 09:36:27 pm »
GRRRR!  I'm so sick of slikstik, they are a bunch of jerkoffs!

I ordered two optical stainless steel pear-top joys march 4th and they still haven't delivered.  To top that off, it doesn't seem like they'll even be here any time soon.

From slikstik,
Quote
I can issue a refund if you like. There has been a problem getting
stainless steel at competitive prices recently and it is out of
our control. What would you like to do?
End
Quote

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I shouldn't have to give a crap if stainless prices are up.  I paid for a product now they should deliver!
« Last Edit: April 01, 2004, 09:37:18 pm by crashwg »
If there's bees in the trap I'm catching em
By the thorax and abdomen
And sanding the stingers down to a rough quill
Then I dip em in ink, and I scribble a bit
But if it they wriggle then I tickle em until they hold still
Lemme say it again
In my land of pretend
I use bees as a mf'n pen

crashwg

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2004, 09:48:31 pm »
Oh, my girlfriend just reminded me of another e-mail they sent me a week and two days ago.  I though I'd share that one too.

Quote
We are still waiting on the parts to be polished. Hopefully this week.

Team SlikStik
End
Quote

Seems kinda odd to me that they had the sticks a week ago and now they don't even have the raw materials.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2004, 09:49:00 pm by crashwg »
If there's bees in the trap I'm catching em
By the thorax and abdomen
And sanding the stingers down to a rough quill
Then I dip em in ink, and I scribble a bit
But if it they wriggle then I tickle em until they hold still
Lemme say it again
In my land of pretend
I use bees as a mf'n pen

ekopp2

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2004, 07:41:50 am »
Not to be a Sliksick defender, but the issue with steel prices is a huge issue in manufacturing right now (prices more than doubled). Many manufacturers are struggling with the same issue - if, how and when to pass along price increases to consumers for the increase in raw materials costs.

I don't know SS's operation, but if they haven't taken delivery of the sticks yet, the may be faced with a sudden increase in costs for sticks they don't have yet. So, they may be looking at buying the sticks, then selling them to you at a loss. I doubt their cash reserve is so high that they can ride out the poor margins, so they have to wait to see if: 1) prices come down; 2) they can get a better price elsewhere; 3) they should raise prices. In the meantime, they may or may not fill existing orders.

It sucks, and S/S didn't help themselves by giving you just one definitive option (i.e. you can have your money back if you want). From a customer service standpoint, it'd be nice to know how long you'd have to wait. And, for going-the-extra-mile service, they could stop taking orders and fill the ones they have. (which they may or may not be able to do).

Again, it sucks. And it doesn't look like it's being handled very well. But, I don't believe they're trying to rip anyone off (not that you were implying that).

SlikStik-Christian

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2004, 08:58:41 am »
GRRRR!  I'm so sick of slikstik, they are a bunch of jerkoffs!

I ordered two optical stainless steel pear-top joys march 4th and they still haven't delivered.  To top that off, it doesn't seem like they'll even be here any time soon.

From slikstik,
Quote
I can issue a refund if you like. There has been a problem getting
stainless steel at competitive prices recently and it is out of
our control. What would you like to do?
End
Quote

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I shouldn't have to give a crap if stainless prices are up.  I paid for a product now they should deliver!

crashwg,

   Hmm, now I can understand your frustration but we replied to you yesterday with the following email, lets all read below:

***Spaky,

The original issue stemmed from not being able to get stainless
steel at a price that would allow us to make the handles without
losing money. We did not realize that stainless steel was a
commodity product and one day when we placed an order the price
was just double, so that slowed down production until we could
find a source at a competitive price. If we can't make a profit
then we can
Thank You

Christian
SlikStik Customer Support
http://www.slikstik.com
The Worlds Best Arcade Controllers

DYNAGOD

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2004, 08:59:56 am »
I work at a precision machien shop,the exact same industry as slik stik..,
stainless is like gold right now..
I recomend you retract your purchase and consider it on hold until the global pricing for stainless steel comes back down to earth.
Enjoying the fruits of technological obsolescence one game at a time...

rampy

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Re:Slikstik *shrugs*
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2004, 12:54:16 pm »
EDIT ---> I'm opting out of this convo

After a little consideration, I don't really care... and my egotistical need to win a pissing contest has passed =)

regards,

rampy
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 08:34:27 am by rampy »

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2004, 01:17:37 pm »
I've never bought anything from SlikStik myself, so I have no reason to defend them or to put them down, but it does sounds like you're overreacting pretty heavily, crashwg.  They could've communicated with you better to let you know what was going on, but it doesn't look like they're trying to screw you or anything as far as I can see

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Re:Slikstik *shrugs*
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2004, 02:16:02 pm »
I'm not going to wade too deep into the discussion, BUT...

A company should not offer a product at a price if it can't deliver.  Just in time model of ordering/inventory is nice when everything goes well (you get your materials on time at the price you expect) but when something goes wrong you get left holdin the bag (in this case an angry customer who publically complains)

*shrug*  The price of steel is not relevant (nor the price of tea in china): that is, if you do not carry sufficient stock to fulfill the orders you've accepted at a specific price, you have a business process issue that negatively impacts your customers and reputation.

You can either stop taking orders at that price (when this situation arises) or raise the end price to compensate.

I dunno there's a difference between a mom and pop garage operation and how a "real" business conducts itself. (not that I'm inferring either label to SS)

*shrug*

rampy

Rampy,

   Once again, we did not mention nor make any pointers indicating a price increase to any customer/s who have already paid for a product. We simply stated a fact that we were out of Stainless Steel and looking for a new supplier due to the massive price increase in Stainless Steel over the past month, and that is what has caused the delay.

