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Author Topic: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings  (Read 28121 times)

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DarthMarino

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #40 on: December 11, 2020, 11:17:44 pm »
I should mention that you need to play Konami GT on a recent version of MAME. The dial inputs were fixed in the March release.

PL1

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2020, 03:26:34 am »
Avalanche, Clowns, and Warlords are more examples of games that used free spinning pots.
OK, I think I've figured out our communication disconnect.   :cheers:

Atari games like Warlords originally used pots with a slip clutch.
- If you turn the pot in one direction, the wiper will stop turning when it reaches the 5v or ground terminal, but the slip clutch will allow the shaft to continue to turn so the pot isn't damaged by over-torquing.  You can hear the wiper hit the terminal stop at 1:50 in the video.
- With this setup, the wiper will not directly jump the gap between the 5v terminal and the ground terminal.
- The terminal stops allow less than 360 degrees of wiper rotation. (not free spinning)



A free spinning pot is like the one in Omega Race.
- If you turn the pot in one direction, the wiper will not stop turning when it reaches the 5v or ground terminal.
- The gap between the 5v and ground terminals is large enough that the wiper won't short them together.
- With this setup, the wiper will directly jump the gap between the 5v terminal and the ground terminal.
- Having no terminal stops allows an unlimited amount of wiper rotation. (free spinning)

I'll give Road Blasters another try. It seemed to play fine with my analog joysticks last I checked. *Edit* It was fixed in MAME: "0.222: Fixed Road Blasters steering wheel does not auto center. The RoadBlasters steering wheel is very much like the Star Wars yoke, without the vertical (Y) axis [Curseur, Tafoid]. Replaced Dial controller with Stick."
Thanks for the info.  Sounds like that update should make it work much better with potentiometer controllers.   ;D


Scott

KenToad

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2020, 09:50:11 am »
Thanks for the info, Scott.  :cheers:

Aqua Jack is another game that is incorrectly listed as dial control in MAME, when you can clearly see the 5k pot joystick on page 17 in the game manual. http://www.aurcade.com/games/manuals/00002239.pdf
« Last Edit: December 12, 2020, 09:58:10 am by KenToad »

javeryh

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #43 on: January 14, 2021, 02:19:46 pm »
I'm trying to configure my spinner using this guide.  What menu am I supposed to be changing the dial settings?

If I go to "Input (this Machine)" there aren't any dial sensitivity settings to change.  Should I be going into "Analog Controls" and changing "Dial Sensitivity" there?  Does this save to the cfg file of the currently selected game or is this a global (all of MAME) change?  Obviously, I would want different settings for different games...

Also, as an aside - I had a hard time just getting the spinner to work in MAME because the SpinTrak plugged into the iPAC2 is recognized as Dial 2 and not Dial 1.  Or do I have something screwed up?  This is how I have it connected.



Thanks!

KenToad

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #44 on: January 14, 2021, 02:48:28 pm »
Yep, change the sensitivity in analog controls and it will be saved in the game specific cfg file.

Your connection looks correct to me, but I can't verify, as I use Turbotwist 2's with their propietary connection.

It doesn't matter to MAME which mouse number it is. My Turbotwists get recognized as mouse 2 x and y. You just spin the spinner when you're mapping dial controls as whatever dial number x or y axis. It's easiest to map dial controls in the general controls.

javeryh

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #45 on: January 14, 2021, 03:10:23 pm »
Yep, change the sensitivity in analog controls and it will be saved in the game specific cfg file.

Your connection looks correct to me, but I can't verify, as I use Turbotwist 2's with their propietary connection.

It doesn't matter to MAME which mouse number it is. My Turbotwists get recognized as mouse 2 x and y. You just spin the spinner when you're mapping dial controls as whatever dial number x or y axis. It's easiest to map dial controls in the general controls.

Thanks.  I'm going through game by game to change the settings according to your list.  Just to be clear, I should launch the game, hit "Tab" and go into "Analog Controls", change "Dial Sensitivity" (for both Dial 1 and Dial 2) and then "go back to previous menu" until I'm back in the game.  Is that right?

My spinner works fine (moves the mouse left and right in Windows) - I just thought it was strange that is was recognized as Dial 2.

By the way, the first game I tried was Cameltry and it felt great at that setting.  You noted 40.5 (which I assume is just straight math from your formula) so I set it at 41 and it felt great.

KenToad

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #46 on: January 14, 2021, 03:41:32 pm »
Yep, change the sensitivity in analog controls and it will be saved in the game specific cfg file.

Your connection looks correct to me, but I can't verify, as I use Turbotwist 2's with their propietary connection.

It doesn't matter to MAME which mouse number it is. My Turbotwists get recognized as mouse 2 x and y. You just spin the spinner when you're mapping dial controls as whatever dial number x or y axis. It's easiest to map dial controls in the general controls.

Thanks.  I'm going through game by game to change the settings according to your list.  Just to be clear, I should launch the game, hit "Tab" and go into "Analog Controls", change "Dial Sensitivity" (for both Dial 1 and Dial 2) and then "go back to previous menu" until I'm back in the game.  Is that right?

My spinner works fine (moves the mouse left and right in Windows) - I just thought it was strange that is was recognized as Dial 2.

By the way, the first game I tried was Cameltry and it felt great at that setting.  You noted 40.5 (which I assume is just straight math from your formula) so I set it at 41 and it felt great.

That's great to hear! Yeah, it's the formula from the BYOAC wiki, as well as the original spinner resolutions listed there, with some educated guesswork based upon reading forum posts by arcade cabinet owners and referencing arcade game manuals, particularly the diagrams of the control panel assemblies, to try to get the settings as correct as possible.

