PCB, Vending and other questions

[TurboC--]

I have a pac-man cabinet that I restored and and set up with MAME on an old PC.  Everything in it is original except a MAME PC instead of a Pac-man pcb, and a Happ monitor to replace the old burned-in monitor.  I just sold it to someone that wants to set it up for vending.  I know he can't vend with MAME so he will need to get a licensed PCB.  I'm thinking he will want to get a good multi-game PCB which can hopefully work with the native controls (1 joystick & 2 buttons.)  Questions:

1.) If he purchases a licensed PCB, can he then legally vend without some kind of separate license?  (He has a poker machine on the premises which he says cost $600 for a license?)
2.) About how much would a plain Pac-man PCB cost?
3.) What are some good licensed multi-game PCB options which could work in this cabinet (pac-man type vertical monitor, only joystick and 2 buttons for controls.)  For instance, I know there is a 6-game with pac, ms.pac, galaga, rally-x and a couple others, but I remember there being more elaborate ones like 18-in-1, 50-in-1... but then I don't know whether those will need additional controls to be installed (which could require a bit of work and drilling through metal...)
4.) How much can he expect to pay for lock & keys for the coin door?
5.) Is it possible to switch out the 25 cent price symbols in the original coin door with 50 cent ones?
6.) In addition to a PCB and locks, what other hardware would he need to get everything running using a PCB instead of the MAME PC?  Transformer for DC power for the PCB? 
7.) He is willing to pay me for my time in working on the unit, what do you think a fair $/hr amount is to ask for this kind of work?

I haven't done this stuff in years so I have forgotten a lot.  Help is appreciated.  Thanks!

[JDFan]

Depends on where the machine is located (each City,county,state has their own licensing laws) but he will definitely need some sort of license and or permit and will need to pay annually for using the machine.

For example here is a break down of the permits\licenses needed in Texas - ( http://window.state.tx.us/taxinfo/coin/index.html ) so around $300 to $600 per machine per year sounds about right -- plus it has to be a "Legal machine" in order to get the permit which means no 60 in 1 or 300 in 1 etc. machines as those are not legally licensed for commercial use ( there are a few multi game PCBs but the majority of them are chinese knock offs which are not licensed and thus are not "Legally" useable for commercial machines.

[TurboC--]

Located in Pittsburgh PA.  Are Jamma PCBs legal for vending or no?  I'd like to hook him up with the best legal multi-game unit I can.  There is a local arcade here which has a lot of cabinets, including a big multi-game unit.  I wonder if they are doing that legally or not?  I guess there is always the 6-game pac/mspac/galaga/rally x one, could look into that if there aren't any better options with more games. 

Can't believe they make you pay so much just for a license.  What could possibly justify that?  Where does that money go?  I'd have no patience to run a business and put up with that highway robbery.

[Slippyblade]

The poker machine is a different beast.  Anything that has a pay out is a gambling machine and those are in a separate category that is insanely expensive.

[pbj]

Arcades are sleazy money laundering fronts.  The tax man couldn't care less what you're running PacMan on, but he wants his cut and the high fees are to keep you from opening one in his town.

 

[TurboC--]

Can anyone help with the other questions?  Especially what hardware is needed to run a cabinet with a PCB instead of a MAME PC?  I would need a transformer to power it, is that all? 

[Malenko]

Can anyone help with the other questions?  Especially what hardware is needed to run a cabinet with a PCB instead of a MAME PC?  I would need a transformer to power it, is that all?

is the cab wired for JAMMA?

[TurboC--]

It only has the MAME PC+circuit boards and wiring going with those.  There's no original wiring harness, jamma harness, etc.  From what I gather, I will need to get a wiring harness, a PCB which is compatible with that harness, and something to power them?  I looked on ebay, there's a Ms.Pac harness for $75, a Pac & Ms.Pac normal and fast mode PCB for $300, at those prices it would cost like $450 for everything I'd need.  That seems a bit crazy since I see working (although beat up) Ms.Pac cabinets for that or less. 

Is Jamma legal to run for profit?  What's my best option here, assuming I wanted legal/licensed Pac + Ms.Pac at the mininum?

[Malenko]

JAMMA is just a wiring standard.