For example we have over a dozen orders in house at the moment, and they will all be receiving their SS handles (which are in the polishing phase at the moment) even if we have to loose money manufacturing them.

*crashwg's* post specifically the name calling was totally uncalled for, that
Thank You

Christian
SlikStik Customer Support
http://www.slikstik.com
The Worlds Best Arcade Controllers

rampy

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Re:Slikstik *shrugs*
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2004, 02:41:56 pm »

EDIT ---> I'm opting out of this convo

After a little consideration, I don't really care... and my egotistical need to win a pissing contest has passed =)

regards,

rampy
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 08:35:12 am by rampy »

crashwg

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2004, 03:59:35 pm »
Not that I want to be giving you money, slikstik, but I do want what I payed for, so Un-cancel my order and send it.  That's all I wanted in the first place, so there's no reason to cancel my order.

If you sent that email yesterday as you stated I appologize, but I did NOT recieve it.  I would not have posted this in the first place if I had.  If you check when I originally posted this, it was 9pm yesterday which I'm pretty sure was probably after you had sent that message.  I'm not sure how many of your e-mails have not gotten through but if you want I can send you all the messages I've got from you and maybe you'll see how it seems as though your have been skirting arround my questions and not just coming strait out and saying when my order will be shipped.

I don't meen to personally insult anyone at slikstik, just your lack of good communication with your customers, especially me.  And I see no reason not to fulfill my order and move on with our lives/buisness.
If there's bees in the trap I'm catching em
By the thorax and abdomen
And sanding the stingers down to a rough quill
Then I dip em in ink, and I scribble a bit
But if it they wriggle then I tickle em until they hold still
Lemme say it again
In my land of pretend
I use bees as a mf'n pen

nipsmg

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #10 on: April 02, 2004, 04:23:00 pm »
I know I really have nothing to do with this, however I want to give my $0.02.

It reflects extremely poorly on you christian, for cancelling an order of someone who vented their frustrations at not getting their product.  I realize you have the right to refuse service to whomever you want, however reacting in that manner will lose you more customers.

As far as crashwg's issue goes, I understand his frustration.  If you do not have product in stock, and you don't mark it as backordered, or notify your customer of that situation at the time of purchase, he/she should have every right to get very upset.

You'll find that people are going to bash your company, especially if things don't get delivered in a timely fashion.  Instead of taking a juvenile approach and cancelling their order, why don't you take the loss on current orders, make a note on your site that you're backordered for all future orders, and prove to crashwg and to everyone else reading this post that Slickstick AREN'T a bunch of jerkoffs, but a company that is dedicated to timely support and customer service.

--NipsMG

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #11 on: April 02, 2004, 05:08:22 pm »
WOW!  I was reading this and thinking "someone started a fire" (i.e. didn't like the way they were treated).  I read further, "someone put a fire ring around the fire to contain it" (ekopp2's post).  Then, I read Christian/SlikStik's reply, and saw "Oh CRAP, someone threw GASOLINE on the fire to put it out!"

my view:
Crash was purchasing something from a business that, for all intents and purposes, looks to be a professional operation.

In communications with said company, the purchaser was not alerted/made aware of problems beyond the company's control and HOW the company would resolve the issue for the customer in an EFFECTIVE manner.  

I state the above paragraph because NEITHER of you have posted the dialogue between you that stated "is there anything I can do to help iron out the problem".  In the information given, it seems as if the issue is that the customer feels as if "excuses" are being given, and you feel as if "information" is being given.  Neither is right, and neither is wrong, BUT the issue of right and wrong has nothing to do with this situation.  It's an issue of PROPER communication with YOUR customer.

People buy crap/problems on a daily basis.  While your product is almost CERTAINLY not crap, your customer HAS bought a problem and has vented his spleen regarding said problem.  I purchased a washing machine that recently became useless after only 8 months.  Does that mean, Christian, that I don't have the right to vent my spleen because it's under warranty and that it will be fixed free of charge for me?

I see your solution to the problem as pseudo-censorship.  You won't give out product unless someone shuts their piehole regarding your company.  I see your reply and solution with crash as petty and child-like.  You ABSOLUTELY have a right to be upset at the way crash went about what he did but when you had a chance to show your class as a business, your petulance showed anyone reading this that they better NEVER EVER EVER say anything bad about you before they have their products.  BTW, are you planning on taking BACK anything you sold someone because they didn't like it and posted about it?

The fact that you had the opportunity to respond to a customer and solve a problem/issue is telling.  The majority of people dissatisfied with companies never give the company an opportunity to find out WHY and perhaps solve their problem.  You were being given (VERY indirectly) a chance to make a customer a loyal one by your handling of the situation.  By handling the situation in the same fashion you find repulsive and to further compound the situation by "taking your big red ball and going home", you've shown everyone here how they might be treated in their dealings with your company.

You allowed yourself to be blinded by anger, which is evident in how you responded to rampy's post.  I read it, and clearly he was NOT referring to YOUR company, but you took it as such.  Perhaps you might read his post a bit closer and realize there's more clarity there than you've allowed yourself to see yet.

Nipsmg made a good point to you regarding what I am about to say.  I haven't purchased anything from you.  After seeing how you deal with an unsatisfied "pre"-customer, I'll surely not to make the mistake of offering you my business.  If I ever have a problem with a product I intend to purchase, I fully expect the right as a consumer to be able to air my views regarding a company that accepts money for their products.