When you're in the analog controls menu, you should be able to just press Tab again to get back in the game. If the settings seem a little sluggish, I usually Tab straight back to that menu to adjust the sensitivity a little higher. Many of the knobs in the original cabinets were a larger diameter than my Groovy Game Gear spinner knobs, so I might bump up the sensitivity a few degrees to compensate. On the other hand, if you're getting spinback or other erratic behavior when spinning at high speeds, you should be able to adjust the sensitivity lower until that stops being a problem.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2021, 10:27:57 am by KenToad »

bobbyb13

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #47 on: March 04, 2021, 02:00:16 am »
This thread absolutely rocks.

Thanks KenToad for the obviously serious effort putting together and sharing all these details.
Relax, all right? My old man is a television repairman, he's got this ultimate set of tools! I can fix it.

KenToad

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #48 on: March 04, 2021, 04:09:11 pm »
This thread absolutely rocks.

Thanks KenToad for the obviously serious effort putting together and sharing all these details.

Thanks!  :cheers:

SpiteFFM

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #49 on: May 16, 2021, 03:41:09 pm »
What a great thread. I went through the complete list and updated every game on my cabinet. I didnít even know that many spinner games existed. I could not find a real classic, though: Pong

Does anyone have the authentic settings for Pong?

PL1

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #50 on: May 16, 2021, 06:55:37 pm »
Does anyone have the authentic settings for Pong?
Pong used a potentiometer so the way to calculate the sensitivity is a bit different.

1. Have someone with an original cab measure how many degrees of rotation it takes for the paddle to travel from the top of the screen to the bottom.

2. Adjust the sensitivity on your spinner so the same number of degrees of rotation gives the same amount of travel.


Scott

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #51 on: May 16, 2021, 11:38:59 pm »
Does anyone have the authentic settings for Pong?
Pong used a potentiometer so the way to calculate the sensitivity is a bit different.

1. Have someone with an original cab measure how many degrees of rotation it takes for the paddle to travel from the top of the screen to the bottom.

2. Adjust the sensitivity on your spinner so the same number of degrees of rotation gives the same amount of travel.


Scott

Clowns used a pot and played well with a sensitivity of 50, so that might be a starting point.

KenToad

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #52 on: March 22, 2022, 09:11:37 pm »
I finally paid a visit to Galloping Ghost Arcade in Chicago and tested a few games to verify the analog settings in MAME.

Arena AKA WizWarz: The spinner moves the letter selection on the name input screen from the left side to just past the letter B with one full spin. On my Turbotwist 2, that equals a sensitivity of about 2. Generally, the movement does feel a bit sluggish around the outside. Maybe higher sensitivities make the game less difficult and/or more fun?

Mad Planets: One full rotation of the spinner rotates your ship slightly more than one full rotation. On my TT2 spinner, a sensitivity of 3 matches that closely.

Warlords: One half spin makes your sprite move all the way from one side of the castle to the other. I've been using a sensitivity of 50, but it's slightly faster than the real machine.

Blasteroids: One full spin makes the medium ship rotate maybe 380 degrees. The settings listed in the first posts above seem to be correct.

Forgotten Worlds: Your guy rotates pretty much 1 to 1 with the spinner. The settings listed in the first posts above seem correct.

I'll update the information above.


bobbyb13

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #53 on: March 23, 2022, 02:21:18 am »
I finally paid a visit to Galloping Ghost Arcade in Chicago and tested a few games to verify the analog settings in MAME.

Arena AKA WizWarz: The spinner moves the letter selection on the name input screen from the left side to just past the letter B with one full spin. On my Turbotwist 2, that equals a sensitivity of about 2. Generally, the movement does feel a bit sluggish around the outside. Maybe higher sensitivities make the game less difficult and/or more fun?

Mad Planets: One full rotation of the spinner rotates your ship slightly more than one full rotation. On my TT2 spinner, a sensitivity of 3 matches that closely.

Warlords: One half spin makes your sprite move all the way from one side of the castle to the other. I've been using a sensitivity of 50, but it's slightly faster than the real machine.

Blasteroids: One full spin makes the medium ship rotate maybe 380 degrees. The settings listed in the first posts above seem to be correct.

Forgotten Worlds: Your guy rotates pretty much 1 to 1 with the spinner. The settings listed in the first posts above seem correct.

I'll update the information above.

Kudos for keeping at this.
My next cabinet build will finally be one that will benefit greatly from all this wisdom!
Relax, all right? My old man is a television repairman, he's got this ultimate set of tools! I can fix it.

aevans0001

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #54 on: December 30, 2022, 12:43:11 am »
Awesome post @Kentoad!

This has been very helpful to me today.
I hope you are not upset but i converted your post to excel and then to pdf to make it a bit more readable.  Here is a copy.  90% of your info is in this document.  I did cut down some for size issues.




KenToad

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #55 on: January 05, 2023, 01:00:33 pm »
Awesome post @Kentoad!

This has been very helpful to me today.
I hope you are not upset but i converted your post to excel and then to pdf to make it a bit more readable.  Here is a copy.  90% of your info is in this document.  I did cut down some for size issues.

Glad it helped you! Thanks for converting the post to a more readable format, too.  :cheers:

TF14

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Re: Arcade Spinner Games and MAME Sensitivity Settings
« Reply #56 on: June 10, 2024, 04:11:33 pm »
Any chance of getting 360 spinner working with a driving game that has a self-leveling steering wheel like Crazy Taxi or any other game that leverages a self-leveling wheel?  Thanks for this thread!