If you want a 100% legal to run arcade game to make a profit that has Pacman and Ms.Pacman you would have to get a reunion PCB ( http://www.ebay.com/itm/200949663933 ) and a jamma wire loom. The reunion PCB doesn't have VGA out so you'd also have to run the video to an actual arcade monitor, or use some sort of video converter ( http://www.ebay.com/itm/261488206674 ) . You'd also neeed a switching power supply and a 4 way stick.


It sounds like a ton of work to modify the cab you sold him, I'd advocate him just buying another cab.

[TurboC--]

It is an actual arcade monitor, it's a Happ controls model.  I forget the model, but I could check if needed.  I think it should take the outputs from a genuine PCB. 

Would this PCB be profit-legal?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Midway-PAC-MAN-MS-PAC-MAN-Board-PCB-TESTED-WORKING-4-in-1-Board-/181423007196?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a3da765dc

[Malenko]

yeah, I THINK so. That's a legit Pacman board with a rom hack, the switches just go back and forth between which roms are loaded.  Now the speed hack doesnt matter , but I dont know if they are using legit  roms, but honestly, since only 1 game can run at a time it shouldnt matter.  And there is always plausible deny-ability


When I suggested a reunion board, it was so a player can coin up then pick which game to play , which seemed to be your goal. The board you linked to requires the machine to be OFF when flipping a switch to change speeds/games

[TurboC--]

Right, it's more desirable to have it a menu choice, I'm just looking at the various options.  It would be nice to have Pac-man as an option since it's a fairly beautiful pac-man cabinet with all of the original parts (bezel, marquee, pristine CPO, etc.) 

In the mid 90s, at an arcade I remember playing a cabinet with different Pac-man versions, Rally-X, I think Galaga... I thought it was like a 5 or 6-in-1.  Sort of like the handheld Namco collections but it was a cabinet.  I looked around but I can't seem to find it anywhere.  It seemed legit and was being coin operated for profit among 100 other cabs, but now I'm not sure whether it was legit since I can't find it.  Does that sound familiar at all? 

Does the Ms.Pac/Galaga board have any option of running original Pac-man as well?  Some kind of mode or switch?

* I see there is a code you can put into the reunion to play pac-man.  That's cool, however, it looks like the controls for reunion require two ms pac start buttons, two galaga start buttons, as well as fire.  I don't see how that would work without drilling into & defacing the CP.  Hmm.  It makes me lean toward the pac / ms pac switchable, or something like that.  Would be even cooler if Jr. Pac was on there also...

[Malenko]

you can get the 96 in 1 multipac mod:

http://home.everestkc.net/mdoyle/multipac.htm


The game you are thinking of are the Namco Classic Collections. 2 Volumes in the arcades if memory serves.

http://www.arcade-museum.com/game_detail.php?game_id=8824
http://www.arcade-museum.com/game_detail.php?game_id=8825

[TurboC--]

Thanks, yes it was Namco Classic Collection 2.  Looks like that would be out since it needs 2 joysticks. 

The 96-in-1 is interesting, that would be a $145 upgrade of an existing PCB but if I could get a cheap enough pac (or ms pac?) pcb set, it could be a good option.  I imagine that would not be strictly legal commercially, but how strict is the enforcement for something like that?  He would have to own at least a Pac PCB anyway so that's something better than MAME at least...

[TurboC--]

Question - is it legal for someone to run a MAME game commercially IF they own a licensed copy which is not being used?  For instance if he wanted to keep running MAME for profit, but purchased a set of licensed pac man, ms pac man and galaga chips, or something like that.  If so, maybe that would be a good and legal workaround?

[Malenko]

Question - is it legal for someone to run a MAME game commercially IF they own a licensed copy which is not being used?  For instance if he wanted to keep running MAME for profit, but purchased a set of licensed pac man, ms pac man and galaga chips, or something like that.  If so, maybe that would be a good and legal workaround?

no, it violates the MAME EULA.

However, Im not sure anyone ever got put in the clink for using MAME (I DONT THINK DAVE FOLEY HAS GONE TO THE SLAMMER YET!)

[TurboC--]

Can anyone tell me what type of lock I need to fit the original Pac-man coin door?