You'd have a good argument for your petulance and not sending crash the products he ordered if you gave your products away for free.  By dealing with him in the manner you chose to, you have only furthered the view of his original posting.  If you don't want to be labeled as a "jerkoff", don't act like one while trying to prove you're NOT.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2004, 05:15:15 pm by drewkaree »
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in ways that you later wish you hadnít

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2004, 05:37:26 pm »
WOW!  I was reading this and thinking "someone started a fire" (i.e. didn't like the way they were treated).  I read further, "someone put a fire ring around the fire to contain it" (ekopp2's post).  Then, I read Christian/SlikStik's reply, and saw "Oh CRAP, someone threw GASOLINE on the fire to put it out!"

my view:
Crash was purchasing something from a business that, for all intents and purposes, looks to be a professional operation.

In communications with said company, the purchaser was not alerted/made aware of problems beyond the company's control and HOW the company would resolve the issue for the customer in an EFFECTIVE manner.  

I state the above paragraph because NEITHER of you have posted the dialogue between you that stated "is there anything I can do to help iron out the problem".  In the information given, it seems as if the issue is that the customer feels as if "excuses" are being given, and you feel as if "information" is being given.  Neither is right, and neither is wrong, BUT the issue of right and wrong has nothing to do with this situation.  It's an issue of PROPER communication with YOUR customer.

People buy crap/problems on a daily basis.  While your product is almost CERTAINLY not crap, your customer HAS bought a problem and has vented his spleen regarding said problem.  I purchased a washing machine that recently became useless after only 8 months.  Does that mean, Christian, that I don't have the right to vent my spleen because it's under warranty and that it will be fixed free of charge for me?

I see your solution to the problem as pseudo-censorship.  You won't give out product unless someone shuts their piehole regarding your company.  I see your reply and solution with crash as petty and child-like.  You ABSOLUTELY have a right to be upset at the way crash went about what he did but when you had a chance to show your class as a business, your petulance showed anyone reading this that they better NEVER EVER EVER say anything bad about you before they have their products.  BTW, are you planning on taking BACK anything you sold someone because they didn't like it and posted about it?

The fact that you had the opportunity to respond to a customer and solve a problem/issue is telling.  The majority of people dissatisfied with companies never give the company an opportunity to find out WHY and perhaps solve their problem.  You were being given (VERY indirectly) a chance to make a customer a loyal one by your handling of the situation.  By handling the situation in the same fashion you find repulsive and to further compound the situation by "taking your big red ball and going home", you've shown everyone here how they might be treated in their dealings with your company.

You allowed yourself to be blinded by anger, which is evident in how you responded to rampy's post.  I read it, and clearly he was NOT referring to YOUR company, but you took it as such.  Perhaps you might read his post a bit closer and realize there's more clarity there than you've allowed yourself to see yet.

Nipsmg made a good point to you regarding what I am about to say.  I haven't purchased anything from you.  After seeing how you deal with an unsatisfied "pre"-customer, I'll surely not to make the mistake of offering you my business.  If I ever have a problem with a product I intend to purchase, I fully expect the right as a consumer to be able to air my views regarding a company that accepts money for their products.

You'd have a good argument for your petulance and not sending crash the products he ordered if you gave your products away for free.  By dealing with him in the manner you chose to, you have only furthered the view of his original posting.  If you don't want to be labeled as a "jerkoff", don't act like one while trying to prove you're NOT.

Ok, YOUR entitled to YOUR opinion.
Thank You

Christian
SlikStik Customer Support
http://www.slikstik.com
The Worlds Best Arcade Controllers

flampoo

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2004, 05:50:58 pm »
I think it would behoove SS to send him the jstick at the quoted price. He shouldn't have to pay difference or have is order canx'd. It's your responsibility as the business to maintain a standard, and, unfortunately it should be your loss. That's the way it should work.
I have a hard time believing that you had so many orders for the stainless steel JS on hiatus that giving the customers what they already ordered at the price they were given will throw your financial status in upheaval.

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2004, 06:07:08 pm »
My $.02, crashwg comes out of the gate and is pretty pissed off and makes himself look kinda dumb over the whole name calling thing.

Slik-Stik, could have have made him look even dumber by just sucking it up and saying "yes, we are having some issues right now, we are doing the best we can, if you would like a refund, we certainly understand, if not, then we appreciate your patience and will resolve the issue soon."

Instead, they cancel his order on a public forum for something trivial (and believe me, name-calling is trivial), and make themselves look like a two-bit operation and basically vindicate crashwg for everything he said.

Nice professionalism....  I can guarantee you lost more than just crashwg with this thread Slik-Stik.

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #15 on: April 02, 2004, 06:23:18 pm »
Ok, YOUR entitled to YOUR opinion.

You're

You know..... I've never bought anything from Slik-Stik due to Christian's attitudes on the boards. I've sometimes felt a little guilty in judging the company before actually dealing with them.

Sometimes you just need to trust your gut.
If you build a frankenpanel, chances are I don't care for you as a person.

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2004, 07:04:19 pm »

That response is one of the most incredible replies I've seen to a customer comment on a board.

I agree Slikstik will lose a *lot* more business than just one order with comments like that.

I'm new here, but with comments like that, why would anyone buy from him?

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2004, 07:22:07 pm »
Wow, as a business and marketing student I have to comment that this is absolutely insane. In a public forum that is the hub of a majority of their market, not only did slick stick miss the oppurtunity to make themselves look really good by rectifying a situation with a disgruntled customer; they managed to act like petty fools with no respect for an unsatisfied customer.

Christian, you should have taken advantage of this being in public, offered him 25% off of his order, and next day aired his joysticks to him. You would have gotten my business. You will find that people are willing to pay more to purchase from a supplier that they respect than otherwise.  It's not like you even have great prices to start out with.

Now you've got this
Topic: OMFG I'm PISSED!  (Read 194 times)
Topic: Slikstik sucks!!!  (Read 309 times)
« Last Edit: April 02, 2004, 07:23:07 pm by ani »

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #18 on: April 02, 2004, 08:00:35 pm »
i agree with drew for the most part. SS should have just said crash your stuff is coming heres your tracking number, or if it was taking longer offer free shipping or just some kind of gesture to say "sorry we [moderator edit] your order". but instead they really do look like "jerkoffs" now. and i know i will not order from them now their are plenty of suppliers with competitive prices out there




##removed profanity##
« Last Edit: April 02, 2004, 08:36:34 pm by OSCAR »
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #19 on: April 02, 2004, 09:18:58 pm »
Hey, it's not too late! SS could always apologize and offer the stick to crash for free!

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #20 on: April 02, 2004, 09:28:10 pm »
 :(
Thank You

Christian
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http://www.slikstik.com
The Worlds Best Arcade Controllers

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #21 on: April 02, 2004, 09:51:28 pm »
Ok, YOUR entitled to YOUR opinion.
Jeez Christian, that was a pretty rude response.  I thought that drewkaree's post was very well thought-out, and he made quite a few good points.  I have to say it: You really give me the impression that Slik-Stik doesn't give a flying hoot what anybody thinks of them, and that is a terribly bad image for a company to have.  I'm not saying that Slik-Stik offers bad customer support (again, I've never been a Slik-Stik customer, so I wouldn't know either way), but based on your posts, that's what it certainly looks like.

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #22 on: April 02, 2004, 10:34:52 pm »
Quote
Nice professionalism....  I can guarantee you lost more than just crashwg with this thread Slik-Stik.

I was planning on purchasing a SlikStik CO2 Control Panel this weekend for one of my cabinets but after reading this thread, I have decided to go with a GameCab Ultra Arcade Control Panel instead.  The reason for the change is the feeling that if i did have a problem (hopefully not) that I'd be SOL. I have dealt with Charlie at Gamecab before and he has my trust that he stands by what he sells and how he sells it. Gamecab has stopped taking orders for control panels because they need to catch up on outstanding orders. This in my opinion is the admirable way to go and I am willing to wait.

Perhaps things will change with the SS' handling of customer issues and I will buy from them in the future, but for the time being they are not on my list of respected vendors.

-Goz



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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #23 on: April 02, 2004, 10:45:10 pm »
This guy is going to fail. He obviously lacks customer service know-how. In business there is a saying: "The customer is always right." You obviously don't know the first thing about running a successful business or how to handle your customers with care.

Good luck to you SlikStik. Add me to the list of those whom will NOT make a purchase from you.  :-*

PS- Crashwg, I hope you have better luck in the future.



 
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #24 on: April 02, 2004, 10:45:49 pm »
This is Jerry from SlikStik.

You know what. We spoke to this customer via email and tried to handle it in a professional manner, we explained we had problems getting stainless and that caused a delay. Everyone here has seen other posts from people that deal with stainless supporting our claim.

Now even though a few of you have said that the price of our raw materials should have nothing to do with our shipping a product and have even compared it to the price of tea in China, quite frankly the cost of raw materials is a real concern in a business and has everything to do with us shipping a product. That
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #25 on: April 02, 2004, 11:10:10 pm »
Always a dilemma when there's a thread of this nature.  Is it an airing of a legitimate beef, or an attempt at character assassination?  Note that I'm not weighing in on it one way or another. However, if it is a legitimate beef then it's of value to other viewers to see. If it's an attempt at character assassination then it should probably be moved to post-hell.  What if it's somewhere in the middle?

Rather than trying to be a mind reader, and/or run the risk of being accused of censorship or protecting one party or another (which would have its own backlash anyway and be counter-productive even if such was my intent), I have a simple rule I follow.

If the thread stays relatively civil and the language stays acceptable, then I'll leave the thread alone.

This one is already borderline or beyond. Pleaes keep it civil and clean folks. If it degenerates further this thread will be removed.

(this reply is not directed at any single party)

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Re:Slikstik shryukens!!!
« Reply #26 on: April 02, 2004, 11:14:59 pm »
EDIT ---> I'm opting out of this convo

After a little consideration, I don't really care... and my egotistical need to win a pissing contest has passed =)

regards,

rampy
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 08:36:11 am by rampy »

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #27 on: April 02, 2004, 11:21:24 pm »
No offense Jerry, but was that supposed to make people feel better about your company?  Just a more wordy version of Christian's earlier position...

The first post here was ridiculous and had you responded in a professional matter, those satisfied customers would have come to your defense.

Instead, you look like fools and have likely lost many current potential customers who would take notice of anything SS related while considering purchase.  

Read threads about Ultimarc or Oscar complainers and you'll see satisfied customers can be your best salespeople.  Judging from your attached emails, they can sure do a lot better job than you or Christian..............

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #28 on: April 02, 2004, 11:30:43 pm »
Now you guys think we should give him free product and reward someone for doing that to us? I don't think there is one person in here that would run to help someone after they called you a jerk off and tried maliciously to interfere with your income stream. I don't care what background you have or where someone?s marketing degree comes from, you don't have to let people walk over you, or attack you in public just because you are in business, if that?s what you think being in business is about you are mistaken. At some point you have to make a stand and say no, I refuse to deal with people that have the potential to do me harm or don't have common respect. That?s what happened in this case.

We do care what the average customer thinks of our products and us; we don?t care what someone that calls us jerk offs and posts messages with bad intentions thinks of us. As I said above, just because we are in business does not give someone the right to treat us like that. And just because we are in business it does not mean we have to lay down and take everything that some nasty individual throws at us. If you were at work and were doing your best to do the job you were hired for and a customer came in and said ?Hey you jerk off do it this way?, in a crowded room, would you say ?oh yes sir Mr. Customer sir, thanks for calling me a jerk off and I will work today for free to make you happy Mr. Customer sir?.

William has a better chance of getting a letter from our attorney than getting a pair of SS handles unless he buys them used or under someone else?s name.

You guys just aren't getting it.....  No one expected you to kiss his butt, give him free product, etc.

His slamming you guys on this board was uncool as well, given your side of the story, I am on your side at this point and understand why you don't want to do business with him.

However.... that being said, you guys made the big mistake of taking the bait and coming into the forum to air your grievances against him, it obviously didn't help you, it made you guys look like you don't know how to manage your business, taking orders with no product and etc.

You would have been better off not posting here at all, or making a single post stating you would like to work things out offline, flaming crashwg back just didn't help your cause.

It would be nice to see crashwg apologize for taking this public and not giving both sides of the story and for name-calling, and then it would be nice to see you folks at Slik-Stik, get him his joystick handles and be done with it.  

It would be great to see a peaceful resolution, and no more blackeyes for either side.

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #29 on: April 02, 2004, 11:34:25 pm »
Rampy,

I appreciate your response, and I agree that raw material costs are part of a business plan, but in this case stainless steel went up 85% in a 2 week period. You can't anticipate that, its going up again next week too.

The point is we did not raise prices or try to gouge the customer, we just shopped it and eventually wound up paying 85% more anyway, and we still did not raise prices, we just ate it and continued doing business.

What you don't get is someone just can't call me and my associates jerkoffs in a public forum with the sole intention of doing our business harm, we don't tolerate it. I don't treat people like that and don't take it when I am treated that way. I choose not to do business with him, I don't see the big deal.

On the other hand, if someone emails or calls and has just a slightly nice attitude they get treated like kings (anyone that has called and spoken to either Christian or Myself, or dealt with us via email feel free to jump in and say so). We have people that come to the shop in Jersey to pick up products or to see something before they buy and sometimes they stay for hours shooting the ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- and playing video games, or hanging out watching us build panels, we even had one guy come in at the end of the day and stay till midnight playing cards.

I really can't believe that you don't see my side of it and wish I had some way to convey my thoughts better as it just seems so cut and dry to me.

Thanks,

Jerry Mascari
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #30 on: April 03, 2004, 12:08:42 am »
Jerry,

I'm not interested in getting into a full-fledged "debate", and you do bring up some very good points, but I would like to share how this thread looks to me as an "outsider" (meaning that I wasn't involved with this particular transaction as it happened) if I may.  Sometimes a fresh pair of eyes (especially ones that are basically uninvolved with the whole processes) can help clear things up, and hey, I'm a pretty rational guy. :)

Crashwg started the thread making an angry post regarding his dissatisfaction with how he felt Slik-Stik was treating him.  While he did mention a possible discrepancy with the transaction ("Seems kinda odd to me that they had the sticks a week ago and now they don't even have the raw materials"), the bulk of his rant was that he was mad that the product that he ordered had not been delievered, and it didn't appear that it would be delievered anytime soon.  His sticking point is that he feels that he shouldn't have to worry about the price of stainless steel (in other words, he doesn't feel that YOUR problems should be HIS problems), his feeling is just that "I paid for a product now they should deliver!"

Again, and an outsider looking in at this transaction, I felt that crashwg was overreacting to the situation (and I said so in an earlier post).  Granted, I'd be kind of miffed if this happened to ME, but I would venture to guess that most people wouldn't be quite AS upset as crashwg was.  But hey, he has a right to complain.

But the real story in this thread isn't what crashwg said at all - the real story is how Christian and youself have chosen to conduct yourselves in your replies.  The replies from Slik-Stik so far have been:

I don't think anyone expected Slik-Stik to "lay down and take everything that some nasty individual throws at us", but you did the exact opposite: When faced with a hostile customer, you came out swinging.  Regardless of who is right and who is wrong, by acting the way that you (as a company) have acted, you made it appear that there is an adversarial relationship between Slik-Stik and its customers.  Anyone who has worked with the public knows that you're going to get cranky customers, but all Christian had to say was, "I really don't want you to be unhappy with your Slik-Stik experience, crashwg.  What can we do to work this out so that we're all happy in end?"  That's it.  Had he said that, crashwg might have changed his tune.  And I wouldn't consider that "laying down and taking everything that some nasty individual throws at us", either.

Instead, he belittled crashwg, and replied to a post (by drewkaree) in a very condescending and rude manner.  Cancelling crashwg's order when crashwg clearly still wants his product sent out the message "Since I don't like you, you don't get to be one of our customers!"  Jerry, I gotta tell you: by doing that, he made is sound as though Slik-Stik feels like being your customer is some kind of "privilege".

I also have to say that I am honestly aghast that you would say "William has a better chance of getting a letter from our attorney than getting a pair of SS handles unless he buys them used or under someone else
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 12:16:58 am by Sasquatch! »

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #31 on: April 03, 2004, 12:44:49 am »
Jerry, your post here only serves to further exemplify the problem.   You're looking at it from your perspective with no regard for his.  

You yourself state that in your first response to him  
Quote
The first time the customer emailed us we were half way through production on a lot of handles, and we were getting ready to have them polished, I responded to his email and told him as much. The polishing of that many handles takes a long time as they are all done buy hand on a lathe with 3 different grits of sand paper.
Then you state
Quote
The second email I got from him was a little irate in tone and I got the feeling that he felt we were trying to rip him off so I went further into the explanation about the stainless problem and offered him a full refund

YOU got the "feeling" that he felt you were trying to rip him off.  He positively couldn't have posted to this board before you offered him a refund, as he wouldn't have known of your offer BEFORE he posted!  When you got that "feeling", that should have been your clue that a communications breakdown had happened, and different measures should have been taken to ensure that your customer understood more fully what was happening, and shouldn't have ended until he realized the process that would ensue.  

By your own admission, FIRST you tell him the item is being finished, SECOND, you tell him about problems getting the materials.  How can you NOT understand why someone might view that as a "stalling" tactic and might be understandably peeved?  Again, poor communication skills on both parts, his "irate tone" and your response.

Quote
in all honesty the only thing his post could ever accomplish is harming our good reputation in this industry, that was his only intention, lets call a spade a spade, what else was he hoping to accomplish, he was pissed and he lashed out in a public forum to harm us with bad intentions.
I find it crass and arrogant to think you can discern a person's motives regarding your company.  Do you REALLY think that a message board peeing match is the way to promote the POSITIVE values of your company? Even you would be hard-pressed to say that he made no effort to resolve the issue with you.  Two contacts between you two which failed to inform and calm a customer sufficiently about a purchase he was making with your company point to a communications failure on your part.  There are companies out there that would KILL for TWO chances to turn a customer into a raving fan of their product and/or service.  Remember, you're only as good as the worst impression of yourself.

One might ask a similar question regarding your actions towards his treatment of you.  What did you hope to accomplish by treating him in the exact same fashion as he'd done to you?  Were you looking to discredit him and his view, thereby removing the "bad press" he gave you?  The general tone of EITHER of your posts, Jerry OR Christian, is leaving an "I'm right he's wrong, trash anyone who disagrees with us" taste in many mouths here about your view of your company.  

Quote
I don't think there is one person in here that would run to help someone after they called you a jerk off and tried maliciously to interfere with your income stream.
I believe to kowtow to crash is wrong, however, I think the handling of his situation was YOUR mistake.  This SHOULD have been handled privately.  Now you have shown publicly that you have no problem with stooping to his level.  That is hypocrisy in its highest form!  Now, the only blame for "maliciously interfering with your income stream" is the way you are dealing with people who have a response to the situation  It IS ok to "take a stand", but publicly pointing out your "stand", reduces it to GRANDstanding.  You say you shouldn't have to "lay down and take it".  You aren't laying down, you're standing up and, with both barrels, giving back that which you protest so much against.  Your "stand" is a show of aggrandizement.

Your response needn't have included all the self-serving accolades if your company is as grand as you say it is.  What IS needed is the realization that the attitude felt from your representatives in this and other threads are what the public are using to form an image of your company.  On that point, YOU are the one doing the most harm to your company.  I'm sure that there COULD be a list of complaints regarding your company, but that isn't necessary;  you are here giving us what we need to know regarding your company.

I'd like to end with this:
Quote
we treat our customers like gold, unfortunately most of our customers are not in this forum, if they were they would post comments like I posted above.
I believe you have had more customers in this forum than you think.  What I find hard to swallow is the line "unfortunately most of our customers are not in this forum".  If you found it to be so unfortunate, why has this thread shown that statement to be so contrary?  Please re-read the numerous postings OTHER than crash's for a general feeling as to what I am speaking of.  As an example, while self-serving, I will tell you that I thought long and hard, previewed AND edited my posts before posting them, so as not to side with one OR the other, as you are both wrong in this case.  The LENGTHY post was dismissed with "YOUR entitled to YOUR opinion".  As others have noted, they found the reply to be rude.  I found it to be more than that, but again, illustrates why it almost CERTAINLY is the case that most of your customers are not in this forum.

I think I've been civil in this post and my other one, as I read Saint's statement before finishing this post.  I feel this thread's value is comparable to a Consumer Reports article.  One wouldn't know the bad AND the good regarding a product if all that was ever shown was the good.  While I see worth in what SlikStick offers, there is also worth in how a company treats its present and future customers.  In this case, I feel BOTH parties have failed to see the worth in dealing respectfully with others.  
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #32 on: April 03, 2004, 01:18:28 am »
I think everyone needs to understand that no matter how much the consumer and seller vent their experience, by virtue of being an outsider you can't truly understand the predicament. The whole thing is a debacle and I don't think there is much more to be said.

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #33 on: April 03, 2004, 01:19:53 am »
Sasquatch,

Sorry if I sounded condescending, I was not trying to be, someone posted that they were in marketing or studying business and I was addressing the fact that regardless of what you learn about marketing or that other clich
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #34 on: April 03, 2004, 01:37:05 am »
in other words he threw the first punch, and it was a sucker punch to boot.
The problem is that you threw the second punch, and as the retailer, you shouldn't have thrown ANY "punches" in my opinion.  You shouldn't have engaged him.
Quote
maybe someone else would have given him something free or smooched his behind but frankly we don't respond well to his tactics and were not very motivated by his post.
I get the sense that you feel that the only two options are "kiss his behind" or "come out swinging", with no middle ground.  That's kind of my point.  I sure as hell wouldn't be giving him free swag just for being a rude angry customer, but I wouldn't have beat him over the head like you did either.
Quote
If you ever did business with us you would feel differently. If someone came here and called Kelsey or Andy a jerk off there would be a crew buying rope and building a gallows because you have all done business with them so you have something to judge by.
So you're saying that people are more likely to defend OSCAR/Ultimarc simply because those companies have possibly more customers?  No, it's because of how they treat people.  I had a good sense of what kind of people Kelsey and Andy were before I ever gave either of them a single penny.
Quote
Sorry we come across in a way that everyone finds unattractive, we just tell it how it is and as I said we don't respond well to posts like his.
I don't blame you one bit for not responding well to posts like that.
Quote
If standing up for ourselves, and not having or wanting to kiss ass makes us bad then I don't know what to say
I still maintain that Slik-Stik could've done more to resolve the issue without having to "kiss ass".  Making an angry customer happy is not "kissing ass".
Quote
your not really judging us on customer service you have experienced or the extreme quality of our products, your judging us on the customer service you are witnessing after a customer put up a post saying we suck and we are a bunch of jerk offs.
You're exactly right: I am judging you on the customer service that I am witnessing after a customer put up a post saying you suck and calling you jerkoffs.


EDIT: Thanks for replying, Jerry.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 01:37:32 am by Sasquatch! »

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #35 on: April 03, 2004, 02:41:35 am »
One can hardly blame Crash for his tantrum.....he's been drinking out of baby bottles lately cos his girlfriend refuses to wash the dishes  :P

Seriously, though, I'd tip this in his favor.  As much as I suspect that Crash has acted pretty intolerably, Slikstik seems to have thrown the first stone.  Unless you wait until you have run completely out of stock before ordering more raw materials (which would be a bit assinine) there should only have been two scenerios:

1- You were NOT out of stock when the order was placed so you ship it out immediately, or

2- You had already tried to order raw materials and knew there would be a delay -- which should have been conveyed to the customer at the time of the order (if this is what happened than Crash has no legitimate complaint).

Really, though, I think you have taken far more heat due to your responses here, which have tended toward smugness, than to the way you handled Crashes specific situation.  

You know, your image isn't just about who is right.  Look at the presidential debates between Gore and Bush.  You had Gore, an intellectual giant pitted against a dislexic rich kid whose only argument consisted of shrugging his shoulders and looking around incredulously with a look of, "Can you believe this guy?" on his face.  But who won the debate?  Gore went in thinking he was just going to wipe the floor with this guy and his smugness lost him the debate.  It's not just about what you say, it's about what people hear.  Bush didn't win that debate because of what he said.  He won it because people liked him.  

That's where your public relations is sometimes lacking, and I am not referring solely to this thread.  It would not have been difficult to say everything you said in this thread so far without belittling anyone and without coming across like you couldn't care less about losing Crash as a customer.  I'm not saying that you should necessarily care, just that it's a foolish business move to publicly announce that you don't care...especially with such a poorly written post that makes you seem petty.  And once the post had been made what you needed was some damage control and you kind of dropped the ball in that area too.

I still plan to purchase one, possibly two tornado spinners from you, but I have to say that there is only one reason:  Oscar's spinners are just too big to fit on my control panel.  I have yet to do business with either of you.  But if it was an option, Oscar Controls would get my spinner business (and thread has only solidified that resolve).  I think that's an issue that you should address.  

« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 02:45:44 am by shmokes »
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #36 on: April 03, 2004, 05:03:34 am »
I was addressing the fact that regardless of what you learn about marketing or that other clich
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 05:09:09 am by Magnet_Eye »
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #37 on: April 03, 2004, 07:48:49 am »
My 2 cents...You have to reward him for being a disgruntled customer.. Under Promise Over Deliver. One unsatisfied Customer tells 250 people, a satisfied customer less.

SS should have never taken the bait but I understand how hard it can be not to respond when something you obviously have worked hard at is under attack.


I say delivery the sticks at full price, maybe eat the shipping, add a 15% cuopon for another purchase, apoligize
and just always take the high road. There are people (and Im NOT SAYING THIS IS THE CASE IN THIS DISPUTE) that just wanna see what they can get for free. Just part of doing business. Anyway good luck and I hope those sticks stay at 30 bucks :)
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #38 on: April 03, 2004, 10:41:57 am »
What's funny is that this whole discussion centers over a very small part... In comparison, I spent over 700 dollars on a custom Classic and could not be happier with the support or the product.

Keep it in perspective guys...

Every communication with them was great, this was a screwed up set of circumstances and sh*t happens.  How many times have you looked at ebay vendors with 2000 positive responses and 2 negative... would not not do business with them? OF course not!  

I know crash is pissed and he has a right to.  He wanted a cool product and could not get it.  It also took a long time for he to find out that he wasnt' going to get it.  Most people in this hobby are used to getting their way and hate waiting.  (I want it yesterday).

On the other hand, business is business and no one expects slikstik to sell stuff at a huge loss.

Can't we all just get along?????? :P

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #39 on: April 03, 2004, 12:00:07 pm »
i have bought from slilstik before and had no problems. that being said. one thing has been bothering me with this whole thing. why would you email him and say that HIS sticks are being polished then a week later you say you cant get the ss at a good price. if HIS sticks were been polished then you already had the ss for HIS sticks and why would the price hike have any affect on his order. i understand that backordering is a part of bussiness and i have no problem with that. but from your emails it doesnt sound like a backorder issue. it sound like you were trying to buy yourself more time to find cheaper ss which i also have no problem with. but you should have said that in the first place not make up a story about them being polished.
if i am wrong on any of the details please inlighting me. this post is not meant to take any side of this discussion i just would like to hear an answer on this so i can make a decision on whether or not i will buy anything else from slikstik.

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #40 on: April 03, 2004, 02:00:19 pm »
i have bought from slilstik before and had no problems. that being said. one thing has been bothering me with this whole thing. why would you email him and say that HIS sticks are being polished then a week later you say you cant get the ss at a good price. if HIS sticks were been polished then you already had the ss for HIS sticks and why would the price hike have any affect on his order. i understand that backordering is a part of bussiness and i have no problem with that. but from your emails it doesnt sound like a backorder issue. it sound like you were trying to buy yourself more time to find cheaper ss which i also have no problem with. but you should have said that in the first place not make up a story about them being polished.
if i am wrong on any of the details please inlighting me. this post is not meant to take any side of this discussion i just would like to hear an answer on this so i can make a decision on whether or not i will buy anything else from slikstik.

dirt

Ok, I will explain one more time.

Let
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 02:53:22 pm by SlikStik-Christian »
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #41 on: April 03, 2004, 03:04:28 pm »
 thank you for the reply and i now understand your side of the story. but i think you should know that you guys did come off sounding smug in your earlier posts. i am sure it was not your intention and im sure you didn't realize it at the time but as a third party observer it came thru load and clear. i am only pointing this out so you might choose your words more carefully in public. i am sure you dont want people to get that feeling from you. best of luck and i plan on trying out your ss sticks on my next project.


dirt
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 08:01:55 pm by dirt »
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #42 on: April 03, 2004, 03:23:17 pm »
this is the first e-mail I received about the polishing

"We are still waiting on the parts to be polished. Hopefully this
week.

Team SlikStik"

Then when I replied to that this is the next one you sent me

"Spaky,

I can issue a refund if you like. There has been a problem getting
stainless steel at competitive prices recently and it is out of
our control. What would you like to do?

Thanks,

Jerry Mascari
Team SlikStik"

How was I suposed to interperate that.  The first e-mail stated that the sticks were there and they would be done soon but the second makes it sound like you havent got them yet.  If you had said that this was the reason for it taking so long none of this would have ever happend.  Those were the exact e-mails.  You keep telling everyone that you just went into detail about why the sticks were late but in the e-mail I recived you never said anything about that. I never got any other e-mails except the one stating that you cancelled my order.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 03:42:26 pm by crashwg »
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #43 on: April 03, 2004, 08:42:29 pm »
Holy cow.  They're $50 a piece now....just for the sticks!  I've been wanting a couple of these too.  I don't think I can get them at that price.  I'm gonna have to wait until the price comes down.  I'm a little worried that so many people will feel this way that Slikstik will just discontinue them.  That sucks.

Crashwg, here is what I take from that correspondence:

1- Your handles were taking a long time to be delivered so you emailed Slikstik asking them what was taking so long.

2- Slikstik responded saying that they were waiting for them to be polished and that they would hopefully ship "this week"

3- You got all pissy and complained, thinking that they should have had plenty of time to polish them by now, and what the hell was taking so long...

4- In answer to that question they responded, explaining why there was a delay to begin with (shortage of stainless steel) and offered you a refund.  

I in no way take from their second email to you that your sticks were no longer in the polishing phase, but now had not even been manufactured yet.

I think that Slikstik would benefit from some PR improvements, but I'm starting to get the impression that they handled your transaction reasonably.    Customers, too, should realize that their actions have consequences.

Well, that sucks.  It looks like you're going to be out $40 extra now.....or maybe you'll save $60 and just do without pretty handles.  Live and learn...and then get luvs.
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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #44 on: April 03, 2004, 09:30:50 pm »
Shmokes, you're right up to #2.

Here's how 3&4 should go,

3- I was confused as to why it was taking so long, so I e-mailed them asking why.  Civily I might add.

4- They responded with "I can issue a refund if you like. There has been a problem getting stainless steel at competitive prices recently and it is out of
our control.
What would you like to do?"

Sounds to me as if they don't even have the sticks, how 'bout you?  How would you interpret that?

Looking back on it now I see where there could be some confusion, but the cause of the confusion is solely cause by slikstik's lack of communication skills.

I guess I am somewhat to blame in the misscommunication as I am not a PSYCHIC!

All they had to say was, "Your sticks will be sent out on monday.  The reason they took so long is, blah blah blah blah blah."  Simple as that!
« Last Edit: April 03, 2004, 09:31:46 pm by crashwg »
If there's bees in the trap I'm catching em
By the thorax and abdomen
And sanding the stingers down to a rough quill
Then I dip em in ink, and I scribble a bit
But if it they wriggle then I tickle em until they hold still
Lemme say it again
In my land of pretend
I use bees as a mf'n pen

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Re:Slikstik sucks!!!
« Reply #45 on: April 04, 2004, 12:07:48 am »
This thread appears to have gone its course. Unless you have something new, kindly let it die. All three threads are now locked.